# Stupid liberal idea of the day **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [April 20, 2011, 3:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-liberal-idea-of-the-day/579086 "2011-04-20T15:35:49Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 364
**Author:** ![Knowed\_Out](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/knowed_out/32/7380_2.png) [@Knowed\_Out](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Knowed_Out)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2018, 3:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-liberal-idea-of-the-day/579086/7261 "2018-12-12T15:41:16Z")
> [@Velocity](#): > > There are now migrants who are demanding that the U.S. government pay them $50,000 apiece to go home, or let them into America. > > [Migrant groups march to U.S. consulate in Tijuana demanding reparations – San Diego Union-Tribune](https://www.sandiegouniontribune.com/news/border-baja-california/sd-me-migrant-demands-12122018-story.html) > > Not that the U.S. government would likely ever do so, but if they pay the Danegeld they’ll never get rid of the Dane - because there’d suddenly be a massive uptick in people arriving at the border wanting their $50,000, too, if so. I guess Soros didn’t fund them after all. ---
**Author:** ![Budget\_Player\_Cadet](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/budget_player_cadet/32/205_2.png) [@Budget\_Player\_Cadet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Budget_Player_Cadet)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2018, 3:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-liberal-idea-of-the-day/579086/7262 "2018-12-12T15:41:48Z")
Is that a “liberal idea”? I mean, it’s pretty stupid, in the “I’d like a pony which is also a magical unicorn” kind of sense… ---
**Author:** ![Rick\_Kitchen](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rick_kitchen/32/522_2.png) [@Rick\_Kitchen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rick_Kitchen)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2018, 7:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-liberal-idea-of-the-day/579086/7263 "2018-12-12T19:25:22Z")
> [@Ravenman](#): > > Her tweets consistently show that she has a very loose grasp on facts when it is convenient for her political opinions. Cite? ---
**Author:** ![Rick\_Kitchen](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rick_kitchen/32/522_2.png) [@Rick\_Kitchen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rick_Kitchen)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2018, 7:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-liberal-idea-of-the-day/579086/7264 "2018-12-12T19:26:45Z")
> [@Velocity](#): > > There are now migrants who are demanding that the U.S. government pay them $50,000 apiece to go home, or let them into America. > > [Migrant groups march to U.S. consulate in Tijuana demanding reparations – San Diego Union-Tribune](https://www.sandiegouniontribune.com/news/border-baja-california/sd-me-migrant-demands-12122018-story.html) > > Not that the U.S. government would likely ever do so, but if they pay the Danegeld they’ll never get rid of the Dane - because there’d suddenly be a massive uptick in people arriving at the border wanting their $50,000, too, if so. What liberal is supporting this idea? ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2018, 7:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-liberal-idea-of-the-day/579086/7265 "2018-12-12T19:37:34Z")
> [@Rick\_Kitchen](#): > > Cite? > **[Fact-checks | PolitiFact](https://www.politifact.com/factchecks/list/?speaker=alexandria-ocasio-cortez)** > > PolitiFact is a fact-checking website that rates the accuracy of claims by elected officials and others on its Truth-O-Meter. ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2018, 7:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-liberal-idea-of-the-day/579086/7266 "2018-12-12T19:52:16Z")
> [@From link](#): > > When asked how the group came up with the $50,000 figure, organizer Alfonso Guerrero Ulloa of Honduras, said they chose that number as a group. > > “It may seem like a lot of money to you,” Ulloa said. “But it is a small sum compared to everything the United States has stolen from Honduras.” “Group”?? Godless commies! What has the US stolen from Honduras? ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2018, 8:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-liberal-idea-of-the-day/579086/7267 "2018-12-12T20:24:49Z")
> [@carnivorousplant](#): > > “Group”?? Godless commies! > > What has the US stolen from Honduras? It’s sovereignty, for a very large part of the 20th century. And we really took too many mints on the way out. The dish was just sitting there, and any civilized person would obviously just take one. But no, we grabbed a whole handful, like a barbarian would do. ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2018, 10:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-liberal-idea-of-the-day/579086/7268 "2018-12-13T10:42:53Z")
