# Study says young docs learned wrong procedure from TV medical dramas
**URL:** https://boards.straightdope.com/t/study-says-young-docs-learned-wrong-procedure-from-tv-medical-dramas/491736
**Category:** The BBQ Pit
**Created:** [April 2, 2009, 5:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/study-says-young-docs-learned-wrong-procedure-from-tv-medical-dramas/491736 "2009-04-02T17:36:25Z")
**Posts on this page:** 20
**Page:** 3
### Author:  [@Dangerosa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dangerosa)
#### Post date: [April 3, 2009, 1:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/study-says-young-docs-learned-wrong-procedure-from-tv-medical-dramas/491736/41 "2009-04-03T01:23:32Z")
> [@askeptic](#):
>
> What does William Felt have to do with fucking with airways? Had you said “Unless you are Linda Lovelace…” it would have been witty. As it stands it just doesn’t make much sense.
I suppose it depends on your point of view…Felt seems to be fucking the airway…Lovelace having the airway fucked.
---
### Author:  [@Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qadgop_the_Mercotan)
#### Post date: [April 3, 2009, 2:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/study-says-young-docs-learned-wrong-procedure-from-tv-medical-dramas/491736/42 "2009-04-03T02:02:45Z")
I kinda liked how I was taught to do intubation: Practice on a recently deceased John Doe, under the supervision of an ER or surgical or anesthesia resident.
After that, the only times I had to do it in the field, I got it right.
It was considered a legit approach, since folks coming into our teaching hospital gave explicit or implied consent for participating in training of students
But someone decided it wasn’t ethical, because we couldn’t get informed consent from the next of kin. So it was stopped, and next generations of students trained on dummies.
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### Author:  [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skald_the_Rhymer)
#### Post date: [April 3, 2009, 2:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/study-says-young-docs-learned-wrong-procedure-from-tv-medical-dramas/491736/43 "2009-04-03T02:13:51Z")
> [@incidental](#):
>
> One of the most spot-on gripes I ever heard from another med student about Gray’s Anatomy was that no surgical resident would even be walking in the doors of the hospital during daylight hours. So true.
Why not? I’m asking, not contesting.
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### Author:  [@ToeJam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ToeJam)
#### Post date: [April 3, 2009, 2:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/study-says-young-docs-learned-wrong-procedure-from-tv-medical-dramas/491736/44 "2009-04-03T02:36:42Z")
> [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](#):
>
> Why not? I’m asking, not contesting.
Usually their hours start/end waaaay early in the morning, like 3-6am sorta things.
If they’re doing a surgery rotation the surgeons are usually there nice and early before the sun is up to start their days, and so the students and residents also have to get up earlier to beat them there to make a good impression, start their own work/ business, etc.
Or they’re just about to leave before the sun comes up (depending on their shifts) if they just finished being on call.
It’s a very weird feeling to finish studying and start walking back home at 4am and run into the Surgery student who’s getting into get ready for work at like 4am… And then when I’m in the parking garage meet the one who just finished the shift at 4am and is now trying to figure out where can they get dinner at that hour… :smack:
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### Author:  [@dropzone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dropzone)
#### Post date: [April 3, 2009, 2:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/study-says-young-docs-learned-wrong-procedure-from-tv-medical-dramas/491736/45 "2009-04-03T02:44:03Z")
I don’t think it’s true. It sounds like an urban legend, especially because no fictional TV show would show an intubation for two reasons: it’s really really gross and I can’t imagine any actor going along with Noah Wyle sticking a _plastic_ tube down his or her throat.
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### Author:  [@Rand\_Rover](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rand_Rover)
#### Post date: [April 3, 2009, 3:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/study-says-young-docs-learned-wrong-procedure-from-tv-medical-dramas/491736/46 "2009-04-03T03:01:07Z")
> [@Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](#):
>
> I kinda liked how I was taught to do intubation: Practice on a recently deceased John Doe, under the supervision of an ER or surgical or anesthesia resident.
How recently deceased? Just picturing folks shoving away the grieving widow so they can practice on the dude.
---
### Author:  [@DoctorJ](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DoctorJ)
#### Post date: [April 3, 2009, 3:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/study-says-young-docs-learned-wrong-procedure-from-tv-medical-dramas/491736/47 "2009-04-03T03:17:07Z")
The one mannerism that everybody picks up from TV is that at the end of an unsuccessful code, when the doctor “calls” it, a lot of them tend to do so by stating aloud the time of death. In fact, I’ve been in codes where a nurse or tech didn’t think it was “official” until I let out a sigh, looked up at the clock, and gravely intoned, “Time of death: 10:47 PM.”
