# Stupid concepts in video games **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [January 27, 2004, 11:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-concepts-in-video-games/226352 "2004-01-27T23:44:25Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![smiling\_bandit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e9a140/32.png) [@smiling\_bandit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/smiling_bandit)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2004, 1:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-concepts-in-video-games/226352/21 "2004-01-28T13:01:52Z")
Sidequests are alright when they don’t get to the point that the whole plot starts revolving around it. But my big Pet Peeve is something generally exclusive to the Japanese console games: Bloody Stupid Sidequests. Generally, these take several hours, and involve going to a random locaton in the world, where you have no reason to be, and is often hidden completely and only accessible through a twisted, lengthy sequence of acts, none of which you have any reason to do. Or which essentially demand you you go across the world and talk to an NPC, which you have no reason to think has any relationship to the quest. Stupid, STUPID quests! ---
**Author:** ![Kinthalis](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kinthalis/32/16084_2.png) [@Kinthalis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kinthalis)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2004, 1:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-concepts-in-video-games/226352/22 "2004-01-28T13:12:16Z")
> [@Silentgoldfish](#): > > And don’t get me started on mods “extending the life of a game.” It happened ONCE, with Half-life. Now every game that comes out is released with a software developement kit. A few people start half-assed mods, get bored, don’t finish them and by that time game 2: even prettier graphics is out anyway. Now, this is beginning to change. Take a look at Bioware’s Neverwinter Nights. The toolset isn’t a cakewalk, but it’s MUCH easier than anything else out there. And we have over 3,000 mods out there to play through. Hundreds of which are as good, or better than the Official Campaign, and which are of decent length and quite satisfying to play through by youirself or with multi-player. So I wouldn’t knock toolsets, atleast not in light of NWN. ---
**Author:** ![Sweetums](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/5f8ce5/32.png) [@Sweetums](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sweetums)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2004, 2:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-concepts-in-video-games/226352/23 "2004-01-28T14:39:12Z")
> [@GMRyujin](#): > > Jumping puzzles. I hate jumping puzzles. GOD do I hate jumping puzzles. They’re so stupid and pointless. ``` I agree oh Ghod do I agree. This is one of the things that kept the Jedi Knight series from being really stellar (in my opinion). Some of the puzzles are just plain stupid. The best example of this is when you have to change the ship's comunications frequency. To do this, you have to solve a jump puzzle. Think about this. "Captain, we're being ambushed, we have to warn the rest of the fleet." " Very good Mr. Mate, send someone down to the comunications array to solve the jump puzzle." Jump puzzle isn't solved in time, the fleet is blown from the sky by an enemy who operates their com array by flipping a few switches at a central location. ``` My final word is what I often shout at the screen when frustrated by a jump puzzle. “If I had wanted to play Super Frelling Mario Brothers, I would have bought Super Frelling Mario Brothers.” ---
**Author:** ![slortar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/6bbea6/32.png) [@slortar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/slortar)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2004, 3:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-concepts-in-video-games/226352/24 "2004-01-28T15:14:37Z")
> [@Silentgoldfish](#): > > And don’t get me started on mods “extending the life of a game.” It happened ONCE, with Half-life. Now every game that comes out is released with a software developement kit. A few people start half-assed mods, get bored, don’t finish them and by that time game 2: even prettier graphics is out anyway. I agree that most “moddable” games are pretty lame. But there are a few where the mods significantly added on to the game’s shelf life. The Thief games come immediately to mind. There are some truly fantastic fan-made missions out there, such as “Ominous Bequest” or “L’Arsenne”. Personal pet peeves? Pixel-hunting puzzles. Puzzles that require you to make leaps of logic that don’t make sense in-game. For example, there’s one level in Jedi Knight 2 where you have to, for some reason, jump around Nar Shaddaa’s catwalks, risking death from thugs. No railings on anything to prevent plummeting death. Why don’t they have internal hallways to get to where you want to go? Who knows. And then, nearly at the end of it, you have to blow up the only exploding barrel in the game (not marked hazardous, mind you), go through the hole in the wall and slice open a wire to de-electrify a pool. The problem is, the collision detection on the wire is bad, so it’s not entirely clear that it’s supposed to be breakable. Otherwise good game. Shitty level. ---
