Super-Long Bridges-When Will They Be Built?

[furt]

Speculating on how to build a Bring strait bridge = engineer porn.

[Exapno_Mapcase]

@BrainGlutton

BTW – if this topic interests you, check out William Henry Harrison’s AH novel, A Transatlantic Tunnel, Hurrah! (Tor Books, 1991). The engineer Augustus Washington (direct descendant of the traitor George Washington, hanged after his rebellion failed), is building a submarine rail tunnel from Liverpool to New York (by way of the Azores), linking Her Majestys’ dominions on both sides of the ocean sea!

Harrison actually makes you think it could work.

Maybe the reference to Washington as a traitor boggled BrainGlutton’s brain, for the book was written by Harry Harrison the science fiction writer, not William Henry Harrison the President.

[Cillasi]

When linking otherwise non-contiguous land masses, there is more to think about than just engineering concerns. A bridge or tunnel not only allows people to cross, but plants, animals and insects as well. That is probably not a good thing, so I doubt we’ll ever see the Bering Strait or the Strait of Gibraltar bridged.

[Diceman]

@furt

Speculating on how to build a Bering strait bridge = engineer porn.

I wouldn’t go that far, but it is a fun pasttime for us more technically-minded sorts.

[dtilque]

@BrainGlutton

(2) the U.S. and Canada build a Pacific Coast Line, running, say, from Los Angeles up all the way to Anchorage and then due north to Fairbanks and then west to Nome.

That’s a singularly bad route for a railway. There’s a reason they built the Al-Can highway inland. Also why there’s no significant coast road much further north than Vancouver BC.

BTW, is there really enough traffic between western Europe and northwestern Africa to justify a Gibralter bridge or tunnel?

[OxyMoron]

That’s precisely the problem with most of these superbridges, dtilque: they just don’t make economic sense. The 29 July issue of the Economist reviews several of the major European projects, starting with the Gulf of Corinth bridge, slated to open on the eve of the Olympics. Although finished on time and under budget (the writer seems a bit sceptical on the latter), there’s little evidence that this bridge, or many other recent completions, is anything more than an EU-subsidized boondoggle.

Spending a fortune on such giant projects may be great for the construction industry. Whether it is a good use of taxpayers’ money is less clear. Britain’s Humber bridge, completed in 1981, and now used by 17,000 vehicles a day, was clearly uneconomic. Even the Oresund bridge, which made better economic sense, averages only 12,500 vehicles a day, less than forecast. The Sicilian bridge—if anyone can be found to finance it—may be a white elephant. And Greece’s new bridge, for all the century of dreams that has gone into it, looks a fine example of linking nowhere much to nowhere at all. The sponsors expect 11,000 vehicles a day—only 1,000 more than now go by ferry.

The same analysis also describes several recent Japanese projects, such as the monster Akashi Kaikyo bridge connecting Honshu and Shikoku.

[Duke]

[roadgeek]

Of course, you can always “build” a super-long bridge simply by designating any piece of road as a bridge. Just like the State of Illinois did with the Skyway, at eight miles long the longest bridge in Illinois. (Explanation: after work began on the Skyway legislators realized that there was no provision in state law for non-bridge toll routes. So the entire Skyway was officially designated as a bridge.)

[/roadgeek]

[Earl_Snake-Hips_Tucker]

@OxyMoron

That’s precisely the problem with most of these superbridges, dtilque: they just don’t make economic sense.

While hardly a “superbridge,” the congressman from my area is probably going to get his way and get the funding (expected to be about $80 M) to build what is being called “a [nine-mile] bridge from ‘nowhere,’ to ‘nowhere,’” basically linking two rural communities across part of a lake.

[filmyak]

The Chesapeake Bay Bridge Tunnel in Virginia is an interesting option. Been YEARS since I’ve crossed it, but if memory serves, it’s about 20 miles long, and it’s a series of above-water bridges and underwater tunnels, so boats can pass without making it extremely high or turning it into a drawbridge.

Also costs about $20 in tolls to cross. Ewwww.

[BrainGlutton]

@Cillasi

When linking otherwise non-contiguous land masses, there is more to think about than just engineering concerns. A bridge or tunnel not only allows people to cross, but plants, animals and insects as well. That is probably not a good thing, so I doubt we’ll ever see the Bering Strait or the Strait of Gibraltar bridged.

Has anything that shouldn’t crossed from Britain to the Continent, or vice-versa, by way of the Chunnel?

