# Superdome Evacuation Stopped After Shots Fired At Helicopter **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [September 1, 2005, 12:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/superdome-evacuation-stopped-after-shots-fired-at-helicopter/319576 "2005-09-01T12:48:57Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![Blalron](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/35a633/32.png) [@Blalron](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Blalron)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2005, 6:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/superdome-evacuation-stopped-after-shots-fired-at-helicopter/319576/81 "2005-09-01T18:59:58Z")
> [@wolf\_meister](#): > > Could we assume a person running out of a “Best Buy” or “Circuit City” with a carton of CD players is _not_ doing that for humanitarian reasons? Sure. But last time I checked, stealing CDs was not punishable by summary execution. ---
**Author:** ![Batsinma\_Belfry](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/ea5d25/32.png) [@Batsinma\_Belfry](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Batsinma_Belfry)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2005, 7:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/superdome-evacuation-stopped-after-shots-fired-at-helicopter/319576/82 "2005-09-01T19:01:07Z")
> [@Snowboarder Bo](#): > > btw, am I the only person who is thinking “gee, if all our soldiers weren’t so busy in Iraq, I bet we could do more to help **our own fucking citizens** ”… or is that just me thinking that? I’m suprised more people haven’t voiced that oppinion. It’s so obvious. ---
**Author:** ![bordelond](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bordelond/32/150_2.png) [@bordelond](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bordelond)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2005, 7:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/superdome-evacuation-stopped-after-shots-fired-at-helicopter/319576/83 "2005-09-01T19:06:08Z")
> [@Airman Doors](#): > > They can break up violent demonstrations, they can guard stuff, and they can detain, but they cannot arrest and they cannot just open up at the first shot fired and go to town. This suggests to me that the National Guard is helpless. Either they can fire in defense or they cannot. So the first shot whizzes over their heads … they can do nothing. The second shot … still nothing? The third shot rips through one of the Guardsmen’s arms … The one hundredth shot pierces someone’s skull. At what point are they allowed to fight back? ---
**Author:** ![AFAIKnow](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/a6a055/32.png) [@AFAIKnow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AFAIKnow)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2005, 7:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/superdome-evacuation-stopped-after-shots-fired-at-helicopter/319576/84 "2005-09-01T19:13:35Z")
Now there are reports of sniper fire on people trying to leave the charity hospital there. WTF!!! ---
**Author:** ![Larry\_Mudd](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/f14d63/32.png) [@Larry\_Mudd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Larry_Mudd)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2005, 7:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/superdome-evacuation-stopped-after-shots-fired-at-helicopter/319576/85 "2005-09-01T19:14:47Z")
Christ. Reports are now coming in that the evacuation efforts at Charity Hospital have ground to a halt because workers were taking fucking sniper fire while trying to move patients out of intensive care. What kind of sick bastards would do something like this? ---
**Author:** ![bordelond](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bordelond/32/150_2.png) [@bordelond](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bordelond)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2005, 7:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/superdome-evacuation-stopped-after-shots-fired-at-helicopter/319576/86 "2005-09-01T19:15:53Z")
> [@Larry Mudd](#): > > Christ. > > Reports are now coming in that the evacuation efforts at Charity Hospital have ground to a halt because workers were taking fucking sniper fire while trying to move patients out of intensive care. **Snowboarder**? **Askia**? Opinions? **Larry** , where did you find this out? ---
**Author:** ![Xploder](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/x/a183cd/32.png) [@Xploder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Xploder)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2005, 7:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/superdome-evacuation-stopped-after-shots-fired-at-helicopter/319576/87 "2005-09-01T19:17:32Z")
> [@Snowboarder Bo](#): > > btw, am I the only person who is thinking “gee, if all our soldiers weren’t so busy in Iraq, I bet we could do more to help **our own fucking citizens** ”… or is that just me thinking that? Probably you aren’t the only one. Truth is that the National Guard is deployed already and the regular army, by law, can’t do much but guard things. You all need to calm down until we actually get some, ya know, **facts** or something. Rumors and internet crap are not facts. Just because some talking head on CNN said it does not make it true. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2005, 7:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/superdome-evacuation-stopped-after-shots-fired-at-helicopter/319576/88 "2005-09-01T19:19:07Z")
