# Super Star Athlete's Worst Last Performance **URL:** \ **Category:** The Game Room\ **Created:** [January 26, 2010, 1:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/super-star-athletes-worst-last-performance/526503 "2010-01-26T13:30:52Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Snarky\_Kong](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a183cd/32.png) [@Snarky\_Kong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snarky_Kong)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2010, 6:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/super-star-athletes-worst-last-performance/526503/21 "2010-01-26T18:23:18Z")
> [@footballisplayedwithyourfeet](#): > > I think Zinedine Zidane qualifies. This guy was the absolute best footballer on the planet for a while - and won everything there is to win - and the last action of his carreer was headbutting an opposition player and being send off. > > This didn’t just happen in any game, no, this happened during the biggest sporting event in the world; the world cup final (no sporting event is as important from a worldwide perspective). > > So the last action of one of the best players of all time, which was in one of the most important matches of his carreer (he played one other world cup final) is to lose selfcontrol and assault another player, resulting in being sent to the showers and being forced to stay there to hear(maybe watch on tv) how your country/team loses the world cup final. Two things about this: 1. Zidane won player of the tournament (I can never remember if that’s ball or boot, ball I think) 2. That was freaking awesome. ---
**Author:** ![StusBlues](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/dc4da7/32.png) [@StusBlues](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/StusBlues)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2010, 6:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/super-star-athletes-worst-last-performance/526503/22 "2010-01-26T18:33:46Z")
> [@VarlosZ](#): > > Oh, my lord, no. [Ali’s last fight](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XBa9BxfYpHA&feature=related) was against Larry Holmes, a bout that’s universally considered a tragedy, something that absolutely shouldn’t have happened. Ali was not just old, but also, as we now know, neurologically impaired. Listen to Cosell, he sounds like a man doing the play by play for a funeral. Not quite, mate. Ali’s last fight came a year later against Trevor Berbick in the Bahamas. And it looked bad. Ali was very clearly suffering from Parkinson’s Syndrome by then, and was way out of shape. (He’d looked physically better against Holmes because he’d emaciated himself with dubious medications.) Ali won some rounds with his amazing grasp of the fundamentals, but it was very clear that he had no business in the ring with a contender. Halfway through the fight, Berbick stopped pounding on Ali’s arms and demanded that the ref stop the bout, shouting: “Do you want me to kill him?” The ref waved him back in, and the fight went the distance. He was actually pretty competitive, covering up well and landing some good jab-cross combinations, but this owed more to Berbick’s lack of boxing skill than anything else. ---
**Author:** ![whole\_bean](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/96bed5/32.png) [@whole\_bean](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/whole_bean)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2010, 7:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/super-star-athletes-worst-last-performance/526503/23 "2010-01-26T19:03:10Z")
[duplicate] ---
**Author:** ![whole\_bean](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/96bed5/32.png) [@whole\_bean](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/whole_bean)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2010, 7:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/super-star-athletes-worst-last-performance/526503/24 "2010-01-26T19:05:47Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > He was a running back, but otherwise, you’re correct. His last years were his best ones, he retired pretty young, and his last regular season game might’ve been his best one: he ran for 234 yards and three touchdowns and just about willed the team into the playoffs. They lost their first playoff game but he did well there, too. given what his team did the next year, bet he has to wonder if he should have stayed around for one more season ---
**Author:** ![Contrapuntal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e274bd/32.png) [@Contrapuntal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Contrapuntal)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2010, 7:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/super-star-athletes-worst-last-performance/526503/25 "2010-01-26T19:17:05Z")
> [@Munch](#): > > Final regular season game: [12 Att., 74 yards, 1 TD](http://www.pro-football-reference.com/boxscores/196512190crd.htm) > Final playoff game: [12 Att., 50 yards, 0 TD](http://www.pro-football-reference.com/boxscores/196601020gnb.htm) > > Tiki Barber: > > Final regular season game: [23 Att., 234 yards, 3 TD, 3 Rec. 24 yards](http://www.pro-football-reference.com/boxscores/200612300was.htm) > Final playoff game: [26 Att. 137 yards, 0 TD, 2 Rec. 15 yards](http://www.pro-football-reference.com/boxscores/200701070phi.htm) > > Yeah, I can see how Jim Brown could make you forget Tiki Barber… :rolleyes: If you think this is an argument against Brown’s leaving on top you are mistaken. It’s easy to cherry pick a couple of games, but he rushed for over 1500 yards his final season, in 14 games, good enough for second overall if he had been playing in 2009. ---
