# Supreme Court \[declines to hear\] same sex marriage cases.\[plus further developments (Ed.)\] **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [October 6, 2014, 1:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/supreme-court-declines-to-hear-same-sex-marriage-cases-plus-further-developments-ed/700544 "2014-10-06T13:50:23Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 36
**Author:** ![Merneith](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/57b2e6/32.png) [@Merneith](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Merneith)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2015, 8:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/supreme-court-declines-to-hear-same-sex-marriage-cases-plus-further-developments-ed/700544/701 "2015-06-28T20:04:02Z")
> [@MaxTheVool](#): > > Bigotry has lost one big legal battle, but it still has an unfortunate amount of power, and the way to decrease that bigotry, imho, is not by compromising (because we are right and they are wrong) but it’s also not with mockery and derision. Ah, I see the problem. You appear to have mistaken this for “Be Nice To Bigots” week. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2015, 8:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/supreme-court-declines-to-hear-same-sex-marriage-cases-plus-further-developments-ed/700544/702 "2015-06-28T20:07:52Z")
> [@Merneith](#): > > Ah, I see the problem. You appear to have mistaken this for “Be Nice To Bigots” week. Didn’t we _just_ have “Be Nice To Bigots” Century? ---
**Author:** ![rat\_avatar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rat_avatar/32/255_2.png) [@rat\_avatar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rat_avatar)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2015, 8:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/supreme-court-declines-to-hear-same-sex-marriage-cases-plus-further-developments-ed/700544/703 "2015-06-28T20:14:16Z")
Refusing to call these people hate-mongering bigots, is like refusing to call somebody who kills unjustly a murderer. These types of attitudes actually condone the behavior in question and communicate that there is nothing wrong with it. Respecting hate-mongering bigotry or murder means saying that there is nothing wrong with hate-mongering bigotry or murder. ---
**Author:** ![alphaboi867](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alphaboi867/32/3898_2.png) [@alphaboi867](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alphaboi867)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2015, 8:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/supreme-court-declines-to-hear-same-sex-marriage-cases-plus-further-developments-ed/700544/704 "2015-06-28T20:16:53Z")
> [@t-bonham@scc.net](#): > > …\* Presumably, some employers could just decide to drop benefits for all married employees, straight or gay. But that would be pretty vicious, and would tend to really annoy your current employees, and possibly lead them to look for jobs elsewhere. IIRC several Catholic charities & school systems responded to the legalization of same-sex marriage in their state by dropping spousal benefits while grandfathering everyone who was already receiving them. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2015, 8:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/supreme-court-declines-to-hear-same-sex-marriage-cases-plus-further-developments-ed/700544/705 "2015-06-28T20:57:28Z")
> [@silenus](#): > > The bolded part also covers the prohibition against polygamy quite well. Wait a minute. Are you claiming there is a “polygamy taboo” that is part of our nature as humans? That would be astonishing, if true, considering the widespread practice of polygamy. ---
**Author:** ![tomndebb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b9e5f3/32.png) [@tomndebb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tomndebb)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2015, 9:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/supreme-court-declines-to-hear-same-sex-marriage-cases-plus-further-developments-ed/700544/706 "2015-06-28T21:03:31Z")
> [@alphaboi867](#): > > IIRC several Catholic charities & school systems responded to the legalization of same-sex marriage in their state by dropping spousal benefits while grandfathering everyone who was already receiving them. I have no problem believing that this occurred in various Catholic schools. Do you have a citation for it occurring among Catholic charities? (I would be surprised to see that occur even in Lincoln, NE or St. Paul, MN, (the sites of the most openly hostile Archbishops), and it does not strike me as typical of most other diocese. just curious. ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2015, 9:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/supreme-court-declines-to-hear-same-sex-marriage-cases-plus-further-developments-ed/700544/707 "2015-06-28T21:18:20Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > Wait a minute. Are you claiming there is a “polygamy taboo” that is part of our nature as humans? That would be astonishing, if true, considering the widespread practice of polygamy. In no way. I’d say “read for comprehension” but I like you and probably screwed up the phrasing. What I’m saying is the bolded part “Decreasing tensions, preventing insularity, etc.” is also a reason for _legally_ prohibiting polygamy, as it causes many of the same problems. There certainly isn’t a _societal_ taboo - hell, the Bible supports it whole-heartedly in some places. ---
