# Succession on HBO **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Tags:** tv-shows-scripted, hbomax-wb-dc\ **Created:** [June 4, 2018, 7:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/succession-on-hbo/815428 "2018-06-04T19:34:59Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 31
**Author:** ![madmonk28](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/madmonk28/32/20811_2.png) [@madmonk28](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/madmonk28)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2023, 8:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/succession-on-hbo/815428/601 "2023-06-01T20:10:19Z")
> [@MaxTheVool](#): > > It’s typical of many shows, but not the very very best, and what (imho) keeps Succession a rung below (say) _The Wire_ or _Breaking Bad_. The Wire left storylines unexplored. Simon admitted that they created frameworks they never explored. It contributes to the sense of a believable world. Did we lay other groundwork? We did. We could have cannibalized Rawls’ moment in the gay bar and advanced that moment, but I’m not sure we would have created any more theme, and on some level it was very satisfying just to grant the notion of a closeted gay man’s sexuality a moment on screen and then move on. There was something very compelling and real about just acknowledging that but not making it into grist for a storyline that didn’t add anything to our portrayal of Rawls. We were always laying pipe that could be picked up later. It doesn’t mean that you should pick it up. > **[The Wire: David Simon Q & A](https://www.nj.com/alltv/2008/03/the_wire_david_simon_q_a.html)** > > This interview with "The Wire" creator David Simon was conducted over two different days shortly before the 9th episode of the final season aired. (But after I had already seen the series finale.) We discuss several characters' final fates in... ---
**Author:** ![Happy\_Lendervedder](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/happy_lendervedder/32/8488_2.png) [@Happy\_Lendervedder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Happy_Lendervedder)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2023, 10:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/succession-on-hbo/815428/602 "2023-06-01T22:20:28Z")
Even the top-tier Sopranos had plenty of loose end stories: The Russian in the woods Melfi’s attack The bugged lamp in Tony’s basement Meadow’s college roommate None of those bothered me, it just made for interesting TV, and good debate and discussion. Sometimes you just don’t need to know every outcome in the story being told. ---
**Author:** ![MaxTheVool](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/9fc29f/32.png) [@MaxTheVool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MaxTheVool)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2023, 10:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/succession-on-hbo/815428/603 "2023-06-01T22:31:38Z")
Obviously at some point we just disagree. That said, I’m not saying that no loose ends can be left, or that every storyline must be tied up in a neat bow. But I feel like the episode-to-episode business-level storylines in Succession almost NEVER had any lasting impact or effect, particularly in the first 3 seasons. Have I gone through all of The Wire and Succession and Breaking Bad and categorized everything that ever happened and made a big graph of all storylines sorted by size and later-relevance and cross referenced and yada yada yada? Of course not. So I can’t mathematically prove that my assertion is correct, and of course even if it is correct, it’s perfectly reasonable for you not to be bothered by it. But starting right at the beginning of S1, the first big looming arc seems to be that Marcia is trying to become A Player and get extra votes in the family trust (or something). And then… she is basically almost entirely written out of the show, and the family trust (or whatever it is) is basically never mentioned again. That kind of thing happens over and over… or at least, it felt to me like it did. ---
**Author:** ![jsc1953](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/5daacb/32.png) [@jsc1953](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jsc1953)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2023, 12:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/succession-on-hbo/815428/604 "2023-06-02T00:17:35Z")
> [@madmonk28](#): > > she uses the time to pitch him some grubby deal her husband has cooked up For all we know, the pitch idea was more brilliant than any idea the siblings have ever had. ---
**Author:** ![madmonk28](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/madmonk28/32/20811_2.png) [@madmonk28](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/madmonk28)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2023, 12:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/succession-on-hbo/815428/605 "2023-06-02T00:50:14Z")
It’s like an old folks home meets Studio 54 meets Seaworld! ---
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2023, 1:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/succession-on-hbo/815428/606 "2023-06-02T01:26:55Z")
Significant cost savings are achieved by feeding Shamu the weekly dead! ---
