# Stupid Privileged White Kid Gets 6 Months for Rape, Father describes it as "20 minutes of action" **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [June 7, 2016, 2:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-privileged-white-kid-gets-6-months-for-rape-father-describes-it-as-20-minutes-of-action/756733 "2016-06-07T14:12:58Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 42
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2018, 5:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-privileged-white-kid-gets-6-months-for-rape-father-describes-it-as-20-minutes-of-action/756733/821 "2018-06-10T17:42:04Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > My argument (or, more accurately, the argument of the writers whose works I have linked above) is that it will have a disproportionately chilling effect on poor and minority population. It’s unclear to me why you’d emphasize the chilling effect you hope it will have on affluenziatic Stanford boys, except that this is the effect you desire and you don’t wish to confront the potential effect you don’t desire – or don’t wish to acknowledge you desire, or to which you are indifferent. Holy fuck the liar is trying to take the moral high ground argument. How’s your support for the GOP in that light you’re trying to shine? ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2018, 6:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-privileged-white-kid-gets-6-months-for-rape-father-describes-it-as-20-minutes-of-action/756733/822 "2018-06-10T18:27:26Z")
Surely a happy judicial medium exists between coddling the wealthy and oppressing the poor. ---
**Author:** ![Merneith](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/57b2e6/32.png) [@Merneith](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Merneith)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2018, 8:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-privileged-white-kid-gets-6-months-for-rape-father-describes-it-as-20-minutes-of-action/756733/823 "2018-06-10T20:14:04Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > My argument (or, more accurately, the argument of the writers whose works I have linked above) is that it will have a disproportionately chilling effect on poor and minority population. The Law already has a disproportionate effect on poor and minority populations. If you want to address that - then advance your ideas to do so. Letting the judge off the hook for refusing to hold well-off white Ivy League racists accountable actually does nothing to address the fundamental failure of justice. Scaremongering to the effect that we shouldn’t discipline a judge who lets rich white Ivy League boys get away with rape because because maybe some random other judges might be even harder on the poors sounds more like excuses for maintaining the status quo. In short, I find your - or whoever’s - argument to be dishonest and irrelevant. > [@](#): > > It’s unclear to me why you’d emphasize the chilling effect you hope it will have on affluenziatic Stanford boys, except that this is the effect you desire and you don’t wish to confront the potential effect you don’t desire – or don’t wish to acknowledge you desire, or to which you are indifferent. I’m not particularly moved by slippery slope arguments. If you - or those people whose arguments you are bandying - come back in a few years and demonstrate that yes - judges are now being harder on poor and minority defendants, while continuing to allow wealthy white male Stanfordians to escape punishment, then we can re-address that problem. Possibly we’ll address it by firing a few more judges! But it’s no argument for allowing Persky to continue after the people of California have lost confidence in his judgement. ---
**Author:** ![Merneith](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/57b2e6/32.png) [@Merneith](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Merneith)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2018, 8:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-privileged-white-kid-gets-6-months-for-rape-father-describes-it-as-20-minutes-of-action/756733/824 "2018-06-10T20:20:26Z")
Sorry - “well-off white Ivy League racists” should have been “well-off white Ivy League rapists” in the first para. ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2018, 8:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-privileged-white-kid-gets-6-months-for-rape-father-describes-it-as-20-minutes-of-action/756733/825 "2018-06-10T20:23:14Z")
> [@Merneith](#): > > Sorry - “well-off white Ivy League racists” should have been “well-off white Ivy League rapists” in the first para. Meh, probably right on both counts. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Finn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dewey_finn/32/4222_2.png) [@Dewey\_Finn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Finn)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2018, 8:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-privileged-white-kid-gets-6-months-for-rape-father-describes-it-as-20-minutes-of-action/756733/826 "2018-06-10T20:27:01Z")
