# Surviver 10/2 **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [October 2, 2003, 12:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/surviver-10-2/205100 "2003-10-02T12:34:00Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Realhoops](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/8dc957/32.png) [@Realhoops](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Realhoops)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2003, 4:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/surviver-10-2/205100/41 "2003-10-03T16:01:32Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Munch \* > \*\*Morgan: Lill > Drake: Ruppert or Sandra > > Realhoops, if I were on Drake I’d vote off Rupert. He’s a strong character, but he hasn’t done anything that other people can’t. I have a feeling he’s hogging the fishing duties, which can breed resentment. They haven’t shown any reactions by other players to his behavior, at _all_, so I’m wondering if Burnett is editing out bad feelings against him. Jon could very much be working behind the scenes against him. > > Sandra is annoying, but the only annoyance she’s been has been in the presence of Morgan, not Drake. She was indispensable in the first episode in the village, and her actions there have given her an entitlement to their possessions. I think there’s a lot of respect for her in Drake that we haven’t seen. I wouldn’t be suprised to see a Jon-Sandra alliance that takes them well into the merge. \*\* I’ll concede it certainly could be editing. But I think you’d be making a huge mistake to get rid of Rupert if you were on Drake, at least at this point. He’s been a HUGE asset to that tribe. He’s been a central figure in several of their challenge wins so far, he provides all of their food (I know others _can_ but all we’ve seen is one person manage to catch 1 fish and another nearly lose the head of their spear for good). And when they do show them all together, everybody seems to like him just fine. What we _have_ seen is multiple shots of people seeming to have problems with Jon. So while Jon might be working behind the scenes against him, I don’t think we’ve seen anything that would suggest that would work. And now the previews for next week (also edited to be misleading, I’m sure) suggest the whole tribe is considering losing on purpose just to get rid of Jon. I don’t know, but I guess I refuse to think Sandra hasn’t been utterly annoying around camp. Her voice and demeanor just seem really grating. The big problem with predictions is that we have no way of knowing what they are editing out and how they are playing us! So who knows what will happen. I just wondered if I had missed something they _had_ shown that gave a clue that Rupert could be in trouble. I still think he’s in good shape to make it quite a while yet, and Jon and Sandra are in trouble. This is why we watch, right? 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Duderdude2](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/cdc98d/32.png) [@Duderdude2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Duderdude2)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2003, 4:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/surviver-10-2/205100/42 "2003-10-03T16:06:23Z")
That’s the one thing that pisses me off about Survivor: The damn editing. It’s the most misleading bullcrap I’ve endured in ages. Copious times, an episode has been centered around why one particular individual is going to be heading home that night at Tribal Council, of course, when the time comes to vote, it’s frequently someone that was not even so much as alluded too during the entire broadcast who walks the plank. ---
**Author:** ![Jadis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/87869e/32.png) [@Jadis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jadis)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2003, 4:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/surviver-10-2/205100/43 "2003-10-03T16:15:11Z")
**Duderdude2** , you’re right…editing is everything in this game, and you never know if what you’re seeing is the way it actually happened. I don’t know if this counts as a spoiler or not, but there was a very revealing comment about this issue by Nicole (the boot from the first show) in [the interview](http://www.realitynewsonline.com/cgi-bin/ae.pl?mode=1&article=article3664.art&page=1) that **David B** did with her on his website, Reality News Online. A quote from that article, spoiler-boxed just in case… [spoiler]RNO: Before you said anything to Lill about targeting Tijuana, when it seemed likely that either Lill or Ryan S. would be going, why didn’t you just join in with the rest of the tribe and get rid of one of them? Nicole: The editing on the show is a little confusing about that whole incident. I actually talked to Lill about Tijuana long before I knew of a strategy to vote off Ryan S. Had I known that, I never would have tried to oust Tijuana. I didn’t think the others thought Ryan S. wasn’t working hard enough because I actually thought he was trying very hard.