# Supposably - have mispronounced words become standard? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [February 17, 2015, 12:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/supposably-have-mispronounced-words-become-standard/712875 "2015-02-17T00:36:45Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 7
**Author:** ![jz78817](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jz78817/32/1028_2.png) [@jz78817](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jz78817)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2015, 4:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/supposably-have-mispronounced-words-become-standard/712875/121 "2015-02-19T04:09:35Z")
> [@Keeve](#): > > Yes, I agree, I would know exactly what they were talking about. > > But if someone is talking about a digestive tract, then I would expect them to at least occasionally read about digestive tracts. When someone pronounces it as “track”, they are announcing that they don’t read about it, or they don’t read enough about it. > > It’s not the mispronunciation that makes them sound ignorant. It’s the lack of reading. so when someone from Pittsburgh says “the car needs washed,” does that mean they haven’t read enough about verbs? ---
**Author:** ![Ambivalid](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/a5b964/32.png) [@Ambivalid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ambivalid)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2015, 4:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/supposably-have-mispronounced-words-become-standard/712875/122 "2015-02-19T04:12:30Z")
> [@Keeve](#): > > Next Wensday, I’ll aks you to put a nucular bomb in the digestive track of anyone who says “Febuary”. Supposably, I’d be comftorble with that. “Progressive English”. You’re a trailblazer. 🆒 ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2015, 4:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/supposably-have-mispronounced-words-become-standard/712875/123 "2015-02-19T04:16:38Z")
> [@Keeve](#): > > Next Wensday, I’ll aks you to put a nucular bomb in the digestive track of anyone who says “Febuary”. Supposably, I’d be comftorble with that. Does anyone actually pronounce the “d” in “Wednesday”? I’ve never heard it. The only variation I’ve heard is whether you pronounce the last syllable as “day” or “dee.” ---
**Author:** ![ellie303](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/53a042/32.png) [@ellie303](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ellie303)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2015, 4:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/supposably-have-mispronounced-words-become-standard/712875/124 "2015-02-19T04:54:08Z")
> [@Ornery\_Bob](#): > > I occasionally hear someone say “supposably” as a mispronunciation of “supposedly” and I’m wondering of there are examples of where this sort of mispronunciation has actually become the standard. > > My guess would be that such words would have to be from before standardized spelling got going as the written forms are easily seen to be quite different, but from a purely verbal standpoint, it’s not that big of a difference. > > Obviously, when words get borrowed from other languages they often undergo pronunciation shifts, but I’m thinking more of something where the unwashed masses have misheard a word and made it their own. > > So etymology mavens… any “mispronounced” words that are now standard? I personally use ‘‘gotta’’ instead of ‘‘have to’’ and ‘‘gonna’’ instead of ‘‘going to’’, but I’m trying not to because it can make people sound uneducated. Supposably sounds really ignorant to me. I don’t know how that pronunciation could ever be part of the English language. ---
**Author:** ![guizot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guizot/32/3636_2.png) [@guizot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/guizot)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2015, 7:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/supposably-have-mispronounced-words-become-standard/712875/125 "2015-02-19T07:21:42Z")
> [@ellie303](#): > > I personally use ‘‘gotta’’ instead of ‘‘have to’’ and ‘‘gonna’’ instead of ‘‘going to’’, but I’m trying not to because it can make people sound uneducated. Who exactly do you think sounds uneducated? Tim Cook, CEO of apple? [Auburn University (B.S.) Duke University (M.B.A.)]: [1:16 on the video the interview](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tH_WuWbVyeM), when saying: [QUOTE=Tim Cook] I wanted you to ask him because I wanted to hear what they were **going to** say. [/quote] Or maybe you think Harvard Law professor Stehphen Carter sounds uneducated here ([1:55 in the interview](http://www.npr.org/2014/12/13/370538639/yale-law-professor-torture-is-never-justified)), when he says (about torture): [QUOTE=Stephen Carter] I’ve written about it many times in the past. I thought it was a terrible thing for the United States to do, but that doesn’t mean I’m **going to** sit here and claim that no good information