I said nothing that could reasonably be construed as suggesting the groups were equal in size, common sense, or moral standing. I merely asserted then, and now, that they are a largely disjoint set of people with different mindsets and motivations. Painting either group with the other’s brush is both ignorant and misleading. FTR, I personally am in neither group and haven’t been for ~30 years.
Now yes, many folks who started out as hunter / sportsmen as kids 40 years ago have now morphed into fear-driven survivalists with ridiculous arsenals.
In my parsing of the facts as I see them that’s them abandoning the “hunt for sport or food” camp and entering the “personal / home defense AKA fear-driven” camp.
I think there is some credibility to the claim based entirely on my own feelings to be clear. Although I may well be something of an outlier, as a (D) leaning, gun owner with several firearms.
First, a quick but associated digression. I own a LOT of guns, and expect to own a LOT more in the not-too-distant future. Mostly because my wife’s grandparents hunted, their siblings hunted, my father and his brothers as well. But in the current generation, there’s ONE hunter and the wife and I who target shoot. So most of my grandparent’s generation, and a lot of my FIL’s generation firearms have gone to a smaller and smaller selection of descendants. I have a lot of them, because my FiL lacked the space to store them securely anymore, but I can’t (yet) sell or otherwise get rid of many of them because they’re heirlooms.
Now, back to my patterns. I have purchased several firearms myself. A pair of semi-auto pistols picked up for self defense when I was doing a job with higher-than-normal risk. I do have a CCW, but have not carried for years - that higher risk made me uncomfortable and I left the job. I also have various firearms that are just fun to shoot (a lever action pistol caliber carbine, and a Ruger Mini-14) that were purchased only to put holes in paper.
BUT - and directly to the OP, with the ongoing threats from the Right (I’m in a pretty red area of a light blue state), mass shootings near me (Colorado Springs), and the seemingly endless increase in anti-Semitism (while secular, my name is a pretty trope-tastic Jewish name) I do have some generalized anxiety about assaults upon myself and home. I don’t DO anything about it, but every once in a while, I wonder if I should carry again, or if I should buy more ammunition.
The rational, practical and pragmatic part of me always answers “No” and I have not done either in years, but yeah, there’s absolutely a “I’m prepared, but am I prepared enough” mindset that comes with the feeling of risk, real and otherwise. And that’s for me who isn’t exactly bombarded by FOX news and MAGA screaming that they’re coming for me. Just those right wingers saying they are in their own words.
Well, I won’t ding anyone here for being a pedant, but since that whole sentence, and verily, my entire post is how I was A) a gun owner and B) how it simultaneously made me feel safer and more anxious at the same time, I don’t think there was any implication that I had done some sort of blind study to add to the research on the point.
Sure, but there is also skeet & trap shooting, Olympic shooting, Cowboy action shooting and people who collect but dont shoot.
From your cite, it does show that 52% of Americans have the gun for hunting even if not the prime reason. 59% use for sport shooting and 41% for collecting. But yes, protection is the most cited reason.
And saying “for use against people” is a stretch since your cite says “for protection”. Most people that have a gun for that reason hope and pray they never have to use it, and often just displaying a gun can get a intruder to run.
i carried a gun as a Security guard, and then later they gave me a CCW due to a serious threat. But carrying concealed is annoying, so after I moved out of that county where we got the threat, I let my permit expire. I dont feel any need or desire to carry a gun for protection, unless in the wilderness. And I sold off almost all my guns, keeping only my service pistol and an old .22 single shot rifle my Father gave me. I also gave up hunting and trap shooting.
Well, they had their automatic firing guns with anesthesia needles , and Doc carried knock out gas bombs.
And trap & skeet shooting and Cowboy action shooting and collecting and Olympic/target shooting and …
True- “Obama will take away our guns!” "Biden will take away our Guns! "- neither of which happened. In fact the trump administration banned more guns that either of those (Bump stock ban)…
Apples and oranges. You are comparing what % of the US Population vs what % of gun owners. From Der_Trihs cite, it shows that 52% of gun owners own a gun for hunting, altho for only 32% that is their primary reason. 52% is a large percentage of gun owners.
Not only to play off of your comment, but your past profession:
It’s the proverbial self-licking ice cream cone. Much like every RW pundit on the air these days, talking about “Americans’ lack of faith in our election system,” they’re the ones creating that doubt.
It’s also the old joke about the guy who kills both his parents, and then begs the court for lenience because he’s an orphan.
Classic American perverse incentive. It’s truly what – IMHO – “American exceptionalism” is actually about.
I have said my piece, made a few points and corrections, but these Gun threads get very heated and people start Flagging posts like a rat going for a nicotine fix.
I guess I am too. I live remote. Ain’t nobody gonna help me but me. The sheriffs office is closed from 11pm to 7am. Nobody even on patrol. It would take them a 15 minutes to a half hour to get here on a good day when they are open.
I don’t feel ‘endangered’. That’s BS. I’ve been a target shooter since I was 9 years old. I would feel endangered if I had no way to defend my wife and I.
A bear broke into a house about a month ago and severally injured a man. Would a gun have helped? No way to know. They are not a magic rock that keeps tigers away.
Anyway, I’m not really concerned about two legged predators. I guess a crazy person might try to break in though. I’m sure in our valley everyone is armed. Well, it’s a good assumption.
I don’t conceal or open carry. Would be a pain in the ass. Guns carry a tremendous amount of responsibility and… focus. Too much of a distraction for day to day living.
More like lots of them, they’ll take the ammo too. Despite all the paranoia over “home invasions”, in real life most burglars make a point of avoiding confrontation and by preference rob places when they are empty. Those guns aren’t going to shoot burglars all by themselves.
After you own one gun you need a second to protect the first. And then you have two guns to protect, so that needs even more firepower. The bigger your arsenal, the more insufficient it is to protect itself.
Airplanes on treadmills have nothing on this line of logic.
I was just out to dinner with a colleague of mine, a retired cop who is very in to guns (he teaches CCW classes and also gun shows are the highlight of his year). He said in a very exasperated tone that he was not looking forward to going to downtown Cleveland the next day to take his grandson to a Cavaliers game, as his daughter had gotten a suite for them. My other colleagues and I (a buncha liberal GenXers) were confused as to why it would be a bad thing to go to a suite at a game. Sounded cool to us!
He said he hates going downtown, it’s a “two strap situation” (meaning two CCWs I guess?) but since he’s no longer a police officer he can’t bring his guns to the arena.
Now, I live in the suburbs (as does he) and I’ve been going downtown all my life, and have gone many times by myself and have NEVER felt unsafe. I mean, I’m walking around with heightened awareness but I’ve never felt the need to be armed. Especially when you’re there for a sporting event - the streets are shoulder-to-shoulder suburbanites trying to get to the game.
I tried to call him out on him being a bit of a baby not feeling safe without his guns, going to a basketball game, but he was like “don’t you hear about all of the shootings happening at bars after games?” No, I don’t. And like…I don’t go to bars after games?
Then when we left he said he was happy to get home in time for the 10 o’clock news. He says he watches the news every morning at 8 and every night at 10.
I dunno if his exposure to local news is the problem, or his ex-cop status (he was a cop in the suburbs), or his age (72), or his racism, or what…but he is definitely a person who’s guns make him feel safe and endangered at the same time.
In the case of (retired) LEOs there’s also the ingrained reaction that the sound of violence means they need to charge into it and take control of it.
Rather than the reaction of non-LEOs which is to either ignore it or flee from it based on which seems safer.
Ref @ZipperJJ’s example, the best way to avoid a bar shooting is to be at the bar across the street, or already driving home before the stupid people come out.