**Author:** ![Captain\_Carrot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f0a364/32.png) [@Captain\_Carrot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Carrot)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2004, 3:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-concepts-in-video-games/226352/25 "2004-01-28T15:18:05Z")
Diablo 2 violates most of the linked page’s requisites! Of course, you do have to kill a boss monster in every act, and in the second act, one of them escapes before you get there and goes to the third act, thus ensuring an even distribution. And when you kill the final boss, you restart the game with tougher monsters and better stuff. Not that I’m complaining…(I’m really not, actually. I like that part of Diablo 2) ---
**Author:** ![NE\_Texan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/e99b99/32.png) [@NE\_Texan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NE_Texan)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2004, 3:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-concepts-in-video-games/226352/26 "2004-01-28T15:49:01Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > I thought so, too, and it damn near ruined Ultima 8 for me, until I realized that contrary to appearances, there aren’t actually any jumping puzzles in it. If you want to jump to a particular platform, you put your mouse pointer on that platform, and click. You’ll jump exactly onto it, every time. Keep in mind, though, that feature was added as a patch. The original release of Ultima 8 had the jumping problem, and it was dang frustrating. The game developers had that as a feature – they thought it was a great addition! It was only after a lot of negative feedback that they released the patch where you could click to jump as you describe. I remember starting that game, being immensely frustrated, and putting it back on the shelf until months later when I found out they had released a patch. I enjoyed it after that. Later editions of the game (like on the Ultima collection) had the patch already in there. ---
**Author:** ![MrVisible](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/46a35a/32.png) [@MrVisible](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrVisible)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2004, 4:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-concepts-in-video-games/226352/27 "2004-01-28T16:31:18Z")
Ah, jumping puzzles… Wandering throught Baldur’s Gate (1) with my boyfriend. We’ve levelled up well, we kick ass all over the screen, we’re headed towards the thieves’ lair so as to knock some heads together in a righteous fashion… When we hit jumping puzzles. Fireball-flinging puzzles. More jumping puzzles. Weird little arrow-thing puzzles. More jumping puzzles. Now, for one thing, we’ve just been fighting up until then. No problems, few deaths, billions of asses kicked. The jumping puzzles were just absurd in that contest. Suddenly, you see platforms! Floating! In space! Your grizzled war-hardened dwarf and sexy dynamo sorceress stop and scratch their heads in puzzlement, then leap out and fall to their deaths. Repeatedly. But the thing that really bugged me was… These puzzles were on the way to the thief headquarters. We met dozens, even hundreds of thieves once we were past them, and killed them all. They lived there. Which meant that every so often, some thievy guy we just killed had had to maneuver his way over deadly pits, through fireballs and missiles and killer rabid spiders and giant rats and exploding spores… to bring home the groceries. ---
**Author:** ![Reverse](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e79b87/32.png) [@Reverse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Reverse)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2004, 5:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-concepts-in-video-games/226352/28 "2004-01-28T17:15:24Z")
> [@dwalin](#): > > Diablo 2 violates most of the linked page’s requisites! The linked page is about console RPG clichés. Diablo II is a computer RPG. Ha ha! ---
**Author:** ![Kinthalis](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kinthalis/32/16084_2.png) [@Kinthalis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kinthalis)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2004, 5:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-concepts-in-video-games/226352/29 "2004-01-28T17:51:59Z")
> [@Reverse](#): > > The linked page is about console RPG clichés. Diablo II is a computer RPG. Ha ha! Diablo is a computer APPLICATION. An RPG? No way in hades. ---
