I think we should hold people accountable for their choices, and voting for Trump, with all the information that is out there is indeed stupid.
However, I would still hesitate to call people themselves stupid, because firstly, the adjective starts to lose all force if we’re using it to describe what might (sadly) be the majority of the electorate.
Secondly if making a stupid choice in one facet of someone’s life, one time, is enough to label that person a stupid person, then I’m stupid and I’m not sure I’ve ever known someone who wasn’t.
And finally of course there’s just the media environment in the US right now. It doesn’t excuse people not seeking out reliable sources, but it’s definitely a factor that the rabbit holes are so deep and with so many people welcoming you in.
I’m pretty sure that over 50% of US voters are low information voters. A bit of a mystery to me why they need to vote in presidential elections if they either do not know much or have ignored all the information coming to them. A good portion of them also never check the credentials of a news source. It is somewhat undestandable due to the good ones also using click baits to a large degree. Especially the headlines are worded that way.
Back in 1972, although I wasn’t even old enough to vote, I realized you should never underestimate the stupidity of the American electorate. And that was before being able to blame it on Fox and their ilk.
Yes that’s the sad thing; the MAGA movement has mobilized and energized the low-information voter.
There a CGP Grey video on memes; it’s pretty old so I won’t bother to post it. But it talked about research on the properties of memes that help them spread, and the best property was: anger. If a meme makes you angry, you’re much more likely to share it with your social group than any of the other traits they were counting.
Many of the people who haven’t touched politics before are suddenly motivated to get involved because of nonsense they’ve heard and shared about vaccines, migrants being given luxury houses, pet-eating etc.
I won’t say this is the only reason for MAGAs success, but it’s at least, say, a third of it.
Sure. Of course I saw that. And if course I know that stupid /= ignorance.
But you also decline to add anything of value. You were the first person (recently) to use the word ignorant, and then you suggest a couple of flavors of ignorance. Yet you fail to offer which flavor of ignorance (or just plain old ignorance) applies to Trump voters, and how willful or arrogant ignorance are not “stupid.” So I’m not sure what clever point you think you are making. Repeating it does not make it any more clever or insightful.
Seriously, you have made as stupid choices, in the face of such profound available evidence, as thinking Trump is the better candidate? You think most people have? I’d love to hear examples.
And, you suspect that the folk who are willing to vote for Trump are not making additional quality choices in other facets of their lives?
Further, I’m not sure I intended to state that Trump voters are “stupid” in all aspects of their lives. I apologize to the extent I gave that impression. I presume many of them know how to tie their own shoes. But the choice to vote for Trump certainly impresses me as either stupid or depraved. Not sure folk have offered other better explanations.
And I personally am not sure ignorance suits. We might need to agree on a definition of “ignorance.” I just did a quick google and came up with
lacking knowledge or awareness in general; uneducated or [unsophisticated] OR lacking knowledge, information, or awareness about a particular thing.
Do you believe Trump voters and/or Fox believers are lacking knowledge, information, or awareness about the election? Serious question, does the term “ignorance” necessarily include “RELIABLE” (or some similar adjective) information/knowledge/awareness? If you believe that, cite, please.
By my understanding, an ignorant voter would be a person who paid minimal attention to the election, consumed minimal media about it, yet for whatever reason, decided to vote and either flipped a coin or voted for Trump because they used to enjoy watching the Apprentice.
Possibly someone who voted Trump because he is a man, or against Harris because she is female and of color might qualify as ignorant. But I would not hesitate to assign any number of uncomplimentary adjectives to such versions of ignorance.
You’re in one of the seven swing states. This race is going to come down to turnout. Who turns out the most people-- will it be Trump or Harris? Have you checked out mobilize.us to find a GOTV event near you? Canvassing, phone banking, office/admin work are all needed to turn people out in Michigan. Gut feelings are bullcrap, getting out the vote is how we win this.
Is a silly point that adds nothing to understanding. Of course people can be intelligent and well intentioned and misinformed. Every professional deals with this every day. Even when dealing with highly educated people.
The issue relevant to this discussion is why someone is misinformed. And if they are open to becoming informed.
That’s my simple, and I thought easy to understand, point: these are not just plain old ignorant people in most cases. These are people intentionally keeping blinders on and avoiding information that is inconsistent with their current beliefs, and people who think they know more than they do so are unwilling to consider that their beliefs are false.
Simple ignorance, just plain old being misinformed, are fine. Heck stupidity I have understanding of. This is worse than that.
The idea that Trump voters are “ignorant”, “low-information” or “stupid” is repeated a lot here.
Another hypothesis is that they know exactly what Trump is and they like what they see.
I know what I think is more likely.
It’s the second one. They are not ignorant or stupid, they are angry and Trump is their revenge. That’s why nothing Trump does affects his support, they want an asshole.
I’d like to offer an alternative between “stupid” and “ignorant”: “ill-educated.” These are people with the skills to reason (so not stupid) and who take in information and assess it (so not entirely ignorant).
What they’re not doing is assessing their sources of information critically, or working through the long-term implications of the choices they are making now. They’re thinking, but they haven’t been trained as to how to think critically in their role as citizens of a democratic republic.
A report from Bug Tussle, Tennessee, i.e. Trumpo Country.
Relatively few Trumpo signs, compared to past elections.
Many, many more signs for Democrats.
Challenges to GOP Reps & Senators here, too.
A large increase in people moving into Tennessee, especially in Middle TN, may have a “blueing” effect.
Local GOP officials are quietly cold to Trump, & may be working behind the scenes to sink his ship.
I wonder where the people who are blue-ing Tennessee are moving in from? However, it’s probably still red enough that it cannot turn into the next Virginia.
Either way, though, the fact that signs are decreasing for Trump nationally, and signs increasing for Kamala/Democrats nationally, is Indication #89724 that the goose is cooked. Although Trump was never popular to endorse in public, the stigma is clearly increasing.