**Author:** ![Munch](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/munch/32/5281_2.png) [@Munch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Munch)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2010, 7:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/super-star-athletes-worst-last-performance/526503/26 "2010-01-26T19:17:55Z")
> [@Contrapuntal](#): > > If you think this is an argument against Brown’s leaving on top you are mistaken. It’s easy to cherry pick a couple of games, but he rushed for over 1500 yards his final season, in 14 games, good enough for second overall if he had been playing in 2009. It’s an argument for the flavor of the thread - which is about last PERFORMANCES, not seasons. ---
**Author:** ![Contrapuntal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e274bd/32.png) [@Contrapuntal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Contrapuntal)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2010, 7:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/super-star-athletes-worst-last-performance/526503/27 "2010-01-26T19:21:53Z")
> [@Munch](#): > > It’s an argument for the flavor of the thread - which is about last PERFORMANCES, not seasons. Well, you should have taken \*\*Elvis \*\*to task for that, then. Absent that, your example in no way refutes the notion that Brown left at the top, which was his assertion. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2010, 7:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/super-star-athletes-worst-last-performance/526503/28 "2010-01-26T19:29:54Z")
> [@Tom\_Scud](#): > > What, not Ted “home run in his last at-bat” Williams? He was already pretty thoroughly done by then. Jack Fisher always hotly denied grooving him that fastball, but there’s no way to be sure. Is a “performance” a moment, a game, or a season, **Munch**? :dubious: I need to know if you’re worth arguing with here. ---
**Author:** ![Munch](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/munch/32/5281_2.png) [@Munch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Munch)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2010, 7:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/super-star-athletes-worst-last-performance/526503/29 "2010-01-26T19:30:32Z")
> [@Contrapuntal](#): > > Well, you should have taken \*\*Elvis \*\*to task for that, then. I did - by providing all stats available for the final games of the two players in question. The fact that you and Elvis can’t follow along with the point of the thread isn’t my fault. ---
**Author:** ![Munch](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/munch/32/5281_2.png) [@Munch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Munch)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2010, 7:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/super-star-athletes-worst-last-performance/526503/30 "2010-01-26T19:34:52Z")
> [@ElvisL1ves](#): > > Is a “performance” a moment, a game, or a season, **Munch**? Fancy Socialite 1: Buffy, did you go to the performance last night? Fancy Socialite 2: I thought Enrico’s interpretation of Vivaldi was obscene. Beer Swilling Football Fan 1: Did you see Favre’s performance last night? Beer Swilling Football Fan 2: He had a pretty crappy game. bouv: Don’t forget Tiki Barber. Marley23: …last regular season game might’ve been his best one: he ran for 234 yards and three touchdowns… ElvisL1ves: You can if you remember Jim Brown, perhaps the ultimate example of leaving at the top. One of these things is not like the other… ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2010, 7:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/super-star-athletes-worst-last-performance/526503/31 "2010-01-26T19:38:25Z")
That answers that, then. G’day, mate. ---
**Author:** ![Contrapuntal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e274bd/32.png) [@Contrapuntal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Contrapuntal)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2010, 7:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/super-star-athletes-worst-last-performance/526503/32 "2010-01-26T19:45:30Z")
> [@Munch](#): > > I did - by providing all stats available for the final games of the two players in question. The fact that you and Elvis can’t follow along with the point of the thread isn’t my fault. Regardless of whether we are off point, your example still does not refute the idea that Brown left at the top, despite your continuing disability to understand this. Jim Brown may be the prime example of a healthy athlete leaving at the top of his game. Yes, it may be off point somewhat. It’s an internet message board. Get used to it. Or better yet, why not ignore posts that are somewhat off point, if it’s going to wad your knickers up so much? ---
**Author:** ![Tom\_Scud](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/f08c70/32.png) [@Tom\_Scud](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tom_Scud)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2010, 7:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/super-star-athletes-worst-last-performance/526503/33 "2010-01-26T19:55:07Z")
> [@ElvisL1ves](#): > > [Ted Williams] was already pretty thoroughly done by then. Jack Fisher always hotly denied grooving him that fastball, but there’s no way to be sure. He had a pretty damn awesome last year - 6th in the league in homers despite missing a third of the games, and if he’d qualified for the batting title he’d have finished second in batting and first in on base and slugging. His previous year may have been his only bad year with the bat, but I’d say he went out pretty close to the top. ---
