# State of Florida vs. George Zimmerman Trial Thread **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [June 20, 2013, 8:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/state-of-florida-vs-george-zimmerman-trial-thread/661501 "2013-06-20T20:32:41Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 89
**Author:** ![Fotheringay-Phipps](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/d9b06d/32.png) [@Fotheringay-Phipps](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fotheringay-Phipps)\ **Post date:** [July 12, 2013, 7:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/state-of-florida-vs-george-zimmerman-trial-thread/661501/1761 "2013-07-12T19:29:23Z")
> [@Stoid](#): > > I am white. I don’t think race is an important issue at all, and Zimmerman is guilty. You’re liberal, which is close enough. People are rarely in touch with the interaction between their emotions and thoughts enough to provide a valid assessment of its extent (and they’re also biased in this regard). IMO close to 100% of people who think GZ is guilty do so because they are wedded to the general idea of black-kid-as-victim-of-angry-white-man to the point where they will see it in this case regardless of th facts. ---
**Author:** ![UltraVires](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ecccb3/32.png) [@UltraVires](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UltraVires)\ **Post date:** [July 12, 2013, 7:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/state-of-florida-vs-george-zimmerman-trial-thread/661501/1762 "2013-07-12T19:36:51Z")
> [@Jack\_Batty](#): > > There was a contention that Martin’s hands were on Zimmerman’s face – where the blood was. Was it claimed that he placed his hands on his face after he hit him square in the nose AND after the wound started bleeding? ---
**Author:** ![Jack\_Batty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jack_batty/32/3201_2.png) [@Jack\_Batty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jack_Batty)\ **Post date:** [July 12, 2013, 7:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/state-of-florida-vs-george-zimmerman-trial-thread/661501/1763 "2013-07-12T19:39:19Z")
If I recall, Zimmie claimed he was being smothered to a point where he though he might pass out, after they were on the ground. ---
**Author:** ![Terr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/839c29/32.png) [@Terr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Terr)\ **Post date:** [July 12, 2013, 7:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/state-of-florida-vs-george-zimmerman-trial-thread/661501/1764 "2013-07-12T19:40:17Z")
> [@jtgain](#): > > Was it claimed that he placed his hands on his face after he hit him square in the nose AND after the wound started bleeding? .. and that he placed his hands on his face in the position to get the blood on them and not in other place, … and that he placed his hands on his face after Zimmerman got up (since when you’re on your back and your nose is internally bleeding, the blood does not show outside the nose). Etc. etc. ---
**Author:** ![simster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/simster/32/1047_2.png) [@simster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/simster)\ **Post date:** [July 12, 2013, 7:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/state-of-florida-vs-george-zimmerman-trial-thread/661501/1765 "2013-07-12T19:40:38Z")
I think Z is guilty - not of M2 - moreso of Manslaughter or ‘negligent homicide’ because his actions directly led to the death of Martin. He started the chain of events. He, by having a CC permit, has a ‘larger culpability’ for his actions, especially since he had to discharge his firearm in an effort to ‘stop’ the chain of events that he started. Did he have a ‘right’ to do what he ‘did’ (followng, pursuing, getting out of truck to get address, etc) ? yes - should he have done it differently so as not to ‘provoke’ the other party? absolutely - announcing himself, etc was all that was needed. Had Martin been up to "no good’ (as he assumed from the outset) - then that announcment would have caused Martin to flee - had he waited in the car until the cops arrived (as he had done in the past) - none of this would have happened. IOW, he caused the situation that neccesitated his ‘self defense’ - and while in the eyes of the ‘law’ he has the right to it, I think he should still be punished (under the law) for causing the situation to begin with. (Not saying there is a law that he could be punished under - jsut ath is how I see it). ---
**Author:** ![BlakeTyner](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/50afbb/32.png) [@BlakeTyner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BlakeTyner)\ **Post date:** [July 12, 2013, 7:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/state-of-florida-vs-george-zimmerman-trial-thread/661501/1766 "2013-07-12T19:40:57Z")
> [@Stoid](#): > > I am white. I don’t think race is an important issue at all, and Zimmerman is guilty. The protesters presently outside the courtroom disagree. [https://twitter.com/NatalieTolomeo/status/355772754018054144/photo/1](https://twitter.com/NatalieTolomeo/status/355772754018054144/photo/1) The middle sign is the cutest. ---
