# Stupid liberal idea of the day **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [April 20, 2011, 3:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-liberal-idea-of-the-day/579086 "2011-04-20T15:35:49Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 311
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [September 19, 2017, 9:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-liberal-idea-of-the-day/579086/6201 "2017-09-19T09:34:11Z")
A Vox writer believes that failure by Harvard to admit a child killer proves that their commitment to diversity is a farce: > **[Harvard has shown its commitment to diversity was always a farce](https://www.vox.com/first-person/2017/9/18/16329144/harvard-michelle-jones-diversity)** > > Look how it treated Michelle Jones, a once-incarcerated woman. Leaving aside the issue of whether Harvard should or should not have admitted this woman, it is not a diversity issue. ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [September 19, 2017, 10:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-liberal-idea-of-the-day/579086/6202 "2017-09-19T10:55:56Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > A Vox writer believes that failure by Harvard to admit a child killer proves that their commitment to diversity is a farce Please - the correct term is “Paedocidal-American”. Seriously though, I had to force myself to finish reading that. And here’s why: > [@](#): > > **Having served 20 years in prison for killing her child** , Jones managed to not only survive psychological trauma, sexual violence, physical abuse, poverty, racism, sexism and two decades of incarceration but also obtained a bachelor’s degree, became a certified paralegal, conducted historical research, and produced award-winning scholarship — all from behind bars. (Bolding mine). The rest of the article was all about how Jones is the real victim here. I’m all for allowing people to move on with their lives having paid their debt to society for their crimes, but the casual marginalization by the author of what is by any measure a heinous crime – for whatever reasons it may been committed – immediately destroyed all credibility. Whatever other subgroups Jones may belong to, the one that will trump all others in most people’s minds is “child killer”, and while there are legitimate arguments for why Harvard should have accepted Jones, I agree that the diversity one is the most idiotic one by a long way. Stupid Liberal Idea achieved! ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [September 19, 2017, 11:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-liberal-idea-of-the-day/579086/6203 "2017-09-19T11:13:40Z")
Being fair to the author, the trauma is a real thing and it’s pretty clear that that trauma led to her murdering her son. And NYU did actually admit her, and it doesn’t look like it created too much of a furor, thus making Harvard’s fears look unfounded, although you can never underestimate the outrage machine. But where she goes wrong is in calling Harvard’s commitment to diversity a farce, and in going too far with the victim/crime/redemption story. She is a victim, but most victims manage not to murder their children. I have a friend whose children ALL came from rape and she hasn’t killed any of them. She loves them in fact. Also, she is not redeemed. IMO, it takes more than writing a really good history thesis to be redeemed for murdering your child. Maybe dying to save another child might pull that off. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [September 19, 2017, 12:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-liberal-idea-of-the-day/579086/6204 "2017-09-19T12:00:18Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > Being fair to the author, the trauma is a real thing and it’s pretty clear that that trauma led to her murdering her son. And NYU did actually admit her, and it doesn’t look like it created too much of a furor, thus making Harvard’s fears look unfounded, although you can never underestimate the outrage machine. > > But where she goes wrong is in calling Harvard’s commitment to diversity a farce, and in going too far with the victim/crime/redemption story. She is a victim, but most victims manage not to murder their children. I have a friend whose children ALL came from rape and she hasn’t killed any of them. She loves them in fact. Also, she is not redeemed. IMO, it takes more than writing a really good history thesis to be redeemed for murdering your child. Maybe dying to save another child might pull that off. The Harvard bigwigs’ own words about why they rejected this student, that they were afraid of the reaction of conservative media, is well worth criticizing. Based on Stauffer’s words, the fact that she was a minority was part of the reason they rescinded the accpetance, and that’s pretty awful. If Harvard’s policy really is that, in some circumstances, being black makes it less likely that they will accept a student, then yes, their commitment to diversity can reasonably be criticized as a farce. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [September 19, 2017, 12:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-liberal-idea-of-the-day/579086/6205 "2017-09-19T12:15:04Z")
