# Stevie Vai..For The Love Of God **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [December 9, 2017, 3:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stevie-vai-for-the-love-of-god/803988 "2017-12-09T03:21:56Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 19\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![WordMan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e8c25b/32.png) [@WordMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WordMan)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2017, 1:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stevie-vai-for-the-love-of-god/803988/41 "2017-12-12T01:18:33Z")
No argument. ---
**Author:** ![Penfeather](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/penfeather/32/384_2.png) [@Penfeather](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Penfeather)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2017, 1:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stevie-vai-for-the-love-of-god/803988/42 "2017-12-12T01:53:49Z")
> [@Saintly\_Loser](#): > > I’m a big fan of U2 (although one has to make allowances for their messianic delusions), so don’t take this wrong. . . > > I don’t really think of The Edge as a guitarist. He’s a fantastic musician and writer who happens to use a guitar to drive a whole pile of sound-producing devices. And what he does works so well for U2’s music. But it doesn’t really feel like guitar playing to me, even though I love the sound. [Bill Bailey’s Catastrophic Technical Failure At A U2 Gig.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H8dZwXnMrRU) ---
**Author:** ![FoieGrasIsEvil](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/foiegrasisevil/32/16638_2.png) [@FoieGrasIsEvil](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FoieGrasIsEvil)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2017, 2:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stevie-vai-for-the-love-of-god/803988/43 "2017-12-12T02:11:34Z")
> [@Saintly\_Loser](#): > > I’m a big fan of U2 (although one has to make allowances for their messianic delusions), so don’t take this wrong. . . > > I don’t really think of The Edge as a guitarist. He’s a fantastic musician and writer who happens to use a guitar to drive a whole pile of sound-producing devices. And what he does works so well for U2’s music. But it doesn’t really feel like guitar playing to me, even though I love the sound. It’s like if Phil Spector could play guitar (and not murder people). ---
**Author:** ![Try2B\_Comprehensive](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/try2b_comprehensive/32/65_2.png) [@Try2B\_Comprehensive](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Try2B_Comprehensive)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2017, 3:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stevie-vai-for-the-love-of-god/803988/44 "2017-12-12T03:40:26Z")
Lemme give it to you straight, **Foie Gras**. A couple of weeks ago I was driving around with my gf listening to the conclusion of the Top 1000 Rock Songs of All Time. We got back to my house at the beginning of #2, Comfortably Numb, and decided to stay in the car and listen long enough to confirm that #1 Had to be Stairway to Heaven (it was). I think we all know David Gilmour. He plays guitar solos like they _have to be_ that way. He’s full of quarter- and half-notes, he’s melodic and soaring, he’s moody and snarling- his playing really expresses the emotions of the song and draws the listener in. The trick seems to be in the little clicks and arpeggios between the drawn-out sections, but try and imitate that and the plan evaporates from beneath your fingers. Anyway, sit in the car and listen to That and your gf will not become bored and annoyed. Vai? I like him. Don’t know if my gf would, never tried. I don’t remember hearing him in the top 1000, but I only tuned in a little for that. We all should have music careers as glorious as Vai’s, but he never seems to have that pop hit. Should every musician have pop hits? God, no. I bonded with a clerk today over the Liszt playing on the Pandora; nobody around here seems to properly appreciate Liszt, either. But I would rather choose between hearing either Liszt or Willie Nelson, _Spirit_, again, than Vai. I just don’t reach for it. Maybe I’ll dig him more later. I certainly don’t think he should quit. ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2017, 4:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stevie-vai-for-the-love-of-god/803988/45 "2017-12-12T04:51:44Z")
Like many, I think that Steve Vai is an awesomely talented guitar player who is at his best when he is taking direction from someone else. I also think he’s a way cool dude and I’d be happy to party with him or go bowling or catch a hockey game or something. One of my favorite stories is [Steve Vai talking about his audition for Frank Zappa](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xx1RguHA4XE). It’s a hilarious story and makes a point that **astorian** might appreciate hearing. And [here’s an interview and some playing](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gh5gCb1th90), where at [3:06](https://youtu.be/Gh5gCb1th90?t=3m6s) Mr. Vai says during the Halloween '81 shows “…Frank just played the guitar like I’ve never seen anybody in my life.” A clip from one of the shows (tho not from the soundcheck) follows; I’d be surprised if anyone didn’t think that Frank was doing anything other than absolutely killing it. And again, Vai’s fondness and respect for Frank is pretty clear. [hijack] The Halloween '77 package that was released earlier this year is freaking awesome! [/hijack] ETA: I thought this quote was cool too: > [@Steve Vai](#): > > I think the definition of a genius is a person that’s able to call into play this inspiration very simply and organically at any time they want; and I’ve seen Frank do this. Constantly. ---
