I don’t have my copy handy, but IIRC in The Making of Star Trek Roddenberry is quoted as saying that everyone on the Enterprise was an officer. His logic was that all of them were the equivalent of 20th century astronauts and so deserved the rank.
I’ll try to dig up my copy this weekend and see if I can find the quote.
That’s true, but consider this… Picard is a man educated in human history. It is established time and time again that Picard has an excellent command of history. It’s his hobby.
In the context of the scene, Picard is arguing that the human race has changed, and in doing so state that a military uniform is a “ridiculous costume.” He’s wearing a uniform! It would be one thing for a soldier from 2002 to say a Revolutionary War outfit looks silly because it’s outdated, but that’s not what Picard was saying; he was obviously saying it was ridiculous because it was a military uniform. It just blows away MY suspension of disbelief that a man allegedly so aware of history would not know that the only difference between his outfit and 3500 years of military uniforms was the style. People who are legitimately well versed in history aren’t that ignorant of their own place in it.
The problem with the scene was that Picard was, as he did many times, channeling Gene Roddenberry’s bizarre claim that Star Trek isn’t militaristic, even though it rather obviously is. I think that if Gene had a chance to go back and re-do the original Star Trek, he would have made Starfleet a civilian organization. But by the time his idealism reached that level, they were into the movies, and the “Star Trek canon” wouldn’t allow them to change the fact that the Federation is a military empire.
The idea of creating a Star Trek that doesn’t have a Starfleet that was basically a 23rd century version of the U.S. Navy strikes me as being a rather intriguing concept. But that’s not what Star Trek is, as it stands.
And while we’re on this subject, that, really, as why the “Prime Directive” is such an ongoing contunuity problem with Star Trek. The whole point of the PD, IMHO, was to try to make Starfleet seem moral and non-imperialistic; “Yes, we’re tooling around with gigantic battleships armed to the gunwales and capable of levelling mountains, but we won’t screw around with lesser civilizations - it’s against the rules! In fact, it’s the biggest rule we have!” The Prime Directive allows the Federation to look and sound a lot like the 20th century United States but with a nice coat of whitewash over the American propensity for forcing its will on weaker nations. But as a plot device, as it turns out, the Prime Directive eats it raw; you just can’t run the serieses the way they did and not violate the Prime Directive. So they’re stuck with the paradox forever now; they have to keep the PD because it’s such a major focal point of the “canon,” but they have to keep breaking it or else the stories will suck big time.
So…you want to know were all the enlisted men in Starfleet are, hmmmmm?
Ya wanna know where they hang out, hmmmmm?
I think we all know the real reason you want to know about the enlisted men, Hail Ants.
You’re going to promise them your help in getting into Starfleet Academy, in exchange for they’re going into the Jeffreys Tubes with you to play “hide the dilithium crystal”.
Again.
We all know you, Hail Ants. 
Just putting my oar in to agree with ** RickJay ** - the whole problem with the PD is that it’s boring as all hell to just go around not interfering with people. That’s why the original series was so much fun - no compunctions about, say shooting the crap out of poor Chekov’s ear worm.
It is something I find utterly insipid about Enterprise, though, that Archer keeps going around saying things like (cue sappy music) “SOME day, there will be some kind of law… A directive! To prevent needless interference between species.” soulful sigh Ack. I thought the whole point of going back in time to pre-PD star trek was to make it exciting and to blow more stuff up. I was wrong.
Prime Directive-Starfleet will not interfere with the natural progression of a culture: any crewmember or vessel is expendible in order to uphold the Prime Directive.
This implies that people have the right to be left alone.
Guess who dosen’t have this right…HUMANS.
Remember the episode where a stellar fragment(?) was about to crash into this planet filled with perfect people who live out their entire lives in this domed city? hen they came into contact with Enterprise, some people wanted to leave with them, leading the city in irrepairable chaos…Riker states “They’re Human, the Prime Directive dosen’t apply.”
And who can forget the forced resettlement and/or abandonment of Federation Colonists in the Cardassian DMZ…surely that was interfereing in their cultures.
Strictly speaking, the Prime Directive only applies to pre-warp cultures. Once a civilization achieves FTL, interference is inevitable.
That’s what I used to think, but in TNG they were invoking it to forbid Picard from interfering in the Klingon civil war, and the Klingons certainly weren’t pre-warp. Mind you, I felt not getting involved in that war was a good policy on it’s face, but not because it would violate the prime directive.
