# Star Wars: The Force Awakens - Seen It (Assume Spoilers Within) **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [December 16, 2015, 11:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-the-force-awakens-seen-it-assume-spoilers-within/740645 "2015-12-16T23:16:03Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 45
**Author:** ![sparky\_1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/77aa72/32.png) [@sparky\_1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sparky_1)\ **Post date:** [December 27, 2015, 9:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-the-force-awakens-seen-it-assume-spoilers-within/740645/881 "2015-12-27T21:42:06Z")
> [@Grsz11](#): > > In all honesty, is it possible to equal or best the original soundtrack? Yes: the soundtrack to Empire bested the first. ---
**Author:** ![Uosdwis\_R.Dewoh](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/9e8a1a/32.png) [@Uosdwis\_R.Dewoh](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Uosdwis_R.Dewoh)\ **Post date:** [December 27, 2015, 10:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-the-force-awakens-seen-it-assume-spoilers-within/740645/882 "2015-12-27T22:16:57Z")
[So this is apparently a thing.](https://images.duckduckgo.com/iu/?u=https%3A%2F%2Fcoedmagazine.files.wordpress.com%2F2015%2F12%2Fstar-wars-fruits1.jpg%3Fquality%3D88%26w%3D656%26h%3D548&f=1) ---
**Author:** ![Raguleader](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/258eb7/32.png) [@Raguleader](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Raguleader)\ **Post date:** [December 27, 2015, 10:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-the-force-awakens-seen-it-assume-spoilers-within/740645/883 "2015-12-27T22:26:24Z")
> [@jimmycolorado](#): > > On only one viewing, I vaguely remember Leia’s Theme being played, even when Princess/General Leia wasn’t in the scene (I could be wrong here though). I want to say they played her theme (actually “Han Solo and the Princess”) when she and Han meet again midway through the movie, and they definitely played it again when she and Rey hug after Han’s death (nice touch, BTW, showing us the traditional post-battle victory celebration juxtaposed with others grieving those lost in the battle) [QUOTE=obfusciatrist] Of course, the “hole” in the armor is something that almost anybody in the galaxy could take advantage of since apparently every ship larger than a toaster has hyperdrive. (And humans have the ability to manually time coming out of it to within a few miles (inside the shields but not inside the planet)). [/quote] To clarify, we’re not talking about the forcefield (and forcefields have always been of spotty effectiveness in the SW series, so this is nothing new), but the actual physical protection of the Thermal Oscillator, which was able to shrug off multiple direct hits from proton torpedoes launched by Poe’s X-Wings as well as the explosive charges set off inside by Han and Chewie. It was only after the latter physically blew a hole through the wall of the thing that Poe was able to exploit it by flying inside of the building and shooting up everything inside before flying back out of the hole. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_other_waldo_pepper/32/12370_2.png) [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Other_Waldo_Pepper)\ **Post date:** [December 27, 2015, 10:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-the-force-awakens-seen-it-assume-spoilers-within/740645/884 "2015-12-27T22:31:33Z")
> [@Johnny\_Angel](#): > > Damn, if you can take credit for having invented this emoticon, I must salute you. I’d love to take credit, but can likewise only salute whoever came up with it. > [@](#): > > But he killed Han Solo in a desperate bid to stop sucking, and surely the next movie will have him turn up as an actual badass worthy of his costume, thus verifying that a morsel of conscience actually significantly nerfs a dark Jedi. But then the question will remain: why didn’t Vader suck? He nursed creditable paternal love, and he was badass. Smapti’s response is good, but I’ll add that even in EMPIRE when he _knows_ he’s a dad looking to recruit his kid for rule-the-galaxy-as-father-and-son hijinks, he still seems casually unbeatable in personal combat: if you have Force powers, (a) you’ll get warned over and over that you’re not ready to beat him before (b) he inevitably uses his lightsaber to disarm you by lopping off your hand; and if you _don’t_ have Force powers, he’ll parry shot after shot after shot from your blaster without even bothering to use his lightsaber, before he disarms you without bothering to use his lightsaber. He’s still the implacable adversary who finds your lack of faith disturbing; it’s just that Han Solo and Luke Skywalker are both Admiral Motti. Kylo Ren is less Darth Vader, and more – well, Admiral Motti. ---
