# SW, Darth Sidious and Palpatine: what the heck? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [July 5, 2004, 3:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sw-darth-sidious-and-palpatine-what-the-heck/253587 "2004-07-05T03:15:28Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Soapbox\_Monkey](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ed655f/32.png) [@Soapbox\_Monkey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Soapbox_Monkey)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2004, 4:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sw-darth-sidious-and-palpatine-what-the-heck/253587/21 "2004-07-07T04:41:13Z")
> [@Hail Ants](#): > > Actually this is a perfect example of Lucas’ clumsy _backfilling canon_. The name ‘Palpatine’ never appears in ROTJ It’s listed in the credits. ---
**Author:** ![Hail\_Ants](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/dc4da7/32.png) [@Hail\_Ants](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hail_Ants)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2004, 6:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sw-darth-sidious-and-palpatine-what-the-heck/253587/22 "2004-07-07T06:23:22Z")
I stand corrected. I guess. He’s only listed as ‘The Emperor’ in the imdb credits. I was pretty sick of _The Muppets meet Star Wars_ less than halfway thru it so I might have missed it. I remember around 98 when they were gearing up for Phantom Menace by releasing a bunch of Star Wars merchandise, all of a sudden he was ‘Emperor Palpatine’. It was similar to Luke’s father not being called ‘Anakin Skywalker’ until ROTJ. ---
**Author:** ![HubZilla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/ccd318/32.png) [@HubZilla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HubZilla)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2004, 7:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sw-darth-sidious-and-palpatine-what-the-heck/253587/23 "2004-07-07T07:02:13Z")
“Once secure in office he declared himself Emperor, shutting himself away from populace. Soon he was controlled by the very assistants and boot-lickers he had appointed to high office, and the cries of the people for justice did not reach his ears.” Hmm, how interesting. I guess he’s not really in charge. I think they’re the same person, but in TPM Sidious says “This is an unexpected move (Amidala coming back to Naboo)”, whereas she told Senator Palps the same thing earlier. Wouldn’t he know? ---
**Author:** ![MEBuckner](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mebuckner/32/2896_2.png) [@MEBuckner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MEBuckner)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2004, 7:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sw-darth-sidious-and-palpatine-what-the-heck/253587/24 "2004-07-07T07:17:05Z")
Maybe Senator Palpatine/Darth Sidious is one guy with _multiple personalities!_ ---
**Author:** ![Diceman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/22d042/32.png) [@Diceman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diceman)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2004, 11:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sw-darth-sidious-and-palpatine-what-the-heck/253587/25 "2004-07-07T11:41:51Z")
> [@](#): > > Hmm, how interesting. I guess he’s not really in charge. Really. I never imagined Palpatine as being a figurehead ruler, but I guess it wouldn’t really be possible for any one guy to control a huge multi-planet empire. ---
**Author:** ![Captain\_Amazing](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6de8d8/32.png) [@Captain\_Amazing](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Amazing)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2004, 2:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sw-darth-sidious-and-palpatine-what-the-heck/253587/26 "2004-07-07T14:31:19Z")
> [@HubZilla](#): > > Hmm, how interesting. I guess he’s not really in charge. I think he got more evil and hands on as the movies went on. In the first movie, the only evil thing the emperor himself does is dissolve the Senate. In the third, he’s a dark Jedi who’s plotting to destroy the rebellion and corrupt Luke, and shooting lightning out of his fingers. ---
**Author:** ![Cervaise](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cervaise/32/16693_2.png) [@Cervaise](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cervaise)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2004, 8:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sw-darth-sidious-and-palpatine-what-the-heck/253587/27 "2004-07-07T20:54:32Z")
> [@](#): > > Once secure in office he declared himself Emperor, shutting himself away from populace. Soon he was controlled by the very assistants and boot-lickers he had appointed to high office, and the cries of the people for justice did not > reach his ears. Odd how this could also be read to describe Lucas himself. ---
