# Steve Bannon: I see the hat, but are there any cattle? **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [October 16, 2017, 9:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/steve-bannon-i-see-the-hat-but-are-there-any-cattle/799083 "2017-10-16T21:43:13Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![QuickSilver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quicksilver/32/7832_2.png) [@QuickSilver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/QuickSilver)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2017, 4:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/steve-bannon-i-see-the-hat-but-are-there-any-cattle/799083/21 "2017-10-17T16:28:49Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > To me, this just looks like a list of things you (and liberals) like to complain about. I’m apparently missing the parallels to Hitler. Could you explain them more thoroughly? Well, Hitler was an authoritarian, racist baiting liar with delusions of grandeur… ---
**Author:** ![koeeoaddi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/koeeoaddi/32/408_2.png) [@koeeoaddi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/koeeoaddi)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2017, 4:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/steve-bannon-i-see-the-hat-but-are-there-any-cattle/799083/22 "2017-10-17T16:28:56Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > …the Republican Party will be half-Frankenstein and half Doctor Strangelove, with one arm trying to pull out the neck bolt, and the other arm pounding it back in. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![QuickSilver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quicksilver/32/7832_2.png) [@QuickSilver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/QuickSilver)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2017, 4:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/steve-bannon-i-see-the-hat-but-are-there-any-cattle/799083/23 "2017-10-17T16:30:32Z")
… I grant you, however, that Trump lacks the mustache. ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2017, 4:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/steve-bannon-i-see-the-hat-but-are-there-any-cattle/799083/24 "2017-10-17T16:40:58Z")
> [@QuickSilver](#): > > Well, Hitler was an authoritarian, racist baiting liar with delusions of grandeur… WTF does that have to do with “ongoing military conflicts with many, many veterans returning with PTSD”, for one example? ---
**Author:** ![BobLibDem](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/boblibdem/32/3149_2.png) [@BobLibDem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobLibDem)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2017, 4:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/steve-bannon-i-see-the-hat-but-are-there-any-cattle/799083/25 "2017-10-17T16:44:37Z")
So as long as one of his many faults isn’t Hitleresque, no need to worry? ---
**Author:** ![QuickSilver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quicksilver/32/7832_2.png) [@QuickSilver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/QuickSilver)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2017, 4:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/steve-bannon-i-see-the-hat-but-are-there-any-cattle/799083/26 "2017-10-17T16:52:50Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > WTF does that have to do with “ongoing military conflicts with many, many veterans returning with PTSD”, for one example? Hey, don’t get angry with me, buster. You asked: > [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > To me, this just looks like a list of things you (and liberals) like to complain about. I’m apparently missing the parallels to Hitler. Could you explain them more thoroughly? I answered: > [@QuickSilver](#): > > Well, Hitler was an authoritarian, racist baiting liar with delusions of grandeur… You don’t like these principles?.. I’ve got others. ---
**Author:** ![asahi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asahi/32/8693_2.png) [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2017, 4:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/steve-bannon-i-see-the-hat-but-are-there-any-cattle/799083/27 "2017-10-17T16:54:11Z")
> [@gatorslap](#): > > Tea Party candidates may have blown a few elections for Republicans, but in very red states they did not. When Bob Bennett got primaried out of his Senate seat in Utah, that didn’t open the door for a Democrat. There is very little danger of a Republican winning Feinstein’s seat. For several different reasons. Fair point – I admit that Feinstein wasn’t the best example. What I was trying to point out, however, is that the progressives need to put ideological purity aside and present a united front against the likes of Trump and Bannon. Yes, Trump looks like a clown, and it’s inconceivable to think that he makes it past 2020. But his winning in the first place was pretty improbable. The worst-case scenario becomes more realistic when you consider the fact that Trump wasn’t a vice president who somehow ended up President. People elected him. They elected everything he campaigned on. ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2017, 4:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/steve-bannon-i-see-the-hat-but-are-there-any-cattle/799083/28 "2017-10-17T16:57:11Z")
> [@BobLibDem](#): > > So as long as one of his many faults isn’t Hitleresque, no need to worry? If we can agree that he’s not Hitleresque, I’d consider that massive progress for this thread. ---