In two ways: one, for succumbing to the outrage machine, and two, for THAT being their worry, rather than real concerns with admitting a child killer. I’d be willing to bet they wouldn’t admit someone who served their time for a hate crime, no matter how remorseful. ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [September 19, 2017, 12:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-liberal-idea-of-the-day/579086/6206 "2017-09-19T12:40:02Z")
[There’s a separate thread on this one](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=836665), but basically: Hobby Lobby was selling some cotton plant twigs with raw cotton attached, stuck in a bottle, as a decoration. One bright spark made the mental leap that cotton=slavery=racism and had a snit. Internet ensued. ---
**Author:** ![Ruken](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/f475e1/32.png) [@Ruken](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ruken)\ **Post date:** [September 19, 2017, 12:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-liberal-idea-of-the-day/579086/6207 "2017-09-19T12:45:25Z")
Re: the lawn mowing incident a couple weeks ago, cut grass does release VOCs, which contribute to urban smog. Probably not what the lady was getting at. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [September 19, 2017, 1:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-liberal-idea-of-the-day/579086/6208 "2017-09-19T13:11:26Z")
> [@Gyrate](#): > > [There’s a separate thread on this one](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=836665), but basically: Hobby Lobby was selling some cotton plant twigs with raw cotton attached, stuck in a bottle, as a decoration. One bright spark made the mental leap that cotton=slavery=racism and had a snit. Internet ensued. I don’t think that’s liberal, more fodder for the “social justice BS” thread. Or perhaps that political correctness thread I started that everyone hates.🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Knowed\_Out](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/knowed_out/32/7380_2.png) [@Knowed\_Out](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Knowed_Out)\ **Post date:** [September 19, 2017, 1:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-liberal-idea-of-the-day/579086/6209 "2017-09-19T13:41:45Z")
OK, let me try a crack at this. [Newsweek](https://www.yahoo.com/news/jennifer-lawrence-boycotts-alt-apos-221037534.html)is suggesting that Jennifer Lawrence is a target of the alt-right because they’re mad at a scene that mocks Christians. Actually, [National Review](http://www.nationalreview.com/article/451338/jennifer-lawrence-mother-sickest-movie-ever-made-disgusting-torture-porn) lists lots of reasons why the film is such a mother! to watch, and it tanked at the box office anyway. [Breitbart](http://www.breitbart.com/big-hollywood/2017/09/16/box-office-poison-jennifer-lawrences-mother-crashes-career-low-8m/)assumed its usual anti-lamestream media stance, but actually gave some valid reasons why Jennifer Lawrence is Box Office Poison. Neither source goes into specifics about the nature of the Christian mockery, but both articles place more emphasis on the faulty filmmaking. Oh wait, liberals are also mad at her because [she rubbed her buttocks against a Hawaiian monument to scratch her ass, and it pushed the rock over and almost fell on a sound techie](http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/jennifer-lawrence-hawaii-sacred-rocks_us_58498a12e4b04002fa801f67). So, Newsweek starts off making Lawrence look like an innocent alt-right target, but it turns out her movie sucks anyway and she’s a bad person for disrespecting Hawaiian gods. This confuses me. How’d I do? ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [September 19, 2017, 1:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-liberal-idea-of-the-day/579086/6210 "2017-09-19T13:43:51Z")
> [@Knowed\_Out](#): > > How’d I do? Well you’ve certainly confused me. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [September 19, 2017, 1:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-liberal-idea-of-the-day/579086/6211 "2017-09-19T13:47:01Z")
Jennifer Lawrence is just fine, but Hollywood may have overestimated her marketability based on the success of Hunger Games, which isn’t all that unusual. But she’s probably not a regular leading lady. ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [September 19, 2017, 2:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-liberal-idea-of-the-day/579086/6212 "2017-09-19T14:26:59Z")
> [@D\_Anconia](#): > > NYT columnist thinks that an 11-year old mowing the lawn at the White House is “Not sending a great signal on child labor, minimum wage & occupational safety”. > > What the fuck? > > [NY Times reporter slammed after saying boy mowing White House lawn sends bad signal on child labor | Fox News](http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2017/09/17/ny-times-reporter-slammed-after-saying-boy-mowing-white-house-lawn-sends-bad-signal-on-child-labor.html) > [@Robot\_Arm](#): > > A child volunteers for the honor of mowing a millionaires lawn for free; I think that’s exactly the message Trump wanted to send. And people defend it as a good lesson in learning the value of a day’s work, so at least some people are falling for it. > [@Brown\_Eyed\_Girl](#): > > Falling for what? > > It’s not exactly the most endearing story, but it’s a far cry from a scathing statement on child labor (as you noted, the kid volunteered), minimum