It’s not a bad idea, really; it’s kind of an odd moment, so you have to say something.
I did woefully few intubations in my training. When I was in med school the residents did them all, and in my residency the respiratory therapists did them all, and were usually halfway done by the time we got there. (Their call room was closer to the ICUs.) The anesthesiologists at my residency hospital were world-class pricks who wouldn’t let us work with them. I’ve done just enough to have privileges to do them at my hospital, and I could if I had to, but I haven’t done one in years. Our ER docs could put one in a gerbil and they’re never more than a minute away.
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### Author:  [@wolfman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wolfman)
#### Post date: [April 3, 2009, 4:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/study-says-young-docs-learned-wrong-procedure-from-tv-medical-dramas/491736/48 "2009-04-03T04:11:06Z")
> [@Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](#):
>
> Do you have a similar issue with “incarcerate”?
>
> QtM, who as intubated the incarcerated, and also reduced the incarcerated hernia of the incarcerated patient.
No, Because Carce or Carcer is not an actual word, or or least anything I’ve ever heard of, but Tube is.
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### Author:  [@Ike\_Witt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ike_Witt)
#### Post date: [April 3, 2009, 4:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/study-says-young-docs-learned-wrong-procedure-from-tv-medical-dramas/491736/49 "2009-04-03T04:23:29Z")
> [@wolfman](#):
>
> No, Because Carce or Carcer is not an actual word, or or least anything I’ve ever heard of, but Tube is.
The [state prison of ancient Rome](http://www.vroma.org/~forum/carcer.html).
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### Author:  [@Aji\_de\_Gallina](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aji_de_Gallina)
#### Post date: [April 3, 2009, 4:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/study-says-young-docs-learned-wrong-procedure-from-tv-medical-dramas/491736/50 "2009-04-03T04:34:30Z")
> [@Duke](#):
>
> You mean it _is_ lupus?
No, it’s Munchausen’s by proxy.
(There should be a ranking as to how many episodes/patients it takes a doctor show to get someone with lupus or Muchausen’s)
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### Author:  [@Lynn\_Bodoni](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lynn_Bodoni)
#### Post date: [April 3, 2009, 5:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/study-says-young-docs-learned-wrong-procedure-from-tv-medical-dramas/491736/51 "2009-04-03T05:08:49Z")
> [@Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](#):
>
> I kinda liked how I was taught to do intubation: Practice on a recently deceased John Doe, under the supervision of an ER or surgical or anesthesia resident.
>
> After that, the only times I had to do it in the field, I got it right.
>
> It was considered a legit approach, since folks coming into our teaching hospital gave explicit or implied consent for participating in training of students
>
> But someone decided it wasn’t ethical, because we couldn’t get informed consent from the next of kin. So it was stopped, and next generations of students trained on dummies.
I have told my husband specifically that I want my dead body to be used for training purposes and/or spare parts. He wasn’t thrilled with the notion, but he agreed to it.
My body will probably be filed under the “Horrible Example” heading.
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### Author:  [@VinylTurnip](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/VinylTurnip)
#### Post date: [April 3, 2009, 6:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/study-says-young-docs-learned-wrong-procedure-from-tv-medical-dramas/491736/52 "2009-04-03T06:16:00Z")
> [@Rand\_Rover](#):
>
> How recently deceased? Just picturing folks shoving away the grieving widow so they can practice on the dude.
Need some time alone with your erection?
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### Author:  [@Typo\_Knig](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Typo_Knig)
#### Post date: [April 3, 2009, 11:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/study-says-young-docs-learned-wrong-procedure-from-tv-medical-dramas/491736/53 "2009-04-03T11:52:01Z")
> [@askeptic](#):
>
> > [@Typo\_Knig](#):
> >
> > The **pendant** in me wants to point out that [Scalia](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scalia) is a Associate Justice of the SCOTUS, not Chief Justice of the United States. But since Scalia really said that a TV show is a model for the law, I find it difficult to continue my **pendantry** and refer to him as “Mr. Justice”. If some bonehead falsely accuses me of being a terrorist, I shan’t expect much justice from Scalia. Even if I can use Gilligan’s Island as precedent. :rolleyes:
>
> Bolding mine.
