# Star Wars: The Force Awakens - Seen It (Assume Spoilers Within) **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [December 16, 2015, 11:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-the-force-awakens-seen-it-assume-spoilers-within/740645 "2015-12-16T23:16:03Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![Scougs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/scougs/32/3158_2.png) [@Scougs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scougs)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2015, 4:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-the-force-awakens-seen-it-assume-spoilers-within/740645/81 "2015-12-18T16:19:33Z")
For what it’s worth, Daisy Ridley is 23 and her father is in his seventies. It does happen. I think it’s completely plausible that Han and Leia didn’t have a kid for a few years after the events of Jedi. Back in the lightsabre question: will we find out where Luke’s original lightsabre came from? He lost it (along with his hand) during a certain life-defining moment on Bespin, and had built a new one by the time of Jedi. (Of course, it’s a topic for discussion as to how Obi-Wan came to be doing the whole “your father wanted you to have this” thing. “Your father wanted you to have this… at least I think that’s what he said… round about the time I chopped his legs off and left him to do in a volcano…”.) ---
**Author:** ![The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_other_waldo_pepper/32/12370_2.png) [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Other_Waldo_Pepper)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2015, 4:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-the-force-awakens-seen-it-assume-spoilers-within/740645/82 "2015-12-18T16:21:03Z")
> [@Scougs](#): > > “Your father wanted you to have this… at least I think that’s what he said… round about the time I chopped his legs off and left him to do in a volcano…”.) “Well, he _might_ have, if we hadn’t tricked him into thinking you were dead.” ---
**Author:** ![Jophiel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jophiel/32/66_2.png) [@Jophiel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jophiel)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2015, 4:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-the-force-awakens-seen-it-assume-spoilers-within/740645/83 "2015-12-18T16:30:57Z")
Wasn’t the conventional wisdom that only Jedis (and the evil flavor thereof) used light sabers because you needed the Force to prevent cutting your own legs off the first time you swung one around? Then the droid in the prequels got handwaved with a “Well, he’s a droid so he already essentially has preternatural command of his reflexes”. 'Cause ex-Stormtrooper dude did pretty well with it there, even fighting a Force-user for several minutes, not counting his rampage at the temple/bar. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_other_waldo_pepper/32/12370_2.png) [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Other_Waldo_Pepper)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2015, 4:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-the-force-awakens-seen-it-assume-spoilers-within/740645/84 "2015-12-18T16:42:44Z")
> [@Jophiel](#): > > Wasn’t the conventional wisdom that only Jedis (and the evil flavor thereof) used light sabers because you needed the Force to prevent cutting your own legs off the first time you swung one around? Then the droid in the prequels got handwaved with a “Well, he’s a droid so he already essentially has preternatural command of his reflexes”. > > 'Cause ex-Stormtrooper dude did pretty well with it there, even fighting a Force-user for several minutes, not counting his rampage at the temple/bar. Han Solo used one to slice open that tauntaun. I don’t get why they’d be especially difficult to use; they’re not, y’know, _whips._ I mean, if I handed you a practice sword – not a bendy fencing weapon, you understand, but a rigid and lightweight one – and asked you not to touch the blade to any part of your body, could you swing it around without hitting yourself? (Sure, try it with some kind of ball-and-chain weapon and I’d maybe even _expect_ you to hit yourself. But a long knife? I have faith in you.) ---
**Author:** ![Jophiel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jophiel/32/66_2.png) [@Jophiel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jophiel)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2015, 4:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-the-force-awakens-seen-it-assume-spoilers-within/740645/85 "2015-12-18T16:47:41Z")
> [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](#): > > I don’t get why they’d be especially difficult to use; they’re not, y’know, _whips._ I don’t disagree but this always seemed to be the answer to why everyone else wasn’t running around with them, deflecting blaster shots and whatnot. [Random Cite](http://scifi.stackexchange.com/questions/9874/do-non-jedi-and-non-sith-use-lightsabers) ---
**Author:** ![Edward\_The\_Head](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/ce73a5/32.png) [@Edward\_The\_Head](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Edward_The_Head)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2015, 4:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-the-force-awakens-seen-it-assume-spoilers-within/740645/86 "2015-12-18T16:49:59Z")
> [@Northern\_Piper](#): > > I thought it looked Irish. The stonework reminded me of the Aran Isles. When I first saw the islands I thought the geography looked Irish but figured they were shooting somewhere else. Even when I saw the [Beehive Huts](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cloch%C3%A1n) I just figured that it was something that was more universal in what people built. I guess I know my Irish history and geography better then I thought. That would have been a great place to shoot a scene, wonder where they found the sunlight though. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_other_waldo_pepper/32/12370_2.png) [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Other_Waldo_Pepper)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2015, 4:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-the-force-awakens-seen-it-assume-spoilers-within/740645/87 "2015-12-18T16:51:39Z")