**Author:** ![erysichthon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/d07c76/32.png) [@erysichthon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/erysichthon)\ **Post date:** [December 27, 2015, 10:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-the-force-awakens-seen-it-assume-spoilers-within/740645/885 "2015-12-27T22:41:18Z")
> [@iamthewalrus\_3](#): > > Not sure if anyone else has mentioned it yet: I was disappointed that the writers decided to double down on the Kessel run parsec nonsense. I actually laughed out loud at this line (although I think I was the only person in the theater who did). It struck me as a massive fuck-you to all the people who have complained about the “12 parsecs” line in the last 38+ years. I don’t condone the misuse of the term,\* but it was still funny. \*I’m aware that one of the _Star Wars_ books contains a reasonable explanation of the parsec thing—something about Han taking a shortcut through a dangerous black hole cluster. However, I don’t believe for a moment that Lucas was thinking of that when he wrote the line. ---
**Author:** ![Evil\_Captor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/f17d59/32.png) [@Evil\_Captor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evil_Captor)\ **Post date:** [December 27, 2015, 10:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-the-force-awakens-seen-it-assume-spoilers-within/740645/886 "2015-12-27T22:54:43Z")
I saw the movie and enjoyed it. Like most, I think they reused WAAAAY too much of Episode IV. I guess you could say I found Disney’s lack of faith in an original story … disturbing. Still it was basically an exciting film and I thoroughly enjoyed it. But if they have another Death Star or Death Star-like weapon as the Big Bad in the next movie, I don’t think I’m gonna bother with watching it in the theater. It’s gotten to be kind of a bore. ---
**Author:** ![BrotherCadfael](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@BrotherCadfael](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrotherCadfael)\ **Post date:** [December 27, 2015, 11:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-the-force-awakens-seen-it-assume-spoilers-within/740645/887 "2015-12-27T23:50:09Z")
> [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](#): > > I saw the movie in a small Vermont town’s theater a few days before Christmas, and it was maybe three-quarters full. I saw it in a small Vermont town’s theater two days after Christmas, and it was PACKED. I may have had the last ticket sold, and there were plenty in line behind me. A ski town, most of the skiing washed out, pouring down rain, what else were people going to do? ---
**Author:** ![Quercus\_alba](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quercus_alba/32/4061_2.png) [@Quercus\_alba](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Quercus_alba)\ **Post date:** [December 27, 2015, 11:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-the-force-awakens-seen-it-assume-spoilers-within/740645/888 "2015-12-27T23:51:05Z")
> [@Johnny\_Bravo](#): > > It had starships and lightsabers and good guys vs bad guys and explosions and John Williams music and old characters doing new things and new characters doing old things. > > It was _fun._ OK–I enjoyed it, but more proof that John Williams never met a theme he wouldn’t plagiarize: was listening to the soundtrack on Spotify, and thought “Rey’s Theme” had a certain familiarity to it. Check out Alan Menken’s Beauty and the Beast Prologue. :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![Deeg](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/deeg/32/2955_2.png) [@Deeg](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Deeg)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2015, 12:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-the-force-awakens-seen-it-assume-spoilers-within/740645/889 "2015-12-28T00:11:25Z")
> [@DSeid](#): > > My take was that he is aware of a prophecy of sorts involving “a girl whose mastery of the Force will rival your powers … but who with you can rule.” Or somesuch. But we don’t hear about any such prophecy, right? I don’t disagree with you but it would have been nice to hear about the prophecy and maybe Rey showing signs of fulfilling it. > [@DSeid](#): > > The hug was with Rey coming back and Hans not. But wouldn’t Chewie be the obvious person (or…thing) to hug? She doesn’t know Rey nor does she know that Rey has feelings for Han. jsgoddess already mentioned it, but it seemed like the writers forgot that Rey and Leia didn’t know each other. > [@DSeid](#): > > The mission to Luke was after it was clear that the Force is strong in Rey, yet still untrained, just awakening, and Leia bets that presenting that adept, with the saber, will be the best chance at pulling Luke back in. Or alternatively also knows of some version of the prophecy that Ren knows and knows that “a girl, powerful in the Force, will arise, and either be salvation or destruction.” And knows Luke knows that too. Yes she piloted there with Chewie and BB-8 … but still the case to Luke is her alone, as if in supplication. Maybe. But wouldn’t it make sense to send at least one person directly connected to the Resistance, like Poe? We’re told how important Luke is but then the Resistance doesn’t send any escorts. If Leia did have some sort of premonition that Rey was the right one to go there should have been an explanation. Otherwise it’s inexplicable. > [@jsgoddess](#): > > I also thought it was a bit off for Fin to leap right into killing other storm troopers once he was established as someone who actually cares about people’s lives and doing the right thing. I will defend the movie here. Finn makes it clear that it’s the First Order that he hates and the reason he’s fleeing. He says that he won’t kill for them. His actions largely feel consistent. ---