**Author:** ![Munch](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/munch/32/5281_2.png) [@Munch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Munch)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2010, 7:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/super-star-athletes-worst-last-performance/526503/34 "2010-01-26T19:56:08Z")
> [@Contrapuntal](#): > > Regardless of whether we are off point, your example still does not refute the idea that Brown left at the top, despite your continuing disability to understand this. Jim Brown may be the prime example of a healthy athlete leaving at the top of his game. See, here’s the thing - I’m not going to argue that Jim Brown didn’t leave with the best final season of any one in the history of football, because he did. What I will argue is that the point Elvis wanted to argue against was “Tiki’s final game was one of the best ever” (if you don’t think that’s what bouv and Marley were talking about, trying reading their posts slower), and he did so by citing Brown’s season (I honestly don’t think there’s an argument here - do you?). Surely you’re familiar with the difference between a season and a single game, yes? It’s like going into a “best records of the 2000 decade” discussion and citing a [99 year old statistic](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=11886959&postcount=11)…:). ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_the\_Turtle](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_the_turtle/32/2926_2.png) [@Fear\_the\_Turtle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_the_Turtle)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2010, 7:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/super-star-athletes-worst-last-performance/526503/35 "2010-01-26T19:58:03Z")
I’d like to nominate Favre for 3 of the top spots for all 3 times he “retired” (vs Giants, vs Mia and vs NO). If he comes back so he can “retire” a 4 th time - maybe he can go 4 for 4. ---
**Author:** ![Contrapuntal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e274bd/32.png) [@Contrapuntal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Contrapuntal)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2010, 8:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/super-star-athletes-worst-last-performance/526503/36 "2010-01-26T20:05:35Z")
> [@Munch](#): > > See, here’s the thing - I’m not going to argue that Jim Brown didn’t leave with the best final season of any one in the history of football, because he did. What I will argue is that the point Elvis wanted to argue against was “Tiki’s final game was one of the best ever” (if you don’t think that’s what bouv and Marley were talking about, trying reading their posts slower), Here’s the part of **bouv** ’s post \*\*Elvis \*\*responded to, bolding mine. – > [@](#): > > Don’t forget Tiki Barber…I think? Wasn’t he a receiver for ther Giants who retired **while at the top of his game** because he didn’t want to become one of those broken-down, hanging on to their legacy and should have been let go years ago, players? No matter how slowly I read that, it still says _while at the top of his game_, not _in his final game_. That’s what Elvis quoted. If you have a complaint about off point posts, perhaps you should take it up with **bouv**. > [@](#): > > and he did so by citing Brown’s season (I honestly don’t think there’s an argument here - do you?). Surely you’re familiar with the difference between a season and a single game, yes? See above. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2010, 8:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/super-star-athletes-worst-last-performance/526503/37 "2010-01-26T20:09:02Z")
Muhammad Ali should never have fought Larry Holmes, but he did, and got his bell permanently rung. But that still wasn’t enough - he staggered through a 10-round unanimous loss to the immortal Trevor Berbick before people who loved him took pity on him. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2010, 8:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/super-star-athletes-worst-last-performance/526503/38 "2010-01-26T20:11:42Z")
> [@Fear\_the\_Turtle](#): > > I’d like to nominate Favre for 3 of the top spots for all 3 times he “retired” (vs Giants, vs Mia and vs NO). I forget, did he end his involvement in the Giants game with a pick, too? ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_the\_Turtle](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_the_turtle/32/2926_2.png) [@Fear\_the\_Turtle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_the_Turtle)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2010, 8:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/super-star-athletes-worst-last-performance/526503/39 "2010-01-26T20:15:17Z")
> [@ElvisL1ves](#): > > I forget, did he end his involvement in the Giants game with a pick, too? Yeah. Pick in OT to set up Tynes’ game winning field goal. ---
**Author:** ![Munch](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/munch/32/5281_2.png) [@Munch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Munch)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2010, 8:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/super-star-athletes-worst-last-performance/526503/40 "2010-01-26T20:33:10Z")
Has there been any other major starting QB who retired after throwing a pick? Oof - check this list out! It’s from [pro-football-reference.com](http://pro-football-reference.com). I specified: Player’s final season Games 12-20 Regular season OR playoffs Interceptions \>= 1 [Results](http://www.pro-football-reference.com/play-index/pgl_finder.cgi?request=1&match=game&year_min=1960&year_max=2009&season_start=-1&season_end=-1&age_min=0&age_max=99&league_id=&team_id=&opp_id=&game_type=&game_num_min=12&game_num_max=20&week_num_min=0&week_num_max=99&game_day_of_week=&game_location=&game_result=&is_active=&is_hof=&c1stat=pass_int&c1comp=gt&c1val=1&c2stat=&c2comp=gt&c2val=&c3stat=&c3comp=gt&c3val=&c4stat=&c4comp=gt&c4val=&order_by=pass_int) reflect not the final game for the player, but in the final half of the season (for the most part). Fran Tarkenton’s final regular season game was pretty interesting. 23/38 for 316 yards and 3 TDs. But FIVE Ints. I wonder if they have teams working to input play-by-play data like they do on the baseball site. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/super-star-athletes-worst-last-performance/526503.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/super-star-athletes-worst-last-performance/526503.md?page=3)