**Author:** ![BobLibDem](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/boblibdem/32/3149_2.png) [@BobLibDem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobLibDem)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2017, 5:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/steve-bannon-i-see-the-hat-but-are-there-any-cattle/799083/29 "2017-10-17T17:01:18Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > If we can agree that he’s not Hitleresque, I’d consider that massive progress for this thread. Sorry, but these things ARE Hitleresque: - the deliberate attempt by leaders to distort truth - the rise of political powers who believe in a fact-free world - violent and vitriolic discourse in right wing media - the open embrace of authoritarianism by people in power - the politics of the dangerous “other” ---
**Author:** ![asahi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asahi/32/8693_2.png) [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2017, 5:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/steve-bannon-i-see-the-hat-but-are-there-any-cattle/799083/30 "2017-10-17T17:15:20Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > To me, this just looks like a list of things you (and liberals) like to complain about. I’m apparently missing the parallels to Hitler. Could you explain them more thoroughly? Take another look at the list and you’ll see that some of the items have nothing to do with left-right political paradigm. The lack of faith in political institutions is widespread, and it’s extremely dangerous. When people in a democracy are just madder than hell but don’t know whether they’re angrier at the presidency, the congress, the judiciary, the bureaucrats, or the media, and that they’re all just equally bad, that’s a problem. Because what you have then is a vacuum in the public trust that ends up getting filled somehow. There are any number of places around the world where that vacuum is filled by political and military strongmen, where military or a national security force, and not a democratically-elected body of representatives, are the law of the land. Or places where a ruling party rules and becomes obsessed with crushing opposition. The thing authoritarianism is that they might come to power with consent, but they don’t leave when people want them to. You don’t get to determine when they leave, or when they’ve crossed one of your lines. From an authoritarian’s point of view, anyone who dares to challenge authority becomes the enemy of the state. ---
**Author:** ![QuickSilver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quicksilver/32/7832_2.png) [@QuickSilver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/QuickSilver)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2017, 5:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/steve-bannon-i-see-the-hat-but-are-there-any-cattle/799083/31 "2017-10-17T17:16:46Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > If we can agree that he’s not Hitleresque, I’d consider that massive progress for this thread. Would you settle for Mussolini-esque? ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2017, 5:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/steve-bannon-i-see-the-hat-but-are-there-any-cattle/799083/32 "2017-10-17T17:16:55Z")
> [@BobLibDem](#): > > Sorry, but these things ARE Hitleresque: > > - the deliberate attempt by leaders to distort truth All politicians do this. Did you forget about Obama’s “Lie of the Year”? > [@BobLibDem](#): > > - the rise of political powers who believe in a fact-free world See above. > [@BobLibDem](#): > > - violent and vitriolic discourse in right wing media You don’t think “violent and vitriolic discourse” is unique to right wing, do you? Remember Kathy Griffin’s little stunt? > [@BobLibDem](#): > > - the open embrace of authoritarianism by people in power Right-wingers felt the same way about Obama and his ‘phone and pen’. > [@BobLibDem](#): > > - the politics of the dangerous “other” I don’t follow. Are you saying Trump is the dangerous “other” and the Left is using “the politics of the dangerous other” ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2017, 5:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/steve-bannon-i-see-the-hat-but-are-there-any-cattle/799083/33 "2017-10-17T17:18:29Z")
> [@QuickSilver](#): > > Would you settle for Mussolini-esque? Sure, if we can cut down on the Hitler references around here, that’s progress. ---
**Author:** ![Bone](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bone/32/407_2.png) [@Bone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bone)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2017, 5:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/steve-bannon-i-see-the-hat-but-are-there-any-cattle/799083/34 "2017-10-17T17:19:40Z")
Please drop the Hitler or other historical fascist-type hijacks. This thread is about Bannon and other electoral politics. [/moderating] ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2017, 5:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/steve-bannon-i-see-the-hat-but-are-there-any-cattle/799083/35 "2017-10-17T17:19:45Z")