**Author:** ![Agent\_Cooper](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/9fc348/32.png) [@Agent\_Cooper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Agent_Cooper)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2004, 9:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sw-darth-sidious-and-palpatine-what-the-heck/253587/28 "2004-07-07T21:31:33Z")
cant believe im posting about star wars … bleh perhaps … lucas wants to think that someday people might watch the movies 1-6, rather than 4, 5, 6, 1, 2, 3. In which case it seems only logical to set up the helpful, kind emperor as coming to save the day in ep1 & ep2, then in ep3 the turn occurs. thus the mystrey in the first films. ---
**Author:** ![Hail\_Ants](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/dc4da7/32.png) [@Hail\_Ants](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hail_Ants)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2004, 1:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sw-darth-sidious-and-palpatine-what-the-heck/253587/29 "2004-07-08T01:22:19Z")
> [@](#): > > cant believe im posting about star wars … bleh Me neither… There was also the rather obvious scene in TPM near the end during Liam Neeson’s character’s funeral (I think you have to rip your tounge out to pronounce his name correctly) when Obi-wan says something like, “There is a darker force at work here” and, with all the elegance and subtlety of a blaster, they **imediately** cut to Palpatine. I would love for Lucas to pull something amazing out of his ass with the finale. I just don’t see it happening. ---
**Author:** ![Soapbox\_Monkey](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ed655f/32.png) [@Soapbox\_Monkey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Soapbox_Monkey)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2004, 4:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sw-darth-sidious-and-palpatine-what-the-heck/253587/30 "2004-07-08T04:53:04Z")
> [@Hail Ants](#): > > “There is a darker force at work here” and, with all the elegance and subtlety of a blaster, they **imediately** cut to Palpatine. Oh my God! What was Lucas thinking by making the connection so obvious!? Maybe its because LUCAS HAS DONE NOTHING BUT SAY THAT THEY ARE ONE IN THE SAME! There IS no mystery. Palpatine = Sidious. That has NEVER been a secret. Lucas wasn’t ruining any mystery with that “unsubtle cut.” :wally ---
**Author:** ![The\_Asbestos\_Mango](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/edb3f5/32.png) [@The\_Asbestos\_Mango](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Asbestos_Mango)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2004, 6:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sw-darth-sidious-and-palpatine-what-the-heck/253587/31 "2004-07-08T06:22:57Z")
> [@Hail Ants](#): > > I would love for Lucas to pull something amazing out of his ass with the finale. I just don’t see it happening. Um, isn’t that how we got TPM and AOTC? ---
**Author:** ![Cervaise](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cervaise/32/16693_2.png) [@Cervaise](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cervaise)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2004, 5:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sw-darth-sidious-and-palpatine-what-the-heck/253587/32 "2004-07-08T17:36:34Z")
> [@Hail Ants](#): > > I would love for Lucas to pull something amazing out of his ass with the finale. We’re almost there. Now all we need is the “amazing” part. ---
**Author:** ![Trunk](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/87869e/32.png) [@Trunk](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Trunk)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2004, 6:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sw-darth-sidious-and-palpatine-what-the-heck/253587/33 "2004-07-08T18:10:31Z")
In Episode 3 are we going to find out that Chewbacca and Chief Chirpa are the same? ---
**Author:** ![Soapbox\_Monkey](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ed655f/32.png) [@Soapbox\_Monkey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Soapbox_Monkey)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2004, 9:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sw-darth-sidious-and-palpatine-what-the-heck/253587/34 "2004-07-08T21:46:16Z")
> [@Trunk](#): > > In Episode 3 are we going to find out that Chewbacca and Chief Chirpa are the same? I’m curious as to how we are even going to know which Wookie is Chewbacca. None of the Wookies can speak english, so unless one of the english speaking characters learns his name and refers to him by it, how will we know _that_ Wookie right there is Chewbacca, and not just random Wookie extra #3? 😕 ---