> [@Ravenman](#): > > Wow, you’re as bad as AOC. (I realize you may take that as a compliment.) > > When she said that the military is sitting on trillions of dollars that could be used to pay for Medicare for All, did you view that as a false statement, or a “statement of principle?” Wow, you’re being a massive fucking moron. I said: > [@Gyrate](#): > > Possibly, although most of the examples of this I’ve seen have involved people deliberately taking statements of broad principle and pretending they’re intended as detailed policy statements. That is a true statement: most of the examples I’ve seen **have** involved people deliberately taking statements of broad principle and pretending they’re intended as detailed policy statements. Note that I even caveated this with “most”. You then jumped in with: > [@Ravenman](#): > > Wait - you think unfactual things are just “broad statements of principle?” Is this the same as what I just said? No, it is not. You went and built a nice big strawman of me so you could subject it to abuse: > [@](#): > > You should look in the mirror. Trump supporters dismiss lies by saying Trump should be taken seriously and not literally. Now you’re applying the same bullshit standard to a politician you happen to agree with. Actually, I’m complaining about people taking what she actually said and completely reinterpreting it, so basically the opposite of what you accused me of. For example, AOC was accused of wanting to lead an insurrection in Congress based on her comments that a proactive progressive caucus would be a good thing. But please proceed - you’re doing so well. ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2018, 11:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-liberal-idea-of-the-day/579086/7269 "2018-12-13T11:45:28Z")
> [@Gyrate](#): > > Actually, I’m complaining about people taking what she actually said and completely reinterpreting it, so basically the opposite of what you accused me of. For example, AOC was accused of wanting to lead an insurrection in Congress based on her comments that a proactive progressive caucus would be a good thing. What in that particular example do you think a person - not just me, but anyone - would give rise to calling her “insurrection” a matter of factual falsehood? Sure seems like you are relying on your own straw man there, buddy. Keep also in mind that I’ve linked to her factual falsehoods in support of my “she doesn’t care about saying untrue things if it makes a snappy Twitter post” theory. But please, go ahead and look at that Politifact page and tell me how I’m wrong. ---
**Author:** ![Budget\_Player\_Cadet](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/budget_player_cadet/32/205_2.png) [@Budget\_Player\_Cadet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Budget_Player_Cadet)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2018, 12:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-liberal-idea-of-the-day/579086/7270 "2018-12-13T12:14:26Z")
> [@Ravenman](#): > > [Fact-checks | PolitiFact](https://www.politifact.com/personalities/alexandria-ocasio-cortez/statements/?list=speaker) Ouch, that’s pretty damning. ☹ ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2018, 12:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-liberal-idea-of-the-day/579086/7271 "2018-12-13T12:56:13Z")
> [@Ravenman](#): > > What in that particular example do you think a person - not just me, but anyone - would give rise to calling her “insurrection” a matter of factual falsehood? Is it that she wasn’t advocating an “insurrection” at all and said nothing about “leading” anything? That’s a “factual falsehood” on the part of the people making the claim about what she said. Which is what I was talking about in the first place. > [@](#): > > Keep also in mind that I’ve linked to her factual falsehoods in support of my “she doesn’t care about saying untrue things if it makes a snappy Twitter post” theory. Yes you have. And I agree that some of the things she has said are false. And you have provide us with a half-dozen examples of this, three of which were from tweets. So I agree with you that she sometimes (on at least three occasions) has been guilty of careless and inaccurate tweeting, and that she should know better. And that on other occasions, in interviews, she has likewise made factually false statements. Whether that can be extrapolated to her “not caring” for the purposes of “making a snappy Twitter post” or whether they are, as I suggested, merely “rookie mistakes” caused by not checking the information she has been given as she should do, is clearly a subjective assessment. > [@](#): > > But please, go ahead and look at that Politifact page and tell me how I’m wrong. You’re wrong in characterizing what **I** said. Can you point, in my posts, to where I said she never makes factual falsehoods? No? How about if you squint? I’m talking about people making shit up about things she said, not that she never says anything that’s false. It seems that we’re talking past each other here. ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2018, 2:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-liberal-idea-of-the-day/579086/7272 "2018-12-13T14:07:32Z")
> [@Gyrate](#): > > Is it that she wasn’t advocating an “insurrection” at all and said nothing about “leading” anything? That’s a “factual falsehood” on the part of the people making the claim about what she said. Which is what I was talking about in the first place. > > Yes you have. And I agree that some of the things she has said are false. And you have provide us with a half-dozen examples of this, three of which were from tweets. > > So I agree with you that she sometimes (on at least three occasions) has been guilty of careless and inaccurate tweeting, and that she should know better. And that on other occasions, in interviews, she has likewise made factually false statements. Whether that can be extrapolated to her “not caring” for the purposes of “making a snappy Twitter post” or whether they are, as I suggested, merely “rookie mistakes” caused by not checking the information she has been given as she should do, is clearly a subjective assessment. > > You’re wrong in characterizing what **I** said. Can you point, in my posts, to where I said she never makes factual falsehoods? No? How about if you squint? > > I’m talking about people making shit up about things she said, not that she never says anything that’s false. It seems that we’re talking past each other here. Now that you have conceded that I am correct in her loose regard for facts, I accept your apology. ---