ever came out of it. [/quote] These are just two randomly pulled examples of the Standard (educated) American English pronunciation of the pariphrastic modal (_be_) _going to_ as /gənə/–it’s normal, educated pronunciation–it isn’t marked or stigmatized in any way. Just because it “looks bad” when people transcribe it as “gonna” doesn’t mean that it’s uneducated. You hear (educated) people saying this all the time without batting an eye. It’s only when you become self-conscious about it (seeing it written that way) that you panic and think there’s something wrong with /gənə/, when in fact there’s nothing uneducated about it. (The same can be said for /wana/.) Spelling by and large doesn’t dictate speech–people naturally speak they way they do regardless of spelling. (Humans start to speak fluently and profusely without ever needing to read.) Speech is a natural human act, while writing is artifice, contrived to generally represent speech (it’s not a phonetic transcription, and isn’t meant to be, at least with English). Often (maybe most of the time) the way (even educated) people talk doesn’t “correspond” to the writing system in a truly representative way–and it doesn’t really have to. ---
**Author:** ![Indistinguishable](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/90ced4/32.png) [@Indistinguishable](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Indistinguishable)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2015, 7:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/supposably-have-mispronounced-words-become-standard/712875/126 "2015-02-19T07:48:08Z")
> [@RealityChuck](#): > > Then you’ve accepted the change; the word had three syllables originally. Are we sure that, historically, “comfortable” was not first pronounced as four-syllable “comfort-able”? That seems most likely to me. [Which isn’t to deny that the three-syllable pronunciation became common at some point in time, or to insist that people ought pronounce it one way or another. Everything’s a-ok by me. I’m just curious about the empirical, historical question.] ---
**Author:** ![Grotonian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/c2a13f/32.png) [@Grotonian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Grotonian)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2015, 12:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/supposably-have-mispronounced-words-become-standard/712875/127 "2015-02-19T12:19:03Z")
No one says “maraschino” cherries properly. The word is mara-skee-no, but I’m the only one who says it that way. ---
**Author:** ![guizot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guizot/32/3636_2.png) [@guizot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/guizot)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2015, 2:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/supposably-have-mispronounced-words-become-standard/712875/128 "2015-02-19T14:35:09Z")
> [@Grotonian](#): > > No one says “maraschino” cherries properly. The word is mara-skee-no, but I’m the only one who says it that way. Thank you for your service. ---
**Author:** ![bump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7c8e57/32.png) [@bump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bump)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2015, 3:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/supposably-have-mispronounced-words-become-standard/712875/129 "2015-02-19T15:35:11Z")
> [@jz78817](#): > > so when someone from Pittsburgh says “the car needs washed,” does that mean they haven’t read enough about verbs? I think maybe “reading about it” isn’t quite what **Keeve** is getting at. Maybe not being self-aware enough to realize that you’re mispronouncing a word, and therefore ignorant of what’s actually coming out of your own mouth is more accurate. I mean, I cringe every time I hear someone say “digestive track” How the heck can you know that the word is spelled T-R-A-C-T, and yet still pronounce it “track”? There’s a huge difference between that kind of thing, and words adapted from other languages a thousand years ago, and consequently having had the pronunciation and spelling shift. The first shows a lack of knowledge/awareness of what the actual pronunciation should be - it’s tract, not track. The second is common usage; I’d be equally likely to look at someone as ignorant if they pronounced Wednesday it “Wed-nez-day”. It’s ultimately the same thing as misspellings. There’s a correct way to spell a word, and not being able to do it shows ignorance (i.e. lack of being exposed to the correct spelling enough) or lack of concern/attention. End of story. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2015, 4:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/supposably-have-mispronounced-words-become-standard/712875/130 "2015-02-19T16:04:05Z")
