# Stoidela, you think the North is better than the South?? **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [November 14, 2000, 7:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stoidela-you-think-the-north-is-better-than-the-south/41190 "2000-11-14T19:48:24Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![Gadarene](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e47c2d/32.png) [@Gadarene](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gadarene)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2000, 11:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stoidela-you-think-the-north-is-better-than-the-south/41190/81 "2000-11-15T23:14:28Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Freedom2 \* > You friggin sock puppet. I’m somewhat surprised you’d out me, **Freedom** ; after all, I’m _your_ sock puppet! **yosemite:** Fair enough. **Stoidela** can be indelicate, and you had a legitimate beef with her various generalizations. It’s just that this thing turned real nasty, real quick. **Stoid** , while partisan, has never struck me as particularly mean-spirited or malevolent; if she says she didn’t mean what you say she meant, I’d be generally inclined to give her the benefit of the doubt, let her know that generalizations aren’t appreciated, and move on. This became uncomfortably personal. I think there’s a tendency on this board, in fact, to give less leeway to people don’t express themselves very well. **bj0rn** springs to mind–boy, does he ever spring to mind–and to a lesser extent, **Danielinthewolvesden**. **Stoidela** certainly doesn’t express herself very well, sometimes, but I really don’t see how she’s warranted this level of venom. ---
**Author:** ![Gadarene](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e47c2d/32.png) [@Gadarene](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gadarene)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2000, 11:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stoidela-you-think-the-north-is-better-than-the-south/41190/82 "2000-11-15T23:24:09Z")
[QUOTE] At this point I feel VOR is a troll.QUOTE] > [@](#): > > I consider you a coward. I also believe that you are a sock puppet. > [@](#): > > Your points and posts seem pretty useless to me. Which is it, **Freedom**? Do you think **VoR** is a troll, or a sock puppet, or do you think that his/her points are invalid? While not necessarily mutually exclusive, these characterizations seem inconsistent to me. There’s nothing about **VoR** , other than the circumstances in which he/she began posting (and that fact that he/she disagreed with you), to cause you to treat him/her so poorly so quickly. I don’t think **VoiceofReason** is a troll _or_ a sock puppet. I could be wrong, of course, I see no reason not to take **VoR** at his/her word until otherwise educated. Just my opinion. ---
**Author:** ![Scylla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a5b964/32.png) [@Scylla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scylla)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2000, 11:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stoidela-you-think-the-north-is-better-than-the-south/41190/83 "2000-11-15T23:24:17Z")
When sock puppets start appearing like rats from a shinking ship, I know my job is done. ---
**Author:** ![Gadarene](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e47c2d/32.png) [@Gadarene](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gadarene)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2000, 11:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stoidela-you-think-the-north-is-better-than-the-south/41190/84 "2000-11-15T23:25:50Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Scylla \* > When sock puppets start appearing like rats from a shinking ship, I know my job is done. Oh, fuck off, **Scylla**. What an ass you can be. ---
**Author:** ![Scylla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a5b964/32.png) [@Scylla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scylla)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2000, 11:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stoidela-you-think-the-north-is-better-than-the-south/41190/85 "2000-11-15T23:26:05Z")
Gadarene: It don’t get much more obvious. ---
**Author:** ![Gadarene](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e47c2d/32.png) [@Gadarene](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gadarene)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2000, 11:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stoidela-you-think-the-north-is-better-than-the-south/41190/86 "2000-11-15T23:28:02Z")
Heh…_love_ that juxtaposition. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![yosemite](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/3ab097/32.png) [@yosemite](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/yosemite)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2000, 11:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stoidela-you-think-the-north-is-better-than-the-south/41190/87 "2000-11-15T23:29:16Z")
Gadarene, I tend to agree, it was not my intent when starting this thread to have it mutate into a venomous “let’s all gang up on Stoidela” fest. I had a legitemate beef, I’ve aired it, Stoid and I an hashed it out and I think we both know we are never going to see eye-to-eye. And yes, I agree, her main problem is just sticking her foot in in a HUGE way, and never really “getting it” when the rest of us get our feathers ruffled. It is really a communication issue for the most part. Freedom2’s more extreme response surprised me, I admit. But I suspected that he had been enduring her attitude for longer than some of us, and had _really_ had his fill of it. I am sure he can speak for himself on this, though. ---
