# "Starvation mode", regular eating, fasting & stubborn belly fat loss **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [October 7, 2013, 9:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/starvation-mode-regular-eating-fasting-stubborn-belly-fat-loss/670576 "2013-10-07T09:30:49Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![elfkin477](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/a9a28c/32.png) [@elfkin477](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elfkin477)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2013, 11:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/starvation-mode-regular-eating-fasting-stubborn-belly-fat-loss/670576/41 "2013-10-08T11:13:57Z")
> [@Kimstu](#): > > Anecdotally, this is not my experience. On the contrary, I find it _easier_ to maintain a reduced-calorie intake when I’m following a vigorous exercise program, and much harder if I’m just doing my regular lifestyle of walking a mile or two every other day or so. Me too, but exercise doesn’t make me hungry because it makes me nauseous. So I’m willing to concede that people who say it makes them hungrier probably are telling the truth. ---
**Author:** ![Telemark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/telemark/32/372_2.png) [@Telemark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Telemark)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2013, 12:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/starvation-mode-regular-eating-fasting-stubborn-belly-fat-loss/670576/42 "2013-10-08T12:43:23Z")
> [@brazil84](#): > > I don’t see how you can be so sure. > > Do you agree that there are bona fide scientific studies out there which suggest there is a relationship between stress and fat distribution? Fair point, there are studies that show some correlation and I’m not up to speed on them. But the OP appears to be asking about specific exercises or diet to reduce belly fat, and so far there is nothing to suggest any way to do that. You can reduce overall body fat and if your body releases belly fat last then it’ll be the last part of your body to become lean. ---
**Author:** ![brazil84](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/8491ac/32.png) [@brazil84](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/brazil84)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2013, 5:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/starvation-mode-regular-eating-fasting-stubborn-belly-fat-loss/670576/43 "2013-10-08T17:17:50Z")
> [@Telemark](#): > > Fair point, there are studies that show some correlation and I’m not up to speed on them. > > But the OP appears to be asking about specific exercises or diet to reduce belly fat, and so far there is nothing to suggest any way to do that. Given that stress might play a role, I would consider a diet and exercise regime designed to minimize stress during weight loss, for example a balanced diet with only a moderate calorie deficit – like 4-5 hundred per day, combined with daily yoga and a relaxing cup of hot tea after each meal. I don’t have a study to back up my proposal, but on the other hand there isn’t much downside to it. ---
**Author:** ![Telemark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/telemark/32/372_2.png) [@Telemark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Telemark)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2013, 6:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/starvation-mode-regular-eating-fasting-stubborn-belly-fat-loss/670576/44 "2013-10-08T18:46:36Z")
> [@brazil84](#): > > I don’t have a study to back up my proposal, but on the other hand there isn’t much downside to it. I can’t argue with that. But I suspect the difference substituting a nap for the yoga would be pretty difficult to measure in weight loss. ---
**Author:** ![JohnClay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/c37758/32.png) [@JohnClay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnClay)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2013, 3:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/starvation-mode-regular-eating-fasting-stubborn-belly-fat-loss/670576/45 "2013-10-09T03:02:20Z")
> [@Telemark](#): > > …But the OP appears to be asking about specific exercises or diet to reduce belly fat, and so far there is nothing to suggest any way to do that… > **[Abdominal fat and what to do about it - Harvard Health](https://www.health.harvard.edu/staying-healthy/abdominal-fat-and-what-to-do-about-it)** > > Abdominal, or visceral, fat is of particular concern because it's a key player in a variety of health problems — much more so than subcutaneous fat, the kind you can grasp with your hand.... **…The good news is that visceral fat yields fairly easily to exercise and diet,…** > **[The Skinny On Stubborn Belly Fat](https://www.prevention.com/weight-loss/diets/a20429173/flat-belly-diet-subcutaneous-and-visceral-belly-fat/)** > > The two kinds of fat you have—and what to do about it **…What also distinguishes the Flat Belly Diet is that it targets the second type of fat—visceral—which is much more dangerous and difficult to lose…** I’ve heard that magazines like Prevention aren’t very accurate though that first link had “Harvard” in the title… > **[Visceral Fat](https://www.diabetes.co.uk/body/visceral-fat.html)** > > Visceral fat is body fat thats stored within the abdominal cavity around a number of important internal organs such as the liver, pancreas and intestines. **…Harvard University states that diet and exercise have been to be more effective at reducing visceral fat than the fat around our hips and thighs…** BTW that page also said this: **…Liposuction only removes subcutaneous fat and therefore should not be undertaken as a procedure for improving health…** ☹ I thought that might have been a possibility to help that woman with a huge belly. ---
