# Surprises coming for voters for the Leopards-Eating-Faces Party
**URL:** https://boards.straightdope.com/t/surprises-coming-for-voters-for-the-leopards-eating-faces-party/1010166
**Category:** The BBQ Pit
**Tags:** trump
**Created:** [November 12, 2024, 7:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/surprises-coming-for-voters-for-the-leopards-eating-faces-party/1010166 "2024-11-12T19:54:17Z")
**Posts on this page:** 20
**Page:** 211
### Author:  [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)
#### Post date: [August 19, 2025, 9:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/surprises-coming-for-voters-for-the-leopards-eating-faces-party/1010166/4235 "2025-08-19T21:37:05Z")
> [@madmonk28](#):
>
> What would you have me do?
Try this:
“I’m sorry that if the US goes down the shitter it will take too many decent people with it. Unfortunately, I can’t save everyone and if you’re one of the unfortunate who can’t escape I’m sorry.”
Rather than ranting about how everyone other than yourself is evil, corrupt, and irredeemable and fuck ‘em all, they deserve to suffer.
But I guess you’re so lacking in empathy and sympathy for others you couldn’t figure that out for yourself.
That’s why I say you’re part of the problem.
---
### Author:  [@dtilque](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dtilque)
#### Post date: [August 19, 2025, 9:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/surprises-coming-for-voters-for-the-leopards-eating-faces-party/1010166/4236 "2025-08-19T21:37:39Z")
> [@Johnny\_L.A](#):
>
> So Texans built, and are building, clean energy plants. This attracted businesses that need a lot of electricity and like low prices. […] Now Trump’s Big Bogus Bill is taking away the tax incentives they need to keep their economy booming at the pace it is.
I’ll bet they keep building clean energy plants. Perhaps not at quite the rate as before, but what are the alternatives? As it says, it takes years to build a gas turbine or nuke plant and they need the energy much sooner than that. And the way they have their grid isolated from the rest of the country, they can’t import it. Ergo, they’re going to keep putting up wind turbines and solar panels.
ETA: They just won’t get the tax benies, so the power will not be as cheap.
---
### Author:  [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)
#### Post date: [August 19, 2025, 10:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/surprises-coming-for-voters-for-the-leopards-eating-faces-party/1010166/4237 "2025-08-19T22:05:56Z")
> [@ShadowFacts](#):
>
> I don’t understand why people are shaming anyone for leaving the US. People leave the US for what they perceive as a better life elsewhere _all the time_, every day. (And people come to the US for what they perceive as a better life here all the time.) What the fuck is wrong with that?
The problem isn’t leaving the US.
The problem is leaving the US and saying those left behind all deserve to live in a dystopian hellscape or deserve death or whatever else is implied by “collapse”.
> [@Cervaise](#):
>
> I understand that some people are angry at the departure of people like me
I’m not angry with you because of this (emphasis added):
> [@Cervaise](#):
>
> And for what it’s worth, **I do feel guilty about those who did not have the energy, resources, or opportunity to make the same change.** I did not dance away laughing, and I do not laugh now at those who remain trapped in the decaying corpse of a dead empire.
> [@crowmanyclouds](#):
>
> I’m wondering if certain folks would think about a person of Jewish ancestry deciding that late 30s Germany wasn’t the bestest place to live anymore.
Or someone Latino in 2025 deciding living in the US wasn’t a good idea anymore. But I haven’t heard too many of them wishing misery and death on those remaining behind regardless of ethnicity or guilt. Unlike @madmonk28
> [@madmonk28](#):
>
> I would argue that people here have convinced themselves that what’s happening isn’t happening and anyone who points that it is in fact happening, is crazy.
Oh, I agree it’s happening. Unlike you I don’t automatically assume anyone who isn’t leaving is automatically in denial or complicit. Millions of people _can not leave_. Just wishing harder isn’t going to change that and it is YOU are in denial about that.
