# Summer Olympics 2021 ongoing discussion **URL:** \ **Category:** The Game Room\ **Tags:** olympic-sports-track\ **Created:** [July 23, 2021, 12:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/summer-olympics-2021-ongoing-discussion/947137 "2021-07-23T12:00:01Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 19
**Author:** ![Novelty\_Bobble](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/a3d4f5/32.png) [@Novelty\_Bobble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Novelty_Bobble)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2021, 9:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/summer-olympics-2021-ongoing-discussion/947137/362 "2021-07-29T21:59:47Z")
> [@Mijin](#): > > I just find it hard to ignore when someone claims to be using a rational argument, but the argument is inconsistent and/or incoherent. If you are referring to my argument then I strongly disagree that it is inconherent. The 100m sprint on the track is covered in one way and one way only with no restrictions on the technique used, You do whatever you need to do to cover that distance in the fastest time. 100m in the pool is covered in 4 different ways with three of those ways made slower on purpose. That’s it in a nutshell. Call it personal taste if you like but, as I’ve said repeatedly were there three extra 100m track races for backwards, sideways and hopping I’d be equally as vocal about their pointlessness. The same would hold for left hand/right hand/standing javelin or spinning, non-spinnning, left hand/right hand discus etc. etc. So if you are going to pickholes in my argument then please do so on the argument I’m actually making. ---
**Author:** ![Yookeroo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/yookeroo/32/323_2.png) [@Yookeroo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Yookeroo)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2021, 10:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/summer-olympics-2021-ongoing-discussion/947137/363 "2021-07-29T22:12:00Z")
> [@TroutMan](#): > > If you don’t want to watch every one of them, there’s a pretty easy solution, and it doesn’t involve cancelling events that other people enjoy watching. But that means they can’t be objectively “right”. > [@Telemark](#): > > It’s all up to the teams, it’ll depend on the strengths of the swimmers you have. I’d imagine there are some limitations. Otherwise, the teams would be 100% men. ---
**Author:** ![EinsteinsHund](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/einsteinshund/32/8400_2.png) [@EinsteinsHund](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EinsteinsHund)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2021, 10:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/summer-olympics-2021-ongoing-discussion/947137/364 "2021-07-29T22:14:23Z")
> [@Yookeroo](#): > > I’d imagine there are some limitations. Otherwise, the teams would be 100% men. Yes, two of the relay team must be women, and two men. The lineup is free to chose. ---
**Author:** ![TroutMan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/troutman/32/6721_2.png) [@TroutMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TroutMan)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2021, 10:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/summer-olympics-2021-ongoing-discussion/947137/365 "2021-07-29T22:17:30Z")
> [@Novelty\_Bobble](#): > > If you are referring to my argument then I strongly disagree that it is inconherent. > > The 100m sprint on the track is covered in one way and one way only with no restrictions on the technique used, You do whatever you need to do to cover that distance in the fastest time. I wouldn’t say incoherent, but certainly inconsistent. First, the other strokes are not created with the purpose of being slower, they are done because it forces a different technique. As was already mentioned, hurdles is a running race with a change that makes it slower. But that’s different in your mind because it’s an addition to the course. Or one could view it as a race where you have to jump every few yards (i.e., a different, slower technique) and there are hurdles in the way to make sure you adhere to that rule. Then there’s slalom canoe and slalom kayak - same course but two different ways you have to get down it. Is that OK in your mind because it’s different equipment? In the rowing events, there are the sweep boats (one oar/person) and sculls (2 oars/person). Doesn’t apply because of equipment again? For some reason, distinct races that force different techniques are fine with you as long as it’s forced by equipment or an addition to the course. Races that use rules to force different techniques are not OK. Maybe it’s an important distinction to you, but it’s an arbitrary difference to many of us and thus seems inconsistent. ---
**Author:** ![filmore](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/7993a0/32.png) [@filmore](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/filmore)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2021, 10:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/summer-olympics-2021-ongoing-discussion/947137/366 "2021-07-29T22:23:01Z")
I like watching swimming, but I think they should cut out broadcasting the qualifying races in the Olympics. With so much sport to show, it’s a shame to dedicate limited broadcasting time to show the 2 semi-final qualifying swims of an event. Just show the finals for the event. Use the extra broadcast time to show badminton or something else. ---
**Author:** ![AlsoNamedBort](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alsonamedbort/32/3213_2.png) [@AlsoNamedBort](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AlsoNamedBort)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2021, 10:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/summer-olympics-2021-ongoing-discussion/947137/367 "2021-07-29T22:23:54Z")
> [@penultima\_thule](#): > > That pantheon almost exclusively comes from the ranks of swimming and gymnastics. Yeah, all this talk about the number of swimming events, I don’t get gymnastics, which is the same group of events 3 times (plus qualifying). You’ve got team, then all around, and then individuals. ---