> [@Airman Doors](#): > > No, they should not. And they cannot, by law. As a matter of fact, the National Guard, even when called up for civil disturbances, needs to be very careful about how they conduct themselves because they are not law enforcement. They can break up violent demonstrations, they can guard stuff, and they can detain, but they cannot arrest and they cannot just open up at the first shot fired and go to town. Not entirely true. The active military forces cannot be used for law enforcement purposes, it’s true. The _Posse Commitatus_ Act makes that plain. It also applies to reserve and national guard units activated under federal authority. However, national guard troops activated under the authority of the state governor derive their authority from the state constitution, and may be deputized and act as law enforcement officers. ---
**Author:** ![Xploder](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/x/a183cd/32.png) [@Xploder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Xploder)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2005, 7:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/superdome-evacuation-stopped-after-shots-fired-at-helicopter/319576/89 "2005-09-01T19:19:07Z")
> [@bordelond](#): > > This suggests to me that the National Guard is helpless. Either they can fire in defense or they cannot. > > So the first shot whizzes over their heads … they can do nothing. > > The second shot … still nothing? > > The third shot rips through one of the Guardsmen’s arms > > … > > The one hundredth shot pierces someone’s skull. > At what point are they allowed to fight back? Fine except that he specifically said {b]the REGULAR ARMY\*\* not the Guard. ---
**Author:** ![Larry\_Mudd](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/f14d63/32.png) [@Larry\_Mudd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Larry_Mudd)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2005, 7:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/superdome-evacuation-stopped-after-shots-fired-at-helicopter/319576/90 "2005-09-01T19:22:01Z")
> [@bordelond](#): > > **Larry** , where did you find this out? It was just on CNN. ---
**Author:** ![Xploder](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/x/a183cd/32.png) [@Xploder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Xploder)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2005, 7:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/superdome-evacuation-stopped-after-shots-fired-at-helicopter/319576/91 "2005-09-01T19:22:41Z")
> [@hillbilly queen](#): > > I’m suprised more people haven’t voiced that oppinion. It’s so obvious. What’s obvious? Are you seriously saying that if all the troops in Iraq weren’t there then we’d have more help for rescue efforts? You do realize that almost none of those troops would be available for immediate relief efforts even if they weren’t in Iraq, right? A hell of a lot of them would be at various bases in Europe and other points around the globe. Unless you’re advocating that we should always keep ALL of our troops right here just in case they might be needed for a natural disaster relief effort. ---
**Author:** ![bordelond](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bordelond/32/150_2.png) [@bordelond](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bordelond)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2005, 7:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/superdome-evacuation-stopped-after-shots-fired-at-helicopter/319576/92 "2005-09-01T19:25:36Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > Not entirely true. > > The active military forces cannot be used for law enforcement purposes, it’s true. The _Posse Commitatus_ Act makes that plain. It also applies to reserve and national guard units activated under federal authority. > > However, national guard troops activated under the authority of the state governor derive their authority from the state constitution, and may be deputized and act as law enforcement officers. All you people saying that the National Guard can’t do anything needs to explain [this passage](http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20050901/ap_on_re_us/hurricane_katrina_30) to me: > [@](#): > > Homeland Security Secretary Michael Chertoff said the government is sending in 1,400 National Guardsmen a day to help stop looting and other lawlessness in New Orleans in the wake of Hurricane Katrina. Already, 2,800 National Guardsmen are in the city, he said. So, what can they really do to “stop … lawlessness”? **Airman** , you basically said their hands are tied. Might this not be a situation where rule of law is ignored for a while? ---
**Author:** ![bordelond](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bordelond/32/150_2.png) [@bordelond](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bordelond)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2005, 7:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/superdome-evacuation-stopped-after-shots-fired-at-helicopter/319576/93 "2005-09-01T19:29:50Z")
> [@Larry Mudd](#): > > It was just on CNN. **Snowboarder** , \*\*Askia \*\* – the national news is now confirming a lot of what I’ve been hearing about all morning. ---
**Author:** ![Askia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/96bed5/32.png) [@Askia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Askia)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2005, 7:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/superdome-evacuation-stopped-after-shots-fired-at-helicopter/319576/94 "2005-09-01T19:31:47Z")
I’m watching it, too. I may owe you an apology. ---
