# Supreme Court: Religious Freedom More Important than Fighting Covid **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [November 26, 2020, 6:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/supreme-court-religious-freedom-more-important-than-fighting-covid/926466 "2020-11-26T06:11:04Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Hamlet](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hamlet/32/2818_2.png) [@Hamlet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hamlet)\ **Post date:** [November 26, 2020, 3:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/supreme-court-religious-freedom-more-important-than-fighting-covid/926466/21 "2020-11-26T15:09:54Z")
> [@Blkshp](#): > > Justice Sotomayor disagrees… > > “[States] may not discriminate against religious institutions, even when faced with a crisis as deadly as this one” > > [[Justices lift New York’s COVID-related attendance limits on worship services - SCOTUSblog](https://www.scotusblog.com/2020/11/justices-lift-new-yorks-covid-related-attendance-limits-on-worship-services/)] > . You gonna finish that quote? "“But those principles are not at stake today.” "The Constitution does not forbid states from responding to public health crises through regulations that treat religious institutions equally or more favorably than comparable secular institutions, particularly when those regulations save lives,” Justice Sotomayor wrote. “Because New York’s Covid-19 restrictions do just that, I respectfully dissent.” ---
**Author:** ![QuickSilver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quicksilver/32/7832_2.png) [@QuickSilver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/QuickSilver)\ **Post date:** [November 26, 2020, 3:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/supreme-court-religious-freedom-more-important-than-fighting-covid/926466/22 "2020-11-26T15:27:15Z")
Details shmeetails. ---
**Author:** ![FigNorton](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fignorton/32/5619_2.png) [@FigNorton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FigNorton)\ **Post date:** [November 26, 2020, 3:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/supreme-court-religious-freedom-more-important-than-fighting-covid/926466/23 "2020-11-26T15:27:55Z")
So, no one happy that the law got blocked because the church people shouldn’t get looser restrictions? ---
**Author:** ![QuickSilver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quicksilver/32/7832_2.png) [@QuickSilver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/QuickSilver)\ **Post date:** [November 26, 2020, 3:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/supreme-court-religious-freedom-more-important-than-fighting-covid/926466/24 "2020-11-26T15:32:49Z")
What is your understanding of the following?: > **[Justices lift New York’s COVID-related attendance limits on worship services...](https://www.scotusblog.com/2020/11/justices-lift-new-yorks-covid-related-attendance-limits-on-worship-services/)** > > The Supreme Court late Wednesday night granted requests from the Roman Catholic Diocese of Brooklyn and two Orthodox Jewish synagogues to block enforcement of a New York executive order restricting attendance at houses of worship. Both the diocese... That restrictions on houses of worship have been tightened or relaxed? ---
**Author:** ![FigNorton](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fignorton/32/5619_2.png) [@FigNorton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FigNorton)\ **Post date:** [November 26, 2020, 3:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/supreme-court-religious-freedom-more-important-than-fighting-covid/926466/25 "2020-11-26T15:34:55Z")
Relaxed. Cuomo should rescind his plan and erase the Worship section of his chart. They’re all mass gatherings. No different than a lecture or concert. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [November 26, 2020, 3:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/supreme-court-religious-freedom-more-important-than-fighting-covid/926466/26 "2020-11-26T15:37:01Z")
> [@FigNorton](#): > > Cuomo should rescind his plan and erase the Worship section of his chart. They’re all mass gatherings. No different than a lecture or concert. So if lectures and concerts are shut down, church services should be shut down also? ---
**Author:** ![FigNorton](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fignorton/32/5619_2.png) [@FigNorton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FigNorton)\ **Post date:** [November 26, 2020, 3:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/supreme-court-religious-freedom-more-important-than-fighting-covid/926466/27 "2020-11-26T15:37:51Z")
What else could I have meant? 🤔 ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [November 26, 2020, 3:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/supreme-court-religious-freedom-more-important-than-fighting-covid/926466/28 "2020-11-26T15:38:36Z")
Just clarifying. ---
**Author:** ![doreen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/858c86/32.png) [@doreen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/doreen)\ **Post date:** [November 26, 2020, 3:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/supreme-court-religious-freedom-more-important-than-fighting-covid/926466/29 "2020-11-26T15:39:11Z")
I don’t necessarily disagree with the idea that he should have done that to begin with- but how do you see it playing out if he does it now? I think the houses of worship will be right back in court and the result will **not** be that religious services at houses of worship are treated like any other gathering. I mean, they objected to being treated more leniently, so they will surely object to being treated the same. And if the SC blocked enforcement when they were treated more leniently, do you believe they will allow enforcement when houses of worship are treated the same as any other gathering? ---
**Author:** ![FigNorton](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fignorton/32/5619_2.png) [@FigNorton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FigNorton)\ **Post date:** [November 26, 2020, 3:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/supreme-court-religious-freedom-more-important-than-fighting-covid/926466/30 "2020-11-26T15:40:10Z")
Yeah, but the church lawyers will have to come up with a whole new tap dance routine. ---
**Author:** ![QuickSilver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quicksilver/32/7832_2.png) [@QuickSilver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/QuickSilver)\ **Post date:** [November 26, 2020, 3:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/supreme-court-religious-freedom-more-important-than-fighting-covid/926466/31 "2020-11-26T15:47:38Z")
> [@doreen](#): > > I mean, they objected to being treated more leniently, so they will surely object to being treated the same. My brain must be on sabbatical today. Was the argument before the SC that restrictions on religious freedoms were too lenient? ---