> [@Jophiel](#): > > I don’t disagree but this always seemed to be the answer to why everyone else wasn’t running around with them, deflecting blaster shots and whatnot. Oh, I wouldn’t expect them to deflect blaster shots. Which is kind of the point, I guess; if you don’t have Jedi reflexes, you’re probably better off in a gunfight with a blaster of your own – not because you’d mangle yourself, but because Indy-vs-Swordsman. ---
**Author:** ![Jophiel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jophiel/32/66_2.png) [@Jophiel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jophiel)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2015, 4:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-the-force-awakens-seen-it-assume-spoilers-within/740645/88 "2015-12-18T16:53:54Z")
> [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](#): > > Oh, I wouldn’t expect them to deflect blaster shots. Which is kind of the point, I guess; if you don’t have Jedi reflexes, you’re probably better off in a gunfight with a blaster of your own – not because you’d mangle yourself, but because Indy-vs-Swordsman. Sure but I assume you can agree that there’s a difference between using one for five seconds to open a taun-taun tummy and using one for several minutes to fence a trained user. ---
**Author:** ![Frylock](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/ce7236/32.png) [@Frylock](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frylock)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2015, 4:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-the-force-awakens-seen-it-assume-spoilers-within/740645/89 "2015-12-18T16:55:16Z")
> [@Pork\_Rind](#): > > You know, that light saber she was swinging around? The one Obi-Wan gave Luke the first go round? Oh, I think of that as Luke’s and don’t think of it as Anakin’s but I guess you’re right really. But also, no I don’t think we heard the younglings being slaughtered, I think we heard her yelling “no!” or “please” or something like that when her parents left her. ---
**Author:** ![Stephe96](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bbe5ce/32.png) [@Stephe96](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stephe96)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2015, 5:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-the-force-awakens-seen-it-assume-spoilers-within/740645/90 "2015-12-18T17:00:55Z")
Finn, Rey, Ren. Anyone else find these names confusingly similar? When referenced, I have to think for a minute to remember which was which. Also, Rin Tin Tin and Fay Wray would make awesome Star Wars names. Random observation: three of 2015’s biggest movies have used the thumbs-up gesture for a laugh; Mad Max: Fury Road, The Martian and, now, Star Wars: The Force Awakens. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_other_waldo_pepper/32/12370_2.png) [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Other_Waldo_Pepper)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2015, 5:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-the-force-awakens-seen-it-assume-spoilers-within/740645/91 "2015-12-18T17:06:41Z")
> [@Jophiel](#): > > Sure but I assume you can agree that there’s a difference between using one for five seconds to open a taun-taun tummy and using one for several minutes to fence a trained user. Sure, but in that link you posted I read that someone named Pre Vizla has apparently used one to fight Force users on a couple of occasions; maybe if you’re a skilled fencer, you can use one without too much trouble. (I mean, it’s still _silly_; as we all know from EMPIRE STRIKES BACK, pulling a lightsaber on a Force user without being anywhere near as good with the Force means he can just _stand back and use the Force at you_.) (Heck, think of that sneering idiot who gets Force-choked while insulting Darth Vader: what changes if he has a sword? Like, even if it’s a laser sword?) ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2015, 5:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-the-force-awakens-seen-it-assume-spoilers-within/740645/92 "2015-12-18T17:09:41Z")
> [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](#): > > Oh, I wouldn’t expect them to deflect blaster shots. Which is kind of the point, I guess; if you don’t have Jedi reflexes, you’re probably better off in a gunfight with a blaster of your own – not because you’d mangle yourself, but because Indy-vs-Swordsman. As an aside, from what I understand it’s not just Jedi reflexes that lets them deflect blasters - it’s also Jedi precognition that allows them to know the shot is coming a split-second before it hits. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_other_waldo_pepper/32/12370_2.png) [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Other_Waldo_Pepper)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2015, 5:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-the-force-awakens-seen-it-assume-spoilers-within/740645/93 "2015-12-18T17:17:43Z")
> [@Alessan](#): > > As an aside, from what I understand it’s not just Jedi reflexes that lets them deflect blasters - it’s also Jedi precognition that allows them to know the shot is coming a split-second before it hits. Huh. I was using “Jedi reflexes” to mean “precognitive reflexes”; I’m not even sure they’re supposed to have heightened reflexes _beyond_ being precognitive – how could you even tell? – but, yeah, I guess it’s possible they’ve got a double shot of benefits. ---
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2015, 5:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-the-force-awakens-seen-it-assume-spoilers-within/740645/94 "2015-12-18T17:40:07Z")
I, for one, loved it and think some of you are being too nit-picky. 12/10. ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2015, 5:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-the-force-awakens-seen-it-assume-spoilers-within/740645/95 "2015-12-18T17:46:14Z")
