# STII-Wrath of Khan: Did Khan have a legit gripe? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [August 28, 2015, 1:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stii-wrath-of-khan-did-khan-have-a-legit-gripe/729129 "2015-08-28T01:33:23Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![terentii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terentii/32/212_2.png) [@terentii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/terentii)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2015, 2:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stii-wrath-of-khan-did-khan-have-a-legit-gripe/729129/21 "2015-08-28T02:38:11Z")
> [@Peter\_Morris](#): > > NB: Federation Planet != Starfleet. Cite? :dubious: ---
**Author:** ![terentii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terentii/32/212_2.png) [@terentii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/terentii)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2015, 2:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stii-wrath-of-khan-did-khan-have-a-legit-gripe/729129/22 "2015-08-28T02:40:19Z")
> [@AncientHumanoid](#): > > Joachin looked like that guy on Taxi. You mean the blonde guy who played the ancient alien in _ **The Phoenix** _? :dubious: [![](https://i.ytimg.com/vi/9SASkqWyn40/hqdefault.jpg?sqp=-oaymwEmCOADEOgC8quKqQMa8AEB-AG-AoAC8AGKAgwIABABGGAgZShKMA8=&rs=AOn4CLDWDkKbaDBsObBZy642Xj-mhqah6g "The Phoenix TV Series Intro 1982") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9SASkqWyn40) ---
**Author:** ![Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skald_the_Rhymer)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2015, 2:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stii-wrath-of-khan-did-khan-have-a-legit-gripe/729129/23 "2015-08-28T02:42:32Z")
> [@Bryan\_Ekers](#): > > I can picture him grabbing Tyrell and Chekov when they stumble into the _Botany Bay_ sections (this is actual a minor plot hole with _Space Seed_ - in addition to Khan recognizing Chekov, even though the character had not yet been introduced into the series, Khan discarded the _Botany Bay_ shortly after seizing the _Enterprise_. There was no indication Kirk went back for it or any part of it after regaining control) but once he realized who they were, he should have asked for evacuation and relocation, rather than gone all “eel” on them. As soon as he did that, his concerns didn’t matter nearly as much as the need to kill him and fast. Khan recognizing Chekov is not a plot hole. Chekov never got an introductory episodes, so we don’t know when he joined the crew the way we know when, say, the traitor Ro Larren joined the E-D. There’s no real to think he didn’t graduate Starfleet Academy at 20 or so and was a night-shift officer on board the Enterprise during the first season. ---
**Author:** ![terentii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terentii/32/212_2.png) [@terentii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/terentii)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2015, 2:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stii-wrath-of-khan-did-khan-have-a-legit-gripe/729129/24 "2015-08-28T02:43:56Z")
> [@ExTank](#): > > IIRC, in the novelization, the discrepancy (missing planet, wrong orbital patterns) is noted when the Reliant enters the system; but, (again, IIRC) it was put down to some sort of data entry glitch since the Ceti Alpha system was so remote/“off the beaten path,” or something like that. I hated the novelization! :mad: ---
**Author:** ![terentii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terentii/32/212_2.png) [@terentii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/terentii)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2015, 2:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stii-wrath-of-khan-did-khan-have-a-legit-gripe/729129/25 "2015-08-28T02:45:00Z")
> [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](#): > > There’s no real to think he didn’t graduate Starfleet Academy at 20 or so and was a night-shift officer on board the Enterprise during the first season. _Watch!_ Night _watch!_ :mad: ---
**Author:** ![Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skald_the_Rhymer)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2015, 2:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stii-wrath-of-khan-did-khan-have-a-legit-gripe/729129/26 "2015-08-28T02:47:45Z")
> [@terentii](#): > > _Watch!_ Night _watch!_ :mad: Don’t make me shove this eel-worm in your ear. ---
**Author:** ![Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skald_the_Rhymer)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2015, 2:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stii-wrath-of-khan-did-khan-have-a-legit-gripe/729129/27 "2015-08-28T02:49:36Z")
> [@terentii](#): > > I hated the novelization! :mad: I LOVED the novelization. I just wish McIntyre had figured a way to bring Mandala Flynn and Hunter into the story. ---
**Author:** ![terentii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terentii/32/212_2.png) [@terentii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/terentii)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2015, 2:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stii-wrath-of-khan-did-khan-have-a-legit-gripe/729129/28 "2015-08-28T02:52:06Z")
> [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](#): > > I LOVED the novelization. I just wish McIntyre had figured a way to bring Mandala Flynn and Hunter into the story. McIntyre is one of those authors who couldn’t write her way out of a wet paper bag! :mad: ---
**Author:** ![Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skald_the_Rhymer)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2015, 2:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stii-wrath-of-khan-did-khan-have-a-legit-gripe/729129/29 "2015-08-28T02:54:08Z")
> [@terentii](#): > > McIntyre is one of those authors who couldn’t write her way out of a wet paper bag! :mad: That’s two. ---
**Author:** ![terentii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terentii/32/212_2.png) [@terentii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/terentii)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2015, 2:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stii-wrath-of-khan-did-khan-have-a-legit-gripe/729129/30 "2015-08-28T02:54:21Z")
> [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](#): > > Don’t make me shove this eel-worm in your ear. \*\*\*AAAAAAAAAARRRRRRRRRRRGGGGGGGGGGGGGHHHHHHHHH!!! \*\*\* :eek: :eek: :eek: :eek: :eek: ---
