# Star Wars: The Force Awakens - Seen It (Assume Spoilers Within) **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [December 16, 2015, 11:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-the-force-awakens-seen-it-assume-spoilers-within/740645 "2015-12-16T23:16:03Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 19
**Author:** ![Enderw24](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/ba9def/32.png) [@Enderw24](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Enderw24)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2015, 4:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-the-force-awakens-seen-it-assume-spoilers-within/740645/361 "2015-12-21T16:51:47Z")
> [@Jragon](#): > > OBJECTION > > Clones But you can’t make clones out of Han Solo. It says so, right in his name. ---
**Author:** ![Intergalactic\_Gladiator](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/intergalactic_gladiator/32/112_2.png) [@Intergalactic\_Gladiator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Intergalactic_Gladiator)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2015, 5:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-the-force-awakens-seen-it-assume-spoilers-within/740645/362 "2015-12-21T17:03:02Z")
> [@Max\_Torque](#): > > That being said, he pulls off a trick we’ve never seen before: stopping a blaster bolt in mid-air. So, clearly, the Skywalker DNA is strong in him, but he is highly undisciplined. I thought that was cool that he did stop a blaster bolt and it was something we haven’t seen before but having it just hang in midair forever seemed a little too much. Vader deflected bolts in Empire and was a badass, Kylo Ren made it stop because of rule of cool, I think. Maybe if it dissipated while Poe was captured or something. What is the life cycle of a blaster bolt? > [@Max\_Torque](#): > > C3PO seemed irrelevant and unnecessary. It was nice to bring back the whole old crew, but give the poor guy something to do. I like his intro and it was very much in character for him to be in Solo’s way. I’m not so hot on the red arm because it seems (so far) like a change for the sake of change but the fact that C3PO would mention it because otherwise Solo might not recognize him was very funny. He didn’t really have anything to do after that though, which is unfortunate. I mean, there’s no reason for him to get trapped in a droid factory and have his head put on another droid or something stupid like that, but after his intro he was mostly inessential. ---
**Author:** ![Lsura](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7993a0/32.png) [@Lsura](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lsura)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2015, 5:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-the-force-awakens-seen-it-assume-spoilers-within/740645/363 "2015-12-21T17:25:20Z")
I saw it yesterday morning and really liked it. Granted, I’m not a stickler on some things. I’m incredibly glad I managed to see it before I got spoiled: I didn’t know what was coming and it’s been a long time since I’ve seen a movie unspoiled like that - I’d say _Serenity_ was probably the last time. I liked Kylo Ren: there was a comment when Leia and Han are talking about him having too much Vader in him. I understand why they said that, but my thoughts up to then had been that he was much like Anakin: throwing the temper tantrums was to me similar to Anakin killing the Tusken Raiders (though admittedly Anakin’s was murderous while Ren’s was simply destructive). Vader never tended toward displays like that, but Anakin did. ---
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2015, 5:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-the-force-awakens-seen-it-assume-spoilers-within/740645/364 "2015-12-21T17:44:24Z")
> [@Pleonast](#): > > I knew Han was going to die from the look he gave Leia when he said he’d bring back their son. It was like when he went to get Luke in Hoth. It was something he was going to do or die trying. As soon as Han called out to Ben on the railing, I started thinking to myself “Ohgodhesgonnakillhanpleaseno”, and it only intensified when Kylo started talking about needing the courage to do what he had to do. Then I got faked out for just a split second and thought he’d changed his mind. Then he did it. > [@gonzoron](#): > > (BTW, it’s not clear to me if the Knights of Ren are named after Kylo, or if he is just one of many \_\_\_ Rens that make up the Knights.) My wild speculation is that “Ren” is a historically significant Dark Side Force-user among Snoke’s people, and that Snoke suggested the name to Kylo for his new order. In the old EU, the title “Darth” originated from the Rakata word for “emperor”, so I could definitely see Ren having a similar origin. > [@Intergalactic\_Gladiator](#): > > Maybe if it dissipated while Poe was captured or something. What is the life cycle of a blaster bolt? IIRC, blaster bolts are supposed to be superheated gas or plasma, so presumably it would dissipate over time as it lost heat to the atmosphere. > [@Lsura](#): > > I liked Kylo Ren: there was a comment when Leia and Han are talking about him having too much Vader in him. I understand why they said that, but my thoughts up to then had been that he was much like Anakin: throwing the temper tantrums was to me similar to Anakin killing the Tusken Raiders (though admittedly Anakin’s was murderous while Ren’s was simply destructive). Vader never tended toward displays like that, but Anakin did. I commented on it before, but I think that Mustafar was the moment that changed Vader from being full of rage to being cold and detached. Being crippled, getting stuck in a suit of armor, and spending 20 years believing he’d killed his wife and his unborn children must have broken him emotionally, to the point that he simply didn’t feel anything anymore when he ordered entire planets destroyed in the name of “galactic peace”. Kylo is very much what Anakin would have been if he’d escaped Mustafar intact. ---
