Cal, you forgot to mention a human society advanced enough to have faster than light travel but lacking ARTILLERY for christ’s sake.
Hated the movie for all the reasons CalMeacham said.
However, I loved Roughnecks , which is what ST should have been.
I felt the same way when I saw the movie the first time, but upon seeing it over I think it’s part of the message. We aren’t supposed to see the final battle or even know the outcome–we’re just supposed to trust that The Government knows what’s best and will make everything right somehow as long as we do what we’re told. Yes, the acting is poor and the military strategy leaves much to be desired–but that’s not the point.
As for those mentioning RoboCop–yes, see this movie post-haste, but try your darndest to track down the out-of-print director’s cut, and keep in mind that the film is a comedy. You’ll enjoy it much more.
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*Originally posted by CalMeacham *
**I’m the one who said “terminally stupid”, and I stand by it. I have to say that I love the film, nonetheless, and own a copy of it. It was clearly meant as satire, and the guy who wrote the screenplay (who also co-authored the script for Verhoeven’s Robocope) knew what he was doing.
But since the philosophy of the movie is 180 degrees from that of the book, and contains (possibly deliberately) incredible inanities and scientific errors, I still have to say it’s terminally stupid.
Let me put it this way – if someone made a movie out of C.S, Forester’s “Horatio Hornblower” novels, and used the title of one of Forester’s books – “Beat to Quarters”, say – yet had Hornblower sailing a submarine through an ammonia ocean while fighting the Roman navy in triremes during the time of the American Civil War, you’d be pissed. Justifiably, too.
The scientific erors, first o all, are astounding, and in the casse of a godd, no, GREAT, hard sf-author like Heinlein, are particularly galling. Technology-free bugs throwing rocks at earth from the other side of the galaxy? Our great to the zillionth grandchildren might have to worry about it. Colonies of bugs on apparently barren worlds with no vegetation? What are they eating? Space Ships that are almost hit by asteroids coming at them? Where is this stupidity from? Heinlein wrote about exactly this situation, and how easy it is to avoid.
**Military leaders sending in expensively-armed highly-trained troops against
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vastly superior brainless **insects?
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Whose stupid idea was that? Ships that can’t avoid plasma bursts from bugs?
** That are crowded like that in orbit?
[QUOTE’ Forts built in the middle of nowhere, for no obvious purpose, and with key structural elements on the outside? A commander leading a squad through a valley in enemy-held territory with no scouts, intelligence, or air/satellite cover? What the hell were they trying to accomplish?
Downright fascist leaders with Gestapo-like uniforms? Where are Heinlein’s political arguments and his built-in safeguards?
Heinlein would’ve been spinning in his grave. I wonder if anyone ever asked Virginia what she thought of it. **[/QUOTE]
Those are key elements in the first jump Johnny makes in the novel.
All this was intentional on Verhoeven’s part. It’s a satire, and he makes as brilliant use of bad actors as John Waters does.
I agree with this almost entirely. I say almost because I’m one of the slowly growing number who thinks of Showgirls as Verhoeven’s masterpiece to date.
Maybe I am reading things into it. I completely understand the positions of all those who are opposed to the film, too. But I think all the scientific mistakes and tactical blunders are just there to add to the satire.
** RealityChuck **, you mentioned Swift’s A Modest Proposal as an example of a “real” satire: I think you’re absolutely right. But “Troopers” is jam-packed with “moments of satire”, if you ask me, and what’s more, it uses the exact same strategy as A Modest Proposal in reaching its goal. But that might just be me again, reading things into it. 
If you ask me? It’s bad enough that nobody’s ever made a movie of Starship Troopers. But now, thanks to Verhoeven, nobody ever will, either. I mean, Troopers would make an excellent blockbuster movie. Sure, you’d have to tone down the politics and tone up the mindless violence, but I’m OK with that. So what does Verhoeven do instead? He tones up the politics, and tones down the action. Fascist uniforms are not a good tradeoff for powered armor and nuclear hand grenades.
Ummm…no. The satire was intentional, doing it badly was not.
