# Synthetic Diamonds
**URL:** https://boards.straightdope.com/t/synthetic-diamonds/285508
**Category:** Factual Questions
**Created:** [January 19, 2005, 7:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/synthetic-diamonds/285508 "2005-01-19T07:01:57Z")
**Posts on this page:** 20
**Page:** 1
### Author:  [@ramesh\_sodum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ramesh_sodum)
#### Post date: [January 19, 2005, 7:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/synthetic-diamonds/285508/1 "2005-01-19T07:01:57Z")
Does anyone know about these diamonds and where to get them.
Are they real diamonds?
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### Author:  [@Q.E.D](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Q.E.D)
#### Post date: [January 19, 2005, 7:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/synthetic-diamonds/285508/2 "2005-01-19T07:16:46Z")
Depends on what you mean, exactly. True synthetic diamonds are real diamonds, formed from elemental carbon in the same way as natural diamonds, only under controlled, artificial conditions of heat and pressure. It is difficult, time-consuming and expensive to make gem-quality synthetic stones, so most synthetics are manufactured for industrial applications, such as cutting wheels. It is almost impossible to differentiate natural from synthetic stones.
On the other hand, there are several types of stones which are frequently, and mistakenly called “synthetic diamonds”, most notably, the cubic zirconia. These are considerably less expensive than either natural or true synthetic diamonds, and at least in the case of the CZ stones, are difficult to tell from the real thing. They’re commonly available at jewelry stores.
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### Author:  [@ramesh\_sodum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ramesh_sodum)
#### Post date: [January 19, 2005, 7:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/synthetic-diamonds/285508/3 "2005-01-19T07:42:50Z")
> [@Q.E.D.](#):
>
> Depends on what you mean, exactly. True synthetic diamonds are real diamonds, formed from elemental carbon in the same way as natural diamonds, only under controlled, artificial conditions of heat and pressure. It is difficult, time-consuming and expensive to make gem-quality synthetic stones, so most synthetics are manufactured for industrial applications, such as cutting wheels. It is almost impossible to differentiate natural from synthetic stones.
>
> On the other hand, there are several types of stones which are frequently, and mistakenly called “synthetic diamonds”, most notably, the cubic zirconia. These are considerably less expensive than either natural or true synthetic diamonds, and at least in the case of the CZ stones, are difficult to tell from the real thing. They’re commonly available at jewelry stores.
So what is Gemesis and Apollo doing in The US. They are making Synthetic diamonds of Gem quality. Any information on the Technology?
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### Author:  [@Desmostylus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Desmostylus)
#### Post date: [January 19, 2005, 7:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/synthetic-diamonds/285508/4 "2005-01-19T07:45:18Z")
> [@ramesh sodum](#):
>
> Does anyone know about these diamonds and where to get them.
>
> Are they real diamonds?
They’re real. A list of places you can buy them can be found here:
[http://www.gemesis.com/where.htm](http://www.gemesis.com/where.htm)
A good background story on the things can be found here:
[http://www.wired.com/wired/archive/11.09/diamond.html](http://www.wired.com/wired/archive/11.09/diamond.html)
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### Author:  [@HMS\_Irruncible](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HMS_Irruncible)
#### Post date: [January 19, 2005, 8:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/synthetic-diamonds/285508/5 "2005-01-19T08:01:35Z")
In addition to synthetic diamonds and CZ, there’s also Moissanite gems which are made from silicon carbide. They’re about a third the cost of regular diamonds and can only be distinguished from natural diamonds by a thermal conductivity test.
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### Author:  [@Zoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zoe)
#### Post date: [January 19, 2005, 8:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/synthetic-diamonds/285508/6 "2005-01-19T08:07:17Z")
One difference in the synthetic stones and natural diamonds is that the synthetic stones are _flawless_.
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### Author:  [@Testy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Testy)
#### Post date: [January 19, 2005, 9:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/synthetic-diamonds/285508/7 "2005-01-19T09:53:35Z")
> [@NattoGuy](#):
>
> In addition to synthetic diamonds and CZ, there’s also Moissanite gems which are made from silicon carbide. They’re about a third the cost of regular diamonds and can only be distinguished from natural diamonds by a thermal conductivity test.
And the moisannite is also a heck of a lot harder than CZ and never turns yellow as I have been told CZ is prone to do.
Regards
Testy
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### Author:  [@HMS\_Irruncible](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HMS_Irruncible)
#### Post date: [January 19, 2005, 10:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/synthetic-diamonds/285508/8 "2005-01-19T10:35:22Z")
> [@Testy](#):
>
> And the moisannite is also a heck of a lot harder than CZ and never turns yellow as I have been told CZ is prone to do.
