# Stupid Gun news of the day (Part 1) **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [January 29, 2013, 7:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-gun-news-of-the-day-part-1/648729 "2013-01-29T19:01:55Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 301
**Author:** ![davidm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/davidm/32/225_2.png) [@davidm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/davidm)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2015, 3:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-gun-news-of-the-day-part-1/648729/6001 "2015-10-06T15:16:33Z")
> [@ElvisL1ves](#): > > A whole lot of people have thought it could never happen to them, until one day it did. > > There is no such thing as zero risk. A claim that there is indicates a capacity for self-delusion. And even if he were perfect, and never makes a mistake, how certain is he that everyone else is just as perfect? Does he really believe that every Joe Schmo on the street that qualifies for a license is going to follow all the rules and is never going to make a mistake? That’s even more delusional. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2015, 10:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-gun-news-of-the-day-part-1/648729/6002 "2015-10-06T22:48:26Z")
> [@septimus](#): > > It’s official. Guns now kill more Americans (34,000 annually) than car, bus and truck crashes combined (33,000). Special thanks to Law Enforcement whose 1000+ kills took gun deaths over! > > Gun deaths are on track to overtake deaths due to septicemia later this decade, and breast cancer deaths early next decade. > > Well done, America! Bravo!! There are about 5000 handgun murders per year. Most of those "gun deaths’ are suicides. [http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/fact-checker/wp/2015/10/05/obamas-claim-that-states-with-the-most-gun-laws-tend-to-have-the-fewest-gun-deaths/](http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/fact-checker/wp/2015/10/05/obamas-claim-that-states-with-the-most-gun-laws-tend-to-have-the-fewest-gun-deaths/) However, **50,000** Non-smokers die every year due to second hand smoke. **Well done, Big Tobacco! Bravo!!** ---
**Author:** ![Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/8edcca/32.png) [@Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hentor_the_Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2015, 12:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-gun-news-of-the-day-part-1/648729/6003 "2015-10-07T00:22:23Z")
[quote=“DrDeth, post:6002, topic:648729”] There are about 5000 handgun murders per year. Most of those "gun deaths’ are suicides. [/quote] There are about 11,000 to 12,000 firearms homicides per year. Are you claiming that about 6,000 to 7,000 of those are committed with long guns? Usually gun advocates like to minimize the number of long gun homcides. Interesting. It’s true that there are more suicides than homicides by firearms, but only by 60/40 or so. ---
**Author:** ![Esox\_Lucius](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/848f3c/32.png) [@Esox\_Lucius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Esox_Lucius)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2015, 6:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-gun-news-of-the-day-part-1/648729/6004 "2015-10-07T06:01:12Z")
> [@canned\_mayhem](#): > > Amazingly as it sounds, you would never even know I had a gun on me. The smug, superior attitude is a dead giveaway. ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2015, 7:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-gun-news-of-the-day-part-1/648729/6005 "2015-10-07T07:59:05Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > There are about 5000 handgun murders per year. Most of those "gun deaths’ are suicides. > [http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/fact-checker/wp/2015/10/05/obamas-claim-that-states-with-the-most-gun-laws-tend-to-have-the-fewest-gun-deaths/](http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/fact-checker/wp/2015/10/05/obamas-claim-that-states-with-the-most-gun-laws-tend-to-have-the-fewest-gun-deaths/) > However, **50,000** Non-smokers die every year due to second hand smoke. > **Well done, Big Tobacco! Bravo!!** And guess what that number would be if smoking hadn’t been increasingly regulated and restricted over the years ([recent UK example](https://www.gov.uk/government/news/smoking-in-vehicles)). Unlike guns in the US, where any regulation to attempt to reduce gun deaths is met with passionate resistance. Is this really the comparison you wanted to use? ---
