# Starving Artist - we remember you **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [December 3, 2014, 4:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/starving-artist-we-remember-you/706204 "2014-12-03T04:53:17Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 14
**Author:** ![Spice\_Weasel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spice_weasel/32/5435_2.png) [@Spice\_Weasel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spice_Weasel)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2014, 9:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/starving-artist-we-remember-you/706204/261 "2014-12-05T21:56:10Z")
> [@Mr.Nylock](#): > > No. I am saying what I wrote. I am making no other inferences or exptrapolaions. I am saying that life is not universally better for all black people. Anecdotally, I know of areas that really were hit hard by the crack epidemic, and have met people who have told me about it. There is also the sociological phenomenon of white flight which as far as I know is accepted as a factual thing that does indeed exist. Inner city black people were effected by these things; some neighborhoods deteriorated tremendously. Those who could not get out of them were not in better shape before these event occurred; those who were able to move and adapt probably do have a better life now. It depends upon who you talk to. The loss of factory and union jobs of course is another thing to effect black people. The restructuring of welfare benefits under Clinton also had a polarizing effect: > > \*But while welfare reform may have initially reduced poverty, it left those still living at that income level worse off than they were before, reaching fewer of them and giving those it did reach less. And our poverty rates didn’t stay low. When they began to rise again, the program couldn’t offer them the support it used to. The recession has been a crystal clear, and incredibly painful, demonstration of this fact. > > Dylan Matthews has already taken a look at the claim that millions moved off of welfare’s rolls and poverty was reduced. As he writes, the program’s numbers have steadily fallen since 1996: “Since reform, the rolls have shrunk from 12.6 million to 4.6 million.” The number of people in poverty “fell by 6.4 million people under Clinton, whereas the number of people in poverty increased by 7.4 million between 1981 and 1993 (and the rate went from 14 percent to 15.1 percent).” There is a catch, though. “But it’s worth noting that welfare reform led to a huge spike in extreme poverty, as defined as the number of households making under $2 a day,” Matthews adds.\* > > [The Nation](http://www.thenation.com/blog/169788/clinton-touts-welfare-reform-heres-how-it-failed) > > So, to me, someone saying that every black person they have talked to thinks life is better just makes me think they have an isolated view. To use that isolated view as a basis for “fighting ignorance” seems silly to me. It’s just my opinion. This is a great post, and I would agree with the general rule that ‘‘the black people I talk to are more representative of reality than the black people you talk to’’ is a pretty dumb argument. That said, **Starving Artist** was claiming that liberal policies have been bad for black people, and the information you provided here might erroneously be used to support that point. The thing is, while Clinton was technically a liberal, his welfare reform was a mighty conservative move for him politically. I would not, by any stretch of the imagination, consider TANF an example of liberal policy in action. TANF made it harder for poor families to qualify for aid, established a lifetime limit (2-5 years, at state’s discretion) on the aid that could be received, and tied the receipt of that aid to the expectation of work. Among people I know who study the issue of income inequality, it is almost universally reviled as an example of policy based on conservative values failing to address systemic problems. ---
**Author:** ![miss\_elizabeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/838e76/32.png) [@miss\_elizabeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/miss_elizabeth)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2014, 10:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/starving-artist-we-remember-you/706204/262 "2014-12-05T22:10:38Z")
> [@Spice\_Weasel](#): > > I think it’s not as simple as having less empathy, more in viewing problems of the ‘‘privileged’’ demographics to be less a result of systemic problems and therefore less likely to be preventable. Of course, liberals are sometimes wrong about this - bias in the court systems against men who seek child custody is very much a systemic problem, for example. No, it isn’t. This used to be true, but no longer is. It is a lie spread by the Men’s Rights Activists because it is the only legitimate sounding cause they can tout. But it’s a lie. Cites: [http://amptoons.com/blog/files/Massachusetts\_Gender\_Bias\_Study.htm](http://amptoons.com/blog/files/Massachusetts_Gender_Bias_Study.htm) [http://www.villainouscompany.com/vcblog/archives/2012/04/child\_supportcu.html](http://www.villainouscompany.com/vcblog/archives/2012/04/child_supportcu.html) [http://parenting.blogs.nytimes.com/2009/11/17/more-fathers-getting-custody-in-divorce/](http://parenting.blogs.nytimes.com/2009/11/17/more-fathers-getting-custody-in-divorce/) > **[Do Dads REALLY Get Dissed In Divorce Court?](https://www.huffpost.com/entry/dispelling-the-myth-of-ge_b_1617115)** > > We hear a lot about how the courts are biased in favor of mothers when deciding child custody. [http://www.leadershipcouncil.org/1/res/cust\_myths.html](http://www.leadershipcouncil.org/1/res/cust_myths.html) Sorry, I’m just really really tired of people granting quasi-legitmacy to MRA’s with this. ---
