# State your religion, please. Here's your ticket. **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [April 30, 2006, 6:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/state-your-religion-please-heres-your-ticket/354818 "2006-04-30T06:36:34Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![liberty](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/958977/32.png) [@liberty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/liberty)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2006, 3:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/state-your-religion-please-heres-your-ticket/354818/61 "2006-05-01T03:10:43Z")
[QUOTE=Monty] Well, evidently that particular church itself doesn’t consider it a slur. [/QUOTE] . I’m a member myself. I remember President Hincley trying to move us away from using the term “Mormon” I imagine the church mormon in that sute because most non-members know us by. ---
**Author:** ![liberty](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/958977/32.png) [@liberty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/liberty)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2006, 3:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/state-your-religion-please-heres-your-ticket/354818/62 "2006-05-01T03:15:40Z")
[QUOTE=DocCathode] Huh. I always thought that it came from the fact that when the angel Moroni led Joseph Smith to the hill Cumhorra and gave him the seerstones Urim and Thumim so that he could read the golden plates, Smith called the translated text The Book Of Mormon. It seems natural that outsiders would call believers Mormons. I’ve been told that Mormon is not the preferred term, but never that it was a slur. I’m more concerned with the fact that people keep calling my religion Judaism. We do NOT worship Judah! Sure, during Hannukah mom includes this Judah Maccabee doll in the decorations and he’s really cute, like a Hebraic Cabbage Patch Kid, but we do NOT worship him. [/QUOTE] I guess I just get a little upset at being called Mormon because a lot of people believe then we worship Mormon and not Christ. Oh well, I’m over sensiiv anyway. ---
**Author:** ![DocCathode](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/doccathode/32/18773_2.png) [@DocCathode](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DocCathode)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2006, 3:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/state-your-religion-please-heres-your-ticket/354818/63 "2006-05-01T03:21:42Z")
[QUOTE=liberty] I guess I just get a little upset at being called Mormon because a lot of people believe then we worship Mormon and not Christ. Oh well, I’m over sensiiv anyway. [/QUOTE] I’ve never heard that allegation. Last time I checked, most people were also clear that Lutherans do not worship Luther, Calvinists do not worship Calvin, and Baptists do not worship the god Bapti, baptismal fonts, or black American princesses. ---
**Author:** ![liberty](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/958977/32.png) [@liberty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/liberty)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2006, 3:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/state-your-religion-please-heres-your-ticket/354818/64 "2006-05-01T03:25:46Z")
[QUOTE=DocCathode] I’ve never heard that allegation. Last time I checked, most people were also clear that Lutherans do not worship Luther, Calvinists do not worship Calvin, and Baptists do not worship the god Bapti, baptismal fonts, or black American princesses. [/QUOTE] I have heard people tell me to my face that mormons worship mormon or Joseph Smith. ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2006, 3:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/state-your-religion-please-heres-your-ticket/354818/65 "2006-05-01T03:28:30Z")
And Catholics are told they worship Mary. Get over it. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2006, 3:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/state-your-religion-please-heres-your-ticket/354818/66 "2006-05-01T03:32:36Z")
[QUOTE=DocCathode] Huh. I always thought that it came from the fact that when the angel Moroni led Joseph Smith to the hill Cumhorra and gave him the seerstones Urim and Thumim so that he could read the golden plates, Smith called the translated text The Book Of Mormon. It seems natural that outsiders would call believers Mormons. I’ve been told that Mormon is not the preferred term, but never that it was a slur. I’m more concerned with the fact that people keep calling my religion Judaism. We do NOT worship Judah! Sure, during Hannukah mom includes this Judah Maccabee doll in the decorations and he’s really cute, like a Hebraic Cabbage Patch Kid, but we do NOT worship him. [/QUOTE] The suffix, “-ism” does not connote that the root word is an object of worship. “-ism” only denotes a system of thought, doctrine or theory in the mode of or in relationship to the noun to which the suffix is added. (“pacifism” is not the worship of peace, e.g.). “Judaism” is not intended to imply the worship of Judah but the religion and culture of the Jewish people (i.e. the tribe and region of Judah/judea). If I’m being whooshed, please disregard all of the above. ---
**Author:** ![Mighty\_Girl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/7bcc69/32.png) [@Mighty\_Girl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mighty_Girl)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2006, 3:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/state-your-religion-please-heres-your-ticket/354818/67 "2006-05-01T03:33:15Z")
And by the way, since they say the baby weighted 7 lbs it seems as if he is VERY skinny. I say it must be a mistake. ---
**Author:** ![Mighty\_Girl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/7bcc69/32.png) [@Mighty\_Girl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mighty_Girl)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2006, 3:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/state-your-religion-please-heres-your-ticket/354818/68 "2006-05-01T03:35:26Z")
:: Looks around. Checks forum :: **Fuck!** Wrong thread. :: goes away mumbling uninteligibly :: ---
