And now it’s up $169. Do you have an actual factual point to make?
Post 135 for facts.
Do you?
JohnT goes to the work of composing a post that reviews over 70 years of economic history. You “refute” him by mentioning the latest 1-hour fluctuation in DJIA. :smack: Have you considered seeking a job in newscasting? 
He already has one. Almost always lands them on the porch.
That was worthy of Elucidator. Good job!
Hope he has some bond funds, some of which are doing really well.
I had a friend who worked for IBM, and who got laid off near retirement just as IBM stock cratered. He had his entire 401K in IBM stock. Ouch.
We all know Ike was a Rino. Look at the tax rates during his term!
Awesome post! Thanks.
Guys, apparently all the bailouts floated by the Trump Administration, including
… Cruise ships
… Hotels
… Airlines
… Fracking companies
… The Oil Industry
… the shipping industry
has raised the DJIA by 1,100+ points.
Again: Americas economic system is socialism for the wealthy and connected, capitalism for everyone else.
You may not get a check, but your employer will get a payroll tax deduction which should… what was the term… trickle down to you.
(Please note that Trumps remarks today were all about the economic impact, and nary a word about the human impact. This, D’anconia, is why him… and his ideology… are monstrous.)
This is a bit off topic, but…
… I am perpetually amazed at the pearl-clutching of conservatives at the rising popularity of socialism. I am amazed despite the fact that I am a dyed-in-the-wool believer in capitalism and free markets, but the resurgence of interest in socialism and even communism is totally understandable; it’s because of pigs like Donald Trump and his lackeys. It’s because of utter horseshit like the 2008/2009 fiscal crisis where rich people made out like bandits and poor people suffered and the government shrugged its shoulders.
When you have rich pigs just shamelessly looting the working taxpayer right out in the open, it is absolutely, totally understandable that people would start to look at alternative systems. It would be frankly mystifying if they didn’t.
Tired: Socializing Profits
Wired: Socializing Losses
The stock market experts which worried about Bernie Sanders’ ‘socialism’ are now begging for socialism in the form of corporate rescue packages.
I support bailouts for airlines and cruiselines for much the same reason that I support mandatory sick leave for workers: it removes the incentive to be stupid.
Airlines and cruiselines should receive aid, contingent on their offering generous refund policies until the pandemic has subsided. Otherwise, they’ll almost certainly be assholes about refunds, which will pressure people into using the trips they’ve already paid for, which will spread the disease further.
I’m not normally a fan of funneling government money to big companies, but I’m a pragmatist, not an idealist. In cases like this, we do what we need to do, even if it means rewarding people who don’t need a reward.
Darn.
Down 1,145 as I type this. Looks like the Dow is trickling down on the Fed and the Trump Administration.
It’s all happening so fast, and swinging so wildly from one day to the next, that it’s really hard to assess and forecast what the economic damage will be.
Meanwhile, we’re just now getting around to testing people. South Korea tests more people in a single day than we have during the entire epidemic. Countries like South Korea, Germany, and others can test people in their cars; in the US, by contrast, people have waited for the tests, they’ve gone to be tested only told they don’t fit the official criteria for testing eligibility, and worst of all many healthcare workers are dealing with potentially ill patients without wearing any protection or having any protocols on how to manage potential cases - there is no uniform protocol on how to deal with COVID-19! I cannot emphasize just how jaw-droppingly shocking and dangerous this situation is about to become. - because when the healthcare workers themselves get taken down with this illness, the healthcare system will become overwhelmed.
And yet, just look at the sports pages tonight, tomorrow night, and the next several weeks and life is going to continue as planned with tens of thousands of people sitting right next to each other, oblivious to whether the person next to them is sneezing or coughing or picking his nose. And when the game is over many will ride home in Ubers or the local transit system. And they’ll presumably go back to work the next day.
If you think the markets are down now, wait until cases spike in Washington, DC, New York City, Chicago, and LA - that’s when the fun really begins. I don’t think our healthcare system is prepared for what’s about to happen, and I don’t think our economic policymakers are either. We’re in for a rough ride, folks.
As I noted in another thread:
“If the US markets are in free-fall now, bond and credit markets tightening up, while 99% of Americans still go about their normal lives… when this sentiment changes, holy hell will be wreaked on these same markets, making the bailouts promised yesterday appear as band aids.”
HOWEVER…
Trump’s signature accomplishment… not fucking up the Obama rally… is officially over. Today, 3-11-2020, marks the beginnings of the official TrumpSlump with the DJIA closing down 20.3% since February putting it officially in bear market territory.
RIP Obama’s Bull Market: 3-09-2009 - 3-11-2020.
Official cause of death: Republicans and their voters. (See post 135.)
Boeing just drew down their credit lines.
In English, they took out the maximum cash advance that their card agreement would allow: $13.8 billion.
Is there any sort of historical precedent for what that means?
In other words have other very large companies done that in the past and what happened next?
Yes, it’s generally a bad sign, signalling that the company is in major financial trouble. I can find examples of this in 2008, but would have to go home and read some books. I’m thinking Bear Stearns and/or Lehman Brothers did the same thing… oh! Enron did this, but not in 2008… and there are some others.
The only time it was done successfully (in my memory) was Ford in 2008, who effectively mortgaged the entire company as to not be put under receivership ala GM. It worked, but Ford is still struggling… even before this crash, their stock traded below $10.
Thanks. Interesting times.
The NCAA announced the no fans attending March Madness games. World Health Organization just declared covid-19 a pandemic.