**Author:** ![Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/8edcca/32.png) [@Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hentor_the_Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2014, 10:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/starving-artist-we-remember-you/706204/263 "2014-12-05T22:33:11Z")
It’s funny how there’s always one female poster who sees **Starving Artist** as terribly misunderstood, or like some kind of recovery project. Why am I blanking on the name of the previous iteration of **Spice Weasel**? Anyway, good luck with that. ---
**Author:** ![Starving\_Artist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@Starving\_Artist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Starving_Artist)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2014, 10:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/starving-artist-we-remember-you/706204/264 "2014-12-05T22:46:30Z")
You blank on much, and usually manage to be utterly wrong about the few things you do manage to keep in mind. But thanks for your sexist and misogynist post implying that if anyone’s going to be a sap for ol’ **Starvey’s** bullshit it’s invariably going to be a woman. :dubious: ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2014, 10:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/starving-artist-we-remember-you/706204/265 "2014-12-05T22:54:41Z")
Well, it’s possible there are multiple saps, but so far only women have summoned the effort to try to defend/redeem you, Starving. The sample size isn’t large enough to make any general hypotheses. That you spew bullshit is, I trust, undisputed. ---
**Author:** ![Spice\_Weasel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spice_weasel/32/5435_2.png) [@Spice\_Weasel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spice_Weasel)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2014, 10:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/starving-artist-we-remember-you/706204/266 "2014-12-05T22:54:57Z")
> [@Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](#): > > It’s funny how there’s always one female poster who sees **Starving Artist** as terribly misunderstood, or like some kind of recovery project. Why am I blanking on the name of the previous iteration of **Spice Weasel**? > > Anyway, good luck with that. I don’t suppose it was **olivesmarch4th**? I get ragged on all the time for trying to connect with people that my friends have decided are not worth it. _giant tentacled creature descends upon city and devours people whole_ **Spice Weasel** : Let me talk to it! It’s just misunderstood! **Sr. Weasel** says I’m going in the closet when Cthulhu rises. ---
**Author:** ![Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/8edcca/32.png) [@Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hentor_the_Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2014, 11:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/starving-artist-we-remember-you/706204/267 "2014-12-05T23:01:19Z")
> [@Bryan\_Ekers](#): > > Well, it’s possible there are multiple saps, but so far only women have summoned the effort to try to defend/redeem you, Starving. The sample size isn’t large enough to make any general hypotheses. > > That you spew bullshit is, I trust, undisputed. I wouldn’t say “women”, just a single one at a time. Kind of like a Sith thing, I guess. ---
**Author:** ![Starving\_Artist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@Starving\_Artist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Starving_Artist)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2014, 11:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/starving-artist-we-remember-you/706204/268 "2014-12-05T23:04:14Z")
> [@Spice\_Weasel](#): > > I don’t suppose it was **olivesmarch4th**? I’ve had rewarding friendships with several women here over the years, though I think in **olives’** case I was probably more fond of her than she was of me. ---
**Author:** ![stretch](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a6a055/32.png) [@stretch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/stretch)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2014, 11:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/starving-artist-we-remember-you/706204/269 "2014-12-05T23:13:06Z")
> [@Spice\_Weasel](#): > > I don’t suppose it was **olivesmarch4th**? I get ragged on all the time for trying to connect with people that my friends have decided are not worth it. I believe \*\*Hentor \*\*may be thinking of **Zoe** , not your previous username. ---