[/spoiler] That casts an entirely different light on what happened on the first show. I believe I called Nicole one of the stupidest players ever after seeing it, and from what she said above, what really happened was _so_ misrepresented by editing, it seriously makes me wonder about everything else we see. Interesting stuff. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Wrong\_Girl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b782af/32.png) [@The\_Wrong\_Girl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Wrong_Girl)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2003, 4:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/surviver-10-2/205100/44 "2003-10-03T16:25:43Z")
> [@](#): > > _Originally posted by elf6c \* > \*\* Better to try and win, because you will eventually lose anyway. Numbers going into the merge is key. With another win or two before the merge they will be able to play the numbers game._\* Maybe, but not always. If Jon’s as hated as the editing is making him out to be (and yes, I know that’s a big if), there’s nothing to say that he won’t immediately desert his team after the merge. Remember Chii Ann? She couldn’t wait to go over to the other side as soon as the merge happened (heh. and we all know how _that_ worked out.) So it’s hard to guage whether or not you should keep someone so universally disliked. ---
**Author:** ![Indygrrl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/58f4c7/32.png) [@Indygrrl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Indygrrl)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2003, 4:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/surviver-10-2/205100/45 "2003-10-03T16:38:53Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by H8\_2\_W8 \* > \*\*The good guys - > > Rupert - making Induhnapolis proud - tenacious, smarter than your average bear. > > \*\* He used to bartend at the Alley Cat, I’m sure he can “survive” this.😃 ---
**Author:** ![Terminus\_Est](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terminus_est/32/3087_2.png) [@Terminus\_Est](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Terminus_Est)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2003, 4:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/surviver-10-2/205100/46 "2003-10-03T16:54:31Z")
> [@](#): > > > [@](#): > > > > This just in: Captain Morgan Rum has filed suit against Mark Burnett for defamation of their trademark. > > Dumb. First, Captain Morgan was an actual pirate. Burnett can just say (quite possibly truthfully) that he chose the name “Morgan” because Morgan was an actual person. Secondly, I think people would be more likely to buy Captain Morgan Rum because of a perceived connection to the show, even if the Morgan Tribe are losing. Kinda windy in here, isn’t it? ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2003, 5:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/surviver-10-2/205100/47 "2003-10-03T17:29:59Z")
Ordinarily, I’d think a player shuffle was on the horizon. Burnett’s going to want to do something to keep Morgan in the game. But the previews would seem to say that the tribes will be unchanged going into next week’s immunity challenge. ---
**Author:** ![Batsinma\_Belfry](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/ea5d25/32.png) [@Batsinma\_Belfry](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Batsinma_Belfry)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2003, 5:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/surviver-10-2/205100/48 "2003-10-03T17:38:35Z")
> [@](#): > > For those tabbing “Rupert” to get dinged. He ain’t going anywhere. Squirley boy is going first. Well yeah, you can say that AFTER seeing the previews for next week. :rolleyes: But the comments about Rupert getting voted off were made based on his behavior LAST week. It’s obvious Shawn and Burton have Rupert issues. But the ladies love him, so he’ll be around for awhile. ---
**Author:** ![PunditLisa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/4af34b/32.png) [@PunditLisa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PunditLisa)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2003, 5:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/surviver-10-2/205100/49 "2003-10-03T17:49:22Z")
Re the previews next week. Okay, looks like Morgan is going to lose the next challenge thanks to the previews. Why else would JEFF be standing around hollering to Osten to keep swimming? ---
**Author:** ![Biggirl](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/biggirl/32/3294_2.png) [@Biggirl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Biggirl)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2003, 6:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/surviver-10-2/205100/50 "2003-10-03T18:02:35Z")
Are the previews _ever_ acurate? The fact that Jeff is hollering at Olsten in a preview leads me to believe Morgan will actually _win_ a challenge next week. It’s true that I’m a Survivor newbie, but every single preview I’ve seen insinuated almost the opposite of what actually happens. ---