**Author:** ![Snarky\_Kong](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a183cd/32.png) [@Snarky\_Kong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snarky_Kong)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2023, 1:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/succession-on-hbo/815428/607 "2023-06-02T01:45:46Z")
It’s publicly traded, but the Roys have at least a plurality of shares and board seats. So, installing one of the kids would be possible. ---
**Author:** ![MaxTheVool](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/9fc29f/32.png) [@MaxTheVool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MaxTheVool)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2023, 1:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/succession-on-hbo/815428/608 "2023-06-02T01:55:10Z")
If that were the case, why did they have to get signoff from “the grownups” (Gerri, Frank, Karl, etc.) when Ken/Roman became co-CEOs? It’s pretty clear in season 4 that the kids do not have enough shares/seats to control the company themselves. I know basically nothing about corporate governance… but I’m incredibly skeptical that any real-life person along the Gerri/Frank/Karl mode would ever vote for Roman to be CEO, given that he was basically a playboy until two years ago, and since then he blew up a rocket, sent Geri dick pics, and was basically a profane and feckless little shit. ---
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2023, 1:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/succession-on-hbo/815428/609 "2023-06-02T01:55:53Z")
The Board members would be voting for an unqualified candidate without even the pressure of the candidate’s father to bear. They would no more do such a thing than they would install me. ETA: Response to Snarky Kong ---
**Author:** ![MaxTheVool](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/9fc29f/32.png) [@MaxTheVool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MaxTheVool)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2023, 1:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/succession-on-hbo/815428/610 "2023-06-02T01:58:07Z")
> [@MaxTheVool](#): > > Obviously at some point we just disagree. That said, I’m not saying that no loose ends can be left, or that every storyline must be tied up in a neat bow. Taking a step back for a second… I think part of the issue is that (as the AV club argues) the show really isn’t a business drama with comedic elements. It’s a dark comedy about terrible people against a business-drama background. But the business drama is always secondary or tertiary to the comedic personal elements. So maybe, in a sense, the fact that I want more concrete and satisfying plot resolutions just means that I don’t, in some sense, “get it”. But even comedies can have satisfying and consistent plots. ---
**Author:** ![madmonk28](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/madmonk28/32/20811_2.png) [@madmonk28](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/madmonk28)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2023, 2:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/succession-on-hbo/815428/611 "2023-06-02T02:13:16Z")
> [@MaxTheVool](#): > > If that were the case, why did they have to get signoff from “the grownups” (Gerri, Frank, Karl, etc.) when Ken/Roman became co-CEOs? It’s pretty clear in season 4 that the kids do not have enough shares/seats to control the company themselves. They controlled a very large block, but not a majority. The grownups backed them as CEOs for continuity so the share price wouldn’t crash and they could close the deal. This was explicitly stated in the show. ---
**Author:** ![Snarky\_Kong](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a183cd/32.png) [@Snarky\_Kong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snarky_Kong)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2023, 2:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/succession-on-hbo/815428/612 "2023-06-02T02:19:52Z")
And they didn’t. “They have to convince 2 people to get them over half the votes” and “this is fucking insane!” are not that close. ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2023, 2:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/succession-on-hbo/815428/613 "2023-06-02T14:28:11Z")
> [@MaxTheVool](#): > > …he was basically a playboy until two years ago, and since then he blew up a rocket, sent Geri dick pics, and was basically a profane and feckless little shit. I wouldn’t be surprised to see Roman get business cards with that printed on 'em. ---
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2023, 2:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/succession-on-hbo/815428/614 "2023-06-02T14:42:32Z")
“Feckless little shit, bitch” ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2023, 3:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/succession-on-hbo/815428/615 "2023-06-02T15:33:06Z")
> [@filmore](#): > > After they yelled cut, Jeremy Strong had the urge to jump over the railing, so he starting running for it. The actor who played his bodyguard ran after him and stopped him. It was totally unplanned and they got it all on film, but decided not to use it… More on that: [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1W4yitwfKvo](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1W4yitwfKvo) ---