**Author:** ![psychobunny](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/54ee81/32.png) [@psychobunny](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/psychobunny)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2021, 10:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/summer-olympics-2021-ongoing-discussion/947137/368 "2021-07-29T22:32:44Z")
> [@Novelty\_Bobble](#): > > The 100m sprint on the track is covered in one way and one way only with no restrictions on the technique used, You do whatever you need to do to cover that distance in the fastest time. > > 100m in the pool is covered in 4 different ways with three of those ways made slower on purpose. I am assuming that you would drop the 110 meter hurdles, then. It seems that the hurdles only serve to make the runner slower on purpose. Why require them to jump over a hurdle when they could run much faster without them. ---
**Author:** ![Novelty\_Bobble](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/a3d4f5/32.png) [@Novelty\_Bobble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Novelty_Bobble)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2021, 10:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/summer-olympics-2021-ongoing-discussion/947137/369 "2021-07-29T22:35:26Z")
> [@TroutMan](#): > > As was already mentioned, hurdles is a running race with a change that makes it slower. But that’s different in your mind because it’s an addition to the course. Or one could view it as a race where you have to jump every few yards (i.e., a different, slower technique) and there are hurdles in the way to make sure you adhere to that rule. where is the rule that says there is a specifc way that you must run that race and clear that hurdle? Show me multiple 100m hurdle races that dictate how you must run between the hurdles and how you must clear them and you have an analogous situation to the multiple swimming strokes. > [@TroutMan](#): > > For some reason, distinct races that force different techniques are fine with you as long as it’s forced by equipment or an addition to the course. Yep, the course is set and then it is up to the competitor to cover the course in the fastest time possible using whatever technique they choose. The only “forcing” of a technique is that which allows the fastest progress. You’ve just proved that my argument is perfectly coherent and consistent. The “course” and the “technique” used to complete it are two distinct entities. > [@TroutMan](#): > > Maybe it’s an important distinction to you, but it’s an arbitrary difference to many of us and thus seems inconsistent. Arbitrary is not inconsistency. Sport is pretty much a collection of arbitrary rules that are consistently applied. ---
**Author:** ![TroutMan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/troutman/32/6721_2.png) [@TroutMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TroutMan)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2021, 10:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/summer-olympics-2021-ongoing-discussion/947137/370 "2021-07-29T22:39:28Z")
> [@Novelty\_Bobble](#): > > You’ve just proved that my argument is perfectly coherent and consistent. I get that it is to you according to what distinctions you think are important and not. But using your personal opinion to proclaim “I’ve proved it!” is never a winning move. ---
**Author:** ![Novelty\_Bobble](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/a3d4f5/32.png) [@Novelty\_Bobble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Novelty_Bobble)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2021, 10:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/summer-olympics-2021-ongoing-discussion/947137/371 "2021-07-29T22:40:46Z")
> [@psychobunny](#): > > I am assuming that you would drop the 110 meter hurdles, then. It seems that the hurdles only serve to make the runner slower on purpose. Why require them to jump over a hurdle when they could run much faster without them. 110 metres with hurdles is a different _course_ to a 100m flat. I mean, the clue is in the name. Even a 100 hurdles is a different and longer course. ---
**Author:** ![Novelty\_Bobble](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/a3d4f5/32.png) [@Novelty\_Bobble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Novelty_Bobble)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2021, 10:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/summer-olympics-2021-ongoing-discussion/947137/372 "2021-07-29T22:45:10Z")
> [@TroutMan](#): > > I get that it is to you according to what distinctions you think are important and not. But using your personal opinion to proclaim “I’ve proved it!” is never a winning move. I’ve “proved” nothing and have never claimed to. It is just personal opinion and always has been. What _is_ true is that the argument I’m making is internally consistent and coherent. You are free to disagree with my personal opinion and the qualitative judgement that I come to (many do) and I won’t say you are wrong, how could I? ---
**Author:** ![EinsteinsHund](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/einsteinshund/32/8400_2.png) [@EinsteinsHund](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EinsteinsHund)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2021, 10:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/summer-olympics-2021-ongoing-discussion/947137/373 "2021-07-29T22:46:12Z")
Would please some mod step in to end this tedious sidetrack about the swimming competitions? I know I know, we like to debate on the Dope, but this takes splitting hairs over a trivial subject to another level, and most of all is booooring. ---