**Author:** ![WordMan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e8c25b/32.png) [@WordMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WordMan)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2017, 10:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stevie-vai-for-the-love-of-god/803988/46 "2017-12-12T10:52:30Z")
> [@FoieGrasIsEvil](#): > > It’s like if Phil Spector could play guitar (and not murder people). Nice. Yes, The Edge uses his guitar as a sound-triggering device almost more than as a guitar. **Tom Morello** does this, too, but in a very different way of approaching the effects in his signal chain. I can’t imagine. Guitars is weird. ---
**Author:** ![wguy123](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wguy123/32/3161_2.png) [@wguy123](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wguy123)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2017, 4:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stevie-vai-for-the-love-of-god/803988/47 "2017-12-12T16:47:51Z")
> [@Try2B\_Comprehensive](#): > > Lemme give it to you straight, **Foie Gras**. A couple of weeks ago I was driving around with my gf listening to the conclusion of the Top 1000 Rock Songs of All Time. We got back to my house at the beginning of #2, Comfortably Numb, and decided to stay in the car and listen long enough to confirm that #1 Had to be Stairway to Heaven (it was). > > I think we all know David Gilmour. He plays guitar solos like they _have to be_ that way. He’s full of quarter- and half-notes, he’s melodic and soaring, he’s moody and snarling- his playing really expresses the emotions of the song and draws the listener in. The trick seems to be in the little clicks and arpeggios between the drawn-out sections, but try and imitate that and the plan evaporates from beneath your fingers. Anyway, sit in the car and listen to That and your gf will not become bored and annoyed. > > Vai? I like him. Don’t know if my gf would, never tried. I don’t remember hearing him in the top 1000, but I only tuned in a little for that. We all should have music careers as glorious as Vai’s, but he never seems to have that pop hit. > > Should every musician have pop hits? God, no. I bonded with a clerk today over the Liszt playing on the Pandora; nobody around here seems to properly appreciate Liszt, either. But I would rather choose between hearing either Liszt or Willie Nelson, _Spirit_, again, than Vai. I just don’t reach for it. Maybe I’ll dig him more later. I certainly don’t think he should quit. I agree with what you write here. I really liked Passion and Warfare when it was released and I was the 20 year guitar shredder wannabe. I can still listen to that album and find songs I like but for the most part, I’d rather listen to something else. And I really, really love Spirit along with Teatro. I think those two albums are heartbreakingly beautiful creations. ---
**Author:** ![FoieGrasIsEvil](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/foiegrasisevil/32/16638_2.png) [@FoieGrasIsEvil](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FoieGrasIsEvil)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2017, 12:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stevie-vai-for-the-love-of-god/803988/48 "2017-12-13T00:51:21Z")
I really like the cascading guitars and effects as headphone music on Passion And Warfare’s “The Riddle” from about 1:15 (showcasing the low B and uber distortion) through about 4:30, which shows off his recording/layering/backtracking/sound effect skills. Sometimes there’s so many guitars going on at once it’s hard to keep track. Those that find Vai’s playing cold, well…it is what it is. I agree with Wordman to an extent about “slop” and that being an emotional factor in guitar playing, especially when soloing, but I also happen to hear emotional and melodic passages in Vai’s music where others find none. The beauty of music and it’s relativism, I guess. The Riddle: [The Riddle - YouTube](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DOQrkDxdsgk) ---
**Author:** ![Doubticus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e56c9b/32.png) [@Doubticus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Doubticus)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2017, 4:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stevie-vai-for-the-love-of-god/803988/49 "2017-12-13T16:04:13Z")
There is no denying that Vai is a phenomenal player. But his skill falls short of the likes of Chris Broderick or Yngwie. Ultimately though, it comes down to personal matters of taste. Jeff Loomis is still my favorite, while not the most technical, his composition keeps me engaged from beginning to end. ---
**Author:** ![DCnDC](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dcndc/32/2842_2.png) [@DCnDC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DCnDC)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2017, 5:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stevie-vai-for-the-love-of-god/803988/50 "2017-12-13T17:23:23Z")
Curious that Yngwie keeps coming up. While no one can deny the man is a skilled guitar player, I’ve not ever heard an even marginally decent song come out of him. The man’s music is objectively terrible, and the fact that he’s such an arrogant douchebag sure doesn’t help. ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2017, 5:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stevie-vai-for-the-love-of-god/803988/51 "2017-12-14T05:05:32Z")
Wait; which Yngwie Malmsteen are we talking about? There’s so many, I often get them mixed up. ---
**Author:** ![WordMan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e8c25b/32.png) [@WordMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WordMan)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2017, 10:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stevie-vai-for-the-love-of-god/803988/52 "2017-12-14T10:33:03Z")
Honestly, I never seek him out. You know how I mentioned having a go-to song for some players? I don’t have one for him. I get what he can do and have no interest in hearing him do it. As Truman Capote said of Jack Kerouac’s _On the Road_: That’s not writing, that’s typing. ---
