# Students of Virginity: A Rant **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [March 31, 2008, 5:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/students-of-virginity-a-rant/443352 "2008-03-31T05:33:40Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2008, 6:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/students-of-virginity-a-rant/443352/61 "2008-03-31T18:42:40Z")
[QUOTE=cwthree] …you could inadvertently bond yourself to yourself (or to your Hitachi Magic Wand, your shower head, your **picnic table** , etc.). [/QUOTE] I might need to start a GQ thread about the bolded part. 😕 **Essay** , I propose we have sex immediately in celebration of your position. Agreed? ---
**Author:** ![Freudian\_Slit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/5daacb/32.png) [@Freudian\_Slit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Freudian_Slit)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2008, 6:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/students-of-virginity-a-rant/443352/62 "2008-03-31T18:43:54Z")
[QUOTE=eleanorigby] I feel sorry for her. She must be quite unhappy on some level. I have no problem with no someone not wanting to masturbate or have sex. I have no problem with her odd notion of hormones. I have no problem with any of her choices, IF they were for her alone. It’s the evangelism and the insistence on her position being the correct one that disturbs me. I think she must have control issues–to fear orgasm (ie to lose control) and intimacy that much. ☹ [/QUOTE] I agree. If I had a friend who didn’t want to have sex until they were married, or want to masturbate, or anything she’s done, I’d be fine with that–no pressure or anything. It’s her life, it’s her choice. I respect it. But I don’t think she can really generalize to everyone based on her life. Her statements about wondering do men do that (look at people and think you’d like to have sex with them) and getting weirded out by her friend Leo’s description of his urges/lust…it does make me wonder why she’s really doing this. The article also did say that Leo’s father was a child molestor. I’m not saying he was abused and therefore he’s celibate…but yeah, I have to admit, it made me wonder. And it makes me wonder about her choices, too. Not that there’s anything wrong with them, but as you point out, **eleanorigby** , there seems to be an undercurrent of hostility. I sort of worry for her. ETA: [QUOTE=Really Not All That Bright] I might need to start a GQ thread about the bolded part. 😕 [/QUOTE] > **[Fox News - Breaking News Updates | Latest News Headlines | Photos & News Video](https://www.foxnews.com/)** > > Breaking News, Latest News and Current News from FOXNews.com. Breaking news and video. Latest Current News: U.S., World, Entertainment, Health, Business, Technology, Politics, Sports. ---
**Author:** ![cwthree](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/9de0a6/32.png) [@cwthree](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cwthree)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2008, 6:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/students-of-virginity-a-rant/443352/63 "2008-03-31T18:49:19Z")
[QUOTE=Really Not All That Bright] I might need to start a GQ thread about the bolded part. 😕 [/QUOTE] [Your wish](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=9626982&postcount=31) is my command. ---
**Author:** ![Antinor01](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ecae2f/32.png) [@Antinor01](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Antinor01)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2008, 6:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/students-of-virginity-a-rant/443352/64 "2008-03-31T18:53:56Z")
[QUOTE=Ensign Edison] You immature sociopathic abusive sadist, you! [/QUOTE] I know! Us Monty Python fans are just freaks that should be locked up. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2008, 7:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/students-of-virginity-a-rant/443352/65 "2008-03-31T19:06:08Z")
[QUOTE=cwthree] [Your wish](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=9626982&postcount=31) is my command. [/QUOTE] Oh. Where does the penis go? > [@](#): > > I think she must have control issues–to fear orgasm (ie to lose control) and intimacy that much. [TMI]I once knew a girl who refused to masturbate or allow anyone else to touch her “down there” including her SOs, because she was terrified that she’d lose control of her sphincter(s) if she had an orgasm. I always figured she had some sort of embarrassing public urination or defaecation incident as a child.[/TMI] ---
**Author:** ![Weirddave](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/919ad9/32.png) [@Weirddave](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Weirddave)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2008, 7:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/students-of-virginity-a-rant/443352/66 "2008-03-31T19:18:21Z")
[QUOTE=Cervaise] Christ, you’re an idiot. [/QUOTE] Oh go fuck yourself. My farts are smarter than you are. Personally, I happen to agree with the OP WRT sex, but I’m at least honest enough to recognize hypocrisy when I see it, I don’t give it a pass just because I happen to agree with the position presented. ---
**Author:** ![Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/qadgop_the_mercotan/32/83_2.png) [@Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qadgop_the_Mercotan)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2008, 7:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/students-of-virginity-a-rant/443352/67 "2008-03-31T19:18:35Z")
[QUOTE=eleanorigby] I have no problem with her odd notion of hormones. [/QUOTE] I have a problem with her pushing her completely unproven, and in some cases demonstrably false, assertions about sex and oxytocin as actual fact. ---