**Author:** ![Isilder](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/cc9497/32.png) [@Isilder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Isilder)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2013, 10:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/starvation-mode-regular-eating-fasting-stubborn-belly-fat-loss/670576/46 "2013-10-09T10:21:51Z")
> [@AaronX](#): > > Ok there seems to be (objective, studied) consensus on this. But how about fat GAIN? Does anything affect where you gain fat? Why do we have terms like “beer belly”? Its just the same. There is no fat cell differentiation, it may be in the heart muscle more or less than on the belly or bum. Men drink beer , and men tend to put fat onto their belly first (or mostly). Some guys have fat legs and no huge belly. ---
**Author:** ![Darth\_Panda](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ee7513/32.png) [@Darth\_Panda](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darth_Panda)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2013, 11:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/starvation-mode-regular-eating-fasting-stubborn-belly-fat-loss/670576/47 "2013-10-09T11:05:28Z")
This is from what I would consider a reliable source, WebMD, quoting an expert in the field: > [@](#): > > So when you lose weight, what kind or kinds of fat do you shed? “You’re losing white fat,” Fried tells WebMD. “People tend to lose evenly all over.” > > The results change a bit, however, if you add workouts to your calorie reduction, she says. “ **If you exercise plus diet you will tend to lose slightly more visceral fat from your belly.** ” > > “We’re at an exciting point in science,” says Whitmer, echoing the input from other scientists in the field. > > Whitmer and others expect more discoveries about fat of all types to be made in the near future. (bolding mine) > **[What You Need to Know About Body Fat](https://www.webmd.com/diet/features/the-truth-about-fat?page=3)** > > Body fat isn’t just about your size or how you look. It’s crucial to your body’s function and overall health. The person being quoted is > [@](#): > > Susan Fried, PhD, director of the Boston Obesity and Nutrition Research Center at Boston University and the article was reviewed by Louise Chang, MD. > [@](#): > > Chang completed her undergraduate degree at Stanford University and attended medical school at New York Medical College. She completed her internal medicine residency at Saint Vincent’s Hospital in New York City, where she also served as a chief resident. Prior to joining WebMD, Dr. Chang served as an attending physician at Grady Memorial Hospital and faculty of the Emory University School of Medicine. She currently is adjunct assistant professor of medicine at Emory University School of Medicine. ---
**Author:** ![brazil84](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/8491ac/32.png) [@brazil84](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/brazil84)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2013, 2:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/starvation-mode-regular-eating-fasting-stubborn-belly-fat-loss/670576/48 "2013-10-09T14:05:47Z")
> [@Isilder](#): > > Its just the same. There is no fat cell differentiation, > it may be in the heart muscle more or less than on the belly or bum. > > Men drink beer , and men tend to put fat onto their belly first (or mostly). I did a Google search on alcohol and visceral fat and found [this study](http://nutrition.highwire.org/content/133/8/2655.full) among other things. > [@](#): > > Alcohol Drinking Patterns Differentially Affect Central Adiposity as Measured by Abdominal Height in Women and Men Central adiposity = belly fat AFAIK. ---
**Author:** ![SerafinaPekala](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecae2f/32.png) [@SerafinaPekala](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SerafinaPekala)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2013, 2:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/starvation-mode-regular-eating-fasting-stubborn-belly-fat-loss/670576/49 "2013-10-09T14:46:16Z")
The trick for me was to trigger the IGF (insulin growth factor) and hGH. Many ways to do this but fasting after 7p, exercise in short high intensity bursts (HIIT) and taking secretagogues (GIYF) did it finally for me. I take glutamine 2000mg po on empty stomach at bedtime for 6 months, then switch to GrowthFactor9 for 6 months. I dont eat eggs, gluten, sugar or sugar subs, soy, peanuts, or dairy. Its essentially the Virgin Diet and I take the protein powder drink for brek mixed with colostrum powder, greens powder and royal jelly. I only eat meat, veggies, quinoa and fruits and lots of water and green tea. Believe me its not that hard and its self-perpetuating once you realize how much better your body works this way. YMMV of course, just sharing what works for me. ---
**Author:** ![Lucas\_Jackson](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lucas_jackson/32/303_2.png) [@Lucas\_Jackson](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lucas_Jackson)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2013, 3:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/starvation-mode-regular-eating-fasting-stubborn-belly-fat-loss/670576/50 "2013-10-09T15:02:37Z")
> [@JohnClay](#): > > If you do a google search for lose belly fat there are lots of results… i.e. it seems that that kind of fat can be targeted. I have my ACE certification and have worked at various health clubs during my life. Despite the preponderance of websites, ads and fascination with belly fat there is no way to target it in any meaningful way. It’s a national obsession. Think of all the ‘ab-buster’ type devises there are ads and infomercials for. If there was a way to target belly fat, it would be well known. From a practical standpoint spot reducing will not work, period. Look at the link in Darth Panda’s post. “Exercise plus diet” is the best thing you can do. But that’s standard advice and it will pull fat from your body in the reverse order your body put it on. BTW, in my experience exercise does not stimulate appetite. ---