And if you _really_ want to be nitpicky, Stanford is _not_ an Ivy League school. ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2018, 9:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-privileged-white-kid-gets-6-months-for-rape-father-describes-it-as-20-minutes-of-action/756733/827 "2018-06-10T21:38:46Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > My argument (or, more accurately, the argument of the writers whose works I have linked above) is that it will have a disproportionately chilling effect on poor and minority population. It’s unclear to me why you’d emphasize the chilling effect you hope it will have on affluenziatic Stanford boys, except that this is the effect you desire and you don’t wish to confront the potential effect you don’t desire – or don’t wish to acknowledge you desire, or to which you are indifferent. I didn’t get to vote in this recall, but I’m the next county over and heard much of the discussion. None of it was about judges being too lenient on crime in general. In fact, in 2012 California limited the 3 strikes law to apply only to felonies for the third strike, which made things somewhat more lenient. This was all about sex crimes not being treated seriously enough, especially when the assailant was a “good boy.” If this means harsher penalties for sex criminals of any race, fine with me, but I suspect the poorer ones don’t get off that easily right now. ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2018, 9:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-privileged-white-kid-gets-6-months-for-rape-father-describes-it-as-20-minutes-of-action/756733/828 "2018-06-10T21:42:39Z")
> [@Dewey\_Finn](#): > > And if you _really_ want to be nitpicky, Stanford is _not_ an Ivy League school. Shhh, don’t let them hear you say that! ---
**Author:** ![asahi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asahi/32/8693_2.png) [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2018, 12:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-privileged-white-kid-gets-6-months-for-rape-father-describes-it-as-20-minutes-of-action/756733/829 "2018-06-11T00:07:14Z")
> [@Chimera](#): > > I tend to think more of the outrage in this case was aimed at the “ **But he’s a good kid who gets good grades and is on the swim team, so don’t ruin his life** ” bit That’s how people perceive the judge’s thought process, and the media aren’t helping matters in their biased and sensational reporting. When you look at the facts of the case, however, what’s probably a more accurate characterization is simply to say that Turner did not have any previous criminal convictions. That’s not a judge or the parole board saying “He’s a good white boy, leave him alone.” That’s something that judges in every criminal case across the land routinely take into consideration. There are inconvenient facts in this case, such as the fact that both Turner and the victim herself had blood alcohol levels that were way beyond the legal limit to operate a motor vehicle. Authorities estimate that the victim’s were approaching .20, which is seriously drunk. I want to be clear: in no way does that justify sexual assault, which I believe Turner committed. But what I would say is that it’s a mitigating factor. That’s not just my opinion but apparently the opinion of the parole board and the judge. I get that there’s outrage, but parole boards and judges have probably seen hundreds, if not thousands, of sexual assault cases of all types, to varying degrees. In my view, the parole board made a mistake. They made a recommendation for sentencing that was too lenient. The judge’s error was in adopting the parole board’s lenient recommendation. I may be wrong, but I think what Bricker is trying to get across to you is that there are unintended consequences when you encourage judges to ignore the recommendations of parole boards. And there are unintended consequences when you encourage judges to think more about being too soft on crime when what they should be doing is making impartial decisions based on established legal doctrine and guidelines. ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2018, 12:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-privileged-white-kid-gets-6-months-for-rape-father-describes-it-as-20-minutes-of-action/756733/830 "2018-06-11T00:11:58Z")
We all know about unintended consequences: for instance, getting recalled is an unintended consequence of the judge following the PB rec. ---
**Author:** ![asahi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asahi/32/8693_2.png) [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2018, 12:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-privileged-white-kid-gets-6-months-for-rape-father-describes-it-as-20-minutes-of-action/756733/831 "2018-06-11T00:24:43Z")
> [@Snowboarder\_Bo](#): > > We all know about unintended consequences: for instance, getting recalled is an unintended consequence of the judge following the PB rec. It is indeed, but show me the evidence that the judge acted illegally or even unethically. I get that he #metoo’s a thing and people want to cut Brock Turner’s dick off - hell I do, too, if I’m being honest. But firing a judge who followed the guidelines of a parole board and who has otherwise adjudicated without controversy for more than a decade might have repercussions that aren’t obvious now. This is nothing more than mob rule, and the rule of the mob is always, always, always more dangerous than the occasional example of misrule by a local judge. Even without elections, judges can be impeached for misconduct. Conversely, there is no impeaching a mob. ---
**Author:** ![Chimera](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/8e8cbc/32.png) [@Chimera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chimera)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2018, 12:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-privileged-white-kid-gets-6-months-for-rape-father-describes-it-as-20-minutes-of-action/756733/832 "2018-06-11T00:29:22Z")
You’re ignoring the judge’s subsequent doubling down, which said nothing about the parole board or recommended sentencing, and his doubling down on that with his petulant attitude toward the recall. If he HAD apologized or indicated some remorse for the sentence, he probably would not have been recalled. ---
