# State of Florida vs. George Zimmerman Trial Thread **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [June 20, 2013, 8:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/state-of-florida-vs-george-zimmerman-trial-thread/661501 "2013-06-20T20:32:41Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 12
**Author:** ![hmarvin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/858c86/32.png) [@hmarvin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hmarvin)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2013, 5:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/state-of-florida-vs-george-zimmerman-trial-thread/661501/221 "2013-06-27T17:34:45Z")
DD’s timeline just isn’t working. According to her, Trayvon is at his father’s house (?), the phone disconnects, twenty seconds go by before rerconnecting, and two minutes later, the confrontation begins. ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2013, 5:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/state-of-florida-vs-george-zimmerman-trial-thread/661501/222 "2013-06-27T17:35:18Z")
> [@steronz](#): > > These are teenagers you’re talking about. Kids. They’re not known for good judgement. > > Also, they’re _black_ teenagers. There’s a cultural element here, an ingrained (and logical) distrust of the police. So the culturally expected behavior in this case is what exactly? If he is not inclined to call the police to deal with such matters what are you suggesting is the normal course of action? ---
**Author:** ![Terr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/839c29/32.png) [@Terr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Terr)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2013, 5:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/state-of-florida-vs-george-zimmerman-trial-thread/661501/223 "2013-06-27T17:37:31Z")
> [@hmarvin](#): > > DD’s timeline just isn’t working. According to her, Trayvon is at his father’s house (?), the phone disconnects, twenty seconds go by before rerconnecting, and two minutes later, the confrontation begins. If I remember her today’s testimony correctly, she claimed Martin was “right next to” his father’s fiancee’s house as the verbal confrontation started. ---
**Author:** ![steronz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steronz/32/11765_2.png) [@steronz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/steronz)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2013, 5:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/state-of-florida-vs-george-zimmerman-trial-thread/661501/224 "2013-06-27T17:42:46Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > So the culturally expected behavior in this case is what exactly? If he is not inclined to call the police to deal with such matters what are you suggesting is the normal course of action? The culturally expected behavior is for him to “man up” and not be a pussy about it. Seriously. In some cultures (like my neighborhood), if your neighbors are being rowdy you call the police to file a noise complaint. In other cultures you just go over there and ask them to turn it down. Don’t like confrontation? Worried you’ll get your ass kicked for interfering in their party? Tough shit, man up. Getting the cops involved is a huge no-no. If we believe even the gist of DD’s testimony, Martin initiated the confrontation by, at the very least, stopping, turning around, and saying, “Why are you following me.” That he confronted Zimmerman about Zimmerman’s behavior doesn’t mean that he wasn’t afraid, nor does it mean that he’s the one who made the confrontation physical. I believe it’s likely that he was conditioned to overcome his fears in that situation and deal with his stalker “like a man.” I don’t think he was looking for a fight. ---
**Author:** ![Hbns](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/8edcca/32.png) [@Hbns](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hbns)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2013, 5:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/state-of-florida-vs-george-zimmerman-trial-thread/661501/225 "2013-06-27T17:49:11Z")
> [@standingwave](#): > > I didn’t find that credible either. I know the name of the street I live on and just doing a quick rundown in my mind, I know the names of several cross streets in each direction. Nine in total. I hate to admit, but after 9 years I still don’t know the names of the two immediately adjacent cross streets to my house. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2013, 5:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/state-of-florida-vs-george-zimmerman-trial-thread/661501/226 "2013-06-27T17:51:35Z")
> [@steronz](#): > > The culturally expected behavior is for him to “man up” and not be a pussy about it. Seriously. In some cultures (like my neighborhood), if your neighbors are being rowdy you call the police to file a noise complaint. In other cultures you just go over there and ask them to turn it down. Don’t like confrontation? Worried you’ll get your ass kicked for interfering in their party? Tough shit, man up. Getting the cops involved is a huge no-no. > > If we believe even the gist of DD’s testimony, Martin initiated the confrontation by, at the very least, stopping, turning around, and saying, “Why are you following me.” That he confronted Zimmerman about Zimmerman’s behavior doesn’t mean that he wasn’t afraid, nor does it mean that he’s the one who made the confrontation physical. I believe it’s likely that he was conditioned to overcome his fears in that situation and deal with his stalker “like a man.” I don’t think he was looking for a fight. That would be more relevant if Martin were on trial. What’s the relevance for Zimmerman’s trial? ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2013, 5:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/state-of-florida-vs-george-zimmerman-trial-thread/661501/227 "2013-06-27T17:52:59Z")
