# Subpoenaed but can't enter US? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [September 10, 2016, 5:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/subpoenaed-but-cant-enter-us/765545 "2016-09-10T17:40:43Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Canadjun](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/76d3ee/32.png) [@Canadjun](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Canadjun)\ **Post date:** [September 10, 2016, 5:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/subpoenaed-but-cant-enter-us/765545/1 "2016-09-10T17:40:43Z")
This is a purely hypothetical question stimulated by the Border Security programs I love watching. I am a Canadian citizen living in Canada. Let’s suppose I have been naughty (maybe a history of marajuana use or something else you guys don’t like) and have been prohibited from crossing the Canada/US border. However you guys have subpoenaed me to appear in the US for some reason. What happens then? Does a subpoena over-rule the prohibition against crossing the border? ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [September 10, 2016, 7:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/subpoenaed-but-cant-enter-us/765545/2 "2016-09-10T19:25:45Z")
Probably not, but the answer will vary depending on details you didn’t specify. Denying someone entry to the country is something that the federal government, and only the federal government, can do. Most subpoenas, though, would be issued by a state. And while the federal government in theory can only act in a very limited arena (in practice, of course, it can exert power in all sorts of other ways), in that arena where the federal government can act, it’s explicitly superior to anything the states can do. Of course, it’s also possible that you got subpoenaed by the feds themselves. In that case, I dunno. ---
**Author:** ![slash2k](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/439d5e/32.png) [@slash2k](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/slash2k)\ **Post date:** [September 10, 2016, 7:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/subpoenaed-but-cant-enter-us/765545/3 "2016-09-10T19:56:52Z")
A subpoena is usually valid only in the state it was issued in; getting a Michigan subpoena enforced in Indiana usually requires going to an Indiana court, for example. A U.S. subpoena, in and of itself, isn’t worth the paper it’s written on in Canada. If a party to a U.S. court action wants you to testify, the usual process would be for the U.S. court to issue a polite request (“letters rogatory”), which will then be filed in your local court in Canada in an application for an order compelling you to testify. Most likely, you would then have to sit for a deposition in your part of Canada, and the written record would then be taken back to the U.S. court. This applies whether or not you are able to travel to the U.S., because the American court simply doesn’t have the jurisdiction to enforce its subpoena over Canadians. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [September 10, 2016, 8:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/subpoenaed-but-cant-enter-us/765545/4 "2016-09-10T20:26:30Z")
> [@](#): > > This applies whether or not you are able to travel to the U.S., because the American court simply doesn’t have the jurisdiction to enforce its subpoena over Canadians. Indeed; I was assuming that the Canadian in question was willing to voluntarily cooperate with the US courts, but was (potentially) being prevented from doing so by the prohibition to enter the country. Though of course that wouldn’t prevent testifying via mail or video chat or any other communication medium, and the Canadian courts would likely cooperate with any such effort. ---
**Author:** ![Canadjun](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/76d3ee/32.png) [@Canadjun](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Canadjun)\ **Post date:** [September 10, 2016, 9:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/subpoenaed-but-cant-enter-us/765545/5 "2016-09-10T21:11:06Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > Indeed; I was assuming that the Canadian in question was willing to voluntarily cooperate with the US courts, but was (potentially) being prevented from doing so by the prohibition to enter the country. Though of course that wouldn’t prevent testifying via mail or video chat or any other communication medium, and the Canadian courts would likely cooperate with any such effort. Yes, I forgot to mention that in my hypothetical scenario I was willing to obey but the prohibition on crossing the border prevented it. Thanks! ---
**Author:** ![Declan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ecae2f/32.png) [@Declan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Declan)\ **Post date:** [September 11, 2016, 12:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/subpoenaed-but-cant-enter-us/765545/6 "2016-09-11T00:41:16Z")
> [@Canadjun](#): > > This is a purely hypothetical question stimulated by the Border Security programs I love watching. > > I am a Canadian citizen living in Canada. Let’s suppose I have been naughty (maybe a history of marajuana use or something else you guys don’t like) and have been prohibited from crossing the Canada/US border. However you guys have subpoenaed me to appear in the US for some reason. What happens then? Does a subpoena over-rule the prohibition against crossing the border? Cut the individual states out of the argument and you have been ordered to testify before congress, something you were witness or party to. I can’t see why they can’t depose you in Toronto (airport or consulate) , or one of the border crossing areas. Otherwise, it more sounds like they should be issuing an arrest warrant, and extradition request, even if you are voluntarily “surrendering”. ---