**Author:** ![Duke\_of\_Rat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ad7895/32.png) [@Duke\_of\_Rat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Duke_of_Rat)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2005, 7:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/superdome-evacuation-stopped-after-shots-fired-at-helicopter/319576/95 "2005-09-01T19:32:21Z")
> [@Larry Mudd](#): > > Christ. > > Reports are now coming in that the evacuation efforts at Charity Hospital have ground to a halt because workers were taking fucking sniper fire while trying to move patients out of intensive care. Sorry, Larry. This can’t be right. > [@Snowboarder Bo](#): > > **As I cited** the people in direct control and communication with **all air traffic** have no reports of shots being fired. Even the man on the ground only says he has a report, not that he has confirmation. Crawl back into your survival bunker, throw the blanket back over your head, and wait for further instructions. :wally ---
**Author:** ![Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/8edcca/32.png) [@Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hentor_the_Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2005, 7:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/superdome-evacuation-stopped-after-shots-fired-at-helicopter/319576/96 "2005-09-01T19:40:46Z")
> [@bordelond](#): > > **Snowboarder** , \*\*Askia \*\* – the national news is now confirming a lot of what I’ve been hearing about all morning. Really. Any news on the bit about the armed gunmen taking over a building, especially the Convention Center? > [@bordelond](#): > > BTW – it’s not one shot fired. There are reports of large buildings in the city (the Convention Center for one) that have been taken over by armed gangs. Sorry, no cite – take or leave this info. ---
**Author:** ![Winnie](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e480ec/32.png) [@Winnie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Winnie)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2005, 7:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/superdome-evacuation-stopped-after-shots-fired-at-helicopter/319576/97 "2005-09-01T19:46:15Z")
Here’s the latest on the gunmen targeting the hospitals and medical supplies: [New Orleans’ Charity Hospital halted efforts to evacuate its patients after it came under sniper fire, according to Dr. Tyler Curiel, who witnessed the incidents.](http://www.cnn.com/2005/WEATHER/09/01/katrina.impact/index.html) ---
**Author:** ![wolf\_meister](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wolf_meister/32/15202_2.png) [@wolf\_meister](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wolf_meister)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2005, 7:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/superdome-evacuation-stopped-after-shots-fired-at-helicopter/319576/98 "2005-09-01T19:47:29Z")
**Airman Doors** As you probably know, on May 4, 1970, the Ohio National Guard at Kent State University used deadly force without 1 shot ever being fired at them. I don’t want to debate the events of that 35 year old incident. However, it does show that sometimes, the National Guard does a little bit more than just guard things. ---
**Author:** ![bordelond](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bordelond/32/150_2.png) [@bordelond](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bordelond)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2005, 7:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/superdome-evacuation-stopped-after-shots-fired-at-helicopter/319576/99 "2005-09-01T19:50:52Z")
> [@Hentor the Barbarian](#): > > Really. Any news on the bit about the armed gunmen taking over a building, especially the Convention Center? [Here](http://saintsreport.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=172372) is where I learned of that. I know and trust the guy that posted it. That won’t impress most here, but so be it. Being that the raiding of the Convention Center happened last night, I wonder if the armed thugs moved on afterwards. That, I don’t know. After a lot of this stuff dies down, there will be stories and accounts coming out of a lot of things that happened during Katrina’s aftermath that aren’t being reported now. ---
**Author:** ![Ike\_Witt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ike_witt/32/283_2.png) [@Ike\_Witt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ike_Witt)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2005, 7:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/superdome-evacuation-stopped-after-shots-fired-at-helicopter/319576/100 "2005-09-01T19:51:47Z")
Does all this mean that our entire society is only about 3 bad days from collapse? I don’t remember hearing about crap like this after the tsunami. I am seriously going to re-think my personal situation and consider stockpiling some canned goods and getting a shotgun for my house. Hey **Padeye** , if I bring food and beer can I crash at your place during the apocalypse? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/superdome-evacuation-stopped-after-shots-fired-at-helicopter/319576.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/superdome-evacuation-stopped-after-shots-fired-at-helicopter/319576.md?page=6)