# Steaks: the layer of flavor **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [November 24, 2015, 2:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/steaks-the-layer-of-flavor/738397 "2015-11-24T02:05:11Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![the\_diego](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7bcc69/32.png) [@the\_diego](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/the_diego)\ **Post date:** [November 24, 2015, 2:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/steaks-the-layer-of-flavor/738397/1 "2015-11-24T02:05:11Z")
How does one retain the taste of the basting/marinade on a chargrilled steak? Does singeing burn most of it off? I find using just salt and pepper too bland for my taste. ---
**Author:** ![tenacious\_j](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/439d5e/32.png) [@tenacious\_j](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tenacious_j)\ **Post date:** [November 24, 2015, 2:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/steaks-the-layer-of-flavor/738397/2 "2015-11-24T02:08:26Z")
I prefer just salt and pepper to let the steak shine, since they cost more than I like to spend and I have them so rarely. However, if you use a marinade, marinate them for an hour, and the flavor will permeate the meat and not burn off. It might help to use a marinade which is not high in sugar, as well, so it doesn’t get burned or sticky. Steer clear of glazes and thick sauces too. ---
**Author:** ![the\_diego](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7bcc69/32.png) [@the\_diego](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/the_diego)\ **Post date:** [November 24, 2015, 2:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/steaks-the-layer-of-flavor/738397/3 "2015-11-24T02:13:31Z")
One hour? Ok, thanks. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Enlightening\_Meditation](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/ecc23a/32.png) [@Enlightening\_Meditation](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Enlightening_Meditation)\ **Post date:** [November 24, 2015, 2:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/steaks-the-layer-of-flavor/738397/4 "2015-11-24T02:32:43Z")
I like this procedure: -marinade a steak for 6 to 8 hours (i.e. 3 or 4 hours in a Ziploc bag in the fridge, then flip over to marinade in a different orientation for the remaining 3 to 4 hours). I typically use a teriyaki or hickory style marinade and then add some spices for kick. Any marinade that advertises itself as a “30 minute marinade” is usually too salty for me. -Pre-heat in an oven. For 1 inch thick steak, I heat the steak to 230°F for 35 to 40 minutes. -Remove steak from oven. Let the steak sit in ambient air for 10 to 15 minutes. -Sear the steak on a propane heated barbecue style grill at 600°F at 30 to 90 seconds per side depending on how well you like it cooked. Again, I’m referring to steak of 1 inch thickness. For me, it’s typically a top sirloin, filet mignon, or tri-tip steak. -Don’t add any thick sauce until ready to eat. With a tasty marinade, no sauce is needed, however. ---
**Author:** ![Grrr](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/grrr/32/146_2.png) [@Grrr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Grrr)\ **Post date:** [November 24, 2015, 2:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/steaks-the-layer-of-flavor/738397/5 "2015-11-24T02:33:21Z")
> [@the\_diego](#): > > One hour? Ok, thanks. 🙂 Or overnight. Especially for cheaper cuts. Not only will the flavor permeate, it will also make them more tender. ---
**Author:** ![tenacious\_j](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/439d5e/32.png) [@tenacious\_j](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tenacious_j)\ **Post date:** [November 24, 2015, 2:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/steaks-the-layer-of-flavor/738397/6 "2015-11-24T02:48:32Z")
> [@the\_diego](#): > > One hour? Ok, thanks. 🙂 At least. Again, I am overly cautious about over-salting or over-tenderizing steaks so I would never let one go for several hours, but YMMV. With pork or chicken I’d be more willing to let them sit longer. ---
**Author:** ![Common\_Tater](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/common_tater/32/13846_2.png) [@Common\_Tater](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Common_Tater)\ **Post date:** [November 24, 2015, 3:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/steaks-the-layer-of-flavor/738397/7 "2015-11-24T03:56:34Z")
Let’s be clear - “Steaks” implies a higher cut of beef, such as filet or “new york” strip, ribeye, and no sane person should marinate a high quality cut because they don’t need it. Salt and pepper, maybe herb butter is all that is required because the flavor of the beef should shine through. Tougher cuts like shank and flatiron need tenderizing. ---
**Author:** ![the\_diego](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7bcc69/32.png) [@the\_diego](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/the_diego)\ **Post date:** [November 24, 2015, 4:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/steaks-the-layer-of-flavor/738397/8 "2015-11-24T04:12:35Z")
Got that. Trouble is, as I mentioned, I find SP or even SPG as too bland. Again, I just want to put a taste on the surface of the meat. ---