> [@commasense](#):
>
> The major challenge is that my wife has three grown children, two married, and six grandchildren. She would be _extremely_ reluctant to go anywhere they couldn’t follow. To say nothing of her brother and his family and my (unmarried) sister. The logistics of arranging a mass emigration of between twelve and twenty people is extremely daunting.
Don’t wait too long - my Russian ancestors didn’t move fast enough. Only about 6 of them made it to the US. _Every single other member of the extended family was dead by 1945_.
Unfortunately, as I said, despite looking for years now I haven’t found a way to leave the US. Well, OK, I could go to Israel but I think they’re even more oppressive than the US right now and I don’t speak the language. If I was 25 years younger and not a cancer survivor my knowledge of French could get my foot in the door for Canada or possibly even France. Like I said - I’m too old, too sick, and don’t have any money so now no one wants me.
Either I stay and fight (I was not physically able to do this while undergoing chemo) or find a hidey-hole somewhere in US territory, but leaving for elsewhere is not an option for me.
> [@Der\_Trihs](#):
>
> I never said anything about most people deserving what will happen to them, of that all Americans are complicit. But it doesn’t _matter,_ fascism respects neither people’s opposition to it nor innocence.
That’s why I said @madmonk28 is part of the problem - they don’t respect peoples’ opposition or innocence. It’s that simple.
As I have not read every post in this thread I can only say I have not seen YOU, @Der_Trihs, make any statement as @madmonk28 has done.
And with that, I will return to discussing leopards eating faces.
---
### Author:  [@madmonk28](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/madmonk28)
#### Post date: [August 19, 2025, 10:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/surprises-coming-for-voters-for-the-leopards-eating-faces-party/1010166/4238 "2025-08-19T22:39:44Z")
> [@Broomstick](#):
>
> Oh, I agree it’s happening. Unlike you I don’t automatically assume anyone who isn’t leaving is automatically in denial or complicit. Millions of people _can not leave_. Just wishing harder isn’t going to change that and it is YOU are in denial about that.
I didn’t say that everyone in America is in denial, just the people freaking the fuck out in this thread because they heard an idea they don’t like. Those people are every bit as much faces for leopards as anyone else.
---
### Author:  [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)
#### Post date: [August 19, 2025, 11:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/surprises-coming-for-voters-for-the-leopards-eating-faces-party/1010166/4239 "2025-08-19T23:17:24Z")
I don’t know-how _can_ you fight?
What do I do? I stand guard against ICE at a local church that caters to minorities every Sunday, ready to bolt the doors and call 911 and local media at a second’s notice. I throw active support, time and money towards my Governor, Tina Kotek, in her fight against Federal fascism. I support a local food pantry when support is being cut back massively. I work for a school system that practically shouts “D.E.I.!” I march, I shout, I support…I actively look for things to do.
---
### Author:  [@Pleonast](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pleonast)
#### Post date: [August 19, 2025, 11:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/surprises-coming-for-voters-for-the-leopards-eating-faces-party/1010166/4240 "2025-08-19T23:32:35Z")
> [@Miller](#):
>
> Maybe just shut the fuck up? We get it. Your thesis has been fully explained:
>
> 1. America is fucked.
> 2. Nothing we can do can fix it.
> 3. We probably deserve what’s coming anyway.
>
> Is there anything else to add to that? Is there some nuance you feel has not been adequately explained? Because otherwise, what the fuck is your purpose here? Your trying to, what, explicitly stomp out any embers of hope people might have?
Exactly. That poster keeps repeating fascist talking points because they _are_ a fascist. Maybe subtle at first, but how much water does someone need to carry for Trump before we know they’re MAGA?
Best to ignore them and move on. (And my condolences that you can’t ignore them.)
---
### Author:  [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)
#### Post date: [August 19, 2025, 11:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/surprises-coming-for-voters-for-the-leopards-eating-faces-party/1010166/4241 "2025-08-19T23:43:33Z")
> [@madmonk28](#):
>
> I didn’t say that everyone in America is in denial, just the people freaking the fuck out in this thread because they heard an idea they don’t like.