**Author:** ![Novelty\_Bobble](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/a3d4f5/32.png) [@Novelty\_Bobble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Novelty_Bobble)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2021, 10:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/summer-olympics-2021-ongoing-discussion/947137/374 "2021-07-29T22:50:04Z")
> [@EinsteinsHund](#): > > Would please some mod step in to end this tedious sidetrack about the swimming competitions? I know I know, we like to debate on the Dope, but this takes splitting hairs over a trivial subject to another level, and most of all is booooring to be fair, the time taken in this thread regarding swimming is pretty much proportionate to the time taken up by swimming in the Olympics. ---
**Author:** ![TroutMan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/troutman/32/6721_2.png) [@TroutMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TroutMan)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2021, 11:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/summer-olympics-2021-ongoing-discussion/947137/375 "2021-07-29T23:07:59Z")
> [@Novelty\_Bobble](#): > > to be fair, the time taken in this thread regarding swimming is pretty much proportionate to the time taken up by swimming in the Olympics. Exactly (and I struggle to see why discussing Olympic events is a sidetrack to a thread about the Olympics). But if we need to change to a different topic, I will type further responses about swimming using only my left hand. Then it’s a different argument. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Novelty\_Bobble](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/a3d4f5/32.png) [@Novelty\_Bobble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Novelty_Bobble)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2021, 11:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/summer-olympics-2021-ongoing-discussion/947137/376 "2021-07-29T23:44:04Z")
> [@TroutMan](#): > > But if we need to change to a different topic, I will type further responses about swimming using only my left hand. Then it’s a different argument. 🙂 ah! but the message board remains the same! 😀 ---
**Author:** ![Mijin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mijin/32/9369_2.png) [@Mijin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mijin)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2021, 11:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/summer-olympics-2021-ongoing-discussion/947137/377 "2021-07-29T23:46:31Z")
> [@Novelty\_Bobble](#): > > Arbitrary is not inconsistency. Sport is pretty much a collection of arbitrary rules that are consistently applied. Yeah _sports’ rules_ can be arbitrary. _Arguments_ OTOH are not supposed to be, ---
**Author:** ![penultima\_thule](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/penultima_thule/32/3833_2.png) [@penultima\_thule](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/penultima_thule)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2021, 11:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/summer-olympics-2021-ongoing-discussion/947137/378 "2021-07-29T23:48:03Z")
> [@AlsoNamedBort](#): > > … gymnastics, which is the same group of events 3 times (plus qualifying). You’ve got team, then all around, and then individuals. Which leads to the usual result of the all-round medalists medaling in two individual events and medaling in the team for their bag of four. Just bear in mind, the equivalent situation, in the past 10 Olympiads occurs 2 1/2 time more frequently in swimming and in essentially no other discipline. (Lewis, Joyner-Kersee and van Moorsel) ---
**Author:** ![Mahaloth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mahaloth/32/1079_2.png) [@Mahaloth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mahaloth)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2021, 11:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/summer-olympics-2021-ongoing-discussion/947137/379 "2021-07-29T23:50:20Z")
I just watched Richard Torrez Jr. debut in boxing and man, he was amazing. I have rarely seen so many punches land in such a short time in boxing. He totally destroyed his opponent. They were not wearing the typical headgear I see in Olympics boxing and they also did not have white sections on their gloves, which I thought they used to score points. Did the rules change or am I out of touch? ---
**Author:** ![TroutMan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/troutman/32/6721_2.png) [@TroutMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TroutMan)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2021, 11:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/summer-olympics-2021-ongoing-discussion/947137/380 "2021-07-29T23:53:42Z")
I caught some of the women’s 49er FX sailing race, and it was way more exciting that I expected. One boat rammed another one, a few boats capsized or the sailors took a bath, and when sailing well, those boats are screaming across the water. ---
**Author:** ![Mahaloth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mahaloth/32/1079_2.png) [@Mahaloth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mahaloth)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2021, 11:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/summer-olympics-2021-ongoing-discussion/947137/381 "2021-07-29T23:54:43Z")
> [@TroutMan](#): > > I caught some of the women’s 49er FX sailing race, and it was way more exciting that I expected. One boat rammed another one, a few boats capsized or the sailors took a bath, and when sailing well, those boats are screaming across the water Thanks, I’ll have to check it out. How long are their races? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/summer-olympics-2021-ongoing-discussion/947137.md?page=18) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/summer-olympics-2021-ongoing-discussion/947137.md?page=20)