# Subliminal messages **URL:** \ **Category:** Cecil's Columns/Staff Reports\ **Created:** [November 8, 2001, 10:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/subliminal-messages/92292 "2001-11-08T22:11:49Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 5\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![rowrrbazzle](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rowrrbazzle/32/414_2.png) [@rowrrbazzle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rowrrbazzle)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2001, 10:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/subliminal-messages/92292/1 "2001-11-08T22:11:49Z")
Cecil has done a few articles on subliminal messages, such as [Do subliminal tapes played while you sleep really work?](http://www.straightdope.com/classics/a2_324.html) and [Are subliminal messages secretly embedded in advertisements?](http://www.straightdope.com/classics/a2_344.html) This article says that some learning can take place subliminally. However, the effect is small and non-specific, unlike previous claims. (The article is in the NY Times archive and is no longer free.) **The Education of the Subconscious** Column Name: \*\* Vital Signs: Perceptions\*\* _New York Times_; New York, N.Y.; Oct 30, 2001; Eric Nagourney > [@](#): > > The findings were presented in last week’s issue of Nature…[Random dots were shown on a screen during another test.] The dots appeared to be swimming about aimlessly. But, in fact, 5 percent were choreographed to move in the same direction. That percentage was too small to be perceived by the conscious mind, the researchers said. But the pattern seemed to have an effect. After a month of exposure, when the volunteers were shown dot patterns where 10 percent of the dots moved in the same direction as the 5 percent earlier had, they were better at discerning the pattern than they had been before the subconscious training. ---
**Author:** ![royjwood](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ce73a5/32.png) [@royjwood](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/royjwood)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2001, 3:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/subliminal-messages/92292/2 "2001-11-09T03:17:45Z")
I am also very interested in learning more about the subliminal tapes. I have seen several advertisements for a light and tape therapy that alleges to take the victim into a Theta wave brain wave pattern. The advertisement further alleges that while in the Theta wave pattern, the victim’s brain is most susceptible to infusion of new thoughts. That is when the tape apparently kicks in with “mommy and I are one…destroy mommy” mind altering messages. I would seem rather apparent to me, that if this were the case, why had our government not acted on this program to teach it’s operative’s all kind of great stuff, similar to the what they did to Keanu Reeves in, “The Matrix”. ---
**Author:** ![vanilla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/f19dbf/32.png) [@vanilla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/vanilla)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2001, 3:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/subliminal-messages/92292/3 "2001-11-09T15:26:07Z")
Wilson Bryan Key had many books on this subject. ---
**Author:** ![Irishman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/b487fb/32.png) [@Irishman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Irishman)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2001, 10:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/subliminal-messages/92292/4 "2001-11-12T22:48:36Z")
Vanilla, did you have a point? If you read the linked articles in the OP, you will see that Cecil discussed Key at length. In this article, though, the followups left me with a question. [http://www.straightdope.com/classics/a2\_344.html](http://www.straightdope.com/classics/a2_344.html) B. Faxon from Los Angeles said: > [@](#): > > It appears from your column that you relied completely on secondhand data from a notoriously unreliable source–a psychologist. Of course a psychologist is going to try to smear Key. Psychs are among those who try to figure out the unconscious motivations of alcoholics and smokers > so that ad agencies can sell them harmful products. They did most of the research from which subliminal ad techniques were developed. I’m surprised Cecil didn’t take him to task for a blanket character assault and several logical fallacies (psychologists trying to understand how the brain works hardly means they are trying to find ways to manipulate people; participation of a few psychologists in advertising techniques does not make all psychologists guilty; ad hominem attack that psychologists are unreliable by definition; assertion that all psychologists would automatically “smear” Key). I assume it was a limitation of space and not an oversight of such blatant ignorance. ---
**Author:** ![whitetho](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/whitetho/32/1059_2.png) [@whitetho](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/whitetho)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2001, 11:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/subliminal-messages/92292/5 "2001-11-12T23:02:56Z")
Just trying a little subliminal test here: XsXaXnXtXaXcXlXaXuXsXiXsXoXuXrXfXrXiXeXnXd!X