**Author:** ![Dave\_Hartwick](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/7feea3/32.png) [@Dave\_Hartwick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dave_Hartwick)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2015, 8:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-gun-news-of-the-day-part-1/648729/6006 "2015-10-07T08:52:35Z")
The only thing that stops a bad guy with a cigarette is a good guy with a cigarette! Just like the only solution to drunk driving fatalities is more drunk drivers! ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2015, 3:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-gun-news-of-the-day-part-1/648729/6007 "2015-10-07T15:20:23Z")
> [@Dave\_Hartwick](#): > > The only thing that stops a bad guy with a cigarette is a good guy with a cigarette! Just like the only solution to drunk driving fatalities is more drunk drivers! Actually you’re more likely to stop a bad guy with a gun by tackling him than by shooting him, statistically speaking. [Combat Vets Destroy the NRA’s Heroic Gunslinger Fantasy](http://www.thenation.com/article/combat-vets-destroy-the-nras-heroic-gunslinger-fantasy/) (Yes, it’s a lefty source but there’s a lot of studies cited in the article. Also, I’d like to register my usual objection to headlines that use the word “destroy” to mean “offer an opposing argument to”, no matter how strong the evidence; it’s WAY overused.) > [@](#): > > Not pulling a weapon is often the wisest course of action in active-shooter situations. While a number of conservatives declared that Oregon’s Umpqua Community College, the scene of a mass shooting last week, was a gun-free zone, the truth is that several concealed carry holders were present, and they wisely decided to leave their guns holstered. Veteran John Parker later explained to MSNBC, “We could have opened ourselves up to be potential targets ourselves, and not knowing where SWAT was… if we had our guns ready to shoot, they could think that we were bad guys.” Sadly, he wasn’t asked about the effectiveness of shouting “Hey everybody, let’s get him!” > [@](#): > > Blair co-authored a study for the FBI that looked at 185 mass shooting events over a 13-year period. It found that while around one-in-five were stopped by civilians before police arrived, in only one case was it done by a typical “good guy with a gun” (professionals—an off-duty cop and an armed security guard—used their guns to stop two others). **In most cases Blair and his colleague studied, civilians ended a rampage by tackling the assailant**. Bolding mine. > [@](#): > > “Despite what we see on TV, the presence of a firearm is a greater risk, especially in the hands of an untrained person,” says David Chipman, the former ATF agent. “Someone can always say, ‘If your mother is being raped by 5 people, wouldn’t you want her to have a gun?’ Well, OK, if you put it that way, I’d say yes, but that’s not a likely scenario. The question is: If you see someone running out of a gas station with a gun in their hand, do you want an untrained person jumping out and opening fire. For me, the answer is clearly ‘no.’” ---
**Author:** ![septimus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/septimus/32/410_2.png) [@septimus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/septimus)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2015, 3:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-gun-news-of-the-day-part-1/648729/6008 "2015-10-07T15:39:16Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > There are about 5000 handgun murders per year. This is a very different number than my source shows. Your link seems to provide no such statistic. Are most gun murders by shotgun? Murders without arrest/conviction or pled down to manslaughter don’t count? Don’t keep us in suspense – what’s your Gotcha? (Or are you omitting gun murders where the victim was to blame, per leading GOP scientist Ben Carson?) ---
**Author:** ![Esox\_Lucius](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/848f3c/32.png) [@Esox\_Lucius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Esox_Lucius)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2015, 3:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-gun-news-of-the-day-part-1/648729/6009 "2015-10-07T15:57:20Z")
> [@Dave\_Hartwick](#): > > Seems he’s confused his manhood with an inanimate object as well. Excellent point.😃 He has also confused “carrying a gun in the United States” with “deciding his own fate” when there’s almost zero likelihood that he’ll ever have to use it. What a paper cowboy. Thank you for your pretend service, canned mayhem. As a reward, here’s a little joke you can relate to… \*A cowboy rides into town one day, goes into the saloon and orders a drink. Looking around, he sees that he and the bartender are the only ones there. “Where is everyone?” he asks. “At the hangin’”, the bartender says. “Yeah?” The cowboy downs his drink. “Who are they hangin’?” “Brown Paper Pete”, says the bartender. “Brown Paper Pete? What kind o’ name is that for a cowboy?” “Well,” says the bartender, “he wore a brown paper hat, brown paper shirt, brown paper pants and brown paper boots.” “Really? So what are they hangin’ him for?” “Rustling.”\* Take care, CM.😉 ---