What people would those be?
It’s not me - I made it clear how I felt in that post. Did you bother to read past the first two paragraphs?
---
### Author:  [@Spice\_Weasel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spice_Weasel)
#### Post date: [August 20, 2025, 12:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/surprises-coming-for-voters-for-the-leopards-eating-faces-party/1010166/4242 "2025-08-20T00:35:21Z")
Everybody’s cowardly and doing nothing to fight fascism except @madmonk28 who is running away. I’m guessing all this, “it’s your fault you didn’t fight” bullshit is so he can maintain the cognitive dissonance of his actions. You see, he would have stayed and fought if everyone _else_ had. It’s actually everyone else’s fault he didn’t try to stop fascism in America. It’s really just better for all concerned if America collapses… after he gets the fuck out of harm’s way rather than trying to help anyone.
But hey, I actually don’t give a fuck if someone is lucky enough to get out of this country while they can. I have a problem with people saying, “you should do more to defy fascism or else you deserve what you get” without
A) knowing what the fuck I’m actually doing
And
B) doing fuck-all themselves.
---
### Author:  [@Measure\_for\_Measure](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Measure_for_Measure)
#### Post date: [August 20, 2025, 12:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/surprises-coming-for-voters-for-the-leopards-eating-faces-party/1010166/4243 "2025-08-20T00:57:46Z")
This hijack needs to be taken elsewhere.
> [@Buck\_Godot](#):
>
> Not to speak for others but I don’t think it was so much the leaving the US that bugged people it was the leaving the US and then hoping the whole thing and everyone left behind collapsed in chaos and misery after they closed the door on the way out. Since you didn’t do that you’re off the hook.
Cervaise also doesn’t engage in [militant doomerism](https://talkingpointsmemo.com/edblog/the-most-pernicious-anticipatory-obedience-hides-in-plain-sight/sharetoken/a0a41c8f-d6f5-490e-8a95-eb3da8c85331): his actions stem from a deliberate risk assessment. Others in contrast act as follows, especially on twitter-X:
> During harrowing times some people become overwhelmed and even lose hope. It’s not a one-way progress. Almost everyone has their moments. But there’s a particular kind of militant doomerism afoot at the moment. Any discussions of next steps in the battle against Trumpism or the preservation of civic democracy, any suggestions or strategies, are met with a chorus of, “don’t you get how it worked under Hitler and Stalin!!?!” Or “don’t you know rules don’t matter to Donald Trump!?!?!”
> In a sense, it’s a dialog genetically related to [what I called “competitive hyperbole”](https://talkingpointsmemo.com/edblog/the-aftermath-of-competitive-hyperbole) two days ago. Strategies for the future or even the assumption that there will be a future get shouted down as a hopeless naiveté. And at least within that stream of conversation — which I’m certainly not saying is dominant, but it is there — it leads to the same escalating declarations of dystopia and totalism.
> [@madmonk28](#):
>
> Please answer my three questions:
>
> 1. what am I supposed to be fighting for?
> 2. How am I supposed to fight?
> 3. and what are you doing to fight?
@Czarcasm already answered Q1. I’m skipping Q2. During the 2020 and 2024 elections, I text banked against Trump, sometimes to the point of causing multiple month inflamation issues. But so what? My grandfather left a thriving law practice to fight the Axis. I’ve also researched best ways of financially fighting MAGA (see [bluetent.us](http://bluetent.us)) and have boosted my charitable setaside by a multiple. Again, so what? It isn’t bankrupting me and I’m not quite pledging my life and fortune. Sacred honor, maybe. Over here, I’ve started this thread: [Fighting for the American Democratic Experiment and Against Trump: Practical Steps and Best Practices](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/fighting-for-the-american-democratic-experiment-and-against-trump-practical-steps-and-best-practices/1013687)
When I thought protest would nudge the needle, I protested. [Trump’s parade flopped. No Kings Day was a hit.](https://paulkrugman.substack.com/p/trumps-parade-flopped-no-kings-day) When I thought the Dems needed a nudge, I nudged my elected reps. I read Indivisible’s Guide to fighting Trump. I recommend it, as it is written by former Congressional staffers.
