# Suicide by Text girl convicted. **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [June 17, 2017, 5:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/suicide-by-text-girl-convicted/789166 "2017-06-17T05:14:25Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Slash1972](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slash1972/32/6461_2.png) [@Slash1972](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slash1972)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2017, 4:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/suicide-by-text-girl-convicted/789166/41 "2017-08-07T16:45:04Z")
> [@Ravenman](#): > > Fraud laws are essentially the criminalization of words that are intended to manipulate people into giving the perpetrator money. I’ve never heard of anyone who suggests that fraud laws are unconstitutional restrictions on free speech. > > In this case, the judge found that the defendant manipulated someone into killing themselves. Now, setting aside the precise details of how the manslaughter statute is written, as a general principle, I would say that if it can be criminalized to talk someone out of their money, then I think it is reasonable to criminalize talking someone out of their life. > > I assume you disagree, but I am interested in your view of why fraud statutes haven’t laid down a principle on this general matter that have been long accepted. If I text you 1000 times “Send me $1000” and then finally you do it, have I committed fraud? ---
**Author:** ![Joey\_P](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/919ad9/32.png) [@Joey\_P](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Joey_P)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2017, 5:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/suicide-by-text-girl-convicted/789166/42 "2017-08-07T17:05:32Z")
> [@Slash1972](#): > > I have read up on the case. I think it’s a bunch of crap. I hope her appeal wins. You can’t bully somebody by texting them. I’m going to assume you’ve never been pushed around or you _were_ the bully in grade school/high school. If you think you can’t bully someone by texting them, you don’t understand what bullying means. Just on an objective level, part of the definition of (cyber) bullying includes text messages. ---
**Author:** ![Joey\_P](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/919ad9/32.png) [@Joey\_P](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Joey_P)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2017, 5:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/suicide-by-text-girl-convicted/789166/43 "2017-08-07T17:13:43Z")
> [@Slash1972](#): > > If I text you 1000 times “Send me $1000” and then finally you do it, have I committed fraud? If your intent was to unfairly get the money from them, then yes, that is fraud, wire fraud since it’s by text. Seems to me it could also be theft and/or harassment. ---
**Author:** ![Slash1972](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slash1972/32/6461_2.png) [@Slash1972](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slash1972)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2017, 5:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/suicide-by-text-girl-convicted/789166/44 "2017-08-07T17:23:20Z")
> [@Joey\_P](#): > > If your intent was to unfairly get the money from them, then yes, that is fraud, wire fraud since it’s by text. > > Seems to me it could also be theft and/or harassment. And I say it’s not. Seems we are at an impasse. ---
**Author:** ![Slash1972](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slash1972/32/6461_2.png) [@Slash1972](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slash1972)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2017, 5:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/suicide-by-text-girl-convicted/789166/45 "2017-08-07T17:24:25Z")
> [@Joey\_P](#): > > I’m going to assume you’ve never been pushed around or you _were_ the bully in grade school/high school. If you think you can’t bully someone by texting them, you don’t understand what bullying means. Just on an objective level, part of the definition of (cyber) bullying includes text messages. Strange assumption to make. And no, you can’t bully someone by texting them. I’ll give you my number. Try to bully me via text. See how successful you are after the 1st text message. ---
**Author:** ![Joey\_P](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/919ad9/32.png) [@Joey\_P](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Joey_P)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2017, 5:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/suicide-by-text-girl-convicted/789166/46 "2017-08-07T17:41:14Z")
> [@Slash1972](#): > > And I say it’s not. Seems we are at an impasse. Just because you want to use a different definition doesn’t really mean anything. > [@Slash1972](#): > > Strange assumption to make. And no, you can’t bully someone by texting them. I’ll give you my number. Try to bully me via text. See how successful you are after the 1st text message. All this means is that you can’t be bullied via text, it means nothing else. It’s great that you’re stronger than lots of other people. But lots of other people aren’t as strong as you and by fighting this fight you’re giving the bullies another layer of protection that they don’t need and it makes it that much harder for the victims to get away from the tormenting. In nearly all of these suicide cases the victims would still be alive if the bullies just didn’t do anything. That’s the worst part. No one is asking them TO do something just to stop doing what they’re doing. No one is asking the bully to apologize, just don’t sent him a text messages calling him nasty names and telling him that no one likes him 10 times a day. No one is asking him to take the long way to class, just don’t dump your soda in his backpack as you go past him. While no where near as awful as some people, maybe it’s because I’ve been through some of this and watched my daughter go through a bit of it as well, but I just can’t understand why you’d defend this behavior. ---