wage (the kid set his own price), or occupational safety (he was wearing gloves, close-toed shoes and eye protection while operating machinery for which he seems to have developed some skill). I can’t decide which was dumber: some kid mowing the WH lawn for Trump or criticizing it under that pretense. > [@mhendo](#): > > Emphasis mine. > > I don’t care very much about this specific incident, one way or another, but the section i have bolded precisely misses the point. > > The fundamental principle of the minimum wage is that you don’t always get to set your own price. I could set the price for my labor at $5.00 an hour, but under California law my employer is required to pay me $10.50, and would be violating the law if he paid me my asking rate. I can’t set my own price because we, as a society, have decided that the minimum is not determined by an indivudal’s willing to sell him- or herself for the smallest amount possible. > > When groups like labor unions and the People’s Party and the socialists and the Progressives were fighting for minimum wage laws in the late nineteenth and early twentieth centuries, one plank of their argument in favor of a minimum wage was precisely that the idea of “liberty of contract,” under which individuals competed for jobs and negotiated their wages one-on-one with their employers, was fundamentally unfair, at least at the bottom end of the economic ladder, because of the massive discrepancies in power and need between the two bargaining parties. > > As an African American socialist and labor leader named Peter Clarke [wrote](https://herb.ashp.cuny.edu/items/show/1915) in the _Cincinnati Commercial_ newspaper, in 1877, in support of striking railroad workers:The basic principle of a minimum wage is precisely that: a minimum decided upon by society. It would be a meaningless concept if a worker could circumvent it simply by choosing to “set his own price.” > [@Robot\_Arm](#): > > The original statement about safety, minimum wage, etc. could be an interesting start to a conversation. I don’t know that I’d call it stupid, but probably an overreaction to cite law and policy issues when it’s just a kid mowing someone’s lawn. > > But the reply about how this is a lesson in self-sufficiency and the value of a day’s work really was stupid. His work does have value, but he’s not going to learn that by doing it for free. And the person who made that tweet fell for Trump’s message in the same way Tom Sawyer’s friends fell for the message that it would be fun to whitewash Aunt Polly’s fence. I guess that to the extent this WAS a SLI(otd), the stupidity lay in delivering his critique via tweet rather than a full opinion piece. Nuance and complex topics don’t tend to translate well in the 140-character format. ---
**Author:** ![Brown\_Eyed\_Girl](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/brown_eyed_girl/32/3574_2.png) [@Brown\_Eyed\_Girl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Brown_Eyed_Girl)\ **Post date:** [September 19, 2017, 3:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-liberal-idea-of-the-day/579086/6213 "2017-09-19T15:18:24Z")
> [@mhendo](#): > > Emphasis mine. > > I don’t care very much about this specific incident, one way or another, but the section i have bolded precisely misses the point. > > The fundamental principle of the minimum wage is that you don’t always get to set your own price. I could set the price for my labor at $5.00 an hour, but under California law my employer is required to pay me $10.50, and would be violating the law if he paid me my asking rate. I can’t set my own price because we, as a society, have decided that the minimum is not determined by an indivudal’s willing to sell him- or herself for the smallest amount possible. > > When groups like labor unions and the People’s Party and the socialists and the Progressives were fighting for minimum wage laws in the late nineteenth and early twentieth centuries, one plank of their argument in favor of a minimum wage was precisely that the idea of “liberty of contract,” under which individuals competed for jobs and negotiated their wages one-on-one with their employers, was fundamentally unfair, at least at the bottom end of the economic ladder, because of the massive discrepancies in power and need between the two bargaining parties. > > As an African American socialist and labor leader named Peter Clarke [wrote](https://herb.ashp.cuny.edu/items/show/1915) in the _Cincinnati Commercial_ newspaper, in 1877, in support of striking railroad workers:The basic principle of a minimum wage is precisely that: a minimum decided upon by society. It would be a meaningless concept if a worker could circumvent it simply by choosing to “set his own price.” That’s quite an argument that has nothing to do with independent contractors. The kid is not an employee of the clients who hire him to mow their lawns. He runs his own business and sets his own rates for services. What he earns from that service is his business not his clients’. Is it a violation of minimum wage laws if a business owner donates his services? Is it a violation if a small business owner forgoes a salary and cycles all revenue back into the business? Now, if you want to make the argument that he’s terrible businessman who doesn’t know how to set rates that sustain his business or pay back his investors, you might actually be on to something. But that shouldn’t come as a surprise for a Trumpet, or the son of one, amirite? ---