**Author:** ![Bippy\_the\_Beardless](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/ac8455/32.png) [@Bippy\_the\_Beardless](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bippy_the_Beardless)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2004, 10:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sw-darth-sidious-and-palpatine-what-the-heck/253587/35 "2004-07-08T22:45:03Z")
> [@Agent Cooper](#): > > . lucas wants to think that someday people might watch the movies 1-6, rather than 4, 5, 6, 1, 2, 3. In which case it seems only logical to set up the helpful, kind emperor as coming to save the day in ep1 & ep2, then in ep3 the turn occurs. thus the mystrey in the first films. I think you are spot on with the GL plan to try and have the movies work viewed 1…6, this is also IMHO why Han was edited to shoot second. If watching in 1…6 order you have seen Gredo as a kid growing up. I susspect GL thought it would make Han seem to evil to have him kill the grown up Gredo without giving a warning or as self defense. ---
**Author:** ![Keweenaw](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/da6949/32.png) [@Keweenaw](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Keweenaw)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2004, 11:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sw-darth-sidious-and-palpatine-what-the-heck/253587/36 "2004-07-08T23:09:34Z")
> [@Soapbox Monkey](#): > > and the fact that Lucas himself has said numerous times that they ARE the same ☹ do you have a cite for this? I’ve always thought Lucas would beat around the bush when asked about this directly. ---
**Author:** ![Apos](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/838e76/32.png) [@Apos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Apos)\ **Post date:** [July 9, 2004, 12:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sw-darth-sidious-and-palpatine-what-the-heck/253587/37 "2004-07-09T00:29:44Z")
> [@](#): > > There IS no mystery. Palpatine = Sidious. That has NEVER been a secret. Lucas wasn’t ruining any mystery with that “unsubtle cut.” Which is exactly the problem. He’s made it so so clear, and yet, not. His official page refuses to call them the same person, treating it as a mystery. The film never directly makes the connection for the audience, but implies it to a ridiculous extent, even having Palp and Sid be played by the same dude. ---
**Author:** ![Soapbox\_Monkey](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ed655f/32.png) [@Soapbox\_Monkey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Soapbox_Monkey)\ **Post date:** [July 9, 2004, 2:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sw-darth-sidious-and-palpatine-what-the-heck/253587/38 "2004-07-09T02:02:09Z")
> [@Keweenaw](#): > > do you have a cite for this? > > I’ve always thought Lucas would beat around the bush when asked about this directly. Aww damn, now you’re gonna make me spend the weekend doing research through the website and my DVDs. 😉 I’ll get back to you on that. ---
**Author:** ![Beauty\_Personified](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/e480ec/32.png) [@Beauty\_Personified](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Beauty_Personified)\ **Post date:** [July 12, 2004, 4:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sw-darth-sidious-and-palpatine-what-the-heck/253587/39 "2004-07-12T16:37:54Z")
> [@Soapbox Monkey](#): > > In EU Boba Fett is a mysterious former senator from some far off system, not the clone of an already notorious bounty hunter. Where in the extended universe is this “backstory” given, anyway? The comics? Anyhoo… ---
**Author:** ![Soapbox\_Monkey](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ed655f/32.png) [@Soapbox\_Monkey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Soapbox_Monkey)\ **Post date:** [July 12, 2004, 6:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sw-darth-sidious-and-palpatine-what-the-heck/253587/40 "2004-07-12T18:27:27Z")
> [@Beauty Personified](#): > > Where in the extended universe is this “backstory” given, anyway? The comics? > > Anyhoo… No clue, I’ve only heard it from a few people on Star Wars message boards. Personally, I don’t ever plan to touch anything EU, so I won’t be able to find that information in order to cite it, sorry. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sw-darth-sidious-and-palpatine-what-the-heck/253587.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sw-darth-sidious-and-palpatine-what-the-heck/253587.md?page=3)