# Stupid Gun news of the day (Part 1) **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [January 29, 2013, 7:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-gun-news-of-the-day-part-1/648729 "2013-01-29T19:01:55Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 268
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2015, 1:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-gun-news-of-the-day-part-1/648729/5341 "2015-08-03T01:56:10Z")
> [@eschereal](#): > > No one is a criminal until they are. No, we’re all criminals. Original Sin, don’tchaknow. ---
**Author:** ![eschereal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eschereal/32/18939_2.png) [@eschereal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eschereal)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2015, 2:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-gun-news-of-the-day-part-1/648729/5342 "2015-08-03T02:52:11Z")
The NRA wants greater freedom of guns and, at least theoretically, stronger prosecution of criminals. But, of course, no one can be prosecuted until they actually do something. And then, beyond that, what if a criminal uses your gun in the furtherance of a crime? Do you get to say, _that was a bad thing_, and walk away, or should you be held accountable for how your guns get used? Are you willing to take “responsible gun ownership” to its proper end? Including not allowing your guns to be stolen? ---
**Author:** ![Bruce\_Wayne](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/22d042/32.png) [@Bruce\_Wayne](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bruce_Wayne)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2015, 4:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-gun-news-of-the-day-part-1/648729/5343 "2015-08-03T04:02:21Z")
> [@eschereal](#): > > Including not allowing your guns to be stolen? Victim shaming. _tsk, tsk_.. ---
**Author:** ![Esox\_Lucius](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/848f3c/32.png) [@Esox\_Lucius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Esox_Lucius)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2015, 2:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-gun-news-of-the-day-part-1/648729/5344 "2015-08-03T14:55:25Z")
If a gun owner thinks it isn’t up to him to ensure his deadly weapon doesn’t fall into dangerous hands, that’s another example of how much real responsibility he lacks. ---
**Author:** ![Damuri\_Ajashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/898d66/32.png) [@Damuri\_Ajashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Damuri_Ajashi)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2015, 3:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-gun-news-of-the-day-part-1/648729/5345 "2015-08-03T15:57:41Z")
> [@Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](#): > > Probably the same place from which Dumuri is awaiting the talking points to respond to the recent studies on guns. What’s the matter? Your butt still hurting you? ---
**Author:** ![Bullitt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bullitt/32/5725_2.png) [@Bullitt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bullitt)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2015, 4:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-gun-news-of-the-day-part-1/648729/5346 "2015-08-03T16:41:18Z")
> [@Esox\_Lucius](#): > > How so? By your same logic, anyone who learns how to drive a car is another potential David Attias. While probabilistically it’s true, the likelihood is so remote. It’s a ludicrous argument. > [@Esox\_Lucius](#): > > Everything you said implied “responsible”: “It’s good to know the basics, how to ensure a gun is safe and unloaded, how to safely handle a gun…” Why else would it be good to know that stuff if not for an implied responsibility on the part of the gun owner? Knowledge is power. When my nephew learns when a gun is safe and when it is not, if in the future and for example he’s hanging out at a friend’s house and his friend totes out his father’s gun, he will know more than he did if the gun has the potential to be duscharged and harm someone. It’s the difference between ignorance and informed. > [@Esox\_Lucius](#): > > Thank you, that’s my point. If you really believe that (and for the sake of this point, I’ll give you the benefit of the doubt), please tell all the gun owners who pat themselves on the back for being responsible just because they know how to handle a gun. You know, the ones who disown a spree shooter as one of their own even though he’d been one of them all along and carried out his killings with an expert knowledge of his weapons. The ones who oppose gun control because safety courses apparently turn gun owners into model citizens. Knowledge and responsibility are two different things. I hope you don’t need me to tell you that - it doesn’t sound like you need me to. I’ve seen idiots at the gun range. You tell the range master, and then you leave. I’ve seen good men and trained Marines make a mistake on the gun line. You walk up quickly to him and correct the problem. And then you continue to watch him more closely. ---
**Author:** ![Bullitt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bullitt/32/5725_2.png) [@Bullitt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bullitt)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2015, 4:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-gun-news-of-the-day-part-1/648729/5347 "2015-08-03T16:51:22Z")
> [@Fear\_Itself](#): > > Booth was not a Democrat, he was a member of the Know Nothing Party. During the Civil War, Booth’s views aligned more closely with the Democrats. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2015, 5:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-gun-news-of-the-day-part-1/648729/5348 "2015-08-03T17:10:41Z")