**Author:** ![Gatopescado](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gatopescado/32/5711_2.png) [@Gatopescado](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gatopescado)\ **Post date:** [November 24, 2015, 4:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/steaks-the-layer-of-flavor/738397/9 "2015-11-24T04:17:17Z")
It really depends on the meat. You can steep a London Broil for a week, and it won’t absorb any flavor. A New York? (why would you marinate that?) Maybe an hour. My World Famous Ass-Kicking Shiska-Bobs marinate for a couple days. Like me. ---
**Author:** ![zombywoof](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/9e8a1a/32.png) [@zombywoof](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zombywoof)\ **Post date:** [November 24, 2015, 4:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/steaks-the-layer-of-flavor/738397/10 "2015-11-24T04:21:17Z")
> [@the\_diego](#): > > Again, I just want to put a taste on the surface of the meat. I’d say rather than trying to add flavor to the meat, make a [pan sauce](http://www.thekitchn.com/how-to-make-an-easy-pan-sauce-in-minutes-cooking-lessons-from-the-kitchn-211220) to serve with it. ---
**Author:** ![Satellite\_Guy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/258eb7/32.png) [@Satellite\_Guy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Satellite_Guy)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2015, 1:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/steaks-the-layer-of-flavor/738397/11 "2015-11-25T01:36:10Z")
[Montreal Steak Seasoning](http://www.mccormick.com/Grill-Mates/Flavors/Seasoning-Blends/Grill-Mates-Montreal-Steak-Seasoning). When I grill steak, I use bbq sauce, with the Montreal Steak seasoning. You can use the seasoning by itself, though. Either way, you can’t go wrong. It’s yummy. eta: I don’t know if [Clubhouse](http://www.clubhouse.ca/en-ca/products/la-grille/seasonings/montreal-steak-spice-seasoning) is available where you are, but that’s the brand we use here. ---
**Author:** ![D\_Odds](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/d_odds/32/2882_2.png) [@D\_Odds](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/D_Odds)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2015, 2:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/steaks-the-layer-of-flavor/738397/12 "2015-11-25T02:11:38Z")
> [@zombywoof](#): > > I’d say rather than trying to add flavor to the meat, make a [pan sauce](http://www.thekitchn.com/how-to-make-an-easy-pan-sauce-in-minutes-cooking-lessons-from-the-kitchn-211220) to serve with it. So far, the only good advice in the thread. Marinades will never penetrate deeply into the meat. Even with a “brinerade” (a marinade heavy on salt), only the salt will penetrate deeper into the meat. Most, if not all non-salt flavors will only be on the outermost layer. Flavor molecules are simply too big to penetrate. Acids in most marinades will make the exterior more mushy with long marinades though. So if you want the marinade flavor, marinade for no more than an hour, reserve some marinade to the side, and after slicing toss the board juices with the marinade and drizzle over the cooked meat. [See here](http://amazingribs.com/recipes/rubs_pastes_marinades_and_brines/zen_of_marinades.html) for more on the secrets and myths of marinading. ---
**Author:** ![tenacious\_j](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/439d5e/32.png) [@tenacious\_j](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tenacious_j)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2015, 3:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/steaks-the-layer-of-flavor/738397/13 "2015-11-25T03:37:57Z")
If all you want is a good steak with more flavor, a pan sauce is a great idea! A red wine and/or mushroom reduction is great on steak. Now I want one of those. Forget turkey! Another of my favorites with steak is a compound butter made with bleu cheese or rosemary or any of a million other herbs. Adds flavor without ruining the steak itself. ---
**Author:** ![salinqmind](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/3ec8ea/32.png) [@salinqmind](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/salinqmind)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2015, 6:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/steaks-the-layer-of-flavor/738397/14 "2015-11-25T06:31:08Z")
> [@D\_Odds](#): > > So far, the only good advice in the thread. > > Marinades will never penetrate deeply into the meat. Even with a “brinerade” (a marinade heavy on salt), only the salt will penetrate deeper into the meat. Most, if not all non-salt flavors will only be on the outermost layer. Flavor molecules are simply too big to penetrate. Acids in most marinades will make the exterior more mushy with long marinades though. So if you want the marinade flavor, marinade for no more than an hour, reserve some marinade to the side, and after slicing toss the board juices with the marinade and drizzle over the cooked meat. > > [See here](http://amazingribs.com/recipes/rubs_pastes_marinades_and_brines/zen_of_marinades.html) for more on the secrets and myths of marinading. You pour raw meat juice and used Marinade over cooked meat??? ---
**Author:** ![Common\_Tater](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/common_tater/32/13846_2.png) [@Common\_Tater](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Common_Tater)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2015, 12:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/steaks-the-layer-of-flavor/738397/15 "2015-11-25T12:38:00Z")
> [@the\_diego](#): > > Got that. Trouble is, as I mentioned, I find SP or even SPG as too bland. Again, I just want to put a taste on the surface of the meat. Filet is a little bland, I suppose. That’s one of the big complaints about them. Porterhouse, T-bone, Strips, etc not so much. But what kind of beef are you buying. Good beef is damnably expensive these days, but it shouldn’t need anything. I agree lesser quality beef needs a little something. Use it for stew, or make your dog very, very happy. ---