> [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](#): > > Huh. I was using “Jedi reflexes” to mean “precognitive reflexes”; I’m not even sure they’re supposed to have heightened reflexes _beyond_ being precognitive – how could you even tell? – but, yeah, I guess it’s possible they’ve got a double shot of benefits. Seems to me that Jedi also have heightened physical capabilities, what with the jumping and flipping and all. ---
**Author:** ![Jophiel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jophiel/32/66_2.png) [@Jophiel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jophiel)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2015, 5:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-the-force-awakens-seen-it-assume-spoilers-within/740645/96 "2015-12-18T17:49:25Z")
> [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](#): > > Sure, but in that link you posted I read that someone named Pre Vizla has apparently used one to fight Force users on a couple of occasions But Extended Universe no longer counts as canon! (Seriously, for not really giving a shit about Star Wars, I know a disturbing amount about Star Wars just from internet osmosis 😛 ) Edit: I guess (looking him up) he was in The Clone Wars cartoon which still counts? Or something? ---
**Author:** ![The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_other_waldo_pepper/32/12370_2.png) [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Other_Waldo_Pepper)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2015, 5:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-the-force-awakens-seen-it-assume-spoilers-within/740645/97 "2015-12-18T17:57:40Z")
> [@Alessan](#): > > Seems to me that Jedi also have heightened physical capabilities, what with the jumping and flipping and all. Unless that’s TK. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_other_waldo_pepper/32/12370_2.png) [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Other_Waldo_Pepper)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2015, 6:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-the-force-awakens-seen-it-assume-spoilers-within/740645/98 "2015-12-18T18:04:24Z")
> [@Jophiel](#): > > But Extended Universe no longer counts as canon! Heh. You know, if we limit ourselves to the movies, the first guy we see picking one up and waving it around is – Luke, before he even knows that the Force can be used for a “these aren’t the droids you’re looking for” effect. Luke, who later tries to parry blasts from the little training drone _before_ he’s learned to actually parry said blasts. If you have the potential, but no training, then by canon you can swing one around without (a) knowing what you’re doing, or (b) mutilating yourself. ---
**Author:** ![iamthewalrus\_3](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/258eb7/32.png) [@iamthewalrus\_3](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iamthewalrus_3)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2015, 6:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-the-force-awakens-seen-it-assume-spoilers-within/740645/99 "2015-12-18T18:36:42Z")
> [@Pork\_Rind](#): > > You know, that light saber she was swinging around? The one Obi-Wan gave Luke the first go round? The one that got lost on Bespin when Luke’s hand got chopped off? I thought the movie was pretty good. The jokes were reasonably funny. The plot was well-paced. The characters had actual character and the actors appeared competently directed. I was disappointed that the plot was so very by-the-numbers of the first movie. I was also disappointed at how small the world seemed, compared to the original trilogy. Part of this was due to the high level of fan service. If you want to cram in all the characters and references, there’s less room for organic world-building. It seemed like Rey’s progression in use of The Force was _way_ too fast to be consistent with the universe as presented in the other movies. Other Jedi take significant training to become that skilled. But the idea presented upthread that she was trained by Luke, and had her memories repressed would make sense of that. I liked Finn and Rey, but I have to imagine there was a conversation something like: JJ: Let’s have a character that’s a Jedi, and flies around with Chewie in the Millennium Falcon, and has cool space hair. George: Well, there are already 3 ch- JJ: No. ---
**Author:** ![Bruce\_Wayne](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/22d042/32.png) [@Bruce\_Wayne](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bruce_Wayne)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2015, 6:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-the-force-awakens-seen-it-assume-spoilers-within/740645/100 "2015-12-18T18:40:48Z")
> [@joemama24\_98](#): > > Agree 100%. This is the only one thing that I really didn’t like. Unless they have big plans for him in the next two, there’s zero point to his character and no backstory presented as to who he/she is. I suppose you can say the same with how the Emperor was revealed in Empire, but this lacked the same impact. In the original trilogy, the existence of the Emperor did not dilute the sinisterness of Vader (perhaps because we saw Vader as the primary antagonist for a full movie before that), but I felt like Ren’s character was diluted by this. The story would have been more powerful for me if it was only Ren who was the “supreme leader” and driving the First Order himself. I haven’t heard anything about Snoke being female. I prefer the Darth Plaguies theory myself. Anakin was conceived without a father, Darth Plaguies could influence the midichlorians to create life. It would make sense for Vader to have a cult following if he was conceived of the Dark side. Also Kylo Ren is just one of many dark side users, in Rey’s flashback and the trailer you saw a few of the Knights of Ren. Benecio Del Toro will probably be one in Ep VIII. I find that refreshing. It would also make sense as to why Luke didn’t just go and whoop ass. If he had to go after both Snoke and his dark knighthood, maybe he was holding out for some help. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-the-force-awakens-seen-it-assume-spoilers-within/740645.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-the-force-awakens-seen-it-assume-spoilers-within/740645.md?page=6)