**Author:** ![BillyBoy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/34f0e0/32.png) [@BillyBoy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BillyBoy)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2000, 11:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stoidela-you-think-the-north-is-better-than-the-south/41190/88 "2000-11-15T23:30:52Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Scylla \* > \*\*When sock puppets start appearing like rats from a shinking ship, I know my job is done. \*\* Quick question here (making sure I ain’t misinterpreting): Since you mention puppets (plural), and I was the only new poster in this thread since the arrival of the first suspected sock puppet, I can’t help but feel that I am being marked as the second candidate for puppethood. If so, kindly tell me what the deal is. If, however, this isn’t the case, then just tell me what an idiot I am and move on 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![BillyBoy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/34f0e0/32.png) [@BillyBoy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BillyBoy)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2000, 11:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stoidela-you-think-the-north-is-better-than-the-south/41190/89 "2000-11-15T23:38:18Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by BillyBoy \* > \*\*If, however, this isn’t the case, then just tell me what an idiot I am and move on 🙂 \*\* Nevermind, I’ll do it myself. BillyBoy, you’re a dumbass. Sorry to interrupt. ---
**Author:** ![McMurphy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e19adc/32.png) [@McMurphy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/McMurphy)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2000, 11:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stoidela-you-think-the-north-is-better-than-the-south/41190/90 "2000-11-15T23:40:08Z")
I for one don’t think you’re being marked out for Sock puppetry Billy. just to reiterate. I an NOT a sock puppet/troll/Stoidela/Friend of Stoidela or anything else. When I have my first post count party I’m sure you’ll believe me 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Scylla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a5b964/32.png) [@Scylla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scylla)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2000, 11:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stoidela-you-think-the-north-is-better-than-the-south/41190/91 "2000-11-15T23:43:01Z")
Billyboy: No, I was referring to VersionOfReality, the mysterious poster who appears out of nowhere to fight injustice, who has the same syntax and word choice, and makes effectively the same argument as was used in the backpedal of the Conservative thread, in exactly the same way. Though sockpuppets tend to come in a series, I used the plural to make my rat analogy sound good. ---
**Author:** ![Gadarene](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e47c2d/32.png) [@Gadarene](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gadarene)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2000, 11:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stoidela-you-think-the-north-is-better-than-the-south/41190/92 "2000-11-15T23:53:26Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Scylla \* > No, I was referring to VersionOfReality, the mysterious poster who appears out of nowhere to fight injustice, _who has the same syntax and word choice_, and makes effectively the same argument as was used in the backpedal of the Conservative thread, in exactly the same way. Emphasis mine. Are you kidding me? If **VoiceofReason** has the same syntax and word choice as **Stoidela** , then I’m Norman Mailer.\* [sub]\*No offense intended to VoiceofReason, Stoidela, or Norman Mailer. YMMV.[/sub] ---
**Author:** ![xenophon41](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xenophon41/32/253_2.png) [@xenophon41](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/xenophon41)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2000, 11:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stoidela-you-think-the-north-is-better-than-the-south/41190/93 "2000-11-15T23:55:04Z")
I avoided getting involved in **Stoidela** ’s infamous “Why I Don’t Trust etc.” thread because I thought it was an ill-advised and simplistic evaluation of conservative philosophy, and, as an outspoken liberal, I didn’t want to be perceived as painting conservatives with the same brush she used. I won’t go into my own views of the differences between modern liberalism and conservatism here, except to say that I agree with what [**Kimstu**](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?threadid=46074&postid=881317#post881317) said in that thread. Now that I’ve made that clear, I’ll jump into _this_ equally ill-advised and poorly conceived thread by agreeing with the much maligned **TheVoiceofReason** (who I sincerely doubt is anyone’s sock puppet). I’ll go a little further and say that I’m actively disgusted at seeing so many deliberate misinterpretations of someone’s posts. Hey **Scylla** , remember that thread not long ago where you were being flayed for your use of the term “language nazi” and some of us came to your defense because we thought you were being victimized by unreasonable standards and thought policing? Guess what, big guy? How does that shiny new thought police badge feel? Oh, and by the way, your last few posts have been incredibly stupid, and I mean that in the nicest possible way. **Milossarian** and **Freedom2** ; ideologue much? I’ve about decided while reading the myriad election threads in here that you’re both too blinded by your own rhetoric to bother with. I hope you prove me wrong; I’ve enjoyed posts from both of you in the past, and I know that you can both be reasonable when you’re not jerking your knees out of joint. And **Yosemitebabe** , you’re normally a sane and pleasant poster but you seem to be determined in this case to maintain a high level of righteous indignation for very little cause. This confuses me. And for everyone else, please go up and read **TVoR** ’s post in defense of **Stoidela**. Right on! I agree with it completely. And by the way, as both a Southerner and a student of human nature, I agree with **Stoidela** ’s observation that Southerners and those in rural areas of the country are, in general, less sophisticated than urbanites. This is such a truism that I feel silly even having to defend the statement. I guess those of you who are so outraged by that generalization should go to your local libraries and ban Aesop’s works for the scandalous “country mouse/city mouse” fable, and try and expunge the word “urbane” from the language. ---