[https://indivisible.org/](https://indivisible.org/)
And I’ve been mulling about discussing the benefits of supporting Democratic moderates here. Work in progress.
> [@Czarcasm](#):
>
> I stand guard against ICE at a local church that caters to minorities every Sunday, ready to bolt the doors and call 911 and local media at a second’s notice.
This is awesome.
---
### Author:  [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)
#### Post date: [August 20, 2025, 4:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/surprises-coming-for-voters-for-the-leopards-eating-faces-party/1010166/4244 "2025-08-20T04:43:02Z")
> [@Broomstick](#):
>
> The problem isn’t leaving the US.
>
> The problem is leaving the US and saying those left behind all deserve to live in a dystopian hellscape or deserve death or whatever else is implied by “collapse”.
For what it’s worth, I never argue with people choosing to emigrate because they believe that the slide toward totalitarian catastrophe is irreversible. They may be right or they may be wrong, but at this point we’d need a crystal ball to know which. Emigrants are facing significant adjustments and generally significant sacrifices, so it stands to reason that they’re going to have a different view of the stakes involved, compared to people who are not emigrating.
I probably could emigrate if I chose, but so far I’m very determinedly in the “stay and fight” camp. Time will tell if that was a wise decision.
(Also for what it’s worth, IIRC **madmonk28** was a career servicemember, so it’s not like he’s incapable of putting himself at risk for his country’s sake.)
---
### Author:  [@WOOKINPANUBv.2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WOOKINPANUBv.2)
#### Post date: [August 20, 2025, 6:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/surprises-coming-for-voters-for-the-leopards-eating-faces-party/1010166/4245 "2025-08-20T06:31:52Z")
Somehow this thread has veered into the ‘madmonk28 show’. I don’t believe anyone has implied that they’re not _allowed_ to leave, nor expressed misunderstanding about _why_ they’re leaving. To me, it comes down to that most basic of rules: don’t be a jerk.
We’ve been hearing their views on the evils of the US, and its impending, deserved doom. What a thoughtless, shitty thing to constantly express to one’s supposed community at this dangerous, distressing time.
Sorry to continue the hijack.
---
### Author:  [@LSLGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LSLGuy)
#### Post date: [August 20, 2025, 10:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/surprises-coming-for-voters-for-the-leopards-eating-faces-party/1010166/4246 "2025-08-20T10:17:35Z")
As is so often the case, I think you’ve nailed it with this post.
I’d also suggest that there’s a difference between white cis-het politically anonymous successful folks emigrating to preserve their comfort, versus folks who’re members of groups likely to be targeted for expulsion or worse emigrating to preserve their non-imprisonment or maybe even preserve their lives.
As alluded to by others upthread, contrast Jews fleeing Germany in the 1930s with wealthy landowners or merchants decamping to safer countries “for the duration”.
---
### Author:  [@madmonk28](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/madmonk28)
#### Post date: [August 20, 2025, 11:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/surprises-coming-for-voters-for-the-leopards-eating-faces-party/1010166/4247 "2025-08-20T11:08:53Z")
> [@Kimstu](#):
>
> (Also for what it’s worth, IIRC **madmonk28** was a career servicemember, so it’s not like he’s incapable of putting himself at risk for his country’s sake.)
No I wasn’t. I was a career foreign aid worker who specialized in conflict zones. My life’s work was erased by DOGE. I now work for a charity that tries to get rural Americans access to health care. I also have volunteered to be a human shield so that drag performers could enter a venue after the Klan threatened to shoot it up, so those of you accusing me of cowardice are barking up the wrong tree. There are many other flaws to choose from.
I never said that the people in America deserve to live in a dystopian shithole, only that America **is** a dystopian shithole and that I am planning to emigrate.