>
> [Snerk] You have a hanging ornament in you that wants to point something out? Or is your name really that accurate?
>
> The pedant in me made me do it…
D’Oh! Yes, my Doper Name is that apt. :smack:
Hanging my head in shame is what I’m doing, and looking for a rock to crawl under. Maybe Nino has a nice rock at Guantanamo I can stay under indefinitely …
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### Author:  [@Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qadgop_the_Mercotan)
#### Post date: [April 3, 2009, 1:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/study-says-young-docs-learned-wrong-procedure-from-tv-medical-dramas/491736/54 "2009-04-03T13:00:56Z")
> [@Rand\_Rover](#):
>
> How recently deceased? Just picturing folks shoving away the grieving widow so they can practice on the dude.
Real recently deceased, otherwise rigor mortis prevents doing the procedure.
And you should note I referred to practicing on recently deceased John Does, who inherently did not have grieving family/friends standing by.
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### Author:  [@gigi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gigi)
#### Post date: [April 3, 2009, 1:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/study-says-young-docs-learned-wrong-procedure-from-tv-medical-dramas/491736/55 "2009-04-03T13:34:50Z")
> [@DoctorJ](#):
>
> The one mannerism that everybody picks up from TV is that at the end of an unsuccessful code, when the doctor “calls” it, a lot of them tend to do so by stating aloud the time of death. In fact, I’ve been in codes where a nurse or tech didn’t think it was “official” until I let out a sigh, looked up at the clock, and gravely intoned, “Time of death: 10:47 PM.”
What would you say otherwise, just “I’m calling it” or similar?
---
### Author:  [@wolfman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wolfman)
#### Post date: [April 3, 2009, 1:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/study-says-young-docs-learned-wrong-procedure-from-tv-medical-dramas/491736/56 "2009-04-03T13:44:54Z")
> [@gigi](#):
>
> What would you say otherwise, just “I’m calling it” or similar?
Th-th-th-a-a-th-th-a-th-a-That’s all folks!
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### Author:  [@ShibbOleth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ShibbOleth)
#### Post date: [April 3, 2009, 1:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/study-says-young-docs-learned-wrong-procedure-from-tv-medical-dramas/491736/57 "2009-04-03T13:46:00Z")
> [@Aji\_de\_Gallina](#):
>
> No, it’s Munchausen’s by proxy.
>
> (There should be a ranking as to how many episodes/patients it takes a doctor show to get someone with lupus or Muchausen’s)
In House it’s always vasculitis, sarcoidosis or amyloidosis\*, but most of the times it turns out to be something else.
FWIW, my brother-in-law has lupus (or at least that’s what I was told he was diagnosed with). I’m a little disappointed that he has yet to turn into a werewolf. That is what that diagnosis means, doesn’t it?
I’m pretty sure I can work those three into a decent parody of “Mairzy Doats”.
---
### Author:  [@DoctorJ](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DoctorJ)
#### Post date: [April 3, 2009, 2:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/study-says-young-docs-learned-wrong-procedure-from-tv-medical-dramas/491736/58 "2009-04-03T14:18:48Z")
> [@](#):
>
> What would you say otherwise, just “I’m calling it” or similar?
Yeah, usually exactly that. There’s a nurse who records things minute-by-minute, so she’ll record the time of death–there’s no need to announce it.
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### Author:  [@Kobal2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kobal2)
#### Post date: [April 3, 2009, 2:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/study-says-young-docs-learned-wrong-procedure-from-tv-medical-dramas/491736/59 "2009-04-03T14:21:30Z")
> [@gigi](#):
>
> What would you say otherwise, just “I’m calling it” or similar?
He’s dead, Jim.
---
### Author:  [@Baldwin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Baldwin)
#### Post date: [April 3, 2009, 2:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/study-says-young-docs-learned-wrong-procedure-from-tv-medical-dramas/491736/60 "2009-04-03T14:36:52Z")
> [@Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](#):
>
> Do you have a similar issue with “incarcerate”?
>
> QtM, who as intubated the incarcerated, and also reduced the incarcerated hernia of the incarcerated patient.
Is that better than a strangulated hernia? I thought “strangulated” sounded funny, even while my surgeon was telling me it could cause fatal peritonitis.
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