**Author:** ![BrotherCadfael](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@BrotherCadfael](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrotherCadfael)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2015, 12:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-the-force-awakens-seen-it-assume-spoilers-within/740645/890 "2015-12-28T00:13:37Z")
Oh, and I totally expected Rey to reply, _“May the Force be with you, Aunt Leia.”_ ---
**Author:** ![SlackerInc](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slackerinc/32/275_2.png) [@SlackerInc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SlackerInc)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2015, 12:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-the-force-awakens-seen-it-assume-spoilers-within/740645/891 "2015-12-28T00:51:36Z")
> [@Johnny\_Angel](#): > > In the case of Kylo Ren, he’s convinced that a little scrap of goodness in him is the reason he sucks. And he does suck. But he killed Han Solo in a desperate bid to stop sucking, and surely the next movie will have him turn up as an actual badass worthy of his costume, thus verifying that a morsel of conscience actually significantly nerfs a dark Jedi. I’ve seen two assumptions about the upcoming movies stated as a matter of faith–and you may find my lack of faith disturbing, but I will be surprised if either or especially both of them are correct. One is that Disney has now exorcised the demons of the prequels and will no longer rely on playing it safe by rehashing what has come before. The other is that Kylo Ren has gotten all of his annoying emo good-guy impulses out of his system, and will emerge as an all-out, terrifying and implacable adversary. A much better bet, it seems to me, is that we will see Kylo making entreaties to his cousin Rey that they should join forces to defeat Snope and rule the galaxy. Rey will be all like “I’ll never join you!” and then in the third movie, Kylo and Snope will be on the verge of killing Rey when Kylo has a change of heart and attacks Snope, perhaps killing him by sending him cascading down into an endless pit, his lightning hands flailing around helplessly. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_other_waldo_pepper/32/12370_2.png) [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Other_Waldo_Pepper)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2015, 12:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-the-force-awakens-seen-it-assume-spoilers-within/740645/892 "2015-12-28T00:54:33Z")
> [@SlackerInc](#): > > A much better bet, it seems to me, is that we will see Kylo making entreaties to his cousin Rey that they should join forces to defeat Snope and rule the galaxy. Rey will be all like “I’ll never join you!” and then in the third movie, Kylo and Snope will be on the verge of killing Rey when Kylo has a change of heart and attacks Snope, perhaps killing him by sending him cascading down into an endless pit, his lightning hands flailing around helplessly. How _dare_ you not mention translucent Luke Skywalker nodding approvingly at the end. ---
**Author:** ![Penfeather](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/penfeather/32/384_2.png) [@Penfeather](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Penfeather)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2015, 1:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-the-force-awakens-seen-it-assume-spoilers-within/740645/893 "2015-12-28T01:15:13Z")
> [@Quercus\_alba](#): > > OK–I enjoyed it, but more proof that John Williams never met a theme he wouldn’t plagiarize: was listening to the soundtrack on Spotify, and thought “Rey’s Theme” had a certain familiarity to it. Check out Alan Menken’s Beauty and the Beast Prologue. :rolleyes: [Well, he did thieve the Star Wars theme from Korngold.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8AokqzpdA3M) ---