Here is what I believe:
1. America is a fascist nation
2. America chose fascism
3. Countries that choose fascism are pretty awful places and were pretty flawed prior to choosing fascism
4. Given that America is a fascist country, I’d rather it collapse, as I’d rather America be a weak fascist nation, than a strong fascist nation. I also think that collapse is probably inevitable at this point
5. Just like the Soviet Union, America is premised on an inherently flawed economic/political model (radical crony communism for the USSR; radical crony capitalism for the USA) that is unsustainable
6. This collapse is bad for me personally and for other Americans, but I think that the well being of humanity is more important than the well being of America or me (although, since I care about my well being, I am building a house in another country and hope to GTFO). Also, I think that we are well past the point of preventing this collapse.
7. The people triggered by the above views are as much a part of the problem as the so called Leopard Face Eating Party voters; you have bought in to a false vision of America that is every bit as delusional as the MAGA crowd and have been complacent for decades about how deeply fucked up America is.
8. This complacency has allowed us to get to this point.
---
### Author:  [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)
#### Post date: [August 20, 2025, 12:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/surprises-coming-for-voters-for-the-leopards-eating-faces-party/1010166/4248 "2025-08-20T12:25:16Z")
My God, have we descended into a pissing contest about who has done more for their country?
It remains, @madmonk28 , that you haven’t shown an iota of sympathy for those who are caught in the dystopia fascist shithole _who are unable to leave._ No matter what they have done they are guilty, guilty, guilty in your eyes and deserve whatever horrible fate they will meet. Clearly, you have adopted the MAGA attitude that the poor and disabled are in that position due to a personal failing and should be treated the same as actual criminals.
I have even stated that you have omitted an expression of sympathy and yet you continue to shit on the heads of anyone who stays in the US, whether by necessity or by choice and hope of continuing the fight. Thus, I can only conclude you really do despite those you are leaving behind. Based on your own statements the only people you think are blameless are those that flee. I think, however, you will find the stain of being American follows you wherever you try to run.
It’s not about being “triggered” or “complacent” or denying that America is descending into fascism - it is what you have said here, and what you have not said.
> [@madmonk28](#):
>
> America chose fascism
No, actually a slim majority of us _did not_, and even that is only counting the people who bothered to vote. A lesson unlearned from history is that fascists don’t actually need to win a majority in an election to claw their way to power. But in your mind all Americans are equally evil. Perhaps we should take a cue from Netanyahu and simply kill every American, right down to premature infants in incubators. Of course that leaves you a target, but you’ve already stated your intention to run away.
> [@madmonk28](#):
>
> Countries that choose fascism are pretty awful places and were pretty flawed prior to choosing fascism
Every nation ever has been “pretty flawed”, don’t know why you think fascism is such an exemplar of that. Plenty of other horrible ways to run a nation.
> [@madmonk28](#):
>
> The people triggered by the above views are as much a part of the problem as the so called Leopard Face Eating Party voters; you have bought in to a false vision of America that is every bit as delusional as the MAGA crowd and have been complacent for decades about how deeply fucked up America is.
No one here is “triggered” by what you are saying. I don’t know why you think they are. Unless you’ve locked into the MAGA “technique” of saying something they _think_ is triggering and assuming it it is. Except it isn’t.
> [@madmonk28](#):
>
> My life’s work was erased by DOGE
Ah, I see - anger and bitterness over a destroyed career. Although you despise me and wish me ill I do in fact have some sympathy for you in that matter. If only you were capable of displaying sympathy for others. Maybe in time, when the pain and anger you are currently experiencing diminish.
> [@madmonk28](#):
>
> I now work for a charity that tries to get rural Americans access to health care.
Why not stay and continue that work? Or do you so hate the disadvantaged you’d rather see them suffer and die while you run away?
> [@madmonk28](#):
>
> I never said that the people in America deserve to live in a dystopian shithole, only that America **is** a dystopian shithole and that I am planning to emigrate.