**Author:** ![Tim\_T-Bonham.net](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/46a35a/32.png) [@Tim\_T-Bonham.net](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tim_T-Bonham.net)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2015, 11:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/supreme-court-declines-to-hear-same-sex-marriage-cases-plus-further-developments-ed/700544/708 "2015-06-28T23:07:38Z")
> [@tomndebb](#): > > I have no problem believing that this occurred in various Catholic schools. Do you have a citation for it occurring among Catholic charities? (I would be surprised to see that occur even in Lincoln, NE or St. Paul, MN, (the sites of the most openly hostile Archbishops), and it does not strike me as typical of most other diocese. Not in St. Paul any more – he resigned. Got caught with his hand both on the altar boys and, worse, in the till. He got away with the first. The prosecutor declined to pursue the case due to an important legal principle (about a third of the St. Paul voters are Catholic). But private attorneys don’t have to be elected, and their civil damage lawsuits have caused the Archdiocese to file for bankruptcy so they can hide their assets. The current acting archbishop isn’t much better, but eventually this Pope might appoint a good one. ---
**Author:** ![Anduril](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/c0e974/32.png) [@Anduril](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Anduril)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2015, 11:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/supreme-court-declines-to-hear-same-sex-marriage-cases-plus-further-developments-ed/700544/709 "2015-06-28T23:43:50Z")
> [@JRDelirious](#): > > Because the prohibition on incestuous marriage is based on a compelling state interest, namely preventing damage to family cohesion, the abuse of the legaly privileged family bond, the genetic health risks, and the misuse of the process in ways such as **t-bonham** ’s Ford heirs example. An “important social objective” and a “reasonable means” to that end. Civil laws need not be based on some sort of transcendent principle. Do these compelling state interests outweigh a fundamental right, particularly when the dangers you alluded to may not be operative in all cases? > [@](#): > > Does this mean that therefore we can’t absolutely say “incestuous marriage will never EVER be normalized, it’s fundamentally impossible”? Well, sure. But it’s just extraordinarily unlikely in our lifetimes. Normalization as a prerequisite for the establishment of the right seems to assume that the change will happen via democratic instruments. The SCOTUS ruling made it clear that such was not necessary. A person inclined to take the cudgels for incestuous and/or polyamorous marriages can seek redress in the same way that the Plaintiffs for the marriage equality case have. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [June 29, 2015, 12:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/supreme-court-declines-to-hear-same-sex-marriage-cases-plus-further-developments-ed/700544/710 "2015-06-29T00:19:45Z")
This just in: [Texas State Attorney General tells state workers they can deny licenses to same-sex couples.](http://abc13.com/news/paxton-state-workers-can-deny-licenses-to-same-sex-couples/813013/) He says Texas is ready to use state funds to defend, free of charge, any public official refusing to grant one. ---
**Author:** ![Ionizer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/5daacb/32.png) [@Ionizer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ionizer)\ **Post date:** [June 29, 2015, 12:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/supreme-court-declines-to-hear-same-sex-marriage-cases-plus-further-developments-ed/700544/711 "2015-06-29T00:59:57Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > This just in: [Texas State Attorney General tells state workers they can deny licenses to same-sex couples.](http://abc13.com/news/paxton-state-workers-can-deny-licenses-to-same-sex-couples/813013/) He says Texas is ready to use state funds to defend, free of charge, any public official refusing to grant one. I am really, really curious about this. In the view of ‘separation-of-church and State’, can an official (of Public Office) be found guilty of civil rights violation(s) or something similar (even criminal)? Be stripped of duties by a Court for not doing their (assumedly) sworn duties according to the laws established, etc? Any chance of the ‘refusers’ to have ANY ground to stand upon? What sayeth the legal minds? Fight my ignorance, please! It just sounds so preposterous. ---
**Author:** ![oft\_wears\_hats](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/7993a0/32.png) [@oft\_wears\_hats](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/oft_wears_hats)\ **Post date:** [June 29, 2015, 1:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/supreme-court-declines-to-hear-same-sex-marriage-cases-plus-further-developments-ed/700544/712 "2015-06-29T01:06:01Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > This just in: [Texas State Attorney General tells state workers they can deny licenses to same-sex couples.](http://abc13.com/news/paxton-state-workers-can-deny-licenses-to-same-sex-couples/813013/) He says Texas is ready to use state funds to defend, free of charge, any public official refusing to grant one. Wow. That is absolutely disgusting. It’s bad enough that they’re going to fight the ruling, but I expected that. What I hadn’t considered is that they would be using taxpayer money to do it. If I were a gay person living in Texas right now, being still unable to get a marriage license, and knowing that the asshole refusing to give me one would be using my tax dollars for their legal defense, I would be seething with rage. As of now, I’m mostly just simmering with rage. Not into seething country just yet, but seriously pissed off. ---
**Author:** ![Zakalwe](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/zakalwe/32/270_2.png) [@Zakalwe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zakalwe)\ **Post date:** [June 29, 2015, 1:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/supreme-court-declines-to-hear-same-sex-marriage-cases-plus-further-developments-ed/700544/713 "2015-06-29T01:26:06Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > He says Texas is ready to use state funds to defend, free of charge, any public official refusing to grant one. The article you cited doesn’t say that. It says: “But he [Paxton] says “numerous lawyers” stand ready to defend, free of charge, any public official refusing to grant one.” Granted, it doesn’t make Paxton any less of a fucking asshole, but let’s at least be accurate about what KIND of asshole he is. ---
**Author:** ![Leaper](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/4bbf92/32.png) [@Leaper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leaper)\ **Post date:** [June 29, 2015, 1:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/supreme-court-declines-to-hear-same-sex-marriage-cases-plus-further-developments-ed/700544/714 "2015-06-29T01:29:12Z")
Though it’s a reasonable assumption, since I’d imagine there are more lawyers willing to work for state money than there are willing to work pro bono for their religious beliefs. ---
**Author:** ![oft\_wears\_hats](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/7993a0/32.png) [@oft\_wears\_hats](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/oft_wears_hats)\ **Post date:** [June 29, 2015, 1:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/supreme-court-declines-to-hear-same-sex-marriage-cases-plus-further-developments-ed/700544/715 "2015-06-29T01:43:16Z")
_Mod note: The video below is barely NSFW. You are hereby warned. -Jonathan Chance_ This was too good not to post here: [ARMAGAYDDON - YouTube](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ervtik_7jYQ) [Associated news article](http://www.adweek.com/adfreak/heres-how-gay-marriage-will-destroy-your-world-warns-satirical-short-film-about-armagayddon-159828) ---
**Author:** ![usedtobe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ec9cab/32.png) [@usedtobe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/usedtobe)\ **Post date:** [June 29, 2015, 4:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/supreme-court-declines-to-hear-same-sex-marriage-cases-plus-further-developments-ed/700544/716 "2015-06-29T04:58:30Z")
Paying lawyers to defend government officials when they violate the Constitution? Just what DOES it take to invoke Contempt of Court? Can the SCOTUS actually order a person jailed for Contempt? ---
**Author:** ![suranyi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e36b37/32.png) [@suranyi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/suranyi)\ **Post date:** [June 29, 2015, 6:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/supreme-court-declines-to-hear-same-sex-marriage-cases-plus-further-developments-ed/700544/717 "2015-06-29T06:14:38Z")
> [@usedtobe](#): > > Paying lawyers to defend government officials when they violate the Constitution? > > Just what DOES it take to invoke Contempt of Court? > > Can the SCOTUS actually order a person jailed for Contempt? We’ll see if it actually happens. Just in the last couple of hours I’ve read a few interviews with the Texas county workers who do this job. Generally, they go something like this: “I disagree with SCOTUS, and theoretically I agree with the AG, but in this county we will be following the law and issuing licenses to same-sex couples.” Of course, Texas has a lot of counties so maybe some tiny one somewhere won’t go along. ---
**Author:** ![usedtobe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ec9cab/32.png) [@usedtobe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/usedtobe)\ **Post date:** [June 29, 2015, 8:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/supreme-court-declines-to-hear-same-sex-marriage-cases-plus-further-developments-ed/700544/718 "2015-06-29T08:52:14Z")
A hint of reality sighted in Texas? Cruz is gonna be very upset over this development. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [June 29, 2015, 1:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/supreme-court-declines-to-hear-same-sex-marriage-cases-plus-further-developments-ed/700544/719 "2015-06-29T13:56:42Z")
> [@usedtobe](#): > > A hint of reality sighted in Texas? > > Cruz is gonna be very upset over this development. Ya think? He was on NPR this morning calling for SCOTUS justices to be elected instead of appointed. ---
**Author:** ![Boyo\_Jim](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/87869e/32.png) [@Boyo\_Jim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Boyo_Jim)\ **Post date:** [June 29, 2015, 2:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/supreme-court-declines-to-hear-same-sex-marriage-cases-plus-further-developments-ed/700544/720 "2015-06-29T14:33:24Z")
I hope the Feds can figure a way to do this legally: Send a swarm of Federal agents with arrest power to Texas, to be dispacthed anywhere a state official refuses to issue a marriage licence to a gay couple. Arrest the official on the spot for deliberate violation of the couple’s civil rights. Sure, let Texas defend these folks – after they get a taste of a jail cell. I guarantee that there won’t be more than a handfull before the rest manage to find it in their conscience to issue them. So, is there some legal means for the Feds to carry out this plan? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/supreme-court-declines-to-hear-same-sex-marriage-cases-plus-further-developments-ed/700544.md?page=35) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/supreme-court-declines-to-hear-same-sex-marriage-cases-plus-further-developments-ed/700544.md?page=37)