**Author:** ![brazil84](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/8491ac/32.png) [@brazil84](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/brazil84)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2013, 3:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/starvation-mode-regular-eating-fasting-stubborn-belly-fat-loss/670576/51 "2013-10-09T15:26:01Z")
> [@White SIFL](#): > > I have my ACE certification and have worked at various health clubs during my life. Despite the preponderance of websites, ads and fascination with belly fat there is no way to target it in any meaningful way. The studies which have been linked to suggest that one should avoid binge drinking; supplement diet with exercise; and avoid being stressed out. Not sure how effective these things are, but they are probably a good idea in any event. I think that the “you can’t spot reduce” crowd is focusing on peoples’ attempts to reduce fat in a particular area of the body by exercising that particular area of the body. For example trying to reduce belly fat by doing crunches. ---
**Author:** ![SerafinaPekala](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecae2f/32.png) [@SerafinaPekala](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SerafinaPekala)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2013, 3:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/starvation-mode-regular-eating-fasting-stubborn-belly-fat-loss/670576/52 "2013-10-09T15:37:54Z")
A large belly can signify poor digestion, too. Google “Leaky gut syndrome”. If you are sensitive to certain foods they can aggravate it certainly. ---
**Author:** ![ollie73082](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/97f17d/32.png) [@ollie73082](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ollie73082)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2013, 6:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/starvation-mode-regular-eating-fasting-stubborn-belly-fat-loss/670576/53 "2013-10-09T18:45:38Z")
> [@scr4](#): > > Yes, but don’t hormones affect how many calories you expend? Absolutely. There seems to be a lack of communication between the calories in/out crowd and the hormone crowd. I think most of the reasonable calorie in/out folk would agree that hormones, insulin, cortisol, how often you eat, etc. can affect your metabolism or your appetite. But when you get down past all those things you just cannot gain weight if you are burning more energy than you are taking in. You’re welcome everyone!! ---
**Author:** ![Deeg](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/deeg/32/2955_2.png) [@Deeg](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Deeg)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2013, 8:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/starvation-mode-regular-eating-fasting-stubborn-belly-fat-loss/670576/54 "2013-10-09T20:09:07Z")
> [@panache45](#): > > And how old are you? When I was in my 20s I ate pretty much whatever I wanted to eat, in any quantity, and I got very little exercise. I was somewhat overweight, but not anywhere near obese. Now, four decades later, I eat almost exclusively lean protein, fruits, vegetables, and whole grains . . . everything I know I should be eating . . . and I still get very little exercise, and I weigh about 70 lbs. more than in my 20s. So neither the quantity nor the quality of food is the deciding factor. The only factor that has changed for the worse is my age. I don’t think the “Calories in/out” crowd isn’t saying you can’t change calories out–one’s metabolism can be slightly changed by exercise and age. I think, however, we forget how much we moved around when we were younger. ---
**Author:** ![JohnClay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/c37758/32.png) [@JohnClay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnClay)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2013, 11:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/starvation-mode-regular-eating-fasting-stubborn-belly-fat-loss/670576/55 "2013-10-10T11:31:53Z")
I watched an interesting documentary “The Truth About Exercise With Michael Mosley” Here’s the transcript: [http://livedash.ark.com/transcript/the\_truth\_about\_exercise\_with\_michael\_mosley/918/KQED/Thursday\_April\_11\_2013/634479/](http://livedash.ark.com/transcript/the_truth_about_exercise_with_michael_mosley/918/KQED/Thursday_April_11_2013/634479/) An interesting bit: **00:17:00 In a four year study, a thousand people were made to exercise 4 hours a week for 20 weeks 00:17:07 And though on average their fitness improved, when Jamie looked at the data in detail, he found people responded very differently to exactly the same amount of training. 00:17:22 And if you look at the data from a thousand people, what you find is that we’ve a got a graph that’s a bit like this. 00:17:32 There are some people over here getting one hell of a lot of benefit from it. 00:17:36 These guys here are super responders. 00:17:41 These guys here, no change. 00:17:44 Right. How many people fall into these two groups? 00:17:48 That’s about 20% of the population and the upper end, the extreme is about 15%. 00:17:53 That is one hell of a scary statistic I have to say. 00:18:00 Jamie and his collaborators investigated the reasons for these variations and discovered much of it can be traced to just 11 genes.** Some of it is about fat loss. ---
**Author:** ![Telemark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/telemark/32/372_2.png) [@Telemark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Telemark)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2013, 12:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/starvation-mode-regular-eating-fasting-stubborn-belly-fat-loss/670576/56 "2013-10-10T12:12:30Z")
So, are you exercising and eating less now? ---