When you say the US should collapse and should do it sooner rather than later then yes, you ARE saying that Americans should live in a dystopian shithole _because that is the only outcome of a total collapse_.
I don’t blame you for running away from that. **What I blame you for is refusal to see the logical outcome of what you desire, and for lacking any sympathy for those left behind who either have been continuing to fight or can’t escape or both.**
---
### Author:  [@madmonk28](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/madmonk28)
#### Post date: [August 20, 2025, 12:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/surprises-coming-for-voters-for-the-leopards-eating-faces-party/1010166/4249 "2025-08-20T12:41:13Z")
> [@Broomstick](#):
>
> When you say the US should collapse and should do it sooner rather than later then yes, you ARE saying that Americans should live in a dystopian shithole _because that is the only outcome of a total collapse_.
I’m saying that Americans aren’t as important as all of humanity and that a powerful fascist America is a greater threat than a weak fascist America. If you disagree with that, you really have a weird morality.
I feel bad for Americans trapped, which could be me, I might not get out in time. But I feel bad for the people trapped in dystopian shitholes everywhere. I don’t think America is somehow special and their suffering is more important than the suffering of other people and I’m in no position to stop that suffering except hopefully for me and my wife.
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### Author:  [@ASL\_v2.0](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ASL_v2.0)
#### Post date: [August 20, 2025, 12:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/surprises-coming-for-voters-for-the-leopards-eating-faces-party/1010166/4250 "2025-08-20T12:50:02Z")
SHUT THE FUCK UP!
…is all I want to say but then discourse tells me “Body is unclear. Is it a complete sentence?”
FUCKING YES!
---
### Author:  [@RitterSport](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RitterSport)
#### Post date: [August 20, 2025, 12:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/surprises-coming-for-voters-for-the-leopards-eating-faces-party/1010166/4251 "2025-08-20T12:50:09Z")
I keep coming back to this thread hoping for new examples of leopard action, only to be, again, disappointed. Seriously, people, jeez.
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### Author:  [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)
#### Post date: [August 20, 2025, 12:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/surprises-coming-for-voters-for-the-leopards-eating-faces-party/1010166/4252 "2025-08-20T12:50:28Z")
> [@madmonk28](#):
>
> I’m saying that Americans aren’t as important as all of humanity and that a powerful fascist America is a greater threat than a weak fascist America. If you disagree with that, you really have a weird morality.
That is why, as @commasense said: “It’s only too late if we give up.” even granting that Americans aren’t as important, _ **it does not contradict what me and him are saying.** _
We have to fight to turn this fascist way of things into weak ones. **The weird morality is really to not fight against that.**
---
### Author:  [@ASL\_v2.0](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ASL_v2.0)
#### Post date: [August 20, 2025, 12:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/surprises-coming-for-voters-for-the-leopards-eating-faces-party/1010166/4253 "2025-08-20T12:52:18Z")
One thing y’all might find helpful (and which I have just activated) is the board’s temporary ignore feature. I don’t think I need to block @madmonk28 forever, but it’s very clear they’re destroying this thread and I think we could all use a break from them.
So I’d like to encourage everyone to put @madmonk28 on ignore for two weeks since they can’t seem to shut the fuck up and let us have this thread.
---
### Author:  [@madmonk28](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/madmonk28)
#### Post date: [August 20, 2025, 12:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/surprises-coming-for-voters-for-the-leopards-eating-faces-party/1010166/4254 "2025-08-20T12:54:13Z")
> [@GIGObuster](#):
>
> That is why, as @commasense said: “It’s only too late if we give up.” even granting that Americans aren’t as important, _ **it does not contradict what me and him are saying.** _
But I disagree, I think that in order for America to be fixed it has to be completely torn down and rebuilt. Vibrant societies don’t elect insane fascist game show hosts and winning an election by 51% is not going to fix anything. The sooner that collapse happens, the better for the majority of people including future people born in the US.
But I see that people here want to return to reveling in the suffering of MAGA and not be confronted by the role they played in its creation. So I’m out of this thread.
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