**Author:** ![Dangerosa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/22d042/32.png) [@Dangerosa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dangerosa)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2008, 7:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/students-of-virginity-a-rant/443352/68 "2008-03-31T19:43:03Z")
[QUOTE=Qadgop the Mercotan] I have a problem with her pushing her completely unproven, and in some cases demonstrably false, assertions about sex and oxytocin as actual fact. [/QUOTE] The whole “hormonal bonding” thing comes from 1930s research and was thankfully debunked decades ago. Thankfully because women who adopt or can’t breastfeed need to (and do) form the same bonds with their children - as do fathers. ---
**Author:** ![Illuminatiprimus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/illuminatiprimus/32/11520_2.png) [@Illuminatiprimus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Illuminatiprimus)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2008, 8:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/students-of-virginity-a-rant/443352/69 "2008-03-31T20:04:03Z")
[QUOTE=Weirddave] Oh go fuck yourself. My farts are smarter than you are. Personally, I happen to agree with the OP WRT sex, but I’m at least honest enough to recognize **hypocrisy** when I see it, I don’t give it a pass just because I happen to agree with the position presented. [/QUOTE] I don’t think that word means what you think it means. As others have pointed out in this thread the OP isn’t pitting abstinence, she’s pitting the self-righteous and evangelical nature of the movement that is trying to get others to take up abstinence based on some very shaky reasoning and unproven research. As the OP says quite a few times she’s all for people abstaining if that’s what they want, as much as she is for people having sex if that’s what they want - it’s a choice. The group the OP refers to, on the other hand, seem to be making their case on the basis that there _shouldn’t_ be a choice - that it’s abstinence and acceptance into some earthly kingdom of heaven come marriage, or have sex and experience a life of emotional disability (and “marital poverty”, no less). The OP is merely pointing out the logical disconnect in that reasoning in an earnest fashion, not saying that their views themselves are wrong. She also makes the (extremely valid) point that she knows what she’s talking about in regards to sex, whereas the people in this movement don’t, so they can’t really claim to be informed can they? So, where exactly is the hypocrisy? Or should I go fuck myself too? Anyway, **Essay** , that was a masterful pitting, and if I had a high enough opinion of myself to keep a blog I’d ask your permission to reproduce it. I seriously laughed my arse off when I read this: [QUOTE=Essay] When asked about masturbation, the group’s president just said, “Oh, God, no!” Replace the “no” with “yes” and you’re a bit closer to my position. [/QUOTE] Brilliant. Oh, and I will be using the phrase “not exactly a bucket of rainbows” in a conversation sometime this week. 😛 ---
**Author:** ![Cervaise](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cervaise/32/16693_2.png) [@Cervaise](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cervaise)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2008, 8:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/students-of-virginity-a-rant/443352/70 "2008-03-31T20:06:29Z")
[QUOTE=Weirddave] Oh go fuck yourself. [/QUOTE] Ooo, that sounds _dirrrrr_-ty. ---
**Author:** ![Weirddave](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/919ad9/32.png) [@Weirddave](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Weirddave)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2008, 8:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/students-of-virginity-a-rant/443352/71 "2008-03-31T20:40:09Z")
[QUOTE=Illuminatiprimus] I don’t think that word means what you think it means. As others have pointed out in this thread the OP isn’t pitting abstinence, she’s pitting the self-righteous and evangelical nature of the movement that is trying to get others to take up abstinence based on some very shaky reasoning and unproven research. As the OP says quite a few times she’s all for people abstaining if that’s what they want, as much as she is for people having sex if that’s what they want - it’s a choice. [/QUOTE] Other people have said as much, but from her own OP: > [@](#): > > There’s a huge middle ground, a middle ground I am delighted to occupy. When you’re with someone you love, you wait until you both feel ready, you respect each other, and you both care about each other’s needs, why the hell shouldn’t you have sex? For God’s sake, it’s fun. If you’re clean, monogamous, and neither of you is slutting it around on the weekends, you’re not likely to catch all the scary diseases they warn you about. Use protection, use good judgment… sure, it carries risk, but so does anything worth doing. and > [@](#): > > AND SOMETIMES, WE ENJOY BEING NORMAL SEXUAL BEINGS. Mature adults in a mature relationship can handle it without devaluing all that is good in the world, and just because you’ve chosen something different doesn’t mean yours is the best decision for every woman, for every couple. Grow the fuck up! Jesus! It’s pretty clear that, all of her lip service to the contrary, she considers folks who chose abstinence to be strange and unnatural and premarital sex to be normal and a good idea (“I think if I were a blushing bride all worked up for my wedding night, I would already be nervous enough that, with one glimpse of that thing, I’d pass out.”). Again, I actually agree with those views, BUT I am not going to tell someone who holds opposing thoughts on the matter “I’m right and you’re wrong” without being completely aware of the hypocritical nature of my statement; doing so in the context of a rant that comes down to condemning the other person for their beliefs that they are right and other people are wrong is a two for one gig: Hypocritical and ironic. ---