**Author:** ![Chessic\_Sense](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/7c8e57/32.png) [@Chessic\_Sense](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chessic_Sense)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2018, 12:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-privileged-white-kid-gets-6-months-for-rape-father-describes-it-as-20-minutes-of-action/756733/833 "2018-06-11T00:43:09Z")
> [@Northern\_Piper](#): > > The public did have another outlet: put pressure on the legislature to clarify the appropriate sentence and also to add a full right of appeal for prosecutors. > > Removing one judge _pour encourager les autres_ is not a systemic fix for the problem. Far better to have a built-in remedy that doesn’t require mobilising public action as in this case, but rather leave it to the regular professional judgment of the prosecutors, who could appeal a too-lenient sentence without needing massive public action. The public doesn’t need another outlet because they already have one…a recall vote. Every judge _should_ have, in the back of their mind, the fact that they can be removed if they fail to serve the public interest. That’s not a chilling effect. You’re glossing over the _other_ outlet the public has: voting “no” to the recall. The public didn’t have to vote to fire the judge. They _chose_ that, intentionally and most likely with great public debate, consideration, and reflection. You don’t dislike that there’s a recall power. You dislike that a judge got recalled, when you don’t think he deserved it. Problem is, 60% of people disagree with your decision. The only message this sends _les autres_ is that when making judgments, they’d better consider what 51% of the people want. ---
**Author:** ![asahi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asahi/32/8693_2.png) [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2018, 3:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-privileged-white-kid-gets-6-months-for-rape-father-describes-it-as-20-minutes-of-action/756733/834 "2018-06-11T03:07:23Z")
> [@Chimera](#): > > You’re ignoring the judge’s subsequent doubling down, which said nothing about the parole board or recommended sentencing, and his doubling down on that with his petulant attitude toward the recall. > > If he HAD apologized or indicated some remorse for the sentence, he probably would not have been recalled. Your opinion assumes that he should feel _remorse_, as though the judge perpetrated a crime or behaved unethically. I know he rendered a judgment that many people did not like, but show me where he acted unethically and illegally. Again, “doubling down”…for fucks sake, he wasn’t trying to goad anyone; he was saying that if he had been presented with the same sets of facts, with the same recommendations from the parole board, it’s probable that, as a legal expert, he would have rendered the same decision. But #metoo. ---
**Author:** ![asahi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asahi/32/8693_2.png) [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2018, 3:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-privileged-white-kid-gets-6-months-for-rape-father-describes-it-as-20-minutes-of-action/756733/835 "2018-06-11T03:12:23Z")
> [@Chessic\_Sense](#): > > The public doesn’t need another outlet because they already have one…a recall vote. Every judge _should_ have, in the back of their mind, the fact that they can be removed if they fail to serve the public interest. That’s not a chilling effect. > > You’re glossing over the _other_ outlet the public has: voting “no” to the recall. The public didn’t have to vote to fire the judge. They _chose_ that, intentionally and most likely with great public debate, consideration, and reflection. You don’t dislike that there’s a recall power. You dislike that a judge got recalled, when you don’t think he deserved it. Problem is, 60% of people disagree with your decision. > > The only message this sends _les autres_ is that when making judgments, they’d better consider what 51% of the people want. Here’s the reality. In recall votes, people who are motivated to get off their ass and vote, are the ones who decide. And while we’re at it, here’s a tip: maybe the average voter in a country that elected Donald Trump for president isn’t really qualified to determine who’s a qualified jurist and who isn’t. Maybe electing judges, particularly in our anti-intellectual society, is just a bad idea. Having a recall is mob rule and mob justice, which is an even worse idea. Sorry bro, but mob rule is going to backfire and for all the shit kicking on this thread about the disparities between rich white defendants and poor brown ones, I can pretty much god damn guarantee you that more poor brown defendants, along with perhaps a few more rich white ones, are going to be drowned by the criminal justice system by judges who are too afraid to adjudicate based on established norms or jurisprudence and defer instead to their fears of how they’re going to be portrayed on Facebook. ---