**Author:** ![Slash1972](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slash1972/32/6461_2.png) [@Slash1972](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slash1972)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2017, 6:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/suicide-by-text-girl-convicted/789166/47 "2017-08-07T18:06:21Z")
> [@Joey\_P](#): > > In nearly all of these suicide cases the victims would still be alive if the bullies just didn’t do anything. That’s the worst part. No one is asking them TO do something just to stop doing what they’re doing The victims would still be alive if they just stopped reading text messages from a jerk. > [@](#): > > No one is asking the bully to apologize, just don’t sent him a text messages calling him nasty names and telling him that no one likes him 10 times a day. No one is asking him to take the long way to class, just don’t dump your soda in his backpack as you go past him. > > While no where near as awful as some people, maybe it’s because I’ve been through some of this and watched my daughter go through a bit of it as well, but I just can’t understand why you’d defend this behavior. How does someone know that a bully sent a text message 10 times a day? Why isn’t the number blocked after the first message? Nobody HAS to read a text message. You don’t see the difference between dumping a soda in someone’s backpack, and sending them a text that they can easily ignore? If not, then there is no point discussing this further. ---
**Author:** ![Joey\_P](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/919ad9/32.png) [@Joey\_P](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Joey_P)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2017, 6:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/suicide-by-text-girl-convicted/789166/48 "2017-08-07T18:27:15Z")
> [@Slash1972](#): > > The victims would still be alive if they just stopped reading text messages from a jerk. Often times these come from multiple sources. It’s groups of people sending them messages via text. People harassing them on facebook and in real life. It become unavoidable, but as you’ve stated, you don’t understand this. I get that. I do understand that many, even most people can simply just walk away from people that are being annoying or block cell phone numbers and facebook contacts. But this is a different mentality and until you understand that you’re not going to get it. Upthread I even mention something about ‘people who can’t or won’t defend themselves’. People get bullied because they won’t walk away, they get bullied because they continue to read the text messages. And bullies continue to bully because they know their victims will continue to be victims. Often times it takes an authority figure to break the cycle. Be it a parent, teacher, lawyer, police officer etc since the victim falls further down the rabbit hole and the bully runs with it. But you’re suggesting that we protect the bully and that it’s the victim’s fault. > [@](#): > > How does someone know that a bully sent a text message 10 times a day? Why isn’t the number blocked after the first message? Nobody HAS to read a text message. > > You don’t see the difference between dumping a soda in someone’s backpack, and sending them a text that they can easily ignore? If not, then there is no point discussing this further. Millions of kids get bullied but I used an example that you picked apart, therefore bullying isn’t a thing, does that about sum it up? ---
**Author:** ![Slash1972](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slash1972/32/6461_2.png) [@Slash1972](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slash1972)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2017, 6:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/suicide-by-text-girl-convicted/789166/49 "2017-08-07T18:43:28Z")
> [@Joey\_P](#): > > Millions of kids get bullied but I used an example that you picked apart, therefore bullying isn’t a thing, does that about sum it up? Of course bullying is a thing. Bullying by text message isn’t a thing. Bullying by Facebook isn’t a thing. Bullying by message board CAN’T be a thing, or else you can go to the Omnibus Trolls R Us Thread and look at all that bullying. ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2017, 7:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/suicide-by-text-girl-convicted/789166/50 "2017-08-07T19:15:54Z")
> [@Slash1972](#): > > If I text you 1000 times “Send me $1000” and then finally you do it, have I committed fraud? It isn’t good sport to answer questions with questions. Why don’t you lay out a response to my question instead of trying to play a silly debate game of turning the question around? ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2017, 7:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/suicide-by-text-girl-convicted/789166/51 "2017-08-07T19:39:10Z")
> [@Slash1972](#): > > Of course bullying is a thing. Bullying by text message isn’t a thing. Bullying by Facebook isn’t a thing. In your opinion, must bullying be physical? Because both of those things can absolutely of course be bullying to me. It astounds me that anyone could think otherwise, but, yet, here we are. ---
**Author:** ![Dorjan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dorjan/32/12440_2.png) [@Dorjan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dorjan)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2017, 7:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/suicide-by-text-girl-convicted/789166/52 "2017-08-07T19:43:36Z")
> [@Slash1972](#): > > Of course bullying is a thing. Bullying by text message isn’t a thing. Bullying by Facebook isn’t a thing. Bullying by message board CAN’T be a thing, or else you can go to the Omnibus Trolls R Us Thread and look at all that bullying. > **[Bullied teen kills herself in front of family | CNN](https://www.cnn.com/2016/12/01/health/teen-suicide-cyberbullying-trnd/index.html)** > > Brandy Vela killed herself this week, putting a gun to her chest while her family begged her not to. [http://www.worldofbuzz.com/cyber-bullied-taruc-student-commits-suicide-friends-urge-bullies-apologise-funeral/](http://www.worldofbuzz.com/cyber-bullied-taruc-student-commits-suicide-friends-urge-bullies-apologise-funeral/) > **[Student may have killed herself after she was cyber-bullied](https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4395902/Student-killed-cyber-bullied.html)** > > A student named Julia who attended Spring-Ford High School in Limerick, Pennsylvania died by suicide last week. Police are investigating if cyber-bullying pushed her to end her life. > **[Suicide of Megan Meier](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Suicide_of_Megan_Meier)** > > Megan Taylor Meier (November 6, 1992 – October 17, 2006) was an American teenager who died by suicide by hanging herself three weeks before her 14th birthday. A year later, Meier's parents prompted an investigation into the matter and her suicide was attributed to cyberbullying through the social networking website MySpace. Lori Drew, the mother of a classmate of Meier, was found guilty of cyberbullying in the 2009 case United States v. Drew. However, her conviction was overturned by the judge... Totally not a thing… ---
