# Suicide Squad. Why all the early hate? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [August 4, 2015, 5:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/suicide-squad-why-all-the-early-hate/726988 "2015-08-04T17:32:54Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 7
**Author:** ![XT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xt/32/456_2.png) [@XT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XT)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2016, 3:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/suicide-squad-why-all-the-early-hate/726988/121 "2016-08-08T15:25:25Z")
> [@tullsterx](#): > > Why all the online hate for Suicide Squad? What little I’ve seen looks pretty cool for a DC adaptation. No idea, though I think this is residual bashing from the (really bad IMHO) recent Superman movies. It’s cool to bash DC. Also, looking at some of the comments on Rotten Tomatoes I get the feeling that people dislike the movie for things other than the movie…things that make me wonder if any of the folks who are writing them ever read any of the comics the movie was based on, or just what sort of movie they thought they were going to see. At any rate, I generally listen to folks like [Angry Joe](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=26vgMGS3INA) and [Jeremy Jahns](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FKaLy54AbWs) as well as the guy at [VariantComics](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CXKWSzl8y9M) for reviews and, unsurprisingly, they all loved it (with some caveats). None of them think the movie deserves the scores it was getting on RT or MC or other review sites. I think they all said this was the best DC movie yet…not that this is a particularly high bar at this point, but I agree with that assessment. This was a very good popcorn and soda super heroes movie, IMHO. ---
**Author:** ![Jophiel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jophiel/32/66_2.png) [@Jophiel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jophiel)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2016, 3:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/suicide-squad-why-all-the-early-hate/726988/122 "2016-08-08T15:31:56Z")
> [@XT](#): > > things that make me wonder if any of the folks who are writing them ever read any of the comics the movie was based on, or just what sort of movie they thought they were going to see. Given that most of the audience also won’t have read the comics, I’m not worried about whether or not the critics did. The movie needs to stand on its own or fail on its own. If the only way it works is to have done the prerequisite reading before seeing it, it’s a poorly made movie. If comic movies were just for people who’d read the books, they’d all have box office totals of $2 million. ---
**Author:** ![XT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xt/32/456_2.png) [@XT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XT)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2016, 3:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/suicide-squad-why-all-the-early-hate/726988/123 "2016-08-08T15:36:12Z")
> [@Jophiel](#): > > Given that most of the audience also won’t have read the comics, I’m not worried about whether or not the critics did. The movie needs to stand on its own or fail on its own. If the only way it works is to have done the prerequisite reading before seeing it, it’s a poorly made movie. > > If comic movies were just for people who’d read the books, they’d all have box office totals of $2 million. If they were expecting another Marvel movie it certainly wasn’t that. But my wife hasn’t read any of the comics and she enjoyed the movie as well. As did my older kids. I had some issues with some of the movie too…some of it was a bit disjointed and there were some continuity issues where you could kind of tell that some scenes had been deleted and were leaving holes in the movie. But the scores on RT and MC were ridiculous for this movie, IMHO. It should rate a solid 7-8 on a 1-10 scale, even if you don’t know anything about the DC universe and have never picked up a single comic. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_Bravo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_bravo/32/493_2.png) [@Johnny\_Bravo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_Bravo)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2016, 3:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/suicide-squad-why-all-the-early-hate/726988/124 "2016-08-08T15:36:57Z")
> [@GreedySmurf](#): > > If every round had hit the head of the target fine, I would happily have said ‘he’s good’, but sending every round through the same bullet sized hole is impossible. Again IMO, bit I’ll never believe otherwise without video evidence. He, like Batman, is a nonpowered human who operates at “peak” ability. Yes, it’s fantastical, but he’s not a meta human. ---
**Author:** ![bump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7c8e57/32.png) [@bump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bump)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2016, 4:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/suicide-squad-why-all-the-early-hate/726988/125 "2016-08-08T16:51:12Z")
> [@Jophiel](#): > > Put simpler: I’m not tough. I’m not scary. That’s kind of the whole point: Joker looks lame enough that even non-tough, non-scary me isn’t the least bit intimidated by him. Non-tough me figures he could take that Joker in a fight. That’s not a measure of my toughness, it’s a measure of him lameness. You know, sometimes you see a character in a movie and think “He’s pretty bad-ass”? Yeah… not this time. That, and juggalos are generally disreputable white trash who listen to and follow a fairly wretched band. Not the kind of thing that evokes fear, terror or panic as a supervillain, when that’s the first thing people think of. ---