**Author:** ![Scylla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a5b964/32.png) [@Scylla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scylla)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2000, 12:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stoidela-you-think-the-north-is-better-than-the-south/41190/94 "2000-11-16T00:06:29Z")
xenophon: I remember. I was wrong in that thread. Time will tell if I’m wrong here. I can’t recall anybody who’s just shown up in the middle of a pit thread with their first post who’s turned out to be legit. Who knows? ---
**Author:** ![Freedom](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/bc8723/32.png) [@Freedom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Freedom)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2000, 12:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stoidela-you-think-the-north-is-better-than-the-south/41190/95 "2000-11-16T00:53:07Z")
> [@](#): > > Which is it, Freedom? Do you think VoR is a troll, or a sock puppet, or do you think that his/her points are invalid? I think VOR is a sock puppet trolling in defense of stoidela, and therefore VOR’s posts are inherently invalid. > [@](#): > > I don’t think VoiceofReason is a troll or a sock puppet. If you keep shilling for VOR’s credibility I’m going to start thinking VOR is **YOUR** sock puppet.🙂 C’mon…it is a fairly well established fact around here that if you jump into a pit thread in defense of another poster on your first post, you have a high likliehood of being a sockpuppet. My opinion is either that VOR is a cowardly sock puppet, or is ill-advised to start his posting career in this thread. I don’t think I have treated VOR badly in either case. > [@](#): > > Milossarian and Freedom2; ideologue much? I’ve about decided while reading the myriad election threads in here that you’re both too blinded by your own rhetoric to bother with. I hope you prove me wrong; I’ve enjoyed posts from both of you in the past, and I know that you can both be reasonable when you’re not jerking your knees out of joint. I’m not really known for hedging and making half-hearted statements.🙂 One of the reasons I stopped posting to the election threads on Saturday was because it was obvious to me that I was too involved in the whole thing. Notice that I didn’t need anyone to tell me to back off, I just let people know I was taking a break and took off. I know I have a partisan view of the election debate. I also know that almost every “fact” we have debated has turned out not to be a fact. (on both sides) Reading stoidela’s little rants all week just really got under my skin. It was probably more of a combination of the whole election mess with a little bit of stoidela on the side than anything else. From her thread about rioting in the streets to her hate thread against conservatives to admitting she is bigoted against “unprotected” groups of people, she has been really pissing me off. This thread came up and I blew off some steam. Truthfully, I had typed up a post in this thread about not piling on stoidela anymore. The whole thing rambled and didn’t make much sense, so I hit the clear fields buttons and erased it. If I had posted it, it would have been right after Manda JO’s post. I wasn’t really sure what the point was myself, but I guess I thought that the thread had been hitting stoidela as much as I could feel comfortable with. I guess I had the feeling you get after you’ve been in a fight long enough that you don’t see a point in going any further. I don’t really _regret_ anything I posted, but I have pretty much gotten it out of my system and was just going to move on. Then the sock puppet showed up and the thread took off again. ---
**Author:** ![yosemite](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/3ab097/32.png) [@yosemite](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/yosemite)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2000, 12:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stoidela-you-think-the-north-is-better-than-the-south/41190/96 "2000-11-16T00:56:44Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by xenophon41 \* > Now that I’ve made that clear, I’ll jump into _this_ equally ill-advised and poorly conceived thread by agreeing with the much maligned **TheVoiceofReason** (who I sincerely doubt is anyone’s sock puppet). I don’t care if Voiceof is a sock puppet or not any more. I have my suspicions, but…whatever. > [@](#): > > And **Yosemitebabe** , you’re normally a sane and pleasant poster but you seem to be determined in this case to maintain a high level of righteous indignation for very little cause. This confuses me. Well, thank you for saying I’m “normally” sane! 