**Author:** ![FlikTheBlue](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fliktheblue/32/10972_2.png) [@FlikTheBlue](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FlikTheBlue)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2015, 5:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-the-force-awakens-seen-it-assume-spoilers-within/740645/365 "2015-12-21T17:47:18Z")
I liked the movie, but it didn’t quite capture the magic of the original trilogy for me. I do have some questions to speculate on. 1. Why hasn’t Leia trained as a Jedi? Wasn’t the implication in Return of the Jedi that if something happened to Luke that Leia could continue in his place? 2. How does Snoke fit in? He isn’t a complete unknown, since Han and Leia were aware that Snoke was the one who had corrupted Ben. On the other hand, there will have to be an explanation of some kind as to why he wasn’t present during the events of the original trilogy. 3. Why would Rey give Luke the blue light saber? Shouldn’t he still have the green one he used in Return of the Jedi? 4. Who are Rey’s parents? It’s tempting to think that she’s Luke’s daughter, but would he really abandon her? My wilder speculation is that she is somehow descended from Palpatine based on how quickly she picked up her Force abilities. 5. Is Finn able to use the Force, and will he eventually train as a Jedi as well? When Snoke and Kylo Ren talked about an awakening in the Force, it seemed like they were referring to Finn rather than Rey. ---
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2015, 5:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-the-force-awakens-seen-it-assume-spoilers-within/740645/366 "2015-12-21T17:57:56Z")
> [@FlikTheBlue](#): > > 1. Why hasn’t Leia trained as a Jedi? Wasn’t the implication in Return of the Jedi that if something happened to Luke that Leia could continue in his place? Leia’s always been a politician, not a warrior - if you recall, the first time we see her in ANH, she’s an Imperial Senator on a diplomatic mission. She’s better suited to calling the shots from HQ than being on the front lines. She may have had _some_ training - she definitely feels the wound in the Force when Han is killed - but I doubt she’d be very interested in lightsaber combat. > [@](#): > > 1. Why would Rey give Luke the blue light saber? Shouldn’t he still have the green one he used in Return of the Jedi? Showing him his father’s lightsaber that he lost 30 years ago tells Luke how far she’s gone to find him. > [@](#): > > 1. Who are Rey’s parents? It’s tempting to think that she’s Luke’s daughter, but would he really abandon her? My wilder speculation is that she is somehow descended from Palpatine based on how quickly she picked up her Force abilities. I doubt Rey is related to anyone we’ve been introduced to previously. It’s _remotely_ possible that Palpatine created her the same way he created Anakin, but my guess is that she’s just a castaway of no significant ancestry who happened to be strong in the Force. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_other_waldo_pepper/32/12370_2.png) [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Other_Waldo_Pepper)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2015, 6:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-the-force-awakens-seen-it-assume-spoilers-within/740645/367 "2015-12-21T18:01:23Z")
> [@Smapti](#): > > I doubt Rey is related to anyone we’ve been introduced to previously. Do you doubt that Finn is related to Lando? ---
**Author:** ![Mahaloth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mahaloth/32/1079_2.png) [@Mahaloth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mahaloth)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2015, 6:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-the-force-awakens-seen-it-assume-spoilers-within/740645/368 "2015-12-21T18:04:01Z")
> [@Lsura](#): > > I saw it yesterday morning and really liked it. Granted, I’m not a stickler on some things. I’m incredibly glad I managed to see it before I got spoiled: I didn’t know what was coming and it’s been a long time since I’ve seen a movie unspoiled like that - I’d say _Serenity_ was probably the last time. > > I liked Kylo Ren: there was a comment when Leia and Han are talking about him having too much Vader in him. I understand why they said that, but my thoughts up to then had been that he was much like Anakin: throwing the temper tantrums was to me similar to Anakin killing the Tusken Raiders (though admittedly Anakin’s was murderous while Ren’s was simply destructive). Vader never tended toward displays like that, but Anakin did. Yes, he reminded me of how Anakin behaved in II and III, only this time, it was well written, directed, and acted. I think Adam Driver really elevated the material with his quality acting. I bought his character completely. In fact, the moment he removed his helmet, I could see so much in his eyes, it really confirmed his character is awesome. ---