**Author:** ![Esox\_Lucius](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/848f3c/32.png) [@Esox\_Lucius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Esox_Lucius)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2015, 4:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-gun-news-of-the-day-part-1/648729/6010 "2015-10-07T16:43:52Z")
> [@Gyrate](#): > > [Combat Vets Destroy the NRA’s Heroic Gunslinger Fantasy](http://www.thenation.com/article/combat-vets-destroy-the-nras-heroic-gunslinger-fantasy/) My nephew entered the local police force earlier this year. In training, it was drilled into him that his most effective weapon is his mouth. If the NRA really wanted to promote responsible gun use, it would take its cue from modern law enforcement agencies rather than its corporate masters. ---
**Author:** ![Projammer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/projammer/32/559_2.png) [@Projammer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Projammer)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2015, 5:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-gun-news-of-the-day-part-1/648729/6011 "2015-10-07T17:10:41Z")
> [@Gyrate](#): > > Actually you’re more likely to stop a bad guy with a gun by tackling him than by shooting him, statistically speaking. > > [Combat Vets Destroy the NRA’s Heroic Gunslinger Fantasy](http://www.thenation.com/article/combat-vets-destroy-the-nras-heroic-gunslinger-fantasy/) > > (Yes, it’s a lefty source but there’s a lot of studies cited in the article. Also, I’d like to register my usual objection to headlines that use the word “destroy” to mean “offer an opposing argument to”, no matter how strong the evidence; it’s WAY overused.) > Sadly, he wasn’t asked about the effectiveness of shouting “Hey everybody, let’s get him!” > > > [@](#): > > > > Blair co-authored a study for the FBI that looked at 185 mass shooting events over a 13-year period. It found that while around one-in-five were stopped by civilians before police arrived, in only one case was it done by a typical “good guy with a gun” (professionals—an off-duty cop and an armed security guard—used their guns to stop two others).\*\* In most cases Blair and his colleague studied, civilians ended a rampage by tackling the assailant.\*\* > > Bolding mine. Did Blair’s study happen to include data about instances where there were options other than tackling the assailant? Like how many times there were armed civilians who decided not to intervene? [A less bloviating article](http://www.arktimes.com/ArkansasBlog/archives/2015/10/02/vet-with-concealed-weapon-explains-why-he-didnt-shoot-in-umpqua) which includes more of the veteran’s commentary. > [@](#): > > Luckily we made the choice not to get involved,” he explained. “ **We were quite a distance away from the building where this was happening**. And we could have opened ourselves up to be potential targets ourselves, and not knowing where SWAT was, their response time, they wouldn’t know who we were. And if we had our guns ready to shoot, they could think that we were bad guys. Bolding mine. Do you believe that Mintz would have been shot seven times tackling the shooter if he had been armed himself? Or if Parker had been in the same or even the next room? Completely agree with you on your objections to “destroy”. If Hillary/Obama had been destroyed as often as the conservative pundits have claimed, they would have been reduced to their component subatomic particles by now. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2015, 5:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-gun-news-of-the-day-part-1/648729/6012 "2015-10-07T17:31:26Z")
> [@Gyrate](#): > > And guess what that number would be if smoking hadn’t been increasingly regulated and restricted over the years ([recent UK example](https://www.gov.uk/government/news/smoking-in-vehicles)). Unlike guns in the US, where any regulation to attempt to reduce gun deaths is met with passionate resistance. Is this really the comparison you wanted to use? Guns are protected by the Bill of Rights, and smoking isn’t. In any case, those “restrictions” are very minor. It’s simple- ban smoking. 100%. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2015, 5:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-gun-news-of-the-day-part-1/648729/6013 "2015-10-07T17:35:45Z")
> [@septimus](#): > > This is a very different number than my source shows. Your link seems to provide no such statistic. wiki: _According to the FBI, in 2012, there were 8,855 total firearm-related homicides in the US, with 6,371 of those attributed to handguns_ I guess my figure of 5000 was from a different year or more rounding. But it’s damn close. ---