😉 Occasionally, I think “I’m fed up with this BS!” when I encounter overzealous and extremely partisan posters, and once in a while, I take them up on it. I’ve gotten into little exchanges before with other dopers, where I fling the sarcasm, they fling it back, but no one comes out of it with too much permanent scar tissue. I assume that Stoidela is a pretty hearty chick and can hold her own. I wish her no real harm, this is NOT Real Life. I just got ticked off by her attitude, and didn’t find her blanket “I didn’t mean it that way” statements too convincing. And I got a little fed up. As for “little cause”, there were a lot of comments and attitudes that built up to this for me. It wasn’t a mere paragraph about rural areas and the South. If it were, that would be a vast overreaction, I agree. > [@](#): > > And for everyone else, please go up and read **TVoR** ’s post in defense of **Stoidela**. Right on! I agree with it completely. I did address Voiceof’s point about the Texas thread, and I disagreed with him/her about it. This thread is _not_ just about regionalism, this is not some tongue-in-cheek discussion about a certain part of the country, which is what the Texas thread is about. Her comment about the South was just the straw that broke the camel’s back, that’s all. > [@](#): > > And by the way, as both a Southerner and a student of human nature, I agree with **Stoidela** ’s observation that Southerners and those in rural areas of the country are, in general, less sophisticated than urbanites. This is such a truism that I feel silly even having to defend the statement. I guess those of you who are so outraged by that generalization should go to your local libraries and ban Aesop’s works for the scandalous “country mouse/city mouse” fable, and try and expunge the word “urbane” from the language. I have a friend from Georgia who would strongly disagree with your belief. He would also strongly disagree with Stoid’s attitude, _particularly_ her idea that because these rural folk are less “sophisticated”, they make their voting choices based on other criteria than she would, and she thinks this is “tragic”. I cannot say whether urban folk are more “sophisticated” or not, or what bearing that has on political leaning. I did point out earlier, though, that with cable TV and the Internet, the playing field is leveled out a bit more. Besides, this thread has mutated into more than “city mouse/country mouse” and we all know it. ---
**Author:** ![Gadarene](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e47c2d/32.png) [@Gadarene](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gadarene)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2000, 12:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stoidela-you-think-the-north-is-better-than-the-south/41190/97 "2000-11-16T00:56:57Z")
Care to place a bet on whether or not **VoR** is a sock puppet? I mean, I realize that the last bet you placed on here didn’t go particularly well, so forgive me if I’m not standing in awe of your prognostication ability. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![nebuli](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/0ea827/32.png) [@nebuli](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/nebuli)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2000, 12:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stoidela-you-think-the-north-is-better-than-the-south/41190/98 "2000-11-16T00:58:17Z")
Voice of Reason- to address the points you originally raised: no, there is nothing in this thread to warrant some of the responses. But you have to understand, that what is being expressed here is not so much reaction to Stoidela’s comments here, as extreme exasperation generated by a consistent style she has displayed in many other recent threads. Read Manda JO’s excellent advice posted earlier in this thread. Now imagine somebody violating all the precepts mentioned in her advice- relentlessly, in thread after thread. You might begin to understand why some people are now overreacting. It is not surprising that Kimstu, Xenophon41 and PunditLisa- who are in general agreement with her politics if I’m not mistaken- are suggesting Stoidela amend her style. And just for the record: I’m a lifelong registered Democrat, a centerist, a New Yorker, and am **far** from being a Bush supporter, so I have no reason to be personally offended by anything she said, I just think many of her comments recently have been counterproductive. (And in fairness I have to say that Stoidela is certainly not the only one guilty of that, as I’m sure you have noticed already). ---
**Author:** ![Gadarene](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e47c2d/32.png) [@Gadarene](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gadarene)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2000, 12:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stoidela-you-think-the-north-is-better-than-the-south/41190/99 "2000-11-16T00:59:17Z")
Sorry, **yosemite** –that last post of mine was directed to **Freedom**. You just kinda snuck in there. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![xenophon41](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xenophon41/32/253_2.png) [@xenophon41](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/xenophon41)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2000, 1:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stoidela-you-think-the-north-is-better-than-the-south/41190/100 "2000-11-16T01:04:38Z")
> [@](#): > > _Freedom2_: I don’t really regret anything I posted, but I have pretty much gotten it out of my system and was just going to move on. Fair enough. I hadn’t noticed that you’d taken a break from the election threads; your reason for doing so is the same as my reason for not posting to them in the first place. I’m too partisan to trust some of my arguments. Glad you got it out of your system. (Next time try an aimless rant attacking _every_ party/position/philosophy that pisses you off. It really feels good!) [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stoidela-you-think-the-north-is-better-than-the-south/41190.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stoidela-you-think-the-north-is-better-than-the-south/41190.md?page=6)