**Author:** ![Frank](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Frank](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frank)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2015, 12:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/steaks-the-layer-of-flavor/738397/16 "2015-11-25T12:48:15Z")
> [@salinqmind](#): > > You pour raw meat juice and used Marinade over cooked meat??? See, this is what I mean about the media wanting us to fear everything. 1. Cuts of beef are safe. The less processing the meat gets, the safer it is. 2. Juices from slicing a cooked piece of meat are not raw. 3. See 1. We’re not talking about hamburger or chicken here. ---
**Author:** ![Spud](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spud/32/347_2.png) [@Spud](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spud)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2015, 1:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/steaks-the-layer-of-flavor/738397/17 "2015-11-25T13:57:48Z")
> [@Common\_Tater](#): > > Filet is a little bland. I see this often, and I always think the person who says it just hasn’t had a good Filet. Just last night I grilled some Dry Aged, Grass Fed Filets on a blazing hot grill. Seasoned only with some Seasoned Salt and Pepper. Served with a baked potato, Caesar Salad, some green beans and a nice Cabernet, and “Bland” never ever came up in the descriptors used. ---
**Author:** ![Athena](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/35a633/32.png) [@Athena](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Athena)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2015, 2:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/steaks-the-layer-of-flavor/738397/18 "2015-11-25T14:04:07Z")
> [@Spud](#): > > I see this often, and I always think the person who says it just hasn’t had a good Filet. > > Just last night I grilled some Dry Aged, Grass Fed Filets on a blazing hot grill. Seasoned only with some Seasoned Salt and Pepper. > > Served with a baked potato, Caesar Salad, some green beans and a nice Cabernet, and “Bland” never ever came up in the descriptors used. I’ve had plenty of dry aged grass fed whatever Filets, and they are bland. Lobel’s, high-end steak places in Chicago, etc etc. They just don’t have the flavor a good NY strip or Rib Eye does. I’ll eat a filet, but it pretty much screams for a sauce. ---
**Author:** ![Spud](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spud/32/347_2.png) [@Spud](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spud)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2015, 2:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/steaks-the-layer-of-flavor/738397/19 "2015-11-25T14:11:05Z")
> [@Athena](#): > > I’ve had plenty of dry aged grass fed whatever Filets, and they are bland. Lobel’s, high-end steak places in Chicago, etc etc. They just don’t have the flavor a good NY strip or Rib Eye does. I’ll eat a filet, but it pretty much screams for a sauce. We will just have to agree to disagree then. Sure, I’ve had more than my fair share of different cuts and I would never turn down a bone in Rib Eye, but what I’m saying is that a good Filet, prepared properly does have a very good beef flavor that can stand on it’s own. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2015, 2:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/steaks-the-layer-of-flavor/738397/20 "2015-11-25T14:36:00Z")
> [@Common\_Tater](#): > > Let’s be clear - “Steaks” implies a higher cut of beef I wouldn’t say that. A “steak,” to me, just means that the meat is cut a certain way into a certain shape, as opposed to a roast or something like that. There are steaks of all kinds from chuck to flank to round to skirt to porterhouse to fillet, etc. It has nothing to do with the quality of meat, and how you prepare the steak depends on what kind it is. I wouldn’t prepare, say, a cube steak the same way I would a NY strip. > [@Spud](#): > > We will just have to agree to disagree then. Sure, I’ve had more than my fair share of different cuts and I would never turn down a bone in Rib Eye, but what I’m saying is that a good Filet, prepared properly does have a very good beef flavor that can stand on it’s own. I have to agree with **Athena** here. Fillet is, compared with other cuts, more gentle on the beef flavor. That said, I love it au poivre (with a pepper, cream, and cognac sauce) or with a bernaise. And I appreciate its tenderness. It’s a yummy cut, even if other cuts are beefier (like my preferred ribeye or strip), and a crowd-pleaser for its tenderness. And how could you make a beef wellington without it? For the OP, there’s plenty of steaks I marinate or dry rub. I really like Alton Brown’s [skirt steak marinade](http://www.foodnetwork.com/recipes/alton-brown/skirt-steak-recipe.html) as well as this [coffee-chili dry rub for steaks](http://cooking.nytimes.com/recipes/1017496-coffee-chile-dry-rub). The marinade I use on cheaper, tougher steaks, and the dry rub on nicer ones (although on really expensive steaks, I just go the simple salt & pepper route myself.) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/steaks-the-layer-of-flavor/738397.md?page=2)