**Author:** ![Smeghead](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/f1d935/32.png) [@Smeghead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smeghead)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2003, 6:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/surviver-10-2/205100/51 "2003-10-03T18:06:37Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Little Nemo \* > \*\*Ordinarily, I’d think a player shuffle was on the horizon. Burnett’s going to want to do something to keep Morgan in the game. But the previews would seem to say that the tribes will be unchanged going into next week’s immunity challenge. \*\* Here’s a thought - will they do any kind of merge or shuffle before both caches of buried treasure have been found? They’re on separate islands, so once they leave a camp, the treasure’s gone. Hmm. Also, I forgot the funniest moment of this week’s show: Jon announcing to the camera that Sandra would NOT be in the Final Four, and that he had “a million dollars” that said she wouldn’t be the final one. What a moron. ---
**Author:** ![Munch](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/munch/32/5281_2.png) [@Munch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Munch)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2003, 6:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/surviver-10-2/205100/52 "2003-10-03T18:14:52Z")
Smeg, I think they’d do a merge after one has been found. They may even give Drake the Morgan maps if they keep winning. But there are 6 pieces, and there are 6 Reward Challenges before the merge. Pundit, I have to ask, and I don’t mean offense, but how many seasons of Survivor have you watched? ---
**Author:** ![minty\_green](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f6c823/32.png) [@minty\_green](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/minty_green)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2003, 6:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/surviver-10-2/205100/53 "2003-10-03T18:44:12Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Little Nemo \* > Ordinarily, I’d think a player shuffle was on the horizon. Burnett’s going to want to do something to keep Morgan in the game. But the previews would seem to say that the tribes will be unchanged going into next week’s immunity challenge. Yeah, I’m wondering about a switch myself. If they’re going to do it, it might be right before the IC. If we don’t see previews showing two challenges, I’d think it’s a safe bet that a switch is on. In the past, switches have been done in either ep. 4 or 5, so we’re coming up on the right time for one. ---
**Author:** ![elf6c](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/c57346/32.png) [@elf6c](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elf6c)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2003, 6:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/surviver-10-2/205100/54 "2003-10-03T18:49:42Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by hillbilly queen \* > \*\*Well yeah, you can say that AFTER seeing the previews for next week. :rolleyes: > > But the comments about Rupert getting voted off were made based on his behavior LAST week. It’s obvious Shawn and Burton have Rupert issues. But the ladies love him, so he’ll be around for awhile. \*\* Actually I had him tabbed since the first episode as the first one out of that tribe. Big mouth, tiny arms and a grating personality to not a long stay make. Same thing with Skinny Ryan. I think Rupert is safe till the merge. No one will want to face him in the final 2, of course, but that’s a long ways away. At the merge it will be a Morgan slaughter till they are gone. So only then will the alliances and gamesmanship come into play in Drake. ---
**Author:** ![elf6c](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/c57346/32.png) [@elf6c](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elf6c)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2003, 6:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/surviver-10-2/205100/55 "2003-10-03T18:57:36Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Jadis \* > \*\*When I saw the setup, I immediately thought that Drake was going to come out on top. The challenge was the same essential issue as you have in tug-of-war, where the person with the _heaviest_ anchor usually wins. Arm strength wasn’t even an issue until the very last segment when they were forced to stand up and forgo the aid of the wooden pole. Rupert had the body mass to just wrap the rope around himself and lay there…that required almost no physical exertion. By the time they stood up, he still had enough arm strength to combine with his weight and leverage advantage to hold out over Osten. Osten might look buff, but there was no way he was going to outlast Rupert, since the key wasn’t so much strength (although you needed some) as