**Author:** ![liberty](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/958977/32.png) [@liberty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/liberty)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2006, 3:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/state-your-religion-please-heres-your-ticket/354818/69 "2006-05-01T03:35:41Z")
[QUOTE=Guinastasia] And Catholics are told they worship Mary. Get over it. [/QUOTE] I even had a catholic professor tell me they do. I am over it. I’m not over by a baptist school saying I couldn’t get hired because I wasn’t “Christian” when I was. ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2006, 3:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/state-your-religion-please-heres-your-ticket/354818/70 "2006-05-01T03:38:15Z")
[QUOTE=liberty] I even had a catholic professor tell me they do. I am over it. I’m not over by a baptist school saying I couldn’t get hired because I wasn’t “Christian” when I was. [/QUOTE] Well, your Catholic professor was wrong-Catholics don’t worship saints, they honor and respect them. Just because you don’t like the term “mormon” doesn’t make it a slur. You can tell people you prefer LDS, but don’t tell them, “Mormon is a slur!” when it’s not. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2006, 3:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/state-your-religion-please-heres-your-ticket/354818/71 "2006-05-01T03:48:15Z")
[QUOTE=liberty] I even had a catholic professor tell me they do. [/quote] Are you sure he din’t use a word more like “revere?” If he told you that Catholics worship Mary, he’s not only wrong but propagating a misapprehension that the RCC has been historically been very touchy about and taken pains to dispel. Maybe he said that Catholics _pray_ to Mary? That would be true but she is not prayed to as an object of worship. Mary and other saints are petitioned for intercession but they are not worshipped as deities in their own right. ---
**Author:** ![DocCathode](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/doccathode/32/18773_2.png) [@DocCathode](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DocCathode)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2006, 3:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/state-your-religion-please-heres-your-ticket/354818/72 "2006-05-01T03:50:17Z")
[QUOTE=Diogenes the Cynic] If I’m being whooshed, please disregard all of the above. [/QUOTE] I think the real problem is that speaking the Ineffable Name properly can work literal miracles, and mispronouncing it leads to things like insanity and demons eating your soul. Probably for the best we just go with Judaism. **Guinastasia** I think **Liberty** meant that the Catholic professor told him ‘The LDS worship Smith.’ ---
**Author:** ![liberty](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/958977/32.png) [@liberty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/liberty)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2006, 4:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/state-your-religion-please-heres-your-ticket/354818/73 "2006-05-01T04:00:51Z")
The professor was female. She said that in Europe, they had statues of Mary that were huge and they prayed to it. I can’t quote her but it was something to the effect that they worshipped her. ---
**Author:** ![chorpler](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chorpler/32/2888_2.png) [@chorpler](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/chorpler)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2006, 4:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/state-your-religion-please-heres-your-ticket/354818/74 "2006-05-01T04:05:13Z")
The way I understand it, the term “Mormonite” was created by critics of Joseph Smith’s new religion, in response to his “Gold Bible” turning out to be called _The Book of Mormon_, and was intended to be a derogatory label. This was quickly shortened to “Mormon,” and can’t really be considered derogatory anymore, though clearly the leaders would prefer to be known as “The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints.” ---
**Author:** ![Excalibre](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/898d66/32.png) [@Excalibre](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Excalibre)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2006, 4:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/state-your-religion-please-heres-your-ticket/354818/75 "2006-05-01T04:19:02Z")
[QUOTE=liberty] I have heard people tell me to my face that mormons worship mormon or Joseph Smith. [/QUOTE] People believe all sorts of stupid things. I would recommend against taking those allegations seriously. [QUOTE=Guinastasia] Well, your Catholic professor was wrong-Catholics don’t worship saints, they honor and respect them. Just because you don’t like the term “mormon” doesn’t make it a slur. You can tell people you prefer LDS, but don’t tell them, “Mormon is a slur!” when it’s not. [/QUOTE] Can **Monty** or **liberty** tell me, if they know, whether “LDS” is the proper term for people from the other Mormon churches? I know a lovely couple (and I know it’s a stereotype that Mormons are particularly nice, decent people, but it’s one that seems to be true from my experience) who belong, I think, to the Community of Christ (formerly the Reorganized Church of Jesus Christ and Latter-day Saints) - at any rate, they belong to one of the other large, mainstream Mormon congregations as opposed to the Salt Lake City folks. I’m familiar with “LDS” as a moniker for members of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, but I’m not sure if it’s specific to that church or to Mormons in general. (That’s why I’ve been using the term “Mormon” in this thread.) This is a minor deal and I’m not sure if you guys will know the specifics, but if you do I’d be much obliged. ---