> [@Grotonian](#): > > No one says “maraschino” cherries properly. The word is mara-skee-no, but I’m the only one who says it that way. I encounter the same problem with “bruschetta.” I’ve just given up and gone with the English “sh” pronunciation instead of the more native “k” pronunciation. “Dachshund” is another one that gets butchered, no matter one’s intelligence. I hear “DASH-und” all the time. ---
**Author:** ![LSLGuy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lslguy/32/5813_2.png) [@LSLGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LSLGuy)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2015, 5:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/supposably-have-mispronounced-words-become-standard/712875/131 "2015-02-19T17:09:23Z")
> [@bump](#): > > … The first shows a lack of knowledge/awareness of what the actual pronunciation should be - it’s tract, not track. The second is common usage; I’d be equally likely to look at someone as ignorant if they pronounced Wednesday it “Wed-nez-day”. … My aged MIL pronounces Connecticut as, well, Connect - ih - cut. The first “t” is \*fully \*pronounced. She’s always pronounced it this way and she even lived there from roughly age 20-40, so 20ish years. And she’s otherwise quite proper in her grammar and speech. If asked, she’ll say she’s saying it right and most other people are saying it wrong. AFAIK, nobody else anywhere pronounces that first “t”. Does anyone know of anyone else who does this? Where / how did she pick this up? ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2015, 5:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/supposably-have-mispronounced-words-become-standard/712875/132 "2015-02-19T17:19:46Z")
> [@bump](#): > > I think maybe “reading about it” isn’t quite what **Keeve** is getting at. Maybe not being self-aware enough to realize that you’re mispronouncing a word, and therefore ignorant of what’s actually coming out of your own mouth is more accurate. > > I mean, I cringe every time I hear someone say “digestive track” How the heck can you know that the word is spelled T-R-A-C-T, and yet still pronounce it “track”? > > There’s a huge difference between that kind of thing, and words adapted from other languages a thousand years ago, and consequently having had the pronunciation and spelling shift. > > The first shows a lack of knowledge/awareness of what the actual pronunciation should be - it’s tract, not track. The second is common usage; I’d be equally likely to look at someone as ignorant if they pronounced Wednesday it “Wed-nez-day”. > > It’s ultimately the same thing as misspellings. There’s a correct way to spell a word, and not being able to do it shows ignorance (i.e. lack of being exposed to the correct spelling enough) or lack of concern/attention. End of story. In spontaneous speech, it sounds to me like most American speakers I know elide over the “t.” If I says “facts of life,” it comes out like “fax of life.” Only if I am speaking slowly and deliberately does that “t” get heard. I don’t think this is an unusual speech feature in many dialects (or “dialecks” as I probably say it in rapid speech.) Then again, I am from Chicago with an accent, so I guess I must just sound ignorant and uneducated to youse guys. ---
**Author:** ![sich\_hinaufwinden](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c5a1d2/32.png) [@sich\_hinaufwinden](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sich_hinaufwinden)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2015, 6:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/supposably-have-mispronounced-words-become-standard/712875/133 "2015-02-19T18:07:34Z")
> [@LSLGuy](#): > > My aged MIL pronounces Connecticut as, well, Connect - ih - cut. The first “t” is \*fully \*pronounced. > > She’s always pronounced it this way and she even lived there from roughly age 20-40, so 20ish years. And she’s otherwise quite proper in her grammar and speech. If asked, she’ll say she’s saying it right and most other people are saying it wrong. > > AFAIK, nobody else anywhere pronounces that first “t”. > > Does anyone know of anyone else who does this? Where / how did she pick this up? I thought everyone pronounced that “t”. It’s the “c” right before it that I don’t pronounce and the dictionary notes that is standard pronunciation: [kuh-net-i-kuh t] ---
**Author:** ![CurtC](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ce73a5/32.png) [@CurtC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CurtC)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2015, 6:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/supposably-have-mispronounced-words-become-standard/712875/134 "2015-02-19T18:07:39Z")
> [@bump](#): > > I mean, I cringe every time I hear someone say “digestive track” How the heck can you know that the word is spelled T-R-A-C-T, and yet still pronounce it “track”? I’m not sure whether I’ve ever heard anyone say “digestive track.” The original point here was about the plural, with a complaint that some people pronounce it “digestive tracks.” My point was that when most people speak, you couldn’t hear the difference. I can force myself to say a clear “t” sound when saying “tracts,” but it is physically difficult to do and sounds very awkward. I added that if I heard anyone do this in conversation I’d think he was a pedantic asshole. ---