> [@Bullitt](#): > > During the Civil War, Booth’s views aligned more closely with the Democrats. Oh, give it the fuck up. You cut and pasted that pack of lies(without even admitting you did so) because it told you what you wanted to hear, and you don’t even have the guts to stand up and admit that you were wrong. ---
**Author:** ![Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/8edcca/32.png) [@Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hentor_the_Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2015, 5:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-gun-news-of-the-day-part-1/648729/5349 "2015-08-03T17:14:41Z")
> [@Bullitt](#): > > During the Civil War, Booth’s views aligned more closely with the Democrats. Than the Know Nothing Party? One wonders why he chose the latter then. Clearly you know his views better than he himself did. You dug yourself a huge hole, moron. Best to stop digging, or to start pulling dirt in behind yourself. ---
**Author:** ![Damuri\_Ajashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/898d66/32.png) [@Damuri\_Ajashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Damuri_Ajashi)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2015, 6:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-gun-news-of-the-day-part-1/648729/5350 "2015-08-03T18:02:55Z")
> [@Esox\_Lucius](#): > > My post had nothing to do with whether or not I own a gun, and everything to do with the vain posture that knowing how to operate a gun automatically makes one responsible with it. Can’t you address that instead of calling me names? Wait, you call his nephew a potential Adam Lanza and you think he’s the one calling names? WTF is wrong with you? And YES, knowing more about guns makes you a more responsible gun owner. ---
**Author:** ![Damuri\_Ajashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/898d66/32.png) [@Damuri\_Ajashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Damuri_Ajashi)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2015, 6:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-gun-news-of-the-day-part-1/648729/5351 "2015-08-03T18:09:25Z")
> [@eschereal](#): > > The NRA wants greater freedom of guns and, at least theoretically, stronger prosecution of criminals. But, of course, no one can be prosecuted until they actually do something. And then, beyond that, what if a criminal uses your gun in the furtherance of a crime? Do you get to say, _that was a bad thing_, and walk away, or should you be held accountable for how your guns get used? Are you willing to take “responsible gun ownership” to its proper end? Including not allowing your guns to be stolen? So if I steal your car and run over an orphanage full of blind kids, is any of that your fault? Are you responsible for those dead blind orphans? ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2015, 6:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-gun-news-of-the-day-part-1/648729/5352 "2015-08-03T18:24:15Z")
> [@Damuri\_Ajashi](#): > > Wait, you call his nephew a potential Adam Lanza and you think he’s the one calling names? WTF is wrong with you? > > And YES, knowing more about guns makes you a more responsible gun owner. Would you let someone who posts lies like [this](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=18557332&postcount=5266), and seems as if he still believes them after they have been show to be false, teach any relative of yours about guns? Ghod knows what crap he might spew out. ---
**Author:** ![eschereal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eschereal/32/18939_2.png) [@eschereal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eschereal)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2015, 6:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-gun-news-of-the-day-part-1/648729/5353 "2015-08-03T18:50:38Z")
> [@Damuri\_Ajashi](#): > > So if I steal your car and run over an orphanage full of blind kids, is any of that your fault? Are you responsible for those dead blind orphans? > [@"\[CarInsurance.com](#): > > ([What to do if your car is stolen | CarInsurance.com](http://www.carinsurance.com/kb/are-you-liable-actions-of-car-thief.aspx))"]If you somehow contributed to the car being stolen, then you and your insurance company may be asked to compensate those who were damaged by your stolen car. > > New York, Tennessee and many other states have laws that say something to the effect that a driver is not permitted to let a vehicle stand unattended without first stopping the engine, locking the ignition and removing the key from the vehicle. If you’re caught doing so, you can be cited and fined. (See “Let the car warm up? Bad idea.”) > > This lack of judgment could have even harsher consequences. > > If you left your unlocked, or worse running, with the keys in it unattended in a public area, then you could possibly be found negligent under state laws for conduct falling below the applicable standard of care. That’s legalese; in plain language it means you didn’t take basic care – like locking up your car – to prevent the theft of your car. > > A judge or jury could determine that a foreseeable outcome to your actions was a person stealing your vehicle and causing damage to others. This may allow you to be found at least partly to blame for ensuing damage done by the thief and held liable for a percentage of the damages. If you _allow_ your gun(s) to be stolen. If you trumpet your arsenal, making yourself a target for thieves, and/or fail to properly secure your weapons, you really ought not be able to apologize and face no consequences. ---