**Author:** ![Penfeather](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/penfeather/32/384_2.png) [@Penfeather](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Penfeather)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2015, 1:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-the-force-awakens-seen-it-assume-spoilers-within/740645/894 "2015-12-28T01:16:58Z")
> [@Quercus\_alba](#): > > OK–I enjoyed it, but more proof that John Williams never met a theme he wouldn’t plagiarize: was listening to the soundtrack on Spotify, and thought “Rey’s Theme” had a certain familiarity to it. Check out Alan Menken’s Beauty and the Beast Prologue. :rolleyes: [Well, he did thieve the Star Wars theme from Korngold.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8AokqzpdA3M) [Here’s the whole thing for comparison.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AJwa9mX0bxA) ---
**Author:** ![Quercus\_alba](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quercus_alba/32/4061_2.png) [@Quercus\_alba](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Quercus_alba)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2015, 1:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-the-force-awakens-seen-it-assume-spoilers-within/740645/895 "2015-12-28T01:18:41Z")
BB-8’s origin story. [Heh…](https://scontent-lga3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xap1/v/t1.0-9/1513647_634129680085328_3038357610810066164_n.jpg?oh=23b2955fd655059a7e41f0ef2e6e2224&oe=56FF009B) ---
**Author:** ![GuanoLad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guanolad/32/42_2.png) [@GuanoLad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GuanoLad)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2015, 2:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-the-force-awakens-seen-it-assume-spoilers-within/740645/896 "2015-12-28T02:17:10Z")
> [@Quercus\_alba](#): > > Check out Alan Menken’s Beauty and the Beast Prologue. :rolleyes: That in itself was plagiarised from Saint-Saens’s [Carnival of the Animals](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YVpl-RNzdE4). ---
**Author:** ![DSeid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dseid/32/20194_2.png) [@DSeid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSeid)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2015, 2:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-the-force-awakens-seen-it-assume-spoilers-within/740645/897 "2015-12-28T02:39:51Z")
> [@Deeg](#): > > But we don’t hear about any such prophecy, right? I don’t disagree with you but it would have been nice to hear about the prophecy and maybe Rey showing signs of fulfilling it. … No we do not hear of such a prophecy. But if one exists then no IMHO at least it would not be better to have that revealed explicitly at this point. Its existence (if it does exist) is a plot point to be revealed in the next installment. If my read is right they are borrowing heavily from Harry Potter as well as the original Star Wars. Which of course was derivative itself. Chewie does not strike me as a hugger, or who one would want a hug of mutual consolation with. To my read Rey was telling Leia with her expression what had happened and how she felt about it and a mutual hug was the appropriate next thing to thing to do. For Leia’s comfort and to communicate that Leia does not hold Rey to blame. ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2015, 4:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-the-force-awakens-seen-it-assume-spoilers-within/740645/898 "2015-12-28T04:48:07Z")
I, too, was underwhelmed by the soundtrack. The movie just crossed the $1 billion mark worldwide - the fastest in history: ['Stars Wars: The Force Awakens' makes $1 billion in a record 12 days](http://money.cnn.com/2015/12/27/media/star-wars-the-force-awakens-1-billion-box-office-record/index.html) ---
**Author:** ![Deeg](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/deeg/32/2955_2.png) [@Deeg](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Deeg)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2015, 5:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-the-force-awakens-seen-it-assume-spoilers-within/740645/899 "2015-12-28T05:19:56Z")
> [@DSeid](#): > > Chewie does not strike me as a hugger, or who one would want a hug of mutual consolation with. Don’t Chewie and Leia hug when they first meet on Maz’s planet? ---
**Author:** ![SlackerInc](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slackerinc/32/275_2.png) [@SlackerInc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SlackerInc)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2015, 6:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-the-force-awakens-seen-it-assume-spoilers-within/740645/900 "2015-12-28T06:51:25Z")
> [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](#): > > How _dare_ you not mention translucent Luke Skywalker nodding approvingly at the end. :smack: You are of course correct. Sorry! This is hilarious: > **[The Confused Notes of a Star Wars Newbie Who Felt Compelled to See The Force...](https://www.vulture.com/2015/12/force-awakens-star-wars-newbie.html)** > > This isn’t unlike Showtime’s The Affair. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-the-force-awakens-seen-it-assume-spoilers-within/740645.md?page=44) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-the-force-awakens-seen-it-assume-spoilers-within/740645.md?page=46)