**Author:** ![andros](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e480ec/32.png) [@andros](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/andros)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2018, 2:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-liberal-idea-of-the-day/579086/7273 "2018-12-13T14:28:07Z")
> [@Ravenman](#): > > Now that you have conceded that I am correct in her loose regard for facts, I accept your apology. Even for the Pit this is weak af. Seriously, **Ravenman** , why does this lady get up your nose so bad? Is it just “old man yells at cloud” syndrome? ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2018, 2:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-liberal-idea-of-the-day/579086/7274 "2018-12-13T14:33:31Z")
> [@andros](#): > > Even for the Pit this is weak af. Seriously, **Ravenman** , why does this lady get up your nose so bad? Is it just “old man yells at cloud” syndrome? Excuse me, but I defended her against the faux-outrage of her not being able to afford an apartment until she started getting her paycheck. She was acting entirely reasonably in that case, and her critics were being absurd. What I pitted her for is the cluelessness of criticizing 44 senators who were implicitly arguing for the Senate to take impeachment charges seriously; because she hopped on a stupid, out of touch criticism that some of those Senators miiiight be lobbyists. It’s a really, really dumb thing to undercut people arguing that impeachment charges should be taken seriously for the sake of the nation because LOBbYIsTS!!1! Then the putting turned to her loose grasp on truth when there’s attention to be had. Frankly, I think both criticisms of her are exactly on point. That does not mean I subscribe to every criticism of her. ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2018, 3:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-liberal-idea-of-the-day/579086/7275 "2018-12-13T15:14:03Z")
> [@Ravenman](#): > > This morning, a few dozen former senators co-signed an op-ed that was mostly a bunch of unspecific pablum, but at this time, is clearly a plea to the Senate to take the Mueller investigation seriously and to put partisanship aside when looking at the allegations that Trump broke several laws. > > [https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/we-are-former-senators-the-senate-has-long-stood-in-defense-of-democracy--and-must-again/2018/12/10/3adfbdea-fca1-11e8-ad40-cdfd0e0dd65a\_story.html](https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/we-are-former-senators-the-senate-has-long-stood-in-defense-of-democracy--and-must-again/2018/12/10/3adfbdea-fca1-11e8-ad40-cdfd0e0dd65a_story.html) > > I have no problem with that message. I mean, who would, other than the most brain-dead partisans? Well, who _would_ have a problem with that message? Here’s the message: “we urge current and future senators to be steadfast and zealous guardians of our democracy by ensuring that partisanship or self-interest not replace national interest.” Gotta admit, it’s hard to argue with that. And that’s the problem. Despite the upfront gloom and doom, their prescription can be read to mean just about anything. Given that the Trump Administration routinely gives a back seat to the national interest, this statement would mean more if they came up with a few particulars and said, “here’s some times you’ve recently failed to do this. This shit can’t go on, y’all.” > [@](#): > > Well, the infamous Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez found something to whine about: the men (and like two women) didn’t declare whether they were currently working as a lobbyist. > > [https://twitter.com/Ocasio2018/status/1072338285882679298](https://twitter.com/Ocasio2018/status/1072338285882679298) > > Jesus Fucking Christ, can you not read for context? So yeah, I’d be concerned that the interests that the signatories represent might have a connection to the milquetoasty nature of the message. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Stainless\_Steel\_Rat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_stainless_steel_rat/32/5727_2.png) [@The\_Stainless\_Steel\_Rat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Stainless_Steel_Rat)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2018, 2:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-liberal-idea-of-the-day/579086/7276 "2018-12-14T02:09:02Z")
I’ve voted Democratic for decades, but in the interest of fairness, there are a couple of ‘what were they thinking’ moments that I think belong in this thread. Oops#1: Mika Brzezinski speaks her mind and let’s Trump take the high ground. [MSNBC's Mika Brzezinski criticized by Trump over offensive remark](https://www.nbcnews.com/news/all/msnbc-s-mika-brzezinski-criticized-trump-over-use-homophobic-slur-n947701) > [@](#): > > Brzezinski was criticizing Pompeo’s recent appearance on Fox News in which he avoided questions about Crown Prince Mohammed. > > “Are the pathetic deflections that we just heard, when [Pompeo] appeared on ‘Fox & Friends,’ is that a patriot speaking, or a wannabe dictator’s butt boy?" Brzezinski asked. "Dead serious, I’m asking. Are these the words of a patriot?” Which gave Trump the chance to tweet: > [@](#): > > “If it was a Conservative that said what ‘crazed’ Mika Brzezinski stated on her show yesterday, using a certain horrible term, that person would be banned permanently from television,” (from: [Trump rips Mika Brzezinski for ‘butt boy’ dig against Mike Pompeo](https://nypost.com/2018/12/13/trump-rips-mika-brezinski-for-butt-boy-dig-against-mike-pompeo/) She’s