**Author:** ![carrps](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carrps/32/2957_2.png) [@carrps](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carrps)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2023, 4:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/succession-on-hbo/815428/616 "2023-06-02T16:43:15Z")
I forgot to mention that the day before this finale aired, we watched _Monsieur Hulot’s Holiday_ again. He’s in a small seaside resort hotel which has a restaurant with a swinging door. There was a whole bit with that door opening and closing while making a distinctive almost chiming sound. In one of the _Succession_ scenes at the HQ before the vote, someone went out of one of those glass office doors, and _it made the exact same sound as in the Tati movie._ We both looked at each other and LOLed. Our _only_ laugh in this episode. ---
**Author:** ![SuperNelson](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/7feea3/32.png) [@SuperNelson](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SuperNelson)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2023, 5:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/succession-on-hbo/815428/617 "2023-06-02T17:26:33Z")
> [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](#): > > The opening credits all season showed a cellphone with a StarGo logo. Matsson heads GoJo, doesn’t he? What’s StarGo? StarGo was Waystar’s streaming app. It appeared most prominently in the episode with Kendall’s birthday, where it was portrayed as buggy, slow, and difficult to use. Matsson hated it, and saw it as an example of everything wrong with old media. He and Roman symbolically trashed it by dropping one of their phones in the urinal, then dousing it together. ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2023, 6:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/succession-on-hbo/815428/618 "2023-06-02T18:22:06Z")
Ah, thanks. I forgot that. ---
**Author:** ![Banksiaman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/banksiaman/32/3334_2.png) [@Banksiaman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Banksiaman)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2023, 10:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/succession-on-hbo/815428/619 "2023-06-02T22:50:51Z")
I generally disagree with the ‘too many unresolved thread’ complaints. You intersect with little bits of many other big dramas all the time - that you even matter in these short encounters is a reflection of how much power the Roy empire wielded just by existing. Its showing power at work in a real-scale world, not a hermetically sealed one. And in complete contradiction to that, what I would desperately like to know is the entire, intimate backstory that was only hinted at in Connor Roy’s concession speech: > “I’d like to say to my first running mate, who I will not dignify with a name-check, but had that woman not dropped out, and then had I not had to replace her with another figure, who turned out not to be able to bear the weight of public scrutiny, had I not been betrayed by those two jackrabbits, who knows? If someone wants to crowdsource a series called ‘Jackrabbits’, scripted by Jesse Armstrong, please PM me. ---
**Author:** ![MaxTheVool](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/9fc29f/32.png) [@MaxTheVool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MaxTheVool)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2023, 5:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/succession-on-hbo/815428/620 "2023-06-03T05:04:13Z")
> [@Banksiaman](#): > > I generally disagree with the ‘too many unresolved thread’ complaints. You intersect with little bits of many other big dramas all the time - that you even matter in these short encounters is a reflection of how much power the Roy empire wielded just by existing. Its showing power at work in a real-scale world, not a hermetically sealed one. I don’t understand this point at all. Sure, the things that are high-stakes for me in my life are very different than the things that are high-stakes for the Roys. But is there intended to be some super-subtle point that _nothing_ is high stakes for them? I mean, either how-many-board-seats-Stewie-and-Sandy-have matters, or it doesn’t matter. If it matters, it should matter. And if it doesn’t matter, it shouldn’t matter. But it mattering until it’s forgotten and never mentioned again is just weird and abrupt. Succession is actually an interesting comparison with a weirdly similar show, albeit not a first glance… _Bojack Horseman_. Both are about extraordinarily damaged rich people with parent issues (although the Roys are WAY richer), and are dark comedies with very memorable characters. But Bojack, despite being WAY more over on the comedy side of the spectrum than Succession, has ongoing season- and series-long storylines with stakes and that leave marks and that continue to matter. When Bojack really wants something, he tries to get it, and he either succeeds or fails, and that success or failure continues to exist and ripple through further storylines. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/succession-on-hbo/815428.md?page=30) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/succession-on-hbo/815428.md?page=32)