**Author:** ![Bullitt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bullitt/32/5725_2.png) [@Bullitt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bullitt)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2015, 7:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-gun-news-of-the-day-part-1/648729/5354 "2015-08-03T19:24:35Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > Oh, give it the fuck up. You cut and pasted that pack of lies(without even admitting you did so) because it told you what you wanted to hear, and you don’t even have the guts to stand up and admit that you were wrong. I haven’t been proven wrong yet until each of the counterpoints, or the points in my list, has been confirmed. ---
**Author:** ![Bullitt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bullitt/32/5725_2.png) [@Bullitt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bullitt)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2015, 7:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-gun-news-of-the-day-part-1/648729/5355 "2015-08-03T19:26:20Z")
> [@eschereal](#): > > If you _allow_ your gun(s) to be stolen. If you trumpet your arsenal, making yourself a target for thieves, and/or fail to properly secure your weapons, you really ought not be able to apologize and face no consequences. If you park your cars on the street, visible to all, and someone steals it… ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2015, 7:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-gun-news-of-the-day-part-1/648729/5356 "2015-08-03T19:28:44Z")
> [@Bullitt](#): > > I haven’t been proven wrong yet until each of the counterpoints, or the points in my list, has been confirmed. Why don’t you try confirming any of the points on your list of lies? While you’re at it, would you like a fresh shovel? ---
**Author:** ![Bullitt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bullitt/32/5725_2.png) [@Bullitt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bullitt)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2015, 7:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-gun-news-of-the-day-part-1/648729/5357 "2015-08-03T19:33:58Z")
Read my post, dipshit. ---
**Author:** ![Damuri\_Ajashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/898d66/32.png) [@Damuri\_Ajashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Damuri_Ajashi)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2015, 7:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-gun-news-of-the-day-part-1/648729/5358 "2015-08-03T19:34:57Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > Would you let someone who posts lies like [this](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=18557332&postcount=5266), and seems as if he still believes them after they have been show to be false, teach any relative of yours about guns? Ghod knows what crap he might spew out. Gun safety is about facts not propaganda. So what if the old codger that teaches gun safety at the NRA headquarters thinks that the second amendment is the right that protects all your other rights. If he effectively teaches you good habits then thats a good thing. Ultimately, gun safety is about good habits. So what if he recites stupid partisan emails. Just like you teach your kids to look both ways before crossing the street, you might want to teach your kids how to handle a firearm. Ultimately, your kid is more likely to benefit from a good first aid class than a good gun safety class but there is no real reason why you can’t have both. ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2015, 7:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-gun-news-of-the-day-part-1/648729/5359 "2015-08-03T19:36:52Z")
> [@Bullitt](#): > > During the Civil War, Booth’s views aligned more closely with the Democrats. Which makes the Booth reference in your list a lie. It said he was a registered Democrat; he wasn’t. Pants on fire. ---
**Author:** ![Damuri\_Ajashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/898d66/32.png) [@Damuri\_Ajashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Damuri_Ajashi)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2015, 7:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-gun-news-of-the-day-part-1/648729/5360 "2015-08-03T19:48:40Z")
> [@eschereal](#): > > If you _allow_ your gun(s) to be stolen. If you trumpet your arsenal, making yourself a target for thieves, and/or fail to properly secure your weapons, you really ought not be able to apologize and face no consequences. So just to be clear, you are only talking about civil liability, not criminal, right? The kind of liability that can be covered by insurance and would only attach if you did the equivalent of leaving your car running in a 7-11? I can see attaching some insurable civil liability to someone who left their gun next to an open window on a sidewalk with heavy traffic. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-gun-news-of-the-day-part-1/648729.md?page=267) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-gun-news-of-the-day-part-1/648729.md?page=269)