**Author:** ![DSeid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dseid/32/20194_2.png) [@DSeid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSeid)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2013, 1:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/starvation-mode-regular-eating-fasting-stubborn-belly-fat-loss/670576/57 "2013-10-10T13:09:43Z")
Earlier in this thread I stated categorically that exercise will preferentially reduce abdominal visceral fat. Here’s some of the support for that. It definitely [does](http://care.diabetesjournals.org/content/20/3/385.abstract?ijkey=bc75013ffa49762193d3ddccae29a44206780168&keytype2=tf_ipsecsha) for those who T2 Diabetes. > [@](#): > > Physical training significantly decreased abdominal fat evaluated by magnetic resonance imaging (umbilicus), with a greater loss of visceral adipose tissue (VAT) (48%) in comparison with the loss of subcutaneous adipose tissue (18%), but did not significantly affect body weight. And the literature showing that exercise is essential for reducing diabetes risk, particularly in those who are overweight or obese, is [overwhelming.](http://care.diabetesjournals.org/content/35/8/1680.full) But was that preferential loss of abdominal visceral fat true only in diabetics? And was it a result of the total negative energy balance rather than the exercise per se? [A study this year](http://jap.physiology.org/content/112/1/79.full) answers that. Viscearal adipose tissue (VAT), and intramuscular adipose tissue (IMAT) are indeed preferentially lost with exercise over calorie reduction (CR) for the same amount of fat lost in all obese subjects. > [@](#): > > In the present study, after statistically accounting for whole body fat mass changes, the reductions in VAT in response to exercise-induced weight loss were significantly greater than those seen in response to CR. Taken together, these results indicate that exercise results in preferential reductions in thigh IMAT and VAT compared with CR, provided that the exercise volume is sufficient to induce weight loss. … > > … Acute vigorous exercise stimulates lipolysis in adipocytes through increases in sympathetic adrenergic activity (3, 17, 32). Although this effect is systemic, visceral adipose tissue is especially sensitive to lipolytic activation by the adrenal system (2). Therefore, it seems plausible that the exercise-induced adrenal activity is at least partly responsible for the preferential reductions in VAT seen in our study. … Again this does NOT mean that exercise preferentially hits that stubborn pinchable belly fat. ---
**Author:** ![JohnClay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/c37758/32.png) [@JohnClay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnClay)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2013, 8:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/starvation-mode-regular-eating-fasting-stubborn-belly-fat-loss/670576/58 "2013-10-11T08:23:57Z")
> [@Telemark](#): > > So, are you exercising and eating less now? Well I have been eating too many cookies/biscuits lately… as far as exercise goes I’m mainly just doing chin-ups. ---
**Author:** ![Mijin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mijin/32/9369_2.png) [@Mijin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mijin)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2013, 9:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/starvation-mode-regular-eating-fasting-stubborn-belly-fat-loss/670576/59 "2013-10-11T09:07:08Z")
> [@ollie73082](#): > > There seems to be a lack of communication between the calories in/out crowd and the hormone crowd. I think most of the reasonable calorie in/out folk would agree that hormones, insulin, cortisol, how often you eat, etc. can affect your metabolism or your appetite. But when you get down past all those things you just cannot gain weight if you are burning more energy than you are taking in. Also, the precise mix of gut bacteria makes a big difference, at least in mice. In humans there are strong correlations between some bacterial species and obesity, but we’re not quite in a position where we can say “This species = BAD” yet. So, I agree that there are a mix of factors, but much of the science has come down on the side of physiology in recent years, and de-emphasized any role of gluttony. There are clear differences in how hungry people feel, given a particular diet, and what different bodies do with excess calories. Still, many people prefer to see it as mass being inversely proportional to willpower. (In case it sounds like I’m making excuses, I’m personally in very good shape. I exercise a lot, but I credit the assist to having manageable appetite levels). ---
**Author:** ![Telemark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/telemark/32/372_2.png) [@Telemark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Telemark)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2013, 12:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/starvation-mode-regular-eating-fasting-stubborn-belly-fat-loss/670576/60 "2013-10-11T12:42:17Z")
> [@JohnClay](#): > > Well I have been eating too many cookies/biscuits lately… as far as exercise goes I’m mainly just doing chin-ups. Your eating habits and lack or cardio exercise are far more likely to have an impact on your waistline than anything posted in this thread. Have you considered adding some walking/running/biking to your daily activities? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/starvation-mode-regular-eating-fasting-stubborn-belly-fat-loss/670576.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/starvation-mode-regular-eating-fasting-stubborn-belly-fat-loss/670576.md?page=4)