**Author:** ![Small\_Clanger](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9fc348/32.png) [@Small\_Clanger](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Small_Clanger)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2017, 3:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stevie-vai-for-the-love-of-god/803988/53 "2017-12-19T15:37:35Z")
> [@Snowboarder Bo](#): > > Wait; which Yngwie Malmsteen are we talking about? There’s so many, I often get them mixed up. Yngwie J. Malmsteen Meanwhile, I am allowed to like stuff by David Gilmour _and_ Steve Vai, right? ---
**Author:** ![Clawdio](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/d07c76/32.png) [@Clawdio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Clawdio)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2017, 5:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stevie-vai-for-the-love-of-god/803988/54 "2017-12-19T17:02:22Z")
I’m in the camp that it’s just too practiced. Compare him with someone like Dimebag… Sure Dimebag has awesome tone and some killer soloes (and a tight rhythm section in Rex & Vinnie) and Pantera songs aren’t exactly the pinnacle of music composition, but the whole thing always feels like its on the edge of falling apart. With someone like Vai, you’re never near that edge, you’re 10 feet back with an OSHA approved railing and a safety harness. There’s no danger. I kind of had a similar reaction to recently seeing a Jeff Beck concert on some cable channel. It was really good, and I could see why he’s considered the guitar player’s guitar player… but after about two and a half songs I was just kind of bored. But I won’t begrudge the upper middle class white folks in sport jackets in the audience their good time. ---
**Author:** ![WordMan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e8c25b/32.png) [@WordMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WordMan)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2017, 5:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stevie-vai-for-the-love-of-god/803988/55 "2017-12-19T17:54:55Z")
Hey - I _am_ one of those white folks! ;). I find Beck’s playing very edgy and spontaneous feeling, but of course YMMV. His not using a pick and his feel for use of the whammy bar and volume control just looks fluid to me, not overcalculated. For me, the biggest issue is the songs - some of the songs Beck plays on just leave me flat. But with the right material, stand back! ---
**Author:** ![Saintly\_Loser](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/saintly_loser/32/4045_2.png) [@Saintly\_Loser](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Saintly_Loser)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2017, 9:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stevie-vai-for-the-love-of-god/803988/56 "2017-12-19T21:54:23Z")
> [@WordMan](#): > > Honestly, I never seek him out. You know how I mentioned having a go-to song for some players? I don’t have one for him. I get what he can do and have no interest in hearing him do it. > > As Truman Capote said of Jack Kerouac’s _On the Road_: That’s not writing, that’s typing. Capote was wrong. You are right. ---
**Author:** ![FoieGrasIsEvil](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/foiegrasisevil/32/16638_2.png) [@FoieGrasIsEvil](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FoieGrasIsEvil)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2017, 10:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stevie-vai-for-the-love-of-god/803988/57 "2017-12-19T22:15:01Z")
I’d only defend Yngwie to a point…his first release had some pretty incredible and melodic work on it (“Far Beyond The Sun”, “Evil Eye”, “Opus IV”, Black Star"), in addition to being super fast. His later stuff…not so much. And he always recruited the most god-awful singers to be in his band. And his attempts at a poppier style (“This Feels Like Paradise”) were hamfisted at best. And now he’s a cartoon with a Strat in his hands. ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2017, 10:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stevie-vai-for-the-love-of-god/803988/58 "2017-12-19T22:15:58Z")
> [@Snowboarder\_Bo](#): > > Wait; which Yngwie Malmsteen are we talking about? There’s so many, I often get them mixed up. > [@Small\_Clanger](#): > > Yngwie J. Malmsteen Oh, Yngwie _J._ Malmsteen. Aye; total pants that one. All technical precision; no soul. He is fast, tho. ---
**Author:** ![Small\_Clanger](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9fc348/32.png) [@Small\_Clanger](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Small_Clanger)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2017, 3:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stevie-vai-for-the-love-of-god/803988/59 "2017-12-20T15:25:00Z")
> [@Snowboarder Bo](#): > > Oh, Yngwie _J._ Malmsteen. Aye; total pants that one. All technical precision; no soul. He is fast, tho. I think the “J” stands for _self regarding pretentious wanker_. Yup, sure knows his harmonic minor. Back on the Vai topic. I like some of his stuff, Flexable, Eat 'em and Smile, Album (PIL). Passion and Warfare in comparison is mostly a bit po-faced but still has some fun bits. I think the cut-off point for me is where his tone, speed and production makes his instrument unidentifiable as a guitar. He may as well have programmed the music into a sequencer. The _Attitude Song_ has about fifty tricks/techniques crammed into 3 minutes 22, and I expect that most guitar players on first hearing it were wondering “How the _feck_ do you make a guitar do that?” - but you can tell it _is_ a guitar. The impression I’m left with for a lot of the later stuff is that too often it tends towards 32nd notes two-handed at the top of the neck. > [@Joni](#): > > The band sounds like typewriters [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stevie-vai-for-the-love-of-god/803988.md?page=2)