# Stupid Gun news of the day (Part 1) **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [January 29, 2013, 7:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-gun-news-of-the-day-part-1/648729 "2013-01-29T19:01:55Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 361
**Author:** ![dropzone](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dropzone/32/7515_2.png) [@dropzone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dropzone)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2016, 5:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-gun-news-of-the-day-part-1/648729/7201 "2016-07-10T17:44:35Z")
> [@Chefguy](#): > > The guy isn’t actually a thug, just another 2nd Amendment gun nut. Kindly define the difference, since in my book someone waving a gun around in a threatening manner, IS a thug. ETA: Never mind. I forgot that “thug” has been redefined and only black people can be thugs. ---
**Author:** ![Sitnam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/6a8cbe/32.png) [@Sitnam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sitnam)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2016, 10:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-gun-news-of-the-day-part-1/648729/7202 "2016-07-10T22:20:09Z")
> [@Lumpy](#): > > Can’t argue with that; in fact, don’t want to. What wonderful fucking world it would be if an argument wasn’t expected though. ---
**Author:** ![Lumpy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lumpy/32/446_2.png) [@Lumpy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lumpy)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2016, 2:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-gun-news-of-the-day-part-1/648729/7203 "2016-07-11T02:39:25Z")
> [@ElvisL1ves](#): > > Too bad the rest of us are trapped in this dreary reality, unable to share the fantasy land where \*\*Lumpy \*\*is a noble hero, not just some fat, balding schlub with Wifi. > > Gonna tell us why people would lie to pollsters about owning guns? We’re still waiting and curious. Dopers, does he really want an explanation or is he just trolling? A day without **ElvisL1ves** is like a day without stepping in dog shit. ---
**Author:** ![septimus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/septimus/32/410_2.png) [@septimus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/septimus)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2016, 6:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-gun-news-of-the-day-part-1/648729/7204 "2016-07-11T06:45:28Z")
> [@Lumpy](#): > > Dopers, does he really want an explanation or is he just trolling? > > A day without **ElvisL1ves** is like a day without stepping in dog shit. I had the same question as **Elvis** , especially since I thought the tendency was to lie _in the other direction_: “We got lotsa guns here, pal. Any thugs and hos show up here, will be walking away missing body parts!” So, **Lumpy** : What is the reason gun owners lie to pollsters and say they don’t have guns? Are they afraid of Obamabama the Gungrabber, that he’ll send his big man-bride over to shove the gun up your ass? ---
**Author:** ![Cartooniverse](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cartooniverse/32/3084_2.png) [@Cartooniverse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cartooniverse)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2016, 10:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-gun-news-of-the-day-part-1/648729/7205 "2016-07-11T10:23:36Z")
> [@ElvisL1ves](#): > > Too bad the rest of us are trapped in this dreary reality, unable to share the fantasy land where \*\*Lumpy \*\*is a noble hero, not just some fat, balding schlub with Wifi. > > Gonna tell us why people would lie to pollsters about owning guns? We’re still waiting and curious. I for one find it bordering between bigotry and hate speech to define those who are overweight with hair loss issues in this light. This is the Straight Dope. If you’re incapable of showing yourself even a modicum of respect, please do effort to show those unseen poster said respect. Sent from my SM-N910V using Tapatalk ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2016, 10:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-gun-news-of-the-day-part-1/648729/7206 "2016-07-11T10:54:43Z")
> [@Lumpy](#): > > Too bad simply banning guns would turn the US into Mexico instead of the UK. It would improve Mexico though, since they get most of their guns from the US. ---
**Author:** ![Projammer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/projammer/32/559_2.png) [@Projammer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Projammer)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2016, 3:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-gun-news-of-the-day-part-1/648729/7207 "2016-07-11T15:38:56Z")
> [@Gyrate](#): > > It would improve Mexico though, since they get most of their guns from the US. Do you have an actual cite for that? I’m aware of one claim by Obama that it’s 90% and a counterclaim by Fox that it’s 17%. Both of those numbers are bogus and just pulled out of someone’s ass. [FactCheck.org](http://www.factcheck.org/2009/04/counting-mexicos-guns/) FactCheck claims there are no reliable numbers. Do you have any hard figures to contradict them? ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2016, 4:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-gun-news-of-the-day-part-1/648729/7208 "2016-07-11T16:18:17Z")