**Author:** ![dangermom](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e274bd/32.png) [@dangermom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dangermom)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2006, 4:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/state-your-religion-please-heres-your-ticket/354818/76 "2006-05-01T04:48:39Z")
“Mormon” started off as a slur long ago, I believe, but it hasn’t been for donkey’s years. The LDS Church is trying to move away from it for official purposes (like news articles etc.), partly because people don’t always connect Mormons and LDS as the same people, and they want to stick to the more accurate term rather than a nickname. But ordinary people don’t care much and mostly still call themselves Mormons and LDS indiscriminately. **Excalibre** , you can’t call a CoC/RLDS member LDS; once upon a time you would have put the R in front, and now you should just say Community of Christ (and then clarify that it means RLDS, because most people don’t know that anyway!). Everyone disagrees on whether you can call \*other \*splinter groups Mormons or LDS. There’s a group that has almost exactly the same name. Some of the polygamist sects call themselves fundamentalist Mormons, which the LDS Church doesn’t like. Some of them have other odd names. Not living in Utah, I don’t know much about them anyway. But there’s no consensus, and I suppose it’s simplest to identify splinter sects by their full names and the big one as the LDS Church. I wanted to go see _States of Grace_, but it hasn’t come to town. Sigh. It’s supposed to be quite good. The director’s first two movies were great; this one is a sequel to the first, _God’s Army_, which was also about missionary life in LA. ---
**Author:** ![chorpler](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chorpler/32/2888_2.png) [@chorpler](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/chorpler)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2006, 4:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/state-your-religion-please-heres-your-ticket/354818/77 "2006-05-01T04:52:11Z")
[QUOTE=Excalibre] Can **Monty** or **liberty** tell me, if they know, whether “LDS” is the proper term for people from the other Mormon churches? I know a lovely couple (and I know it’s a stereotype that Mormons are particularly nice, decent people, but it’s one that seems to be true from my experience) who belong, I think, to the Community of Christ (formerly the Reorganized Church of Jesus Christ and Latter-day Saints) - at any rate, they belong to one of the other large, mainstream Mormon congregations as opposed to the Salt Lake City folks. I’m familiar with “LDS” as a moniker for members of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, but I’m not sure if it’s specific to that church or to Mormons in general. (That’s why I’ve been using the term “Mormon” in this thread.) This is a minor deal and I’m not sure if you guys will know the specifics, but if you do I’d be much obliged. [/QUOTE] That’s a good question. In my experience, “LDS” is usually used to refer specifically to mainstream Mormons. Usually Community of Christ folk are called RLDS, while fundamentalists are called FLDS (if they belong to the actual Fundamentalist Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints – the Colorado City group who just moved to Texas) or just “fundamentalist Mormons.” Of course, the mainstream LDS church objects to that term. ---
**Author:** ![brianjedi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/3be4f8/32.png) [@brianjedi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/brianjedi)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2006, 4:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/state-your-religion-please-heres-your-ticket/354818/78 "2006-05-01T04:53:40Z")
[QUOTE=DocCathode] I’ve never heard that allegation. Last time I checked, most people were also clear that Lutherans do not worship Luther, Calvinists do not worship Calvin, and Baptists do not worship the god Bapti, baptismal fonts, or black American princesses. [/QUOTE] You mean the Lutherans don’t worship Luther Vandross? Next you’ll be telling me that the Calvinists aren’t big Bill Watterson fans. ---
**Author:** ![Zoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/a4c791/32.png) [@Zoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zoe)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2006, 5:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/state-your-religion-please-heres-your-ticket/354818/79 "2006-05-01T05:19:25Z")
> [@](#): > > **Kyrie Eleison** : > In my experience, I’d have to say it slipped under your radar. When I was young, my family slipped through many protestant denominations, and while all of them grudgingly acknowledged that most of the others were generally “Christian”, although mistaken in some particulars, they uniformly delegated Mormonism to a cult-like status. That was about twenty years ago, and my experience ranges from fundamentalist Baptist churches to non-denominational pentecostal ones. > > I will make no defense in their behalf. I have noticed a change during the fifty plus years that I have been a church member. I have become aware of more propoganda against LDS in recent years. (But then twenty years _is_ recent for me!) After my father’s death, my mother returned to the Southern Baptist Church. Although I had never heard her say a word against the LDS, she was shown a film that was an “expose” and suddenly she questioned whether or not they are Christian. For heaven’s sake, the name of the church begins with “The Church of _Jesus Christ_…” They certainly consider themselves Christians and _it is not my place to judge._ There are many who who say that the Southern Baptist Convention is a “cult.” Actually, neither they nor the LDS actually fit the usual cult pattern. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2006, 6:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/state-your-religion-please-heres-your-ticket/354818/80 "2006-05-01T06:06:58Z")
[QUOTE=brianjedi] You mean the Lutherans don’t worship Luther Vandross? [/QUOTE] No, but they occasionally burn Superman in effigy. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/state-your-religion-please-heres-your-ticket/354818.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/state-your-religion-please-heres-your-ticket/354818.md?page=5)