**Author:** ![alphaboi867](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alphaboi867/32/3898_2.png) [@alphaboi867](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alphaboi867)\ **Post date:** [September 11, 2016, 4:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/subpoenaed-but-cant-enter-us/765545/7 "2016-09-11T04:11:16Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > …Of course, it’s also possible that you got subpoenaed by the feds themselves. In that case, I dunno. Presumably in that case the State Department would simply issue you a visa allowing you enter the US for the purpose of court proceedings in spite your prior convictions. ---
**Author:** ![Spiderman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spiderman/32/230_2.png) [@Spiderman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spiderman)\ **Post date:** [September 11, 2016, 3:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/subpoenaed-but-cant-enter-us/765545/8 "2016-09-11T15:36:16Z")
Unless your entry-barring conviction is very recent, how did you manage to get into the US to cause them to want to subpoena you in the first place? ---
**Author:** ![UDS](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ecae2f/32.png) [@UDS](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UDS)\ **Post date:** [September 12, 2016, 1:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/subpoenaed-but-cant-enter-us/765545/9 "2016-09-12T01:51:24Z")
You don’t have to have ever been in the US in order to be in a position to give evidence that might be relevant to legal proceedings in a US court. ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [September 12, 2016, 11:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/subpoenaed-but-cant-enter-us/765545/10 "2016-09-12T11:10:20Z")
Right - two examples that come to mind is that someone in Canada may have knowledge that is relevant to a cross-border marijuana operation, or a cross-border financial trade of some sort. ---
**Author:** ![md2000](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/73ab20/32.png) [@md2000](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/md2000)\ **Post date:** [September 12, 2016, 12:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/subpoenaed-but-cant-enter-us/765545/11 "2016-09-12T12:42:23Z")
IANAL - questions: On what basis would the Canadian court force someone to testify? It’s not a Canadian case, and it seems to me that short of an extradition case or refiling in Canada, there’s nothing happening legally in Canada for the courts to act on? Can you extradite someone as a witness not a defendant? I don’t see how. So what happens in cases between states. If Joe is in, say, Florida and someone in, say, New York wants him to testify, does that mean he will be wanted in NY if he fails to obey the subpoena? Or is it a matter of he wasn’t served in NY so the paper has no value? Does the Florida court have to (or does it routinely?) issue a local subpoena in response? Who pays for his travel? Or does the Florida papers only mean he must make himself available in Florida for a deposition? Does a deposition substitute for court testimony? I thought the accused had a right to “confront” his accusers? ---
**Author:** ![Tom\_Tildrum](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/e95f7d/32.png) [@Tom\_Tildrum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tom_Tildrum)\ **Post date:** [September 12, 2016, 3:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/subpoenaed-but-cant-enter-us/765545/12 "2016-09-12T15:17:28Z")
A US subpoena has no effect outside the US. In order to get documents or deposition testimony from a witness in a foreign country, the US litigant would have to issue something called “letters rogatory,” basically asking the foreign court for assistance. Typically, I think this amounts to a request that the foreign court issue its equivalent of a subpoena, directing the witness to produce some documents to the other litigant or submit to a deposition – at the foreign court or some other address within the foreign country, however, not in the US. Foreign courts will generally be of assistance, but they will usually only order a subpoena response that is consistent with local discovery rules. US civil discovery is wildly more intrusive than just about anyone else’s, so the letter rogatory may only get you a more limited response than you would get from serving a conventional subpoena on a US witness. Unless there is a basis for extradition, I do not know of a way to compel a witness in a foreign country to come to the United States. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [September 12, 2016, 3:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/subpoenaed-but-cant-enter-us/765545/13 "2016-09-12T15:37:02Z")