**Author:** ![furryman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/furryman/32/99_2.png) [@furryman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/furryman)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2004, 6:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-concepts-in-video-games/226352/30 "2004-01-28T18:19:13Z")
I like sidequests too. But most of the side quests in Final Fantasy X were three hours long, at least two sidequests were at least 6 hours long! In Arc The Lad they would have four or five sidequests in a row. By the time I’d gotte. to the fifth sidequest I’d nearly forgotten the main story. > [@](#): > > Al Bhed is a code not a language Cite? The game presents Al Bhed as a code but: The Al Bhed are a race of people, Al Bhed is what they speak. This makes it a language. No one speaks in code! (but teenagers) ---
**Author:** ![Murcielago](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/da6949/32.png) [@Murcielago](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Murcielago)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2004, 7:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-concepts-in-video-games/226352/31 "2004-01-28T19:15:18Z")
In first-person shooters, the designers of high tech security compounds have an odd blind spot when it comes to protecting their air vents and duct work. I thought this handy developer gimmic was dead and buried, but there it was again in _Deus Ex: Invisible War_ (OK, there were a few spider-bots thrown into the mix, but still…). And I’m with you all about the jumping puzzles, particularly in FPS games which don’t allow you to pull back into third-person perspective. Jump to that moving platform, Mr. Designer? Fine, I only wish I was landing on your testicles. ---
**Author:** ![Doomtrain](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/0ea827/32.png) [@Doomtrain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Doomtrain)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2004, 7:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-concepts-in-video-games/226352/32 "2004-01-28T19:18:57Z")
That list of cliches is funny as hell. Can I complain about one (a variation on the Seifer rule)? Why is it that you’re never allowed to finish off one of the NastyMcBadasses? You have to fight Seifer about a billion times and half the game could be avoided if you’d simply give him a good, hard kick in the nuts when he’s down to 1HP. But nooo, the game moves on. ---
**Author:** ![Gumbercules](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a183cd/32.png) [@Gumbercules](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gumbercules)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2004, 7:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-concepts-in-video-games/226352/33 "2004-01-28T19:57:00Z")
Human medical kits lying around all over the place on alien planets (Doom, Quake, etc) Or worse yet, when items aren’t just lying around but are cleverly concealed in CRATES!!! How many games have used crates? It was never a good concept, guys! ---
**Author:** ![elf6c](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/c57346/32.png) [@elf6c](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elf6c)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2004, 8:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-concepts-in-video-games/226352/34 "2004-01-28T20:10:21Z")
In sports games: the infernal “catch-up feature” which is a crutch for lousy AI. In any game: jumping puzzles. In FPS games: busting open crates of goodies (Half-Life), pointless key-card searches (many), non-breakable door or glass despite your massive firepower. Long cut scenes. Forced stealth scenes that you lose if seen. Third-person perspective being forced on you to use a vehicle in a shooter (Halo). Level’s were you need to keep the idiot non-player character alive despite a seemingly massive death-wish. Head-bob as a “feature”, barfing is not a benefit to gaming for me. Making a game longer be making you back-track through previous levels (ohh, but they are darker/exploding now!! :rolleyes: ). ---
**Author:** ![bouv](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/bc8723/32.png) [@bouv](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bouv)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2004, 8:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-concepts-in-video-games/226352/35 "2004-01-28T20:40:50Z")
For some reason, I cannot stand, at all, 99% of Japanese console RPG’s. I have tried many, almost all of the Final Fantasies, and many older one sfor the SNES and NES. The only one I have liked is Chrono Trigger for the SNES, for some reason, it was ok. Things that tend to piss me off about FF-style RPG’s: Only 3 people doing anything at one time. Huh? You have eight freakin’ people in your party, you can actually switch them out DURNG BATTLE! Why can’t all eight just fight the dame thing at once? THERE IS NO LOGICAL REASON FOR THIS! Stupid side quests unrelated to main plot: As said, it’s annoying. Going waaay out of your way so you can have the best armor in the game that is actually just 1 AP better than your current one that you got from killing a rat. Some games do sidequests good, like Neverwinter Nights. The quests pertain to the plot, and