> [@standingwave](#): > > I didn’t find that credible either. I know the name of the street I live on and just doing a quick rundown in my mind, I know the names of several cross streets in each direction. Nine in total. Having now seen posts from people here affirming that they, too, don’t know the names of close cross-streets in their own neighborhoods, does this change your assessment of the credibility? I don’t know the name of the cross street nearest my house. ---
**Author:** ![DragonAsh](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/db5fbb/32.png) [@DragonAsh](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DragonAsh)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2013, 5:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/state-of-florida-vs-george-zimmerman-trial-thread/661501/228 "2013-06-27T17:56:57Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > Having now seen posts from people here affirming that they, too, don’t know the names of close cross-streets in their own neighborhoods, does this change your assessment of the credibility? I haven’t heard anyone say that they are sometimes able to remember the names of close cross-streets and sometimes they forget. I haven’t heard any other neighborhood watch captains say they don’t know the names of nearby cross streets. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2013, 6:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/state-of-florida-vs-george-zimmerman-trial-thread/661501/229 "2013-06-27T18:04:08Z")
> [@DragonAsh](#): > > I haven’t heard anyone say that they are sometimes able to remember the names of close cross-streets and sometimes they forget. I haven’t heard any other neighborhood watch captains say they don’t know the names of nearby cross streets. Have you heard anything at all from other neighborhood watch captains? Because as you phrase it, you seem to be accepting the fallacy of _argumentum ignoratium_: because I have heard nothing, my assumption is true. ---
**Author:** ![steronz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steronz/32/11765_2.png) [@steronz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/steronz)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2013, 6:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/state-of-florida-vs-george-zimmerman-trial-thread/661501/230 "2013-06-27T18:08:45Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > That would be more relevant if Martin were on trial. > > What’s the relevance for Zimmerman’s trial? DD’s testimony is that Martin was scared, but that he wasn’t moving very quickly away from the danger and/or calling the police. People here are saying that discredits her testimony because it’s unreasonable that Martin would act that way. ---
**Author:** ![PatriotX](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/c4cdca/32.png) [@PatriotX](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PatriotX)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2013, 6:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/state-of-florida-vs-george-zimmerman-trial-thread/661501/231 "2013-06-27T18:18:02Z")
> [@Hbns](#): > > I hate to admit, but after 9 years I still don’t know the names of the two immediately adjacent cross streets to my house. If you wanted to find the name of those streets, would you check in the middle of the block for a street sign? Or would you go to an intersection? ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2013, 6:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/state-of-florida-vs-george-zimmerman-trial-thread/661501/232 "2013-06-27T18:18:45Z")
> [@Hbns](#): > > I hate to admit, but after 9 years I still don’t know the names of the two immediately adjacent cross streets to my house. I’m in the same boat after 20 years. I knew all the street names of the area I lived in as a kid because I visited other kids in the neighborhood. I loosely know a few neighbors around me but all my adult friends live elsewhere. I have no reason to know any of the streets around me. I drive straight to my house from major connecting road. If you mentioned the names of the streets around me I would recognize them as being close by but not know exactly where they are. ---
**Author:** ![PatriotX](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/c4cdca/32.png) [@PatriotX](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PatriotX)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2013, 6:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/state-of-florida-vs-george-zimmerman-trial-thread/661501/233 "2013-06-27T18:19:48Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > I don’t know the name of the cross street nearest my house. If it was 7pm in Feb and it was rainy, would you get out of your car in the middle of the block to find a street sign? Or would you drive to the intersection? ---
**Author:** ![Dallas\_Jones](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dallas_jones/32/3277_2.png) [@Dallas\_Jones](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dallas_Jones)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2013, 6:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/state-of-florida-vs-george-zimmerman-trial-thread/661501/234 "2013-06-27T18:20:05Z")
Rachel Jeantel aka Dee Dee’s testimony is going to be disregarded as unreliable. Today she had to admit that she cannot even read the letter she supposedly wrote to Trayvon’s mom about what she heard on the phone that night. Because…she