**Author:** ![RikWriter](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/49beb7/32.png) [@RikWriter](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RikWriter)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2016, 5:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/suicide-squad-why-all-the-early-hate/726988/126 "2016-08-08T17:09:28Z")
> [@GreedySmurf](#): > > He placed every round from the assault rifle literally through the same holes in each target, including when firing the rifle in automatic/burst fire. The natural variation in the flight of the rounds make that impossible IMO. > > If every round had hit the head of the target fine, I would happily have said ‘he’s good’, but sending every round through the same bullet sized hole is impossible. Again IMO, bit I’ll never believe otherwise without video evidence. It was very close range though, and he was using an optical sight. Not impossible. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2016, 5:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/suicide-squad-why-all-the-early-hate/726988/127 "2016-08-08T17:19:07Z")
> [@OneCentStamp](#): > > Speaking for myself, I’m getting deathly tired of the need to make every single damn thing dark and gritty. Everyone in the trailer just looks physically dirty and grimy, and with the exception of Harley Quinn, about 85% similar. > > Also, Will Smith is a dumpster fire. QfT No, Smith was one of the best parts. He has talent. ---
**Author:** ![Ike\_Witt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ike_witt/32/283_2.png) [@Ike\_Witt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ike_Witt)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2016, 5:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/suicide-squad-why-all-the-early-hate/726988/128 "2016-08-08T17:30:22Z")
> [@TYphoonSignal8](#): > > but I think that particular net also catches Geoff Johns, who is Chief Creative Officer at DC. Johns seemed to be involved in the movie in some way at the beginning [perhaps](http://http://www.comicbookmovie.com/suicide_squad/suicide-squad-geoff-johns-david-ayer-hint-at-the-movies-plot-a111865). Johns’ editorial guidance and writing is entangled, immature and insular, and from what I am reading of this movie it sounds like his ethos has pervaded the scripting. I agree with this. Johns may be a problem but he has a high up position at DC/WB and he isn’t going anywhere. Remember he was also involved with the Green Lantern movie. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2016, 5:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/suicide-squad-why-all-the-early-hate/726988/129 "2016-08-08T17:30:39Z")
> [@silenus](#): > > Zack Snyder. It all lays at his feet, and he gets the overwhelming share of the blame. Exile him to Ruthenia and DC might stand a chance of making a halfway decent movie. I personally doubt it, but as long as Snyder is associated with the DCU, it is doomed. Hey! Not Ruthenia! Lower Slobbovia. Bukovenia. But not Ruthenia. ---
**Author:** ![kenobi\_65](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kenobi_65/32/13178_2.png) [@kenobi\_65](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kenobi_65)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2016, 5:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/suicide-squad-why-all-the-early-hate/726988/130 "2016-08-08T17:43:13Z")
> [@Ike\_Witt](#): > > It is the best DC movie since 1978 that did not feature Batman. OTOH, how many films does that actually cover? Superman III (silly) and IV (horrid) with Christopher Reeve, and the more recent Superman films (with Brandon Routh, and then Henry Cavill). Green Lantern. Arguably, Swamp Thing and Watchmen (though the latter wasn’t considered part of the DC canon at that point). Am I missing any? ---
**Author:** ![DCnDC](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dcndc/32/2842_2.png) [@DCnDC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DCnDC)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2016, 5:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/suicide-squad-why-all-the-early-hate/726988/131 "2016-08-08T17:53:18Z")
> [@kenobi\_65](#): > > OTOH, how many films does that actually cover? > > Superman III (silly) and IV (horrid) with Christopher Reeve, and the more recent Superman films (with Brandon Routh, and then Henry Cavill). Green Lantern. Arguably, Swamp Thing and Watchmen (though the latter wasn’t considered part of the DC canon at that point). > > Am I missing any? Jonah Hex (2010) Steel (1997) starring Shaq Supergirl (1984) From Vertigo titles, if they count: Constantine (2005) RED (2010) RED 2 (2013) ---
**Author:** ![kenobi\_65](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kenobi_65/32/13178_2.png) [@kenobi\_65](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kenobi_65)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2016, 5:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/suicide-squad-why-all-the-early-hate/726988/132 "2016-08-08T17:58:25Z")
> [@DCnDC](#): > > Jonah Hex (2010) > Steel (1997) starring Shaq > Supergirl (1984) > > From Vertigo titles, if they count: > Constantine (2005) > RED (2010) > RED 2 (2013) Thanks for the reminders. Plus, there was the horrible Catwoman, with Halle Berry. ---
**Author:** ![Jackknifed\_Juggernaut](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/9de053/32.png) [@Jackknifed\_Juggernaut](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackknifed_Juggernaut)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2016, 6:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/suicide-squad-why-all-the-early-hate/726988/133 "2016-08-08T18:51:49Z")
I watched the 3D version on Saturday with my son. I had no knowledge of any history of these characters, besided Batman. I thought it was pretty entertaining and no better or worse than most of the Marvel ones I’ve seen. I’ve seen maybe 5-6 of those and the only one that stood out was _Guardians of the Galaxy_, and that was more due to the humor and 3D cinematography. But all of these movies are fantastical and I can always find things that don’t make sense in them. ---
