Former professor checking in. IMHO, it is definitely cheating. For those who say that the prof didn’t protect the test, would you say that someone who was robbed didn’t protect their purse, or someone who was raped didn’t protect herself?
Anything that cicumvents you actually learning the material (gee, what a concept!) is a bad idea.
Geez Brynda it’s not “robbing” if the information is freely available to anybody that wants to copy/memorize it off your door. If you post the info in such a public forum, the info is open and available to whoever passes by. And to link this to rape; :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes:
And ruber ruber; if the teacher is known to give the same test semester after semester and post the answers to the test on his/her door I submit that the proferssor is not really interested in testing the knowledge base of the students. IMHO the prof is just going thru the motions and I think the students should get whatever they can out of the course on their own. I would also, with no ethical qualms at all, suggest that they use any freely available “public” data to get the best grade possible.
And ruber ruber; if the teacher is known to give the same test semester after semester and post the answers to the test on his/her door I submit that the prof is not really interested in testing the knowledge base of the students. IMHO the prof is just going thru the motions and I think the students should get whatever they can out of the course on their own. I would also, with no ethical qualms at all, suggest that they use any freely available “public” data to get the best grade possible.
Are you here for the education or the degree?
I would hope that most students are there for both.
In most cases, yes. But a professor giving the exact same test every semester has to expect students will get their hands on them.
Unless the professor tells you not to look at old tests, it isn’t cheating. In fact, I have had professors who encourage students to study old tests. Depending on the type of test, studying old tests can help you learn the material.
This would make the professor:
A) Stupid
B) Lazy
C) Naive
D) All of the above
Actually, in my former discipline, not changing tests wouldn’t make a lick of difference. Often enough in philosophy test questions are given out in advance. This tends not to make exams any easier.
Why not just talk to the prof, tell him that you’ve heard that several students have access to last year’s exam, and ask him whether that’s expected or whether you should avoid using it?
There’s a chance that he’ll say, “Sure, use all the resources available to you.” There’s also a chance that he’ll take the hint and change his exam (thereby not screwing you for being one of the few who didn’t study the old one).
Here’s my opinion as a student labouring under a very strict academic honor code:
a lower grade is always much better than an academic honor code violation on your transcript. Not a single person who has been in a “dicey” or borderline situation at my school has gotten away with it in front of the ethics committee. In case of doubt, ask the professor as to what the deal is with the non-returned test/public posting of answers. Is he trying to use the same test from year-to-year? It may be that he just keeps the same format of the exams but switches up the wording/numbers. If you have a chat with him you might be able to get him to write you a practice test, may not. But at least you will never have to explain to the Bar, employers, future graduate schools, whatever why you have that mark on your transcript.
In my case I one day asked a professor I was writing a paper for if a certain phrase used by a judge would be considered common enough to just put in my paper without a footnote (he said yes). Is it nitpicky? Yes, but the school has been on the warpath with the academic honor code and I don’t relish going in front of the Bar ethics committee explaining an honor code violation check box on my Bar app… They are not…sympathetic.
So my vote is go talk to the professor and see if you can get something out of him to help you.
**anu-la1979 ** Of course, you are correct with “So my vote is go talk to the professor.” Every time I see threads like this, this is the answer that can get the questioner 100% off the hook, safely, with no worries whatsoever. But that usually isn’t what the questioner is looking for. (Not sure about the OP here). Usually what the questioner wants is “Will you nice folks give me permission to do something I know is wrong?” and usually some nice accomodating enabler will appear.
Like sinjin , for example. "I would hope that most students are there for both. " Gosh, that’s an amazing answer–I never would have thought of that. How clever! Both? I’ll need to think that one over. Man, you sure caught me by surprise with your lightning wit and analysis. I have really been put in my place.
Acting-Professor (grad student who’s run Calc 3 for three years now). It’s probably unethical, but it isn’t cheating. Here’s a scratch test: can the exact same functional result occur with no ill intent? That is, I’d say if the determiner is entirely based on intent then it’s not an offense.
Let’s say Alice and Bob are each preparing for an exam. Alice decides to review an old exam by the same examiner on the theory that it will cover similar material, so she gets an old test and studies it. Bob’s friend Eve tells him that this examiner always uses the exact same test, so he gets an old test and studies it. Functionally, both Alice and Bob have acted identically, differing only in their intents and reasons. Is there any rational ground in treating them differently, especially given the near-impossibility of proving unethical intent after the fact? Alice and Bob must clearly pass or fail together, and I’m very uncomfortable denying Alice a grade because she may have been acting like Bob.
But I think Alice and Bob would use the old exams differently - Alice would use it as one piece of her studying strategy - probably reading over each question, making sure she understands how the correct answer was derived, etc., and moving on to other material. Whereas Bob will memorize every detail of the old exam, making sure he can duplicate the answers from memory, and do little or nothing else. When they both sit down for the exam, Alice will certainly have an advantage because she’s seen the same questions before, but Bob will just be able to write down what he’s memorized. I guess the difference is you could train someone with a good memory but no knowledge of the subject material to pass via Bob’s method, but not via Alice’s method, even though they are using the same materials.
I took a 2 year diploma program (that turned into 3 years because I had a little too much fun!).
The head of the program taught 2 semester of COBOL, he had taught both semesters for ~14 years. He has used the same book, the same overhead slides, and you guessed it the same exam questions. How ever he had a pool of about 150 questions, when he would create a mid-term or final, he would grab X number of questions and create a test.
So I had 2 friends that was in the program before me (different years), and I took booth semesters twice and I saved all midterms and finals (and got all the midterms and finals from my friends). So by the time my buddy took the course and I gave him all tests I had in my posession he had every question.
The thing is it’s the professors lazyness. The least he could do is change some variables. But bottom line you are learning by studying the old exams. So when I took the final exam of the last semester I was confident that even if he changed the variables in the questions or had completly new questions I would be fine.
MtM
But you, as the instructor, must distinguish betweenn the two cases a posteriori. That’s my point. You can tell that they studied from an old exam but you can’t tell why they did. As a real-world practical question you have to judge them both the same. The distinction is one of ethics internal to the student. Is it right? possibly not. Is it legal? yes.
Not necessarily. Say that the prof gives essay exams, and you memorized a sort of “bullet points” version of an answer that got an A in the past. You may now have enough knowledge to be able to answer a different, but related question - which is exactly the sort of change a prof would be most likely to make, right?
Looks around, yep this is IMHO and not the pit. I have been giving my humble opinion, as a 16 year professor. For the record: In My Humble Opinion using old exams as study aids is not unethical.
Oh, and since my response above was based on this comment by ruber ruber:
I also have to say : Pot------Kettle :wally
I thought I would just post a little update. Well, I gave in to pressure and ended up getting the test. The main reason for this was due to the fact that I found out that quite a few other people had it as well. I felt it had gotten so that you didn’t so much have an advantage by getting as you were at a disadvantage by not having it. If that makes any sense.
Anyway, the test was absolutely nothing like the previous years. IMO it was much more difficult, but I really studied hard for the test and assume I must have done well. I ended up with an A in the course. Thanks for everyone’s advice and opinions.