**Author:** ![ZebraShaSha](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/eada6e/32.png) [@ZebraShaSha](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ZebraShaSha)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2008, 8:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/students-of-virginity-a-rant/443352/72 "2008-03-31T20:40:36Z")
Is she cute? ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2008, 8:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/students-of-virginity-a-rant/443352/73 "2008-03-31T20:42:12Z")
[QUOTE=Morgyn] And disposing of icky creatures with way too many (or not enough) legs. [/QUOTE] We have a (female) dog who does that. She stalks through the house, finds even the tiniest bug on the ceiling and stares at it. When we knock it down, she gobbles it up. Detection and disposal all in one package. And she’s not a virgin either. 😛 ---
**Author:** ![Weirddave](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/919ad9/32.png) [@Weirddave](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Weirddave)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2008, 8:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/students-of-virginity-a-rant/443352/74 "2008-03-31T20:43:31Z")
[QUOTE=Cervaise] Ooo, that sounds _dirrrrr_-ty. [/QUOTE] Only if we do it right. ---
**Author:** ![Freudian\_Slit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/5daacb/32.png) [@Freudian\_Slit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Freudian_Slit)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2008, 8:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/students-of-virginity-a-rant/443352/75 "2008-03-31T20:44:39Z")
[QUOTE=ZebraShaSha] Is she cute? [/QUOTE] Janie? There’s a pic in the article. ---
**Author:** ![Anne\_Neville](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/b9e5f3/32.png) [@Anne\_Neville](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Anne_Neville)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2008, 8:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/students-of-virginity-a-rant/443352/76 "2008-03-31T20:46:02Z")
[QUOTE=Cat Fight] virgins…on a North American college campus, there are still plenty of them there. [/QUOTE] They’re in the physics and engineering departments. ---
**Author:** ![detop](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/bcef8e/32.png) [@detop](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/detop)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2008, 8:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/students-of-virginity-a-rant/443352/77 "2008-03-31T20:50:29Z")
Actually, I’m all in favor of that virginity shit. Otherwise, where are we easily find sacrifices for Our Dark Lord ? 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Maeglin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/8baadc/32.png) [@Maeglin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Maeglin)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2008, 8:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/students-of-virginity-a-rant/443352/78 "2008-03-31T20:51:55Z")
[QUOTE=Weirddave] It’s pretty clear that, all of her lip service to the contrary, she considers folks who chose abstinence to be strange and unnatural and premarital sex to be normal and a good idea (“I think if I were a blushing bride all worked up for my wedding night, I would already be nervous enough that, with one glimpse of that thing, I’d pass out.”). [/QUOTE] No, what is pretty clear here is that your attempts at critical thinking exceed your capabilities. The OP claims to be part of this “middle” that the abstinence evangelist excludes. The OP made no normative claims. The OP is enthusiastic about sex. Hooray. I don’t mean to be a reflexive (and slightly retarded) contrarian like Weirddave, but the OP is tepid and the position is stunningly non-controversial. If your side of the argument is kind of pedestrian, you have to make up for it with over-the-top rhetoric and honest-to-goodness abuse. Not being able to tell the difference between metonymy and synecdoche doesn’t really cut it. ---
**Author:** ![Autolycus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/22d042/32.png) [@Autolycus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Autolycus)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2008, 9:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/students-of-virginity-a-rant/443352/79 "2008-03-31T21:00:07Z")
Too bad that student group wasn’t at BC. There’s a wonderful course I’m taking called Sex and Spirituality. We tackle issues such as gender, masturbation, sex pre/post marriage/singlehood/celibacy, and homosexuality. The dominant attitude among the heavily Christian class is that sex is a wonderful gift that can be shared between two people who love each other. That’s a gross oversimplification really, but I just wish there were more traditional Catholics that didn’t fall into the camp of premarital sex=ticket to hell, post-marriage=sex is wonderful! > [@Maeglin](#): > > Not being able to understand the difference between metonymy and synecdoche doesn’t really cut it. Huh? I understand the words, but not what you meant. ---
**Author:** ![Boyo\_Jim](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/87869e/32.png) [@Boyo\_Jim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Boyo_Jim)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2008, 9:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/students-of-virginity-a-rant/443352/80 "2008-03-31T21:00:35Z")
nNice rant! I must say, though, you had me at **True Love Revolution (puke!)**. I am forced to remove a tenth point because you exceeded my attention span, or the maybe Virginators did. 9.9, very nice dismount! [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/students-of-virginity-a-rant/443352.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/students-of-virginity-a-rant/443352.md?page=5)