apologized, but still a self-inflicted wound. Oops #2: Congressman Collin Peterson (D-MN) managed to look as dumb as a Republican (which takes some doing these days) when, after a vote on a fairly obscure item with real-world implications…[Dem: I Voted For Yemen War Because I Know Nothing About It](http://nymag.com/intelligencer/2018/12/colin-peterson-yemen-rule-farm-bill-saudi-war.html) > [@](#): > > In a bizarre coincidence, right around the same time, the House Rules Committee realized that its agricultural spending bill was missing one key provision — a rule forbidding the House from voting to end U.S. military support for the Saudi war in Yemen before the end of this year. > > The addition of a pro-famine clause to the annual farm bill struck many Republican lawmakers as odd: When the rule came up for a vote Wednesday, 18 GOP House members voted against it. But the measure passed 206-203 anyway — because five Democratic congressmen (they were, indeed, all men) voted in favor. When asked about it, the Rep replied: > [@](#): > > ``` > Stein: Can you explain your vote on the Yemen resolution? > > Peterson: Yeah. It didn’t belong there. > > Stein: Why not? Couldn’t you just have come back and done another vote? > > Peterson: No — we’ve worked for two years on this farm bill, and I’ll be damned if I let anyone screw it up. > > Stein: Do you have any thoughts about the war in Yemen? > > Peterson: ***I don’t know a damn thing about it*** , and it should be in there and it — it didn’t do anything anyway. [my emphasis] > > Stein: What do you mean by that? > > Peterson: All it did say was that they couldn’t have a vote or something. Didn’t authorize anything, it didn’t — you know. Our party gets off on tangents. It’s ridiculous. > > ``` Hey, I understand you’re from Minnesota and Farming is important to you, but a mild education about the horror going on in Yemen might have made you look less like a moron–leave that to the Republicans. Again, I did this in the interests of fairness; now I need a shower and some juicy stuff in the Mueller thread… ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2018, 10:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-liberal-idea-of-the-day/579086/7277 "2018-12-14T10:57:03Z")
> [@Ravenman](#): > > Now that you have conceded that I am correct in her loose regard for facts, I accept your apology. So, having made up a claim I didn’t make about a stance I don’t hold, you’ve now made up an apology I didn’t make for that claim and stance. But if you want an apology, here you go: I’m sorry you struggle at reading for comprehension. I’m sorry that you hallucinate words that aren’t there. And I’m sorry I even got into this with you, given the previous two apologies. ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2018, 3:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-liberal-idea-of-the-day/579086/7278 "2018-12-14T15:50:25Z")
> [@The\_Stainless\_Steel\_Rat](#): > > Oops#1: Mika Brzezinski speaks her mind and let’s Trump take the high ground. [MSNBC's Mika Brzezinski criticized by Trump over offensive remark](https://www.nbcnews.com/news/all/msnbc-s-mika-brzezinski-criticized-trump-over-use-homophobic-slur-n947701) Yeah, Mika went _way_ over the line there. Not sure it qualifies for this thread: she and Joe aren’t liberals by any stretch of the imagination. They’re anti-Trump conservatives, and once Trump loses in 2020 and Republicans don’t have to be Trump’s lickspittles anymore, Joe and Mika will be just as obviously pro-Republican as they used to be before Trump. ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2018, 3:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-liberal-idea-of-the-day/579086/7279 "2018-12-14T15:54:56Z")
> [@The\_Stainless\_Steel\_Rat](#): > > Oops #2: Congressman Collin Peterson (D-MN) managed to look as dumb as a Republican (which takes some doing these days) when, after a vote on a fairly obscure item with real-world implications…[Dem: I Voted For Yemen War Because I Know Nothing About It](http://nymag.com/intelligencer/2018/12/colin-peterson-yemen-rule-farm-bill-saudi-war.html) > > When asked about it, the Rep replied: > > Hey, I understand you’re from Minnesota and Farming is important to you, but a mild education about the horror going on in Yemen might have made you look less like a moron–leave that to the Republicans. This sort of thing really pisses me off. It’s a Congressperson’s **job** to know more about stuff like this than those of us do who have day jobs to occupy our time, not to mention no staff to research stuff like this and give us capsule summaries. If he can’t be bothered, he should stand down. ---
**Author:** ![Strassia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e8c25b/32.png) [@Strassia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Strassia)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2018, 4:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-liberal-idea-of-the-day/579086/7280 "2018-12-14T16:23:43Z")
A real one, although this one may be considered smart, if undemocratic, on short and local scale: [Democratic majority in New Jersey legislature move to gerrymander a more permanent majority.](https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2018/12/new-jersey-gerrymandering-plan-bad.html) This is stupid on several fronts: 1. New Jersey is already pretty safely blue 2. It makes it harder to push for reforms against this as now it becomes a “both sides do it” situation This is something that should be stopped no matter which party is doing it. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-liberal-idea-of-the-day/579086.md?page=363) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-liberal-idea-of-the-day/579086.md?page=365)