What they ought to do is do a show where the Enterprise meets a superior culture and they invoke the PD for their own protection. I mean, it’s arrogant (or deluded) to believe that your culture can handle anything it encounters, right?
I thought the “no involvement in the Klingon Civil War” rule was more so Starfleet wouldn’t be dragged into Klingon politics in such a way that one side would lose or gain support depending on if the “filthy Humans” were helping them. Of course, “filthy Humans” using tachyeon fields to discover the “filthy Romulans” wasn’t a violation because of complex logic that you’d have to be vulcan to understand. Or crazy. Which is why i understand it…::laughs maniacally next to his “super laser”::
That’s exactly, word for word, what I remember, too. Unfortunately, I don’t have my copy handy, either. Do two identical IIRC’s equal a cite?
However, it must be pointed out that Roddenberry from the very first treatment of the first pilot had a character known as “the Captain’s Yeoman” and there were references to “the officers and crew” in TOS.
Speaking of militarism:
Last night I saw the episode “Mirror, Mirror”, in which Kirk, McCoy, Scott and Uhura are (through the magic of one of the innumerable bizarre transporter accidents) transported to a parallel universe where the Enterprise is part of an evil Empire, Spock has a beard, etc…
After awhile I thought: “Know what? I want to follow the adventures of this ship, as every week they wipe out a peaceful enlightened race, or turn a planet into a glowing ball of slag, while officers try to assassinate each other…”
Sorry Baldwin.
The Mirror-Spock succeeded in disarming his Human Empire unilaterally. Earth was soon decimated by the forces of the Cardassian/Klingon Alliance and humans (and Vulcans) now only survive as slaves.
So how would that work out, for the hard core fans in this bunch? A new series, after Enterprise, dealing with the lives and duties of joe average enlisted men?
Or, OTOH, a series dealing with the Starfleet Ground Forces. Real shoot-em up stuff, fighting on the ground, doing peace keeping missions, etc.
Any takers?
I know from some of the episodes, there are Starfleet ground forces. I don’t know if they are called “Marines” but thats essentially what they are. The show would be a lot cooler if we could see what an actual platoon of Starfleet troopers does. Do they wear body armor? Personal sheilds Holograpic cammofladge or just fancy Ghillie Suits? Do they have artillery or do they simply transport a shell on top of an enemy?
Holy cow did I miss a couple episodes. Where’s this come from, Doc?
Reason I ask is, I’ve read a grand total of one (1) Star trek book, and it contradicts this in a big way; I was under the impression (no idea where I heard this, 'twas years ago) that alla the ST books had to stay within what’s canon, both with the various TV series/movies, and the other books.
[sub]It was a TNG book, Dark Mirror, set in this very universe, for those keeping score.[/sub]
Or did I just get me a whoosh?
Oooh! Me me me!! It’s what I’ve been waiting for since the dawn of ST:TNG and concurrent realisation that we finally get to have sequelage. The main thing that has always annoyed me about Trek is that almost every damn one of the featured characters is top of their field/precociously talented/just happens to have a hobby in studying that one obscure-but-in-this-situation-of-life-or-death-importance field of research. B’Elanna will be quite happily further furrowing her brow about “contech-hyper-whatsit-tachyon-noonie-subverter-whojamagigs” (fair enough, it’s her job), but she’s never allowed to have a stunningly leftfield dangerous-but-it-might-just-work approach to a calamity without Janeway or someone else piping in “Hmmm, you may be right, that’s exactly what I was just thinking.” Everyone being so ceaselessly brilliant is quite exhausting.
What friends and I have been wanting for years from Trek is a cruddy old barge (for once not a federation flagship) which keeps falling to pieces, filled to the brim with grouchy enlisted-types; all of whom graduated bottom of their class, stick to their own field while whining to their union rep. about job-demarcation, grumble constantly about having to go around clearing up the messes left by Riker et al, and pretty much loathe the Federation and all it stands for. If we can also keep the Archer-in-his-underwear factor, I’m happy.
Skkezix: no you weren’t whooshed, but you may be looking in the wrong place. The Original Series episode ended with mirror-Spock agreeing to consider working to pacify the Empire/Federation. We learn the results some years later in an episode of Deep Space Nine (lack of originality is a major 24th-century problem) which starts with an equally improbable transporter accident. This particular episode turned out to be extremely popular and the DS9 characters revisited the mirror universe at least one more time. I’m sure someone can provide the episode refernces.