don’t require you to go to far out of your way. The “End Boss” with countless forms: It’s a staple that the boss will have at least 2, if not 3, 4, or fifteen forms. And each form will force you to barely win (if at all) while using every mana point, health elixer, and “phoenix down” you have. Each person has a set of items they can use, no one else can use them: This makes sense to a point. Cleary, a mage who is not trained in use of a sword can’t use a sword. But sometimes, two characters use swords, but they can’t use the same set of swords, God no. Or armor, Jeff can only wear breast plates, while Bernire can only wear chain mail. They both use swords, and need the same freedom of movement, so they should be able to share, unless one guy is much larger than the other, which is not always the case. Utterly stupid items: In FFX there was a girl who fought with a teddy bear…all I’m going to say is OK… Stupid “games”: Kind of like sidequests, only almost mandatory. You MUST race this chocabo (you mean giant chicken?) in x amount of time. You MUST play water polo (whoops, I mean “blitz ball”.) TURN BASED COMBAT: Ugh! Didn’t we find a nice alternative to this way back when Diablo came out? Yeesh, it is so stupid. I just attacked, now I sit and wait for everyone else to attack then I can do it again. It was neccesary in older systems, like the NES and SNES because the calculations needed to get everyone’s ready time and so forth would be tricky, but a even a rudimentary version was establishedi n Chrono Trigger! Get with the times, Square. Look at Baldur’s Gate or Neverwinter Nights, see how you can make it fluid and realtime? (I realize it’s still _like_ turn based, but at least it doesn’t look and feel like it!) I admit, even the game I said I like falls victim to some of these things, but the amazing story line and fun gameplay make up for it. As a result, I play my RPG’s on PC. ---
**Author:** ![Reverse](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e79b87/32.png) [@Reverse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Reverse)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2004, 8:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-concepts-in-video-games/226352/36 "2004-01-28T20:54:52Z")
> [@furryman](#): > > Cite? The game presents Al Bhed as a code but: The Al Bhed are a race of people, Al Bhed is what they speak. This makes it a language. No one speaks in code! (but teenagers) On [this](http://www.gamefaqs.com/console/ps2/game/27609.html) page you shall find a link to a text file called ‘Al Bhed Language Guide’, written by a fan of the game (but let’s not dismiss it just because of that). In it the following is explained: > [@](#): > > * * * > > ## 02 - LANGUAGE VS. CIPHER VS. DIALECT > > I know this has been on the minds of everyone…: > > AL BHED IS A CIPHER? > · Yes, Al Bhed is a cipher, not a language. According to the Dictionary, a > cipher is “A private alphabet, system of characters, or other mode of > writing, contrived for the safe transmission of secrets; also, a writing in > such characters.” Al Bhed is exactly that, a “secret code” spoken only by > the Al Bhed. > > WHY WOULDN’T AL BHED BE CONSIDERED A DIALECT? > · A dialect is “A regional or social variety of a language distinguished by > pronunciation, grammar, or vocabulary, especially a variety of speech > differing from the standard literary language or speech pattern of the > culture in which it exists: Cockney is a dialect of English.” Bronx is a > dialect of English, Osaka is a dialect of Japanese, but Al Bhed is not a > dialect of Japanese or English. What you hear is their accent. > > WHY WOULDN’T AL BHED BE CONSIDERED A LANGUAGE? > · A language is a “Communication of thoughts and feelings through a system of > arbitrary signals, such as voice sounds, gestures, or written symbols.” > English, German, French, and Spanish are languages – not Al Bhed. A real > language has their own words, sentence structures, and etc. Klingon in > Star Trek and Sindarin in Lord Of The Rings are languages, not Al Bhed. > > THEN WHY ARE YOU CALLING AL BHED A LANGUAGE? > · Because in the Japanese version of Final Fantasy X, they call Al Bhed as > “Aru Bedo Go” which translates into “Al Bhed Language”. Therefore I am > used to calling it a language. I believe that Square Soft’s reasoning to > use the word “language” due to one dictionary meaning, “a race, as > distinguished by its speech.” The Al Bhed were distinguished by their > unique language. > > IS IT WRONG TO CALL AL BHED A LANGUAGE? > · As long as you understand that it’s really a cipher, I don’t see any harm > in calling Al Bhed a language. But that’s just my opinion. To put it short, since all the words and the sentence structure of Al Bhed is identical to English (or Romaji), with only difference being the order of the letters in the Al Bhed alphabet, it is, by definition, a code. I have seen similar in all sorts of “little detectives handbook” type of books, so it’s not even a rare type of code. Admittedly, for the reason mentioned in the Al Bhed Language Guide (one dictionary meaning, “a race, as distinguished by its speech”) Al Bhed could be concidered a language, but I find it to meet the characteristic of a code rather than the ones of a language. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2004, 10:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-concepts-in-video-games/226352/37 "2004-01-28T22:07:13Z")