> [@Projammer](#): > > Do you have an actual cite for that? > > I’m aware of one claim by Obama that it’s 90% and a counterclaim by Fox that it’s 17%. Both of those numbers are bogus and just pulled out of someone’s ass. [FactCheck.org](http://www.factcheck.org/2009/04/counting-mexicos-guns/) > > FactCheck claims there are no reliable numbers. Do you have any hard figures to contradict them? Nothing solid, although it’s incorrect to characterize the two numbers as equally bogus (as the cite you provide suggests); Fox’s math is wrong and even using their methods the low estimate should be at least 34% while the 90% is based on guns submitted by Mexico to the ATF for tracing which is at least some kind of sample to work with. [This interview with Robert Farley of Politifact](http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=103224899)offers more soft data: > [@](#): > > NORRIS: So if the 90 percent statistic is not quite right and the 17 percent number is also incorrect, what is the accurate number? What number should our policymakers be citing? > > Mr. FARLEY: Well, we don’t know exactly what percentage of all the recovered guns in Mexico, where they’re coming from. **But, you know, a Mexican official that we spoke with said that the percentage of guns confiscated in Mexico probably is closer to the 90 percent figure than the 17. If not, fully 90 percent, probably close to that. He said that almost all of the handguns that are confiscated in Mexico come from the United States.** And that amongst the assault weapons, while a good number of them are coming from the United States, they’re also - that’s more of a mixed bag. And they’re coming, as well, through some of the drug routes in Eastern Europe and Africa. [This site](https://www.stratfor.com/weekly/20110209-mexicos-gun-supply-and-90-percent-myth)takes a more sceptical - but still speculative - stance: > [@](#): > > Of course, some or even many of the 22,800 firearms the Mexicans did not submit to ATF for tracing may have originated in the United States. But according to the figures presented by the GAO, there is no evidence to support the assertion that 90 percent of the guns used by the Mexican cartels come from the United States — especially when not even 50 percent of those that were submitted for tracing were ultimately found to be of U.S. origin. Note that they do not dispute the 90% for guns which could be traced; the uncertainty lies in guns not traced (some of which have had their serial numbers removed). (Also note that when they say “not even 50 percent of those that were submitted for tracing were ultimately found to be of U.S. origin” most of the rest couldn’t be traced _at all_). The rest of that article is interesting for the breakdown of types of guns; for certain categories of weapons the US is definitely the main source for legal or illegal purchases while others, like military weapons, were more likely locally-sourced or from elsewhere. So what you think the answer is depends on how you count the population of guns that either aren’t traced or can’t be traced. If you think the traced-and-traceable population is representative, then it’s in the 87-90% range. If you assume every gun not explicitly traced to the US isn’t from the US, then it’s less than half, and possibly less than a third. And of course it depends on whether you mean all weapons or some subset of them. Take your pick. ---
**Author:** ![Lumpy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lumpy/32/446_2.png) [@Lumpy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lumpy)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2016, 4:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-gun-news-of-the-day-part-1/648729/7209 "2016-07-11T16:32:37Z")
> [@septimus](#): > > I had the same question as **Elvis** , especially since I thought the tendency was to lie _in the other direction_: “We got lotsa guns here, pal. Any thugs and hos show up here, will be walking away missing body parts!” > > So, **Lumpy** : What is the reason gun owners lie to pollsters and say they don’t have guns? Are they afraid of Obamabama the Gungrabber, that he’ll send his big man-bride over to shove the gun up your ass? Stripped of the snark, yes, many gun owners consider it prudent to hide whether or how many guns they own. Since you obviously didn’t even bother to read the link in my previous reply, I’ll spell it out for you in short easy words: “Tragic Boating Accident” is a cliche where a gun owner claims that he lost all his guns on a hunting trip when his boat overturned. ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2016, 4:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-gun-news-of-the-day-part-1/648729/7210 "2016-07-11T16:35:03Z")
“Claims” to whom? ---