> [@asahi](#): > > Take another look at the list and you’ll see that some of the items have nothing to do with left-right political paradigm. The lack of faith in political institutions is widespread, and it’s extremely dangerous. When people in a democracy are just madder than hell but don’t know whether they’re angrier at the presidency, the congress, the judiciary, the bureaucrats, or the media, and that they’re all just equally bad, that’s a problem. Because what you have then is a vacuum in the public trust that ends up getting filled somehow. There are any number of places around the world where that vacuum is filled by political and military strongmen, where military or a national security force, and not a democratically-elected body of representatives, are the law of the land. Or places where a ruling party rules and becomes obsessed with crushing opposition. > > The thing authoritarianism is that they might come to power with consent, but they don’t leave when people want them to. You don’t get to determine when they leave, or when they’ve crossed one of your lines. From an authoritarian’s point of view, anyone who dares to challenge authority becomes the enemy of the state. Are you saying you’re worried about a military coup? ---
**Author:** ![QuickSilver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quicksilver/32/7832_2.png) [@QuickSilver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/QuickSilver)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2017, 5:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/steve-bannon-i-see-the-hat-but-are-there-any-cattle/799083/36 "2017-10-17T17:23:09Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > All politicians do this. Did you forget about Obama’s “Lie of the Year”? Some do it more than others. Hell, I forget about Trump’s lie of the past 24 hours. Who can keep up anymore?! ---
**Author:** ![asahi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asahi/32/8693_2.png) [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2017, 5:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/steve-bannon-i-see-the-hat-but-are-there-any-cattle/799083/37 "2017-10-17T17:24:03Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > If we can agree that he’s not Hitleresque, I’d consider that massive progress for this thread. Don’t focus so much on the individual, Hurricane. That’s not important. Nobody knows whether Trump or Bannon will ultimately become successful authoritarians – too soon to tell. But don’t ignore their behavior is what I’m saying. Acknowledge it for what it is. On that point, note that there are times when rhetoric isn’t just empty words, but can have real power, such as when a president threatens to remove television licenses using the FCC power he has at his disposal. I can’t predict what will happen with Trump or Bannon. What I can tell you is that they are thinking, speaking, and behaving like people who subscribe to fascism. Whether they end up following through with it is not necessary to establish that we are in really dangerous territory. We’re in danger in part because a large part of this country doesn’t seem aware of the danger. I think there’s a quote that is attributable to Edmund Burke, in which he says that all that is necessary for evil to triumph is for good men to do nothing. If I may add a twist, I would say that all that is necessary for fascism to triumph is for democratic and liberty-loving people to not take the words and deeds of authoritarians seriously, to over time, accept them as somehow a different less-democratic, but otherwise “normal”, alternative faction in a democracy. ---
**Author:** ![asahi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asahi/32/8693_2.png) [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2017, 5:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/steve-bannon-i-see-the-hat-but-are-there-any-cattle/799083/38 "2017-10-17T17:26:29Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > Are you saying you’re worried about a military coup? No, not necessarily. But think about the fact that we have a president who refers to his secretaries as “my (his) generals.” They’re supposed to be OUR generals, not his. If he weren’t behaving like an authoritarian otherwise, it would be a forgivable slip of the tongue. ---
**Author:** ![BobLibDem](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/boblibdem/32/3149_2.png) [@BobLibDem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobLibDem)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2017, 5:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/steve-bannon-i-see-the-hat-but-are-there-any-cattle/799083/39 "2017-10-17T17:27:57Z")
Bannon is like the guy who put $10 on a longshot horse and it comes through for him, and all of a sudden he’s a handicapping genius. He knows how to make a fraction of the electorate salivate, but that’s about it. He got lucky in that he got to campaign against Hillary. But seriously, he thinks he can take McConnell and Ryan down? He backed Moore in Alabama, but that’s rather like betting on Brazil to qualify for the World Cup. The voters that he resonates with are loyal, but they’re a fraction of Republican voters. I think he’s getting way more than his 15 minutes of fame and he seems to be a bit full of himself. ---
**Author:** ![asahi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asahi/32/8693_2.png) [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2017, 5:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/steve-bannon-i-see-the-hat-but-are-there-any-cattle/799083/40 "2017-10-17T17:28:32Z")
> [@Bone](#): > > Please drop the Hitler or other historical fascist-type hijacks. This thread is about Bannon and other electoral politics. > > [/moderating] Sorry, I know I made a few posts after - didn’t see this until just now. My own personal opinion is that it’s sometimes difficult not to bring up these references when discussing Bannon, but I will respect the moderator’s decision and take it to the pit or elsewhere from now on. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/steve-bannon-i-see-the-hat-but-are-there-any-cattle/799083.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/steve-bannon-i-see-the-hat-but-are-there-any-cattle/799083.md?page=3)