**Author:** ![Projammer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/projammer/32/559_2.png) [@Projammer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Projammer)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2018, 5:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-privileged-white-kid-gets-6-months-for-rape-father-describes-it-as-20-minutes-of-action/756733/836 "2018-06-11T05:44:52Z")
> [@asahi](#): > > It is indeed, but show me the evidence that the judge acted illegally or even unethically. No one here has claimed his actions were illegal or unethical. If that had been the case, there were other remedies available. The judicial review board found, correctly, that his actions weren’t within the scope that they could act on. He demonstrated poor judgement, that while completely legal, substantially undermined the confidence of the people who elected him in the first place. He further compounded his problem by being completely unapologetic when called out on it. You can admire him for standing by his decision and not saying what the people wanted to hear to restore their confidence, but the captain that goes down with his ship is still fish food. Bottom line, there is a remedy for judges acting illegally or unethically and another option for judges who have lost the confidence of their electorate. This was completely and correctly the latter. Are judges going to start handing out harsh sentences for fear of being recalled? I’d bet good money against it. Are judges going to consider whether they can reasonably defend a lenient sentence? That’s my ideal outcome on this. ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2018, 6:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-privileged-white-kid-gets-6-months-for-rape-father-describes-it-as-20-minutes-of-action/756733/837 "2018-06-11T06:06:09Z")
> [@Chessic\_Sense](#): > > The only message this sends _les autres_ is that when making judgments, they’d better consider what 51% of the people want. And, as I said above, that is what the law ultimately is. It’s not some institution that is somehow above democracy. The law is just the codified will of the people. The law also had a procedure built in that allowed for a recall. So the will of the people in this IS THE LAW. That’s why I say this is a false dilemma. Allegiance to the law (in this case, at least\*) _is_ allegiance to the will of the people. This recall shows that judges are not above the law–both the newly passed law and the law that allows for recalls. \*Court cases make this more complicated, since the law needs to be interpreted. And anti-democratic tactics can make it where the law does not agree with what the people want. But, in this case, it aligns. ---
**Author:** ![Banquet\_Bear](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/banquet_bear/32/373_2.png) [@Banquet\_Bear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Banquet_Bear)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2018, 6:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-privileged-white-kid-gets-6-months-for-rape-father-describes-it-as-20-minutes-of-action/756733/838 "2018-06-11T06:13:21Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > My argument (or, more accurately, the argument of the writers whose works I have linked above) is that it will have a disproportionately chilling effect on poor and minority population. It’s unclear to me why you’d emphasize the chilling effect you hope it will have on affluenziatic Stanford boys, except that this is the effect you desire and you don’t wish to confront the potential effect you don’t desire – or don’t wish to acknowledge you desire, or to which you are indifferent. …if you don’t trust the people to be able to make decisions like this: then the only remedy is to remove the option to recall. Is that the outcome you are hoping for? ---
**Author:** ![Tim\_T-Bonham.net](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/46a35a/32.png) [@Tim\_T-Bonham.net](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tim_T-Bonham.net)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2018, 6:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-privileged-white-kid-gets-6-months-for-rape-father-describes-it-as-20-minutes-of-action/756733/839 "2018-06-11T06:22:52Z")
> [@asahi](#): > > The judge’s error was in adopting the parole board’s lenient recommendation. > [@Snowboarder\_Bo](#): > > … consequence of the judge following the PB rec. > [@asahi](#): > > But firing a judge who followed the guidelines of a parole board … People seem to be forgetting that the Judge had two recommendations available to him: the probation department (not parole) and the prosecutor. (Additionally, he could have chosen to sentence anywhere in between them.) He chose to go with the very lenient one, to the outrage of the public, and paid the price for that. Had he just ‘split the difference’ and given a 3-year sentence, most of us never would have heard of this case. ---
**Author:** ![Steve\_MB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steve_mb/32/5339_2.png) [@Steve\_MB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Steve_MB)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2018, 12:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-privileged-white-kid-gets-6-months-for-rape-father-describes-it-as-20-minutes-of-action/756733/840 "2018-06-11T12:42:35Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > My argument (or, more accurately, the argument of the writers whose works I have linked above) is that it will have a disproportionately chilling effect on poor and minority population. It’s unclear to me why you’d emphasize the chilling effect you hope it will have on affluenziatic Stanford boys, except that this is the effect you desire and you don’t wish to confront the potential effect you don’t desire – or don’t wish to acknowledge you desire, or to which you are indifferent. After I figure out a solution to the more prevalent problem of space aliens using too many airport landing and takeoff windows, I’ll devote some thought to the matter of excessive judicial leniency toward poor and minority population. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-privileged-white-kid-gets-6-months-for-rape-father-describes-it-as-20-minutes-of-action/756733.md?page=41) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stupid-privileged-white-kid-gets-6-months-for-rape-father-describes-it-as-20-minutes-of-action/756733.md?page=43)