**Author:** ![Joey\_P](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/919ad9/32.png) [@Joey\_P](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Joey_P)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2017, 7:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/suicide-by-text-girl-convicted/789166/53 "2017-08-07T19:43:54Z")
> [@Slash1972](#): > > Of course bullying is a thing. Bullying by text message isn’t a thing. Bullying by Facebook isn’t a thing. Bullying by message board CAN’T be a thing, or else you can go to the Omnibus Trolls R Us Thread and look at all that bullying. But this is only in your own head. [Many states](https://cyberbullying.org/bullying-laws) either use existing laws to prosecute people that bully via the internet/text or they actual cyber-bullying laws in place. Just clicking around on there, I see that California (and I would assume others) define bullying to include electronic communications. In other words, you can say that it’s not a thing as many times as you want and you’ll still be wrong. Again, that’s all well and good that no one can bug you on the internet or with your phone, but not give other people a way out? Why does it bother you so much that people don’t want to be bullied? Why are you sticking up for assholes who torment people so much the only thing they can do to find relief is to kill themselves. ---
**Author:** ![Slash1972](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slash1972/32/6461_2.png) [@Slash1972](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slash1972)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2017, 7:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/suicide-by-text-girl-convicted/789166/54 "2017-08-07T19:44:42Z")
> [@pulykamell](#): > > In your opinion, must bullying be physical? Because both of those things can absolutely of course be bullying to me. It astounds me that anyone could think otherwise, but, yet, here we are. Yes, of course it does. Unless your definition of bullying is “Hurting someone’s feelings in a way that is easily blocked or ignored by that person” What do you consider bullying? ---
**Author:** ![Slash1972](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slash1972/32/6461_2.png) [@Slash1972](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slash1972)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2017, 7:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/suicide-by-text-girl-convicted/789166/55 "2017-08-07T19:48:14Z")
> [@Ravenman](#): > > It isn’t good sport to answer questions with questions. Why don’t you lay out a response to my question instead of trying to play a silly debate game of turning the question around? Sorry, but I see no questions in your post. ---
**Author:** ![Slash1972](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slash1972/32/6461_2.png) [@Slash1972](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slash1972)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2017, 7:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/suicide-by-text-girl-convicted/789166/56 "2017-08-07T19:52:44Z")
> [@Joey\_P](#): > > Why does it bother you so much that people don’t want to be bullied? People don’t want to be bullied? If that was the case, they would simply block text messages from a bully. Self-evident. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2017, 7:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/suicide-by-text-girl-convicted/789166/57 "2017-08-07T19:59:13Z")
> [@Slash1972](#): > > Yes, of course it does. Unless your definition of bullying is “Hurting someone’s feelings in a way that is easily blocked or ignored by that person” > > What do you consider bullying? Off the cuff, it would be mentally or physically harassing someone psychologically or physically weaker than you as intimidation or entertainment. (I’m sure we can iron it out to something more precise, but let’s use that as a starting point.) Physically abused folks often go back to their physical abusers, even though they can “easily” leave the situation. How is this any different? ---
**Author:** ![Slash1972](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slash1972/32/6461_2.png) [@Slash1972](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slash1972)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2017, 8:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/suicide-by-text-girl-convicted/789166/58 "2017-08-07T20:03:45Z")
> [@pulykamell](#): > > Off the cuff, it would be mentally or physically harassing someone psychologically or physically weaker than you as intimidation or entertainment. (I’m sure we can iron it out to something more precise, but let’s use that as a starting point.) Physically abused folks often go back to their physical abusers, even though they can “easily” leave the situation. How is this any different? Physically abused folks that go back to their physical abusers if they can easily leave the situation are morons. Hey, you’re right! I guess this isn’t any different. ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2017, 8:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/suicide-by-text-girl-convicted/789166/59 "2017-08-07T20:14:58Z")
> [@Slash1972](#): > > Sorry, but I see no questions in your post. Ok, I will ask dumb questions of you then. You asked if fraud could be committed with 1,000 texts. Can it be committed with a single communication? Is it not fraud if that communication is by SMS? ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2017, 8:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/suicide-by-text-girl-convicted/789166/60 "2017-08-07T20:48:18Z")
> [@Slash1972](#): > > Physically abused folks that go back to their physical abusers if they can easily leave the situation are morons. Hey, you’re right! I guess this isn’t any different. I assumed that was going to be your answer, so we truly are at an impasse. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/suicide-by-text-girl-convicted/789166.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/suicide-by-text-girl-convicted/789166.md?page=4)