> [@md2000](#): > > On what basis would the Canadian court force someone to testify? It’s not a Canadian case, and it seems to me that short of an extradition case or refiling in Canada, there’s nothing happening legally in Canada for the courts to act on? You have the subpoena domesticated in Canada, and that creates a cause of action - the need for discovery - that a Canadian court can act on. But we don’t generally do that in international matters; as others have noted, the process uses letters rogatory. Domesticating a subpoena is how it typically works in interstate matters. ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [September 13, 2016, 2:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/subpoenaed-but-cant-enter-us/765545/14 "2016-09-13T02:18:58Z")
What does “domesticate a subpoena” mean? I’m not familiar with the concept. ---
**Author:** ![md2000](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/73ab20/32.png) [@md2000](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/md2000)\ **Post date:** [September 13, 2016, 3:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/subpoenaed-but-cant-enter-us/765545/15 "2016-09-13T03:35:03Z")
Why would a Canadian court have any grounds to compel me to do anything regarding a foreign case? What’s the principle? ---
**Author:** ![UDS](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ecae2f/32.png) [@UDS](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UDS)\ **Post date:** [September 13, 2016, 3:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/subpoenaed-but-cant-enter-us/765545/16 "2016-09-13T03:40:46Z")
The principle of reciprocity - the courts of State A will do things like take evidence on behalf of the courts in State B, in the expectation that when the occasion arises the courts in State B will do the same for them. ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [September 13, 2016, 11:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/subpoenaed-but-cant-enter-us/765545/17 "2016-09-13T11:46:45Z")
Each province has passed legislation giving the provincial superior trial court the authority to require a person to submit to examination upon a properly framed request from a foreign court. For example, see s. 60 of the Ontario Evidence Act: > **[e-Laws](https://www.ontario.ca/laws/statute/90e23#BK67)** > > Our staff can't provide legal advice, interpret the law or conduct research. You may be able to obtain assistance from a lawyer or paralegal. Note that this only applies to civil matters, not criminal. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [September 13, 2016, 1:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/subpoenaed-but-cant-enter-us/765545/18 "2016-09-13T13:47:47Z")
> [@Northern\_Piper](#): > > What does “domesticate a subpoena” mean? I’m not familiar with the concept. You issue a subpoena to the out-of-state person/entity, then apply in the courts of the foreign state for an order basically giving the subpoena effect in its jurisdiction. It’s a pain in the arse. ---
**Author:** ![TokyoBayer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tokyobayer/32/13989_2.png) [@TokyoBayer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TokyoBayer)\ **Post date:** [September 13, 2016, 2:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/subpoenaed-but-cant-enter-us/765545/19 "2016-09-13T14:07:32Z")
I was involved with a lawsuit between the Japanese company where I worked at the time and a US company. It was going to be a royal pain to even arrange for depositions from our friendly witnesses. We were going to have to have them in the US Embassy, IIRC. Fortunately, we settled before that happened. ---
**Author:** ![md2000](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/73ab20/32.png) [@md2000](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/md2000)\ **Post date:** [September 13, 2016, 2:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/subpoenaed-but-cant-enter-us/765545/20 "2016-09-13T14:21:24Z")
> [@Northern\_Piper](#): > > Each province has passed legislation giving the provincial superior trial court the authority to require a person to submit to examination upon a properly framed request from a foreign court. > > For example, see s. 60 of the Ontario Evidence Act: > > [Law Document English View | Ontario.ca](https://www.ontario.ca/laws/statute/90e23#BK67) > > Note that this only applies to civil matters, not criminal. Thank you. This explains it, answers my question exactly what I was asking. I assume there is pretty much the same sort of law in most North American jurisdictions, then… [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/subpoenaed-but-cant-enter-us/765545.md?page=2)