**Author:** ![gigi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a587f6/32.png) [@gigi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gigi)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2015, 6:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/supposably-have-mispronounced-words-become-standard/712875/135 "2015-02-19T18:12:57Z")
> [@pulykamell](#): > > I encounter the same problem with “bruschetta.” I’ve just given up and gone with the English “sh” pronunciation instead of the more native “k” pronunciation. > > “Dachshund” is another one that gets butchered, no matter one’s intelligence. I hear “DASH-und” all the time. I cling to “broosketta”. I have a colleague who goes all the way to “dash-hound”. ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2015, 7:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/supposably-have-mispronounced-words-become-standard/712875/136 "2015-02-19T19:28:07Z")
I actually heard someone say “mara-skee-noh” just two days ago, how about that. I once had the mother of a girl I was dating tell me (she lived in the States, I’m Canadian) that I didn’t pronounce my “dip-thongs” correctly. I told her I’d start pronouncing them the way she wanted when she learned to say “diphthong,” which doesn’t have a “P” sound in it. That relationship didn’t last. ---
**Author:** ![newme](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/e0b2c6/32.png) [@newme](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/newme)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2015, 8:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/supposably-have-mispronounced-words-become-standard/712875/137 "2015-02-19T20:18:31Z")
[QUOTE=bump;18146031 I mean, I cringe every time I hear someone say “digestive track” How the heck can you know that the word is spelled T-R-A-C-T, and yet still pronounce it “track”? [/QUOTE] [That’s the fack, Jack!](http://youtu.be/FOzub_ghAbM?t=1m36s) ---
**Author:** ![Senegoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/senegoid/32/6606_2.png) [@Senegoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Senegoid)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2015, 8:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/supposably-have-mispronounced-words-become-standard/712875/138 "2015-02-19T20:46:33Z")
> [@RickJay](#): > > I once had the mother of a girl I was dating tell me (she lived in the States, I’m Canadian) that I didn’t pronounce my “dip-thongs” correctly. I told her I’d start pronouncing them the way she wanted when she learned to say “diphthong,” which doesn’t have a “P” sound in it. So how do you pronounce [phthalein](http://www.thefreedictionary.com/phthalein) or [phenolphthalein](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phenolphthalein)? In phthalein, apparently, the ph is silent. In phenolphthalein, it should be pronounced as “f” (the second ph, before the th)? I’ve generally heard that word pronounced with the second ph silent also. How do most people say these words? (Of course, it might be only an elite few people who ever have occasion to say these words at all.) ---
**Author:** ![Senegoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/senegoid/32/6606_2.png) [@Senegoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Senegoid)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2015, 8:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/supposably-have-mispronounced-words-become-standard/712875/139 "2015-02-19T20:48:45Z")
Dachs (with the German “ch”) hoont. ---
**Author:** ![Senegoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/senegoid/32/6606_2.png) [@Senegoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Senegoid)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2015, 8:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/supposably-have-mispronounced-words-become-standard/712875/140 "2015-02-19T20:57:37Z")
> [@pulykamell](#): > > In spontaneous speech, it sounds to me like most American speakers I know elide over the “t.” If I says “facts of life,” it comes out like “fax of life.” Only if I am speaking slowly and deliberately does that “t” get heard. I don’t think this is an unusual speech feature in many dialects (or “dialecks” as I probably say it in rapid speech.) Eliding sounds or slurring adjacent sounds together is a fact of life is spoken language in general, especially in casual spoken language. For example, Hebrew has the common phrase מה העיניינים (or מָה הָעִנְיָנִים in another spelling I found) (mah ha-`inyanim) meaning, idiomatically, “What’s the matter?” But in ordinary spoken conversation, it’s always reduced to “man-ya-nim” (the vowels here sound similar to Spanish vowels). [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/supposably-have-mispronounced-words-become-standard/712875.md?page=6) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/supposably-have-mispronounced-words-become-standard/712875.md?page=8)