**Author:** ![Happy\_Fun\_Ball](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/happy_fun_ball/32/17664_2.png) [@Happy\_Fun\_Ball](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Happy_Fun_Ball)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2015, 7:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-gun-news-of-the-day-part-1/648729/6014 "2015-10-07T19:36:31Z")
Yeeeeeeehaww! Looks like its open season on criminals of all stripes now. [This woman is a hero: Bystander opens fire on shoplifter at Home Depot.](http://www.freep.com/story/news/local/michigan/oakland/2015/10/06/cpl-holder-opens-fire-shoplifter-home-depot/73468588/) ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2015, 8:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-gun-news-of-the-day-part-1/648729/6015 "2015-10-07T20:33:31Z")
> [@Happy\_Fun\_Ball](#): > > Yeeeeeeehaww! Looks like its open season on criminals of all stripes now. [This woman is a hero: Bystander opens fire on shoplifter at Home Depot.](http://www.freep.com/story/news/local/michigan/oakland/2015/10/06/cpl-holder-opens-fire-shoplifter-home-depot/73468588/) This will simply be counted as another good example of “defensive gun use”. ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2015, 8:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-gun-news-of-the-day-part-1/648729/6016 "2015-10-07T20:36:04Z")
[11 year old shoots 8 year](http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation-now/2015/10/06/boy-11-charged-murder-girl-8/73433082/) old neighbor with his dad’s shotgun. Unlocked loaded gun in a closet. The more guns there are, the more there will be incidents like this. It is the price you pay for your “freedom.” Good luck with that. ---
**Author:** ![Fubaya](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/c2a13f/32.png) [@Fubaya](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fubaya)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2015, 10:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-gun-news-of-the-day-part-1/648729/6017 "2015-10-07T22:32:31Z")
> [@Euphonious\_Polemic](#): > > [11 year old shoots 8 year](http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation-now/2015/10/06/boy-11-charged-murder-girl-8/73433082/) old neighbor with his dad’s shotgun. > > Unlocked loaded gun in a closet. > > The more guns there are, the more there will be incidents like this. It is the price you pay for your “freedom.” Good luck with that. This one happened in my area and it’s really fucked up. I’m hoping the boy didn’t flat out murder her. I’m hoping he thought the gun was empty and was just trying to scare her. Not that it matters, she’s dead either way. ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2015, 11:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-gun-news-of-the-day-part-1/648729/6018 "2015-10-07T23:08:24Z")
The kid was a known bully with a history of abusing that girl, so I’m going to go with “intentional” and I hope he gets jailed for life or longer. He’s a waste of space. ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2015, 11:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-gun-news-of-the-day-part-1/648729/6019 "2015-10-07T23:17:33Z")
> [@silenus](#): > > The kid was a known bully with a history of abusing that girl, so I’m going to go with “intentional” and I hope he gets jailed for life or longer. He’s a waste of space. And without that easy access to a gun, I don’t think it is likely he would have killed her. But by all means - get more guns. Don’t put any horrible red tape in place that reduces your access. The government should not tell me how to store my guns. More guns will make us all safer. Because Freedom! ---
**Author:** ![Fubaya](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/c2a13f/32.png) [@Fubaya](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fubaya)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2015, 11:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-gun-news-of-the-day-part-1/648729/6020 "2015-10-07T23:21:49Z")
> [@silenus](#): > > The kid was a known bully with a history of abusing that girl, so I’m going to go with “intentional” and I hope he gets jailed for life or longer. He’s a waste of space. He still might have been just trying to scare her. Not that it makes a difference, I’d just rather live in a world where kids are sometimes stupid than one where they are cold blooded murderers. Unfortunately they are saying it’s likely he’ll only be held until 19. It’s nearly impossible to get someone his age tried as an adult in Tennessee, and 19 is the longest they can keep a minor. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-gun-news-of-the-day-part-1/648729.md?page=300) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-gun-news-of-the-day-part-1/648729.md?page=302)