Roddenberry didn’t have a huge amount (or probably even a significant amount) of creative control over TNG, but his late-in-life longings for some kind of uber-moral nonmilitary premise found a sympathetic ear among the early writers, many of whom were glad to play iconoclasts and slam everything about 20th-century America, even if it made no sense to do so.
On reflection, I can remember an Original episode in which Kirk debates how to resolve some confliuct between two cultures. his solution? He does the 20th century thing and establishes a balance of power, giving weapons to the hill people. If anything, that episode was sympathetic to the Johnson Administration, showing how easy it was to get caught up in messy bloody conflict even if you were planning otherwise.
Picard’s version would be to talk until the bad guys see the light, drop their weapons, and move on to a life of religious fulfillment.
The first DS9 episode was “Crossover” and it was a weird wormhole hiccup caused by an engine malfunction that sent Kira and Bashir into the Mirror Universe. They escaped by repeating the accident.
The second episode was “Through the Looking Glass.” Sisko is kidnaped by the alternate O’Brien to help humans overthrow the Cardassian-Klingon alliance. Featuring an appearance by Tim Russ as the mirror Tuvok, Sisko meets the duplicate of his late wife, Jennifer, a brilliant scientist who is allied with the Klingon-Cardassian alliance. Sisko convinces her she’s on the wrong side before returning to DS9.
The next Mirror episode was “Shattered Mirror.” With Worf now part of the DS9 cast, we must therefore meet HIS duplicate and find out he’s an important military commander in the Mirror Universe. Sisko and his son Jake both go to the M.U. where they learn the Human rebels are building a copy of Sisko’s ship, the Defiant. The duplicate Jennifer is helping them. After one of the best space battles ever seen in a Trek TV episode, Jennifer is killed when the duplicate Kira tries to shoot Jake. Jake and his dad go back to DS9, having watched their “mother” and “wife” die all over again.
The next Mirror episode, “Resurrection,” was a change of pace, in that a couple of Mirror characters (Bareil, duplicate of Kira’s lover) and Kira’s duplicate visit DS9 instead of having our guys visit the M.U. No space battles, no political intrigue, not much of an episode, frankly.
The last Mirror episode, “The Emperor’s New Cloak,” focused mainly on Ezri Dax, Quark and other Ferengis and was as silly and forgettable as that sounds.
Info gathered from www.startrek.com and www.epguides.com .
Here’s someone else who recalls Roddenberry’s book as indicating that all the crew of the 1966-69 Trek Original Series (TOS) version of the Enterprise were, to him, “officers”, because they would be the equivalent of fully trained astronauts. But this was in the 60s, when only steely-eyed test pilots with the Right Stuff and advanced engineering degrees flew in space. Today the US has 3 distinct classes of astronaut – Flight Crew, Mission Specialist, Payload Specialist – who don’t all have to be jet jocks or academic researchers, and the Russians have added “Paying Tourist”. Also, today in the US armed forces a mid-level NCO/PO easily has a bachelor’s degree under her belt (another traditional “mark” of the officer, even though the US Navy does NOT require a BA to become commissioned) so the idea that someone with enough education to be on a Starship would have to be an officer is also out the window.
Gene’s interpretation is probably based more on there being no two distinct “social classes” of spacefarer – notice the TOS “ensign” uniforms were just as slick-sleeved as those of the expendable red-shirted crewmen (i.e., no rank insignia of ANY kind) . Yet, that in itself is not borne out by what is seen on the screen: the bridge crew and the key department heads hang together pretty much exclusively; and anyway for a 400-person crew you would have to have some sort of stratification or else management becomes impossible. By the time of TNG/DS9, the surrender to the idea that yes, it’s reasonable for there to be Enlisted Ratings in Starfleet, goes along with an even further devaluing of the enlisted class – as now they exist, but with the exception of O’Brien, who in the beginning is also an officer (continuity is the bane of Trek), are invisible. Or are ratings only due to force of circumstances (because they can’t make it to the Academy, or because they wanted to go to space fast and don’t want to wait that long).
In any case, ST was not designed as an “ensemble” piece, where you would get whole episodes from various lesser characters’ POV, but as a show with a clear proitagonist: the Captain, with support from his closest associates – thus, only the officers get portrayed in any depth.
And yes, TNG, specially that painful 1st season, was awash in new-agey blather about how great was the enlightenment of their civilization, compared with our 20th century. The later Trek versions produced by Rick Berman at least showed us that utopia had a dark side (though a lot of the plots and story arcs still stank).