[BrainGlutton]

@dtilque

That’s a singularly bad route for a railway. There’s a reason they built the Al-Can highway inland. Also why there’s no significant coast road much further north than Vancouver BC.

Well, what I described could follow the route of the Al-Can, and still find its way to Anchorage, Fairbanks and Nome. Assuming demand.

See this link – http://www.newtrains.org/pages/354055/index.htm – you can find a map of a proposed high-speed rail network for the U.S., including a West Coast line from San Diego to Seattle. Just imagine it being extended north.

@dtilque

BTW, is there really enough traffic between western Europe and northwestern Africa to justify a Gibralter bridge or tunnel?

I don’t know, but, as noted above, the Spanish and Moroccan governments are, for some reason, discussing the project.

[Schnitte]

@BrainGlutton

Has anything that shouldn’t crossed from Britain to the Continent, or vice-versa, by way of the Chunnel?

The Channel tunnel has become some sort of gateway to Britain for illegal immigrants. See http://www.cnn.com/2000/WORLD/europe/09/01/britain.tunnel for example.

Illegal immigration into the European Union has become an issue wildly debated here. A bridge or tunnel connecting Spain and Morocco across the Strait of Gibraltar would be attracting way more illegal border crossings.

[sub]Personally, I think that EU immigration laws are way to harsh, and that this legislation is not the last one to blame for the deaths of non-European boat people trying to enter Europe illegally you hear about regularly. Should be loosened IMO.[/sub]

[Fatwater_Fewl]

Here’s a link to pics of one that exists between Prince Edward Island and New Brunswick. It opened in 1997. Should have been a tunnel.

[Polycarp]

Regarding the hypothetical Bering Straits Bridge:

1. The presumption is, of course, that it would be linked by surface transport routes to the inhabited parts of North America and Asia – which is not a small problem in and of itself. Ask anyone with experience in Alaska what it takes to construct a four-season highway in that latitude.

2. It’s probably more feasible, given conditions in the Bering area, to build a tunnel than a bridge. Remember that that strait was coastal plain during the last glaciation, and that it experiences some of the world’s worst weather much of the year today.

3. That said, IMO it would be a wise move for a variety of reasons.

One is showing that 21st Century man is capable of going on and taking new challenges. I’m seeing the slow erosion of the Victorian and first six decades of the 20th Century insistence on progress and a “can do” attitude.

A second is the symbolic element, linking New World with Old.

But most important is the quantity of material that could be shipped via such a system. The bridge or tunnel would of course be carrying rail traffic. A pipeline was mentioned. World travel would suddenly become affordable for many.

[Ryan_Liam]

There is a plan in the works – not to bridge the Straits of Gibraltar, but to dig a tunnel, a la the Chunnel, linking Spain and Morocco. [ur]http://www.dawn.com/2003/12/16/int16.htm

I don’t personally don’t see the point, it just makes it easier for Illegal Immigrants to get from Africa to Europe, this will just make it a place which would be exploited mercelessly. Only when the countries are both on a par in economic and social development, do I see a point in linking them with a bridge or tunnel.

[matt_mcl]

@Fatwater Fewl

Here’s a link to pics of one that exists between Prince Edward Island and New Brunswick. It opened in 1997. Should have been a tunnel.

A tunnel? How come?

Incidentally, the usual suspects are floating a plan to link Newfoundland Island with Labrador via a rail tunnel under the Straits of Belle Isle. judy tenuta It could happen!!

[BrainGlutton]

@Ryan_Liam

I don’t personally don’t see the point, it just makes it easier for Illegal Immigrants to get from Africa to Europe, this will just make it a place which would be exploited mercelessly. Only when the countries are both on a par in economic and social development, do I see a point in linking them with a bridge or tunnel.

Consider the possibility that a rail link between a rich country and a poor one might stimulate the poor one’s economy – and also its social development, by exposing its people to more foreigners and foreign ideas – and, thus, help narrowy the economic and cultural gap between the two.

In any case, the Spanish are looking at this seriously, so apparently they’re not afraid of an influx of poor Moroccans.

Remember, also, we’re not just talking about linking Spain and Morocco, we’re talking about linking Europe and Africa. Once the link is open, it’s not hard to envision a high-speed rail line being built along the southern coast of the Mediterranean, to Alexandria and south to Cairo and then – who knows? One imperial dream of the British in their heyday, never realized, was a continuous rail line from Cairo to Cape Town. Just imagine the possibilities for economic development that would usher in!

But this is starting to get kind of GD . . .