Not only that, moissanite has a bit more “fire” than even natural diamonds do. And they’re flawless. Or at least you can only see the flaws with an electron microscope.
If you’re wondering if I own stock in the company that produces Moissanite material, why, yes I do 🙂
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### Author:  [@Testy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Testy)
#### Post date: [January 19, 2005, 11:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/synthetic-diamonds/285508/9 "2005-01-19T11:42:41Z")
Wasn’t there another material for imitation diamonds? I’ve read about it somewhere. Anyway, the material had a much higher index of refraction than diamond, I believe 6 X was mentioned.
Regards
Testy
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### Author:  [@samclem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/samclem)
#### Post date: [January 20, 2005, 1:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/synthetic-diamonds/285508/10 "2005-01-20T01:10:59Z")
> [@NattoGuy](#):
>
> In addition to synthetic diamonds and CZ, there’s also Moissanite gems which are made from silicon carbide. They’re about a third the cost of regular diamonds and can only be distinguished from natural diamonds by a thermal conductivity test.
Not true. CZ’s can be distinguished from a diamond by a thermal conductivity test. Moissanite cannot be distinguished by a thermal conductivity tester.
Moissanite can be easily distinguished by using a tester which works on light refraction. Moissanite is also doubly refractive, and can be spotted by looking through the crown angles of the stone. Any good diamond buyer should be able to spot this.
**Zoe** said
> [@](#):
>
> One difference in the synthetic stones and natural diamonds is that the synthetic stones are flawless.
There are, of course, flawless diamonds. There are diamonds that are very free of inclusions, to the point that using this as a test of whether a stone is a synthetic or a natural, is not useful.
**Testy** said
> [@](#):
>
> And the moisannite is also a heck of a lot harder than CZ and never turns yellow as I have been told CZ is prone to do.
CZ’s _can_ turn color over a long period, but they’re pretty stable in my experience. Most of the Moisannite that has been produced so far has a yellow tint. I don’t mean **YELLOW** , but not screaming white. Slightly tinted.
I personally don’t think Moissanite has more “fire” than well-cut real diamonds. YMMV\>
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### Author:  [@daffyduck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/daffyduck)
#### Post date: [January 20, 2005, 3:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/synthetic-diamonds/285508/11 "2005-01-20T03:25:47Z")
_So what is Gemesis and Apollo doing in The US. They are making Synthetic diamonds of Gem quality. Any information on the Technology?_
In September of 03, Wired magazine had a cover article on man made diamonds that discusses the technology. You can [find it here.](http://www.wired.com/wired/archive/11.09/diamond.html)
The details are, of course, tightly guarded trade secrets.
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### Author:  [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)
#### Post date: [January 20, 2005, 4:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/synthetic-diamonds/285508/12 "2005-01-20T04:45:53Z")
> [@](#):
>
> I personally don’t think Moissanite has more “fire” than well-cut real diamonds. YMMV\>
It was my understanding that “fire”, in regards to gemstones, is a technical, objective term referring to the index of refraction. Is this not the case?
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### Author:  [@HMS\_Irruncible](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HMS_Irruncible)
#### Post date: [January 20, 2005, 8:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/synthetic-diamonds/285508/13 "2005-01-20T08:06:42Z")
> [@samclem](#):
>
> Not true. CZ’s can be distinguished from a diamond by a thermal conductivity test. Moissanite cannot be distinguished by a thermal conductivity tester.
True, I misspoke on that regard.
> [@](#):
>
> Moissanite can be easily distinguished by using a tester which works on light refraction.
Actually the moissanite tester sold by its major manufacturer [works by measuring absorption of UV light](http://www.moissanite.com/moissanite_faq.cfm)
[/quote]
> [@](#):
>
> Moissanite is also doubly refractive, and can be spotted by looking through the crown angles of the stone. Any good diamond buyer should be able to spot this.
It is easily spotted with a loupe, true enough, if you know what double refraction looks like. Most diamond buyers do not know at this point because they have never had to know.
> [@](#):
>
> I personally don’t think Moissanite has more “fire” than well-cut real diamonds. YMMV\>
There isn’t much room for mileage variance here. “Fire” or dispersion is caused by refractive index. Moissanite has a RI of 2.65, diamond’s is 2.42. [Here’s a demonstration that highlights the visual differences between the two](http://www.moissanite.com/brilliance_fire.cfm).
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### Author