**Author:** ![Clothahump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/51bf81/32.png) [@Clothahump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Clothahump)\ **Post date:** [September 19, 2017, 3:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-liberal-idea-of-the-day/579086/6214 "2017-09-19T15:33:08Z")
> [@Procrustus](#): > > _Every_ loyal American should take\* every\* opportunity to disparage Trump. It’s really important. These are not “normal” times and we should be going about our normal business as if we had a sane and competent President. I really hate to bust your bubble, **Procrustus,** but we have one. As opposed to the batshit-crazy woman you people tried to get elected, and opposed to the massively incompetent President that you did succeed in electing for the preceding two terms. Y’all really need to deal with the fact that you didn’t get your lollipop last election and stop crying and whining 24/7 about it. ---
**Author:** ![Procrustus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/procrustus/32/2994_2.png) [@Procrustus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Procrustus)\ **Post date:** [September 19, 2017, 3:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-liberal-idea-of-the-day/579086/6215 "2017-09-19T15:46:49Z")
> [@Clothahump](#): > > I really hate to bust your bubble, **Procrustus,** but we have one. As opposed to the batshit-crazy woman you people tried to get elected, and opposed to the massively incompetent President that you did succeed in electing for the preceding two terms. > > Y’all really need to deal with the fact that you didn’t get your lollipop last election and stop crying and whining 24/7 about it. Come on now, do you really expect me to believe that you view Trump as “sane and competent?” That’s hard to swallow. I guess you haven’t burned your MAGA cap yet. Let me know when you do. ---
**Author:** ![Knowed\_Out](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/knowed_out/32/7380_2.png) [@Knowed\_Out](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Knowed_Out)\ **Post date:** [September 19, 2017, 4:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-liberal-idea-of-the-day/579086/6216 "2017-09-19T16:26:40Z")
> [@Clothahump](#): > > Y’all really need to deal with the fact that you didn’t get your lollipop last election and stop crying and whining 24/7 about it. Somehow you interpret complaints about Trump’s actions as grousing about the 2016 election. Why is that? ---
**Author:** ![Robot\_Arm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robot_arm/32/18280_2.png) [@Robot\_Arm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robot_Arm)\ **Post date:** [September 19, 2017, 4:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-liberal-idea-of-the-day/579086/6217 "2017-09-19T16:37:43Z")
> [@Clothahump](#): > > Y’all really need to deal with the fact that you didn’t get your lollipop last election and stop crying and whining 24/7 about it. Why? You’re still whining and crying about Obama nine months after he left office. ---
**Author:** ![Procrustus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/procrustus/32/2994_2.png) [@Procrustus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Procrustus)\ **Post date:** [September 19, 2017, 4:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-liberal-idea-of-the-day/579086/6218 "2017-09-19T16:43:53Z")
> [@Knowed\_Out](#): > > Somehow you interpret complaints about Trump’s actions as grousing about the 2016 election. Why is that? That’s a _Trump Talking Point_. We don’t hate Trump, we are just mad that our chosen one, Hillary, didn’t win as expected. ---
**Author:** ![enipla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/54ee81/32.png) [@enipla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/enipla)\ **Post date:** [September 19, 2017, 4:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-liberal-idea-of-the-day/579086/6219 "2017-09-19T16:57:17Z")
> [@Procrustus](#): > > That’s a _Trump Talking Point_. We don’t hate Trump, we are just mad that our chosen one, Hillary, didn’t win as expected. Right. We’re not upset that a fucking moron is sitting in the oval office. We are just mad because we lost. ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [September 19, 2017, 5:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-liberal-idea-of-the-day/579086/6220 "2017-09-19T17:01:51Z")
> [@Clothahump](#): > > I really hate to bust your bubble, **Procrustus,** but we have one. As opposed to the batshit-crazy woman you people tried to get elected, and opposed to the massively incompetent President that you did succeed in electing for the preceding two terms. > > Y’all really need to deal with the fact that you didn’t get your lollipop last election and stop crying and whining 24/7 about it. He’s neither sane nor competent, and he hates America, to boot. Your failure to recognize these facts is another of the myriad\* factors that make you the perennial winner of the “stupidest Doper” title. \*“myriad” means that there are a lot of them. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-liberal-idea-of-the-day/579086.md?page=310) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-liberal-idea-of-the-day/579086.md?page=312)