it was simple mass and leverage. > > I will concede, however, that Jeff took pity on Morgan by the end when it was clear that Morgan was going to lose…in any previous challenege, Osten would have been disqualified as soon as he touched the pole again after being told to get his body _and_ the rope off of it. \*\* Given how massive Osten is I would bet that their masses are pretty close. Or at least close enough that the higher amount of muscle would give Osten an advantage. I think the advantage Rupert had was based on the superior amount and quality of food they are bringing in. Once they stood up, I thought it was all over for Rupert, especially with the slanted rules “enforcement”. I was wrong- yeah! David B noticed this too, by the way: > [@](#): > > Osten is struggling and not taking his rope off the post. Probst tells him to do it and he finally does. But wait, it’s back on the post. Probst keeps telling him to stop, and I am waiting for Probst to disqualify him when Osten finally gives up! “Rupert wins immunity for Drake,” Probst practically yells as Jon jumps into Rupert’s arms. Yeah, good idea – ‘cus I’m sure that’s just what he wanted, to have to lift somebody! The unbelievable winning streak continues. You know, at this point I’ve got to think Morgan has to be hoping that somebody from Drake just up and falls into the fire. [http://www.realitynewsonline.com/cgi-bin/ae.pl?mode=1&article=article3682.art&page=3](http://www.realitynewsonline.com/cgi-bin/ae.pl?mode=1&article=article3682.art&page=3) By the way on the cheesy tribe switch front- I hope they don’t. Keep it pirate rules- nobody bails you out. Let the tribes continue to dislike each other-- it sure will make the merge interesting for once. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![BiblioCat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/ed8c4c/32.png) [@BiblioCat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BiblioCat)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2003, 9:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/surviver-10-2/205100/56 "2003-10-03T21:57:58Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by PunditLisa \* > \*\*Re the previews next week. Okay, looks like Morgan is going to lose the next challenge thanks to the previews. Why else would JEFF be standing around hollering to Osten to keep swimming? \*\* From the previews, I think it looks like Osten is drowning. Is he just not a strong swimmer or can he not swim at all? I wonder if he’s giving up on a challenge? ---
**Author:** ![Curate](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/49beb7/32.png) [@Curate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Curate)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2003, 11:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/surviver-10-2/205100/57 "2003-10-03T23:11:19Z")
A couple of thoughts: I wondered last night if there might indeed be a plan to let Morgan lose most or all of the challenges. But as I consider last night’s challenges it seems to me that Morgan COULD have won either or both. It was hard to tell if Drake had a particular strategy in the sink-the-boat challenge that made them hard to beat, but at least for a while one of Morgan’s boats stayed far enough out of the way that Drake was able to double-team the remaining one. When that one went down I didn’t see much hope for Morgan’s final boat being able to sink both of Drake’s. Is it just me or does Andrew spend an awful lot of his interview time talking about what a great asset Osten is? I don’t think that Osten is a bad player, but he’s not outstanding. I don’t really get much sense that Andrew’s esteem for Osten is reciprocated, though. If Andrew considers Osten one of his long-term alliance members I think he may be fooling himself. Why would Andrew even raise the subject of Darrah’s being voted off? What good to make her understand that she’s just slightly less marginal than Lill? Wouldn’t it be better to let her think she’s part of the in crowd until the axe falls? On Drake, I suppose it’s true that Rupert might have some enemies, but I think Jon has pretty clearly marked himself for the first elimination. There was a conversation going on in the room at the time so that I couldn’t hear all that was said, but did he actually volunteer to sit out the boat challenge? If you are worried that you aren’t perceived as someone able to do his fair share it would seem foolhardy to tacitly admit it by willingly not talking part in a challenge. The fact that he was at the front of the line on the rope challenge telegraphed the same message, I thought. Having him aboard a boat might have made more sense than having someone who was heavier, and being seen doing his part to hold the rope in the second challenge might have exhibited some desirable traits. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2003, 11:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/surviver-10-2/205100/58 "2003-10-03T23:56:08Z")