**Author:** ![Jack\_Batty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jack_batty/32/3201_2.png) [@Jack\_Batty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jack_Batty)\ **Post date:** [July 12, 2013, 7:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/state-of-florida-vs-george-zimmerman-trial-thread/661501/1767 "2013-07-12T19:41:07Z")
IMO close to 100% of people who think GZ in innocent do so because they are wedded to the general idea of a lawful gun owner doing whatever the fuck he wants with his gun, because, by virtue of the fact that if he owns a gun, he must be right in anything he wants to do with it. Holds about as much water as the bullshit Fotheringay is slinging. ---
**Author:** ![brazil84](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/8491ac/32.png) [@brazil84](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/brazil84)\ **Post date:** [July 12, 2013, 7:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/state-of-florida-vs-george-zimmerman-trial-thread/661501/1768 "2013-07-12T19:41:47Z")
> [@Stoid](#): > > I am white. I don’t think race is an important issue at all, Then why do you care about this case enough to post hundreds and hundreds of times on the subject? You do realize, don’t you, that thousands and thousands of people get shot and killed every year? What is it about this case that resonates with you? ---
**Author:** ![RedFury](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ec9cab/32.png) [@RedFury](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RedFury)\ **Post date:** [July 12, 2013, 7:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/state-of-florida-vs-george-zimmerman-trial-thread/661501/1769 "2013-07-12T19:44:36Z")
> [@jtgain](#): > > Was it claimed that he placed his hands on his face after he hit him square in the nose AND after the wound started bleeding? **Jack’s** correct – GZ claims he was smothered after the initial punch to the nose. So where’s the blood on Martin’s hands? This case has more holes than Swiss Cheese. ---
**Author:** ![Hermitian](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hermitian/32/470_2.png) [@Hermitian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hermitian)\ **Post date:** [July 12, 2013, 7:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/state-of-florida-vs-george-zimmerman-trial-thread/661501/1770 "2013-07-12T19:46:54Z")
Do jury deliberations happen on the weekends? Do they get to go anywhere or do they have to stay isolated? ---
**Author:** ![RedFury](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ec9cab/32.png) [@RedFury](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RedFury)\ **Post date:** [July 12, 2013, 7:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/state-of-florida-vs-george-zimmerman-trial-thread/661501/1771 "2013-07-12T19:48:31Z")
I’ve broken my nose a couple of times and IME the bleeding starts as soon as the injury. Splat! ---
**Author:** ![Human\_Action](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/ac91a4/32.png) [@Human\_Action](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Human_Action)\ **Post date:** [July 12, 2013, 7:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/state-of-florida-vs-george-zimmerman-trial-thread/661501/1772 "2013-07-12T19:49:41Z")
> [@RedFury](#): > > **Jack’s** correct – GZ claims he was smothered after the initial punch to the nose. So where’s the blood on Martin’s hands? > > This case has more holes than Swiss Cheese. Recall the testimony of Dr. Bao, [the medical examiner?](http://www.clickorlando.com/news/medical-examiner-says-trayvon-martin-suffered-after-being-shot-by-george-zimmerman/-/1637132/20851274/-/156rxi6z/-/index.html) > [@](#): > > West focused on how Martin’s body was transported from the crime scene. Martin’s hands were not bagged to preserve evidence as they should be, Bao said. West asked what time the medical examiner’s office got to the scene. Bao said according to the note, the office arrived about two hours after the shooting occurred. ---
**Author:** ![UltraVires](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ecccb3/32.png) [@UltraVires](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UltraVires)\ **Post date:** [July 12, 2013, 7:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/state-of-florida-vs-george-zimmerman-trial-thread/661501/1773 "2013-07-12T19:52:04Z")
> [@RedFury](#): > > **Jack’s** correct – GZ claims he was smothered after the initial punch to the nose. So where’s the blood on Martin’s hands? > > This case has more holes than Swiss Cheese. Did the initial punch hit flush or was it one of the subsequent ones on the ground? I think this whole thread shows (at minimum) reasonable doubt. ---
**Author:** ![Terr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/839c29/32.png) [@Terr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Terr)\ **Post date:** [July 12, 2013, 7:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/state-of-florida-vs-george-zimmerman-trial-thread/661501/1774 "2013-07-12T19:55:35Z")
> [@RedFury](#): > > I’ve broken my nose a couple of times and IME the bleeding starts as soon as the injury. Splat! When you’re lying on your back? ---