**Author:** ![Dinsdale](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/97f17d/32.png) [@Dinsdale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dinsdale)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2015, 6:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-the-force-awakens-seen-it-assume-spoilers-within/740645/369 "2015-12-21T18:08:28Z")
> [@SlackerInc](#): > > Then there are people like you and me who fondly remember the original Star Wars, but don’t care to see it rehashed. But they already got our contribution to the openIng weekend box office, so the joke’s on us–which is why I am going to be sure not to go see the next one, although I might watch it if it comes later to Showtime or HBO where I can watch it for free. Yeah - I guess one thing I find a tad disappointing is that this is just one more datapoint of how out of touch I am with much of popular modern film. I guess that’s nothing new. It is funny, tho. Back at one time I was a pretty big fan - and reasonably knowledgeable about - things like SW, ST, and Tolkein. There is a small sense of loss when the way I liked to experience those things gets so hugely overshadowed. Was a little disappointed to not watch RoTK, or beyond the first Hobbit film. But there were plenty of other enterntainment options. Was a little different with all of the Marvel, X-men, etc., since I was never a big fan. I tried a couple movies, and didn’t care for them. Special effects at the expense of story telling. And they all impressed me as interchangeable. But I didn’t really care, because it wasn’t changing something I was quite fond of. Oh well - no need to continue in this vein. Just because I’m an old crank, certainly oughtn’t keep everyone else from their fun. With much of the trend of movies over the past decade or so, I’m finding myself more and more interested in “small” human scale movies. Watching a lot more indies and foreign films than blockbuster releases. And when I see a big release, to me it is generally just a couple of hours of escapist eye-candy. ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2015, 6:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-the-force-awakens-seen-it-assume-spoilers-within/740645/370 "2015-12-21T18:53:41Z")
> [@Smapti](#): > > Showing him his father’s lightsaber that he lost 30 years ago tells Luke how far she’s gone to find him. “Here, you dropped this.” ---
**Author:** ![Mahaloth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mahaloth/32/1079_2.png) [@Mahaloth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mahaloth)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2015, 7:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-the-force-awakens-seen-it-assume-spoilers-within/740645/371 "2015-12-21T19:08:57Z")
> [@FlikTheBlue](#): > > I liked the movie, but it didn’t quite capture the magic of the original trilogy for me. I do have some questions to speculate on. > > 1. Why hasn’t Leia trained as a Jedi? Wasn’t the implication in Return of the Jedi that if something happened to Luke that Leia could continue in his place? > > 2. How does Snoke fit in? He isn’t a complete unknown, since Han and Leia were aware that Snoke was the one who had corrupted Ben. On the other hand, there will have to be an explanation of some kind as to why he wasn’t present during the events of the original trilogy. > > 3. Why would Rey give Luke the blue light saber? Shouldn’t he still have the green one he used in Return of the Jedi? > > 4. Who are Rey’s parents? It’s tempting to think that she’s Luke’s daughter, but would he really abandon her? My wilder speculation is that she is somehow descended from Palpatine based on how quickly she picked up her Force abilities. > > 5. Is Finn able to use the Force, and will he eventually train as a Jedi as well? When Snoke and Kylo Ren talked about an awakening in the Force, it seemed like they were referring to Finn rather than Rey. 1. They decided she chose to not train as a Jedi. 2. Great question. 3. She’s returning it to him. It’s almost proof she was called by the Force. 4. No idea. I think she is a Skywalker and her name is not Rey. 5. I doubt Finn is a Force user. I did not get that impression regarding the awakening. I think he’s just our Han Solo guy, along with Poe Dameron. ---
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2015, 7:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-the-force-awakens-seen-it-assume-spoilers-within/740645/372 "2015-12-21T19:17:54Z")
Poe strikes me as what Wedge Antilles might have been if he’d gotten more screen time and characterization. ---