**Author:** ![terentii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terentii/32/212_2.png) [@terentii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/terentii)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2015, 2:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stii-wrath-of-khan-did-khan-have-a-legit-gripe/729129/31 "2015-08-28T02:55:24Z")
> [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](#): > > That’s two. Yeah, along with Marshak! :mad: ---
**Author:** ![Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skald_the_Rhymer)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2015, 2:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stii-wrath-of-khan-did-khan-have-a-legit-gripe/729129/32 "2015-08-28T02:55:54Z")
> [@terentii](#): > > \*\*\*AAAAAAAAAARRRRRRRRRRRGGGGGGGGGGGGGHHHHHHHHH!!! \*\*\* :eek: :eek: :eek: :eek: :eek: Stop whining, elf. When I eel-worm you, you will know it. ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2015, 2:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stii-wrath-of-khan-did-khan-have-a-legit-gripe/729129/33 "2015-08-28T02:56:28Z")
> [@yellowjacketcoder](#): > > I wouldn’t be surprised if the Enterprise carries some “temporary” housing for emergency situations, like an unexpected hurricane floods a Federation colony and the big E is the only starship in range (when is she NOT the only starship in range?). Not a chance. If they had shit like that, why didn’t Kirk beam it down to save the Away Team in “The Enemy Within?” ---
**Author:** ![Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skald_the_Rhymer)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2015, 2:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stii-wrath-of-khan-did-khan-have-a-legit-gripe/729129/34 "2015-08-28T02:59:15Z")
N > [@terentii](#): > > Yeah, along with Marshak! :mad: You are confusing McIntyre with Culbreath, revealing your essential elvishness. That was would be the third and eel-worm triggering offense but we already knew you were a fricking Noldo. ---
**Author:** ![terentii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terentii/32/212_2.png) [@terentii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/terentii)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2015, 3:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stii-wrath-of-khan-did-khan-have-a-legit-gripe/729129/35 "2015-08-28T03:01:08Z")
> [@silenus](#): > > Not a chance. If they had shit like that, why didn’t Kirk beam it down to save the Away Team in “The Enemy Within?” Everything they beamed down was “inoperable” when it arrived. (Presumably this somehow appliced to advanced insulated arctic clothing and tents as well—or maybe the _Enterprise_ just isn’t as well-prepared for emergency situations as they’d like us to think!) ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2015, 3:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stii-wrath-of-khan-did-khan-have-a-legit-gripe/729129/36 "2015-08-28T03:04:04Z")
How the hell does a tarp or a piece of shelter wall become “inoperable?” No, the Enterprise either doesn’t carry things that any sane captain would make sure were in the Supply Room, or Kirk is the most incompetent Captain in Starfleet. ---
**Author:** ![terentii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terentii/32/212_2.png) [@terentii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/terentii)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2015, 3:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stii-wrath-of-khan-did-khan-have-a-legit-gripe/729129/37 "2015-08-28T03:04:43Z")
> [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](#): > > You are confusing McIntyre with Culbreath, revealing your essential elvishness. That was would be the third and eel-worm triggering offense but we already knew you were a fricking Noldo. Let’s face it: Virtually everyone who ever churned out a Trek novel was a talentless hack; why they continue to sell is beyond me! They’re not even on the same level as Vogon poetry! :mad: ---
**Author:** ![terentii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terentii/32/212_2.png) [@terentii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/terentii)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2015, 3:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stii-wrath-of-khan-did-khan-have-a-legit-gripe/729129/38 "2015-08-28T03:10:29Z")
> [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](#): > > Stop whining, elf. When I eel-worm you, you will know it. I was just doing my Chekov impression. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skald_the_Rhymer)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2015, 3:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stii-wrath-of-khan-did-khan-have-a-legit-gripe/729129/39 "2015-08-28T03:11:56Z")
> [@terentii](#): > > Let’s face it: Virtually everyone who ever churned out a Trek novel was a talentless hack; why they continue to sell is beyond me! They’re not even on the same level as Vogon poetry! :mad: Holy Zeus. YOU JUST INSULTED JANET KAGEN. Not even an elf would sink so low. You’re a _goddamn Smurf_. I must ponder your punishment. Eel-worms are too good for Smurfs. ---
**Author:** ![AncientHumanoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ancienthumanoid/32/278_2.png) [@AncientHumanoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AncientHumanoid)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2015, 3:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stii-wrath-of-khan-did-khan-have-a-legit-gripe/729129/40 "2015-08-28T03:12:28Z")
[quote=“terentii, post:22, topic:729129”] You mean the blonde guy who played the ancient alien in _ **The Phoenix** _? :dubious: [/QUOTE] Yep. Notice I said “looked like.” It’s a joke, ya Pakled! :dubious: [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stii-wrath-of-khan-did-khan-have-a-legit-gripe/729129.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stii-wrath-of-khan-did-khan-have-a-legit-gripe/729129.md?page=3)