can’t read cursive writing. Of the letter she wrote. This witness has no credibility any longer. > **[George Zimmerman Witness Can't Say Who Threw First Punch](https://abcnews.go.com/US/george-zimmerman-witness-read-letter-wrote-shooting/story?id=19504826#.UcyANCLn-Uk)** > > A woman who was talking on the phone to Trayvon Martin moments before he was shot and killed by George Zimmerman acknowledged on the stand today that she does not know whether Zimmerman or Martin started the fatal fight. > [@](#): > > Jeantel, head bowed, eyes averted whispered into the court microphone, “Some but not all. I don’t read cursive.” > > It sent a hush through the packed courtroom And then she admits that she lied under oath . > [@](#): > > “Under oath, you created a lie and said you went to the hospital?” asked West. > > “Yes,” responded Jeantel. She said she lied because she didn’t want to see the body. ---
**Author:** ![DragonAsh](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/db5fbb/32.png) [@DragonAsh](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DragonAsh)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2013, 6:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/state-of-florida-vs-george-zimmerman-trial-thread/661501/235 "2013-06-27T18:21:03Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > Have you heard anything at all from other neighborhood watch captains? > > Because as you phrase it, you seem to be accepting the fallacy of _argumentum ignoratium_: because I have heard nothing, my assumption is true. Huh? I’m saying that I find it odd that someone acting as a neighborhood watch captain in the area - someone that has shown previously that he can and does remember the names of the streets in the area - would suddenly not remember the name of the street. Remember, the only reason the whole ‘name of the street’ cock & bull story comes up at all is because Zimmerman uses that has his pretext for getting out of the truck (‘I didn’t know what street I was on so I got out of the truck to look for a street sign’). ---
**Author:** ![PatriotX](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/c4cdca/32.png) [@PatriotX](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PatriotX)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2013, 6:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/state-of-florida-vs-george-zimmerman-trial-thread/661501/236 "2013-06-27T18:22:17Z")
> [@Dallas\_Jones](#): > > Of the letter she wrote. This witness has no credibility any longer. > [George Zimmerman Witness Can't Say Who Threw First Punch - ABC News](http://abcnews.go.com/US/george-zimmerman-witness-read-letter-wrote-shooting/story?id=19504826#.UcyANCLn-Uk) Your link says that she didn’t write the letter. ---
**Author:** ![steronz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steronz/32/11765_2.png) [@steronz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/steronz)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2013, 6:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/state-of-florida-vs-george-zimmerman-trial-thread/661501/237 "2013-06-27T18:22:39Z")
Right, she dictated the letter. ---
**Author:** ![Dallas\_Jones](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dallas_jones/32/3277_2.png) [@Dallas\_Jones](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dallas_Jones)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2013, 6:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/state-of-florida-vs-george-zimmerman-trial-thread/661501/238 "2013-06-27T18:30:26Z")
> [@steronz](#): > > Right, she dictated the letter. > [@](#): > > Your link says that she didn’t write the letter. She was forced to admit today. Up until today’s testimony it was a letter\* she \*sent to his mom. From the same link that you are selectively citing. > [@](#): > > A teenage friend of Trayvon Martin was forced to admit today in the George Zimmerman murder trial that she did not write a letter that was sent to Martin’s mother describing what she allegedly heard on a phone call with Martin moments before he was shot. No credibility remains for her. ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2013, 6:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/state-of-florida-vs-george-zimmerman-trial-thread/661501/239 "2013-06-27T18:31:21Z")
> [@PatriotX](#): > > If you wanted to find the name of those streets, would you check in the middle of the block for a street sign? > Or would you go to an intersection? you would look back at the intersection to see if you could see it and move on. In this case the sign is located on the Southeast Corner of the street and not visible. Looking for a street sign does not cancel out tracking Martin. There is no doubt that he intended to keep Martin in sight. Looking for a street sign while talking to a dispatcher reflects his attempts at trying to relay location and is consistent with what he was doing. ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2013, 6:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/state-of-florida-vs-george-zimmerman-trial-thread/661501/240 "2013-06-27T18:33:40Z")
> [@Dallas\_Jones](#): > > She was forced to admit today. Up until today’s testimony it was a letter\* she \*sent to his mom. From the same link that you are selectively citing. > > No credibility remains for her. Is she illiterate or incapable of writing? editing to say I think she spelled her name in court. why would she dictate a letter? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/state-of-florida-vs-george-zimmerman-trial-thread/661501.md?page=11) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/state-of-florida-vs-george-zimmerman-trial-thread/661501.md?page=13)