**Author:** ![BlakeTyner](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/50afbb/32.png) [@BlakeTyner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BlakeTyner)\ **Post date:** [July 12, 2013, 7:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/state-of-florida-vs-george-zimmerman-trial-thread/661501/1775 "2013-07-12T19:56:21Z")
> [@RedFury](#): > > I’ve broken my nose a couple of times and IME the bleeding starts as soon as the injury. Splat! And if, say, you were on your back, the blood goes where? Hence why modern medical advice in the event of a nosebleed is to pinch the bridge of the nose and lean the head forward, not back, so that _the blood doesn’t run down your throat._ And, of course, it’d be good police procedure to bag the hands of the body, particularly on a wet, rainy night. That pesky H20, man. ---
**Author:** ![Iggy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iggy/32/3364_2.png) [@Iggy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Iggy)\ **Post date:** [July 12, 2013, 7:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/state-of-florida-vs-george-zimmerman-trial-thread/661501/1776 "2013-07-12T19:56:54Z")
> [@Hermitian](#): > > Do jury deliberations happen on the weekends? > > Do they get to go anywhere or do they have to stay isolated? Here’s at least [one claim](http://gretawire.foxnewsinsider.com/2013/07/11/if-no-verdict-by-5pm-friday-will-the-zimmerman-jury-work-all-weekend-or-rest-until-monday-click-to-find-out/) that they will likely deliberate through the weekend, if needed. Sequestered juries do not always work through the weekend. In the Gosnell case they [took the weekend off](http://www.breitbart.com/Big-Government/2013/05/10/Drained-Gosnell-Jury-Leaves-For-Weekend-With-No-Verdict). ---
**Author:** ![Stoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/stoid/32/272_2.png) [@Stoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stoid)\ **Post date:** [July 12, 2013, 7:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/state-of-florida-vs-george-zimmerman-trial-thread/661501/1777 "2013-07-12T19:59:28Z")
> [@brazil84](#): > > Then why do you care about this case enough to post hundreds and hundreds of times on the subject? > > You do realize, don’t you, that thousands and thousands of people get shot and killed every year? What is it about this case that resonates with you? It’s not the case itself for me, it’s the debate. Which has been remarkable. ---
**Author:** ![hmarvin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/858c86/32.png) [@hmarvin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hmarvin)\ **Post date:** [July 12, 2013, 8:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/state-of-florida-vs-george-zimmerman-trial-thread/661501/1778 "2013-07-12T20:05:50Z")
> [@RedFury](#): > > **Jack’s** correct – GZ claims he was smothered after the initial punch to the nose. So where’s the blood on Martin’s hands? > > This case has more holes than Swiss Cheese. By your logic, the facf they couldn’t find Zimmerman’s DNA or fingerprints on the gun’s trigger and slide proves he didn’t fire the gun. ---
**Author:** ![Stoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/stoid/32/272_2.png) [@Stoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stoid)\ **Post date:** [July 12, 2013, 8:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/state-of-florida-vs-george-zimmerman-trial-thread/661501/1779 "2013-07-12T20:07:29Z")
> [@BlakeTyner](#): > > It was the same, old, same old. Throwing a bunch of stuff at the wall and hoping something would stick. He kept saying “If this…if that…if, if, if.” Told the jury to use their hearts. > > You know what he never said? “The evidence proves…” True enough. But he just sucked in every way. Again, not because it wasn’t possible to NOT suck with what he had, it absolutely was. I was mentally rewriting everythign he was saying in the moment he was saying it, it wasn’t hard. He just happened to suck…really, really badly. It could have been so much more straightforward, clean connections, and it wasn’t. He drove right past SO many important things and dwelled on such insubstantial stuff. And he drove me CRAZY with all completely unnecessary “you’ll be seeing in a minute…” “as I’ll be showing you later” WTF? Dude, you are a professional at this stuff? Holy shit. This was the moment I started to think there might be something to the notion that the prosecution is deliberately trying to tank the case. We’ll see how O’Mara does. (I watch on Youtube after the fact, being in Cali and all) Since I find him thoroughly repugnant out the gate, it will be interesting. ---
**Author:** ![BlakeTyner](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/50afbb/32.png) [@BlakeTyner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BlakeTyner)\ **Post date:** [July 12, 2013, 8:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/state-of-florida-vs-george-zimmerman-trial-thread/661501/1780 "2013-07-12T20:10:31Z")
Oh, **Stoid** , wait until you get to the State’s rebuttal. You’ll feel like the guy from that one scene in “Scanners.” [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/state-of-florida-vs-george-zimmerman-trial-thread/661501.md?page=88) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/state-of-florida-vs-george-zimmerman-trial-thread/661501.md?page=90)