**Author:** ![chorpler](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chorpler/32/2888_2.png) [@chorpler](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/chorpler)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2014, 11:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/starving-artist-we-remember-you/706204/270 "2014-12-05T23:14:17Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > I’ve had rewarding friendships with several women here over the years, though I think in **olives’** case I was probably more fond of her than she was of me. Just to clarify, **olivesmarch4th** and **Spice Weasel** are the same person… I’m pretty sure. ---
**Author:** ![Starving\_Artist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@Starving\_Artist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Starving_Artist)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2014, 11:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/starving-artist-we-remember-you/706204/271 "2014-12-05T23:23:55Z")
Ah, so that explains why I haven’t remembered previous conversations **SW’s** mentioned us having had. Thanks. And thanks to you, too, former **olives**. Nice to see you again. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Starving\_Artist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@Starving\_Artist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Starving_Artist)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2014, 11:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/starving-artist-we-remember-you/706204/272 "2014-12-05T23:26:25Z")
> [@stretch](#): > > I believe \*\*Hentor \*\*may be thinking of **Zoe** , not your previous username. Yes, or maybe **EddyTeddyFreddy.** Unfortunately **ETF** and I eventually came to a parting of the ways. Zoe was (and hopefully still is) a great friend and a very good person. ---
**Author:** ![Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/8edcca/32.png) [@Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hentor_the_Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2014, 11:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/starving-artist-we-remember-you/706204/273 "2014-12-05T23:36:34Z")
> [@stretch](#): > > I believe \*\*Hentor \*\*may be thinking of **Zoe** , not your previous username. That’s it! Thanks. ---
**Author:** ![Ludovic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7ab992/32.png) [@Ludovic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ludovic)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2014, 11:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/starving-artist-we-remember-you/706204/274 "2014-12-05T23:39:32Z")
> [@Mr.Nylock](#): > > Inner city black people were **effected** by these things Just because the creation of the term “inner city” implying “black people” was influenced by white flight doesn’t mean the people didn’t exist before that 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Starving\_Artist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@Starving\_Artist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Starving_Artist)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2014, 11:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/starving-artist-we-remember-you/706204/275 "2014-12-05T23:55:28Z")
> [@Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](#): > > That’s it! Thanks. Yeah, **Hector the Librarian** for some reason used to get really annoyed when I would wish **Zoe** a good night. But he’s an asshole so no one cared. ---
**Author:** ![Morgenstern](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f9ae1b/32.png) [@Morgenstern](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Morgenstern)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2014, 12:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/starving-artist-we-remember-you/706204/276 "2014-12-06T00:13:11Z")
This HazMat suit is getting cumbersome. ---
**Author:** ![Spice\_Weasel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spice_weasel/32/5435_2.png) [@Spice\_Weasel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spice_Weasel)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2014, 12:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/starving-artist-we-remember-you/706204/277 "2014-12-06T00:43:37Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > I’ve had rewarding friendships with several women here over the years, though I think in **olives’** case I was probably more fond of her than she was of me. Ha! [QUOTE=chorpler] Just to clarify, olivesmarch4th and Spice Weasel are the same person… I’m pretty sure. [/QUOTE] Technically true, though I can’t say it always feels that way. I would have about died if that’s who **Hentor** had been thinking of. We try to leave ourselves behind, but can we ever really escape? ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2014, 12:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/starving-artist-we-remember-you/706204/278 "2014-12-06T00:55:55Z")
> [@Spice\_Weasel](#): > > **Sr. Weasel** says I’m going in the closet when Cthulhu rises. I’m sure that Cthulhu is far more popular on this board than **Starving Artist.** 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2014, 1:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/starving-artist-we-remember-you/706204/279 "2014-12-06T01:56:49Z")
> [@Colibri](#): > > I’m sure that Cthulhu is far more popular on this board than **Starving Artist.** 😉 Eric Cartman is more popular than **Starving Artist**. ---
**Author:** ![Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/8edcca/32.png) [@Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hentor_the_Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2014, 2:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/starving-artist-we-remember-you/706204/280 "2014-12-06T02:09:22Z")
> [@Guinastasia](#): > > Eric Cartman is more popular than **Starving Artist**. Most non-fatal (and some fatal) diseases are more popular than **Starving Artist**. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/starving-artist-we-remember-you/706204.md?page=13) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/starving-artist-we-remember-you/706204.md?page=15)