> [@bouv](#): > > TURN BASED COMBAT: Ugh! Didn’t we find a nice alternative to this way back when Diablo came out? Yeesh, it is so stupid. I just attacked, now I sit and wait for everyone else to attack then I can do it again. It was neccesary in older systems, like the NES and SNES because the calculations needed to get everyone’s ready time and so forth would be tricky, but a even a rudimentary version was establishedi n Chrono Trigger! Get with the times, Square. Look at Baldur’s Gate or Neverwinter Nights, see how you can make it fluid and realtime? (I realize it’s still like turn based, but at least it doesn’t look and feel like it!) There aren’t enough adjectives in all the world to describe how strongly I disagree with this. _Especailly_ using Baldur’s Gate as an example of how to do it **right**! God, that game sucked. The sequel made some minor tweaks that fixed it, but combat in the first game was down-right unplayable. Dungeons & Dragons is not a real-time game, and I’m sick to death of every D&D computer game that comes down the pike trying to shoehorn it into a real-time system. Bring back turn based! I want RPGs that require me to think in combat, not twitch like an epileptic on a caffeine jag. On a related peve: games being marketed as RPGs when they contain no actual role-playing. I’m lookin’ at you two, Diablo and Final Fantasy! ---
**Author:** ![pepperlandgirl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/f17d59/32.png) [@pepperlandgirl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pepperlandgirl)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2004, 10:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-concepts-in-video-games/226352/38 "2004-01-28T22:42:47Z")
> [@](#): > > Another thing that bothered me about that game, and about FFX-2, is the way the class/skill system worked. Say I have a character who’s maxed out the Black Mage class. She’s as powerful a spell-caster as is humanly possible. But if I change classes to Warrior, I can’t cast any of my spells anymore. What the hell? Do I just forget them? Am I so dedicated to being a Warrior now that I won’t cast a spell under any circumstances, even when its the only thing that can save my life and, incidentally, save the world from destruction? I much preferred the Sphere Grid from FFX. Or the d20 system used in Neverwinter Nights, which, BTW, is another game with an excellent mod community. Huh? You do realize you can change dress spheres in the middle of a battle, right? “Oh, shit I need firaga! Better change dress spheres!” Just like that. And furthermore, there are special items and dress grids you can equip that allows you to have certain abilities. My Riku always has black magic abilities and Paine always has warrior abilities, regardless of the dress sphere. But I agree that the sphere grid system of FFX rocked. That’s my favorite one of all the games. ---
**Author:** ![Justin\_Bailey](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/justin_bailey/32/8792_2.png) [@Justin\_Bailey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Justin_Bailey)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2004, 10:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-concepts-in-video-games/226352/39 "2004-01-28T22:58:43Z")
> [@Gumbercules](#): > > Human medical kits lying around all over the place on alien planets (Doom, Quake, etc) To be fair Doom took place in a human scientific labratory on Mars. No aliens in Doom. ---
**Author:** ![Morbo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/morbo/32/389_2.png) [@Morbo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Morbo)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2004, 11:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-concepts-in-video-games/226352/40 "2004-01-28T23:04:34Z")
> [@Gumbercules](#): > > Or worse yet, when items aren’t just lying around but are cleverly concealed in > > CRATES!!! > > How many games have used crates? It was never a good concept, guys! I must bring up the one place where crates were great: _Metal Gear Solid_. I loved hiding in a crate and then have a guard walk by and say “Hey! What’s that? Ah, it’s just a crate.” Plus someone would load said crate into a truck and drive you to another floor on that level. Unfortunately _MGS_ also had one of my most despised concepts: The minor character that you speak to through a cut scene who suddenly has valuable information for the first time in the damn game. “Hello Snake, nothing new to report as usual…except in order to keep from dying turn your radio to frequency blah blah.” [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-concepts-in-video-games/226352.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-concepts-in-video-games/226352.md?page=3)