**Author:** ![Justin\_Bailey](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/justin_bailey/32/8792_2.png) [@Justin\_Bailey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Justin_Bailey)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2015, 7:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-the-force-awakens-seen-it-assume-spoilers-within/740645/373 "2015-12-21T19:23:20Z")
> [@MaxTheVool](#): > > And in fact, a lot of marketing faked us into believing that would happen here. On the various posters, Finn is the one holding a light sabre. And in every preview I saw, there was a glimpse of Finn with a light sabre, but not Rey. I love that the poster puts Kylo Ren’s Lightsaber just behind Rey’s staff so it looks like she’s wielding a Maul-style double-ended Lightsaber. I always thought that was a significant choice and I’m glad I turned out to be right. [http://a.dilcdn.com/bl/wp-content/uploads/sites/6/2015/10/star-wars-force-awakens-official-poster.jpg](http://a.dilcdn.com/bl/wp-content/uploads/sites/6/2015/10/star-wars-force-awakens-official-poster.jpg) ---
**Author:** ![msmith537](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d9b06d/32.png) [@msmith537](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/msmith537)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2015, 7:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-the-force-awakens-seen-it-assume-spoilers-within/740645/374 "2015-12-21T19:24:24Z")
> [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](#): > > Do you doubt that Finn is related to Lando? I have no doubt in my mind that Finn is the offspring of Lando and Leia. It would explain why he: a) is the only Stormtrooper in the universe to go AWOL b) can master spacecraft gunnery with no prior training c) didn’t instantly die when fighting Kylo Ren with a lightsaber I’m also predicting that Snoke is like 2 feet tall IRL. > [@Intergalactic Gladiator](#): > > Anyone else think “He’s been in low power mode since Master Luke left” is one of the worst line ever? That’s right up there with “She died of a broken heart.” But having your computer go into “sleep” mode is an actual thing. “Dying of a broken heart” isn’t. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Tooth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c67d28/32.png) [@The\_Tooth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Tooth)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2015, 7:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-the-force-awakens-seen-it-assume-spoilers-within/740645/375 "2015-12-21T19:32:18Z")
> [@Alessan](#): > > “Here, you dropped this.” “Say, thanks! Have I ever told you that this here lightsaber is a symbol of my individuality and my belief in personal freedom?” ---
**Author:** ![Jophiel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jophiel/32/66_2.png) [@Jophiel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jophiel)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2015, 7:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-the-force-awakens-seen-it-assume-spoilers-within/740645/376 "2015-12-21T19:55:43Z")
> [@msmith537](#): > > But having your computer go into “sleep” mode is an actual thing. Not because it’s sulking. It’s not as though someone just tapped the “Wake” button on R2D2 and resumed operations. ---
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2015, 8:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-the-force-awakens-seen-it-assume-spoilers-within/740645/377 "2015-12-21T20:10:27Z")
I’ll agree that the explanation for R2 being quiet was pretty thin. A few more lines of dialogue would have helped there. Maybe something like “Master Luke ordered him to go dormant and he hasn’t moved an inch since. The science unit thinks he’s waiting for something to happen before he wakes up, but we haven’t the slightest clue what that something is.” Also, was there an explanation given for C-3PO’s red arm? ---
**Author:** ![SlackerInc](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slackerinc/32/275_2.png) [@SlackerInc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SlackerInc)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2015, 8:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-the-force-awakens-seen-it-assume-spoilers-within/740645/378 "2015-12-21T20:30:48Z")
I will actually defend that one. Being depressed over Luke’s absence totally seems in character for R2-D2 to me and strikes me as a nice touch. ---
**Author:** ![Soylent\_Juicy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/82dd89/32.png) [@Soylent\_Juicy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Soylent_Juicy)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2015, 8:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-the-force-awakens-seen-it-assume-spoilers-within/740645/379 "2015-12-21T20:32:37Z")
> [@Smapti](#): > > Also, was there an explanation given for C-3PO’s red arm? No, he just said “Yes I know I need to get my original arm re-installed” or something to that effect. ---
**Author:** ![XT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xt/32/456_2.png) [@XT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XT)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2015, 8:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-the-force-awakens-seen-it-assume-spoilers-within/740645/380 "2015-12-21T20:32:48Z")
Spoiler free review of the movie by the [Screen Junkies](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rh_84ExOdhU), fwiw. Pretty much agree with this review on most aspects. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-the-force-awakens-seen-it-assume-spoilers-within/740645.md?page=18) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-the-force-awakens-seen-it-assume-spoilers-within/740645.md?page=20)