**Author:** ![Lumpy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lumpy/32/446_2.png) [@Lumpy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lumpy)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2016, 5:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-gun-news-of-the-day-part-1/648729/7211 "2016-07-11T17:03:16Z")
> [@Gyrate](#): > > “Claims” to whom? Anyone from the government who might be asking. ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2016, 5:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-gun-news-of-the-day-part-1/648729/7212 "2016-07-11T17:16:32Z")
> [@Lumpy](#): > > Anyone from the government who might be asking. Does that happen often? ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2016, 10:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-gun-news-of-the-day-part-1/648729/7213 "2016-07-11T22:29:07Z")
> [@Lumpy](#): > > Stripped of the snark, yes, many gun owners consider it prudent to hide whether or how many guns they own. If so, there are a whole lot more than there used to be. Why is _that_? ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2016, 10:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-gun-news-of-the-day-part-1/648729/7214 "2016-07-11T22:31:01Z")
> [@Cartooniverse](#): > > I for one find it bordering between bigotry and hate speech to define those who are overweight with hair loss issues in this light. But you’re OK with “schlub”, right? 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Lumpy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lumpy/32/446_2.png) [@Lumpy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lumpy)\ **Post date:** [July 12, 2016, 2:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-gun-news-of-the-day-part-1/648729/7215 "2016-07-12T02:56:28Z")
> [@ElvisL1ves](#): > > If so, there are a whole lot more than there used to be. Why is _that_? People like you. ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [July 12, 2016, 8:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-gun-news-of-the-day-part-1/648729/7216 "2016-07-12T08:25:26Z")
Apparently **Lumpy** is scared of you, **ElvisL1ves**. ---
**Author:** ![Jack\_Batty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jack_batty/32/3201_2.png) [@Jack\_Batty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jack_Batty)\ **Post date:** [July 12, 2016, 8:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-gun-news-of-the-day-part-1/648729/7217 "2016-07-12T08:46:55Z")
All these lawful gun owners sure go out of their way to tell how us how we should act with authorities, i.e., the police - ALWAYS DO WHAT YOU’RE TOLD - ALWAYS TELL THE TRUTH - IT’S JUST STUPID TO LIE TO THE POLICE. But it seems if the authority is kicked up a few notches and it involves one’s precious guns the opposite is the order of the day. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [July 12, 2016, 10:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-gun-news-of-the-day-part-1/648729/7218 "2016-07-12T10:36:03Z")
> [@Gyrate](#): > > Apparently **Lumpy** is scared of you, **ElvisL1ves**. He’s scared of a \*lot \*of things. Fortunately he has his blanky made of steel to protect him. ---
**Author:** ![septimus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/septimus/32/410_2.png) [@septimus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/septimus)\ **Post date:** [July 12, 2016, 1:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-gun-news-of-the-day-part-1/648729/7219 "2016-07-12T13:12:32Z")
> [@Jack\_Batty](#): > > All these lawful gun owners sure go out of their way to tell how us how we should act with authorities, i.e., the police - ALWAYS DO WHAT YOU’RE TOLD - ALWAYS TELL THE TRUTH - IT’S JUST STUPID TO LIE TO THE POLICE. > > But it seems if the authority is kicked up a few notches and it involves one’s precious guns the opposite is the order of the day. Indeed. Can the extremist pro-gun Dopers comment? It appears some of you are comfortable with the attitudes in both of these statements: “Darkie, you keep yer hands in the air and tail between yer leg when police is talking at you. And tell nothing but the truth, the whole truth. Don’t try any of yer thuggish lies; it might get you shot, ha ha.” “White man, when you see a man in a suit assume he’s getting ready to grab your guns no matter how friendly he might seem. If he asks about guns, just lie like a m\*\*\*\*\*\ ***k**!” What gives? Is it just that old adage “All’s fair in love and war and guns”? ---
**Author:** ![Lumpy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lumpy/32/446_2.png) [@Lumpy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lumpy)\ **Post date:** [July 12, 2016, 2:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-gun-news-of-the-day-part-1/648729/7220 "2016-07-12T14:27:22Z")
> [@ElvisL1ves](#): > > He’s scared of a \*lot \*of things. Fortunately he has his blanky made of steel to protect him. You’re the one who insists that every gun owner is a threat to your personal safety. Does open-carry make you pee yourself? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-gun-news-of-the-day-part-1/648729.md?page=360) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-gun-news-of-the-day-part-1/648729.md?page=362)