A scattershot satire almost too clever for its own good. It was immediately obvious to me that it was satire and I don’t understand how anybody could miss it. How could anyone think that such a bizzare collision of 1990s teen soap operas, 1950s Americana and 1940s German fascism was meant to be taken seriously? The fact that Verhoeven directed it should have been a dead giveaway. I don’t think he’s ever directed a movie “straight” (Showgirls is similarly misunderstood) and the audience I saw ST with laughed their heads off. That still doesn’t make it brilliant, however, as its reach often exceeded its grasp.
I enjoyed the retro-fascist aesthetic and the portrayal of humans as dangerous agressors out to squash bugs who are clearly the victims. The propaganda shorts and SS Officer Doogie were brilliant. I also love how he twisted Heinlein’s ideas and themes completely out of shape although I admit I would think differently if his writing didn’t always seem to irritate me.
The ridiculous high-school stereotypes and love triangle portrayed with (intentionally) terrible acting and dialogue was also a note perfect send-up of any number of air-headed teen soap operas. In fact, this movie and Wild Things convinced me that Denise Richards was some sort of subversive genius. Sadly, her later filmography would seem to indicate that she wasn’t in on the joke (although Verhoeven surely was). BTW, I love how everybody in Buenos Aires is a blonde-haired, blue-eyed surfer type.
All in all, I think it’s wildly misunderstood.
Although, I admit I liked the idea of co-ed showers! I wonder if phys-ed classes at Annapolis end like that? Casper Van Dien is just a dopey hunk, and doogy Howser as an SS Nazi is delightful!
What I can’t understand: those gross bugs that enjoy eating human brains…how did they find us that tasty?
And the MI “general” found cowering in the storage locker…how come Casper’s superior officerdidn’t just blowhim away?
No they’re not.
They did this ONCE at the beggining of the conflict not after so much time into the conflict. The bugs were tremendously intelligent and even the warrior chaste were described as being reasonable tacticians even though they were good for nothing other than fighting.
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Ships that can’t avoid plasma bursts from bugs?[?QUOTE]
There’s no plasma bursts from bugs in the book, there are missiles.
Ok, that is in the book but there is an explanation. There were lots and lots of ships and they all arrived at once for surprise.
There’s not a mention of anything like these things anywhere in the book.
Yay, Hodge!
The biggest :rolleyes: in the movie though is still the death scene of the tomboy chick (Diz?)
“Diz, I’m sorry”
“It’s OK Johnny, cuz I got to sleep with you first” <croak>
Movie is dumb only because I read the book first
Book is brilliant.
That movie was made 5 years too early and was not thought out clearly. Too much emphasis on action, death and carnage. Hated the Female pilot, couldnt belive they let Dizzy die.
And Rico is supposed to be a Filipino, not some blond nazi with angst.
Ahum… You’re making the statement, so proof of burden is on you - Rico a Filipino? Cite?
From a Heinlein FAQ:
At the end of the book, Rico makes reference to [Ramon] Magsaysay, a great Filipino hero, and mentions that his family’s native tongue is Tagalog (the principal language of the Phillipines).
Personally I though the film was crappy and thought the book was only mediocre Heinlein at best ( a step or two up from his worst, like the lousy Farnham’s Freehold, but several steps below his superior juveniles ).
No accounting for taste, I guess :).
- Tamerlane
The movie was brilliant. It can do no wrong.
Count me among those who think the movie was incredibly stupid. I understood that it was supposed to be satire, but it just didn’t work for me. It seemed as though it was switching back and forth between being satirical and taking itself seriously.
And you know, maybe it’s because I’m a girl and don’t get it, but I never understood why Johnny preferred boring, sappy Carmen to exciting, sexy Dizz. C’mon! Carmen was a wimp. Dizz rocked! (Well, except for that last, incredibly stupid line she had.)
Nope.
The first jump in the novel is a hit & run attack on the Skinnies, a humanoid race that is an ally of the arachnids. They drop from orbit with minimal casualties, set off a talking bomb in a crowded building (one that announces in the local language how many seconds until it goes off, to increase panic), destroy a water processing or power plant (it’s been a long time since I read it), have a little bit of a trouble with the extraction, Dizzy (who is male in the book) dies.
VERY different from the movie.