**Author:** ![doreen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/858c86/32.png) [@doreen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/doreen)\ **Post date:** [November 26, 2020, 3:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/supreme-court-religious-freedom-more-important-than-fighting-covid/926466/32 "2020-11-26T15:51:24Z")
No - they were _in fact_ treated more leniently than all sorts of other situations in the same zones. For example, house of worship were limited to the lesser of 25% capacity or 10 people in the red zone, where all other gatherings were prohibited. Change it so religious gatherings are also prohibited and they will absolutely complain. Change it so that all gatherings are limited to lesser of 25% capacity or 10 people and they will still complain. Because the complaint is really about the limits, not about religious discrimination. But if they didn’t claim discrimination, they would haven’t gotten through the courthouse door. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [November 26, 2020, 3:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/supreme-court-religious-freedom-more-important-than-fighting-covid/926466/33 "2020-11-26T15:51:26Z")
> [@glowacks](#): > > X/X/2023 - The Supreme Court heard a court case today from a cannibal that claims the laws regarding murder do not apply when he is exercising his religious beliefs in accordance with the first amendment. I assume they’ll follow the Scalia precedent and decide that some religions deserve first amendment protection and others do not. ---
**Author:** ![PastTense](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pasttense/32/14550_2.png) [@PastTense](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PastTense)\ **Post date:** [November 26, 2020, 3:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/supreme-court-religious-freedom-more-important-than-fighting-covid/926466/34 "2020-11-26T15:52:03Z")
Here is the actual decision: > **[20a87\_4g15.pdf](https://www.supremecourt.gov/opinions/20pdf/20a87_4g15.pdf)** > > 230.82 KB ---
**Author:** ![TriPolar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripolar/32/3008_2.png) [@TriPolar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TriPolar)\ **Post date:** [November 26, 2020, 3:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/supreme-court-religious-freedom-more-important-than-fighting-covid/926466/35 "2020-11-26T15:54:43Z")
Unlike the Spanish Inquisition, this was to be expected. ---
**Author:** ![bobot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bobot/32/21622_2.png) [@bobot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bobot)\ **Post date:** [November 26, 2020, 3:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/supreme-court-religious-freedom-more-important-than-fighting-covid/926466/36 "2020-11-26T15:56:55Z")
God can’t hear a person pray unless the person is gathered with lots of other people, with their voices together now properly amplified for God’s feeble ears, and spreading the virus around. That’s the sacrifice part. God loves a good human sacrifice. ---
**Author:** ![FigNorton](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fignorton/32/5619_2.png) [@FigNorton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FigNorton)\ **Post date:** [November 26, 2020, 3:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/supreme-court-religious-freedom-more-important-than-fighting-covid/926466/37 "2020-11-26T15:59:50Z")
Sorry, that’s probably my fault. My “because” only meant why you might be happy for the ruling not that it was part of the reasoning. That said, being treated differently was part of the church argument, as I understand it. ---
**Author:** ![QuickSilver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quicksilver/32/7832_2.png) [@QuickSilver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/QuickSilver)\ **Post date:** [November 26, 2020, 4:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/supreme-court-religious-freedom-more-important-than-fighting-covid/926466/38 "2020-11-26T16:01:41Z")
Okay, thx. I understand what you were getting at now. ---
**Author:** ![Saintly\_Loser](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/saintly_loser/32/4045_2.png) [@Saintly\_Loser](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Saintly_Loser)\ **Post date:** [November 26, 2020, 4:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/supreme-court-religious-freedom-more-important-than-fighting-covid/926466/39 "2020-11-26T16:11:01Z")
> [@glowacks](#): > > . . . yet these people believe that they absolutely must meet in large groups in order for their worship to be effective. Well, yes. Catholics do believe that they are obligated to attend Mass on Sundays, and that worshipping as a community is essential. > [@glowacks](#): > > They have no reason to believe this other than it’s their religion. Sure. So what? Believers only believe because they believe. That’s a truism. > [@glowacks](#): > > How does this make it any different from someone who claims he needs to eat raw human flesh as part of his religion, when both are not conducive to a healthy society and simple substitutions that are readily available should suffice? It’s not necessary to kill anyone to attend Mass. Or to form a _minyan_. Look, as a Catholic resident in Bishop DiMarzio’s diocese, I wish he hadn’t brought this lawsuit. Bishop DiMarzio knows there’s a pandemic going on, and back in March, suspended the Sunday obligation. I wish he’d left it at that. But the fact that you find certain religious beliefs uncompelling and even stupid is absolutely irrelevant. It just doesn’t matter what you think. What matters is that our constitution protects religious belief and practice from government interference, without regard to the content of such belief. I don’t know whether the Supreme Court was right or wrong to block enforcement of Governor Cuomo’s executive order. I think the Diocese of Brooklyn (and the Archdiocese of New York, and every other diocese in the country) ought to lock the doors of their churches, or at least massively restrict the size (and spacing, and mask wearing, etc.) of all gatherings, including gatherings for Mass. But contemptuous dismissal of religious belief adds nothing to the situation. ---
**Author:** ![QuickSilver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quicksilver/32/7832_2.png) [@QuickSilver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/QuickSilver)\ **Post date:** [November 26, 2020, 4:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/supreme-court-religious-freedom-more-important-than-fighting-covid/926466/40 "2020-11-26T16:18:13Z")
> [@Saintly\_Loser](#): > > It’s not necessary to kill anyone to attend Mass. 🤨 [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/supreme-court-religious-freedom-more-important-than-fighting-covid/926466.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/supreme-court-religious-freedom-more-important-than-fighting-covid/926466.md?page=3)