Spoiler warnings for the preview, although by now others have already posted this information. It’s always hard to tell with the heavy handed editing, but it appears Jon is making a complete ass of himself. Based on what we’ve seen and heard, Jon thinks he is so popular with the majority of his teammates that he can afford to intentionally confront the ones he doesn’t like. He seems to believe that everyone else will take his side in any split. The reality appears to be that some people openly dislike Jon and the remainder quietly dislike him. As for next week, my guess is Osten’ll screw up during a swimming event in next week’s reward challenge. He won’t really be in any danger of drowning but Morgan will stretch their streak to 0-6. Jon will continue to be a fool and the other Drakes will consider throwing the immunity challenge in order to have an opportunity to vote him off. Based on this, I presume there will not be a team shuffle next week, because if that happened the new tribes would be too shaken up to consider such a risky move. ---
**Author:** ![monstro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ba9def/32.png) [@monstro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/monstro)\ **Post date:** [October 4, 2003, 1:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/surviver-10-2/205100/59 "2003-10-04T13:49:27Z")
I’m such a wimp. When Morgan lost yet again, I actually shed some tears (no joke). I have a weakness for underdogs, you see. I really hope they vote out Jon. The fight he had with Sandra was totally unnecessary (I thought Sandra was right to defend herself). I didn’t like the comment afterwards about how she wouldn’t be sitting in the Final Four. Like he would? Such cockiness should be nipped at the bud. I didn’t get that IC at all. What was the point of having it all rest on Osten and Rupert’s shoulders like that? I think it would have been better if both teams had had to keep standing the whole time. ---
**Author:** ![Mama\_Tiger](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/6de8d8/32.png) [@Mama\_Tiger](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mama_Tiger)\ **Post date:** [October 4, 2003, 1:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/surviver-10-2/205100/60 "2003-10-04T13:57:40Z")
According to what I heard elsewhere online that Jeff said in an interview: Osten really was in trouble in the swimming and they almost waited too late to help him out, not realizing it was as serious as it was. So that should make things interesting next week. I hope Drake doesn’t throw an immunity challenge either, no matter how much they hate Jon. There are plenty of opportunities to pick him off later. The CBS website has some interesting things to say about next week: > [@](#): > > Andrew and Ryan go in search of a good fishing spot, but instead they find themselves in a dangerous situation: lost in the jungle without water. Why does this not surprise me? Although I doubt it’s nearly as dangerous as the teaser suggests; you can’t believe _anything_ in the promos for this show. > [@](#): > > One tribe recovers a buried treasure. But will it have been worth the search? This leads me to wonder if they find the expected planted buried treasure, or find something else entirely – or if Morgan stumbles across their buried treasure by accident (although that would imply them getting off their whining lazy asses and actually DOING something, so I doubt that!). > [@](#): > > The Immunity Challenge shocks the tribes with an unexpected reward. Not a clue here. Well, some speculation. I’ve read some heavy spoilers about this but am not going to pass them along because I much prefer for it to remain a surprise. And I have serious doubts about the truth of all these “supposedly true” spoilers that pop up all over the place. > [@](#): > > Lubricated by whiskey, one Survivor creates a spectacle at a Tribal Council that is not to be missed. This strikes me as something Jon would do in half a heartbeat…but that would mean Drake loses a challenge, so I’m really torn. I’m trying to figure out which one at Morgan would create a bigger spectacle. Darrah, by causing everyone to bleed at the ears when her accent becomes even more pronounced when she’s drunk? Osten, who starts raving about the modeling contract he’s sure is waiting for him as soon as he gets kicked off? Whatever happens, I’m sure it will be what we least expect. Although this week before the show started I said to Papa Tiger, “Well, let’s watch Lill get booted off this week,” and needless to say we weren’t exactly surprised when she was. Don’t forget Morgan’s fishing net, though – the one they haven’t used yet, the one that they were USING AS PART OF THEIR SHELTER. Yeah, with its amazing insulating qualities!!! Sheesh. Why do I keep watching this? Oh, I know – because seeing Morgan lose is one of the greatest pleasures on TV right now. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/surviver-10-2/205100.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/surviver-10-2/205100.md?page=4)