**Author:** ![Ike\_Witt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ike_witt/32/283_2.png) [@Ike\_Witt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ike_Witt)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2016, 7:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/suicide-squad-why-all-the-early-hate/726988/134 "2016-08-08T19:36:23Z")
> [@Jackknifed\_Juggernaut](#): > > I thought it was pretty entertaining and no better or worse than most of the Marvel ones I’ve seen. I’ve seen maybe 5-6 of those and the only one that stood out was _Guardians of the Galaxy_, and that was more due to the humor and 3D cinematography. But all of these movies are fantastical and I can always find things that don’t make sense in them. Thank you for saying that. Suicide Squad is at least as good or better than 3 Spider-Man movies, 2 Hulk movie, 3 Fantastic Four movies, 2 Thor movies, 2 Iron Man movies, 1 Captain America movie and Ant-Man. ---
**Author:** ![D\_Odds](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/d_odds/32/2882_2.png) [@D\_Odds](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/D_Odds)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2016, 7:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/suicide-squad-why-all-the-early-hate/726988/135 "2016-08-08T19:43:54Z")
> [@Ike\_Witt](#): > > Thank you for saying that. Suicide Squad is at least as good or better than 3 Spider-Man movies, 2 Hulk movie, 3 Fantastic Four movies, 2 Thor movies, 2 Iron Man movies, 1 Captain America movie and Ant-Man. This just tells me not to go by your reviews of movies. Now, had you said: _ **2** _ Spider-Man movies 2 Hulk movies 3 FF movies (the proceeding 3 are not Disney/Marvel though) _ **1** _ Thor movie _ **1** _ Iron Man movie and left off CA and AM, then I might trust your reviews more. ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2016, 7:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/suicide-squad-why-all-the-early-hate/726988/136 "2016-08-08T19:44:17Z")
Ah…no. I’ll give you the Spiderman, Hulk and Fantastic 4 movies, but as things equally bad. The rest are either better than or _much better_ than anything Zack Snyder can come up with on his best day. eta: High-fives **D\_Odds**! ---
**Author:** ![XT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xt/32/456_2.png) [@XT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XT)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2016, 7:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/suicide-squad-why-all-the-early-hate/726988/137 "2016-08-08T19:45:53Z")
> [@Ike\_Witt](#): > > Thank you for saying that. Suicide Squad is at least as good or better than 3 Spider-Man movies, 2 Hulk movie, 3 Fantastic Four movies, 2 Thor movies, 2 Iron Man movies, 1 Captain America movie and Ant-Man. I would rate it as on par or slightly better than Iron Man 2-3, both of the Hulk stand alone movies, all of the recent Amazing Spider Man movies (way better than these, as they were terrible IMHO), and certainly the new Fantastic Four (even worse). By far the best DC movie to date (leaving aside the Dark Knight trilogy, and I’m not sure if that is in DC’s new movie-verse thingy). Still not sure where all the hate for this movie comes from, to be honest. This is one I will gladly buy on iTunes to go with my other superhero collection. And I can see this one becoming a franchise, unlike the, to me more uncertain future of the Justice League (I was underwhelmed by the trailer, though I have to say that Aqua-Man looks kick ass at least). ---
**Author:** ![RikWriter](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/49beb7/32.png) [@RikWriter](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RikWriter)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2016, 9:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/suicide-squad-why-all-the-early-hate/726988/138 "2016-08-08T21:11:16Z")
> [@Ike\_Witt](#): > > Thank you for saying that. Suicide Squad is at least as good or better than 3 Spider-Man movies, 2 Hulk movie, 3 Fantastic Four movies, 2 Thor movies, 2 Iron Man movies, 1 Captain America movie and Ant-Man. In your opinion. Not in mine, or nearly all critics, or most movie-goers. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2016, 9:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/suicide-squad-why-all-the-early-hate/726988/139 "2016-08-08T21:16:09Z")
> [@RikWriter](#): > > In your opinion. Not in mine, or nearly all critics, or most movie-goers. I’ll give him 3 Spider-Man movies, 2 Hulk movies, all 3 Fantastic Four movies- adding in Daredevil, Elektra, Ghost Rider 2, and several X-men flicks. Its the best Dc based live action film since the 1990’s. ---
**Author:** ![Ike\_Witt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ike_witt/32/283_2.png) [@Ike\_Witt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ike_Witt)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2016, 10:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/suicide-squad-why-all-the-early-hate/726988/140 "2016-08-08T22:38:43Z")
> [@D\_Odds](#): > > This just tells me not to go by your reviews of movies. > > Now, had you said: > _ **2** _ Spider-Man movies So which one did you like, Spider-Man 3 or one of the Amazing Spider-Man movies? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/suicide-squad-why-all-the-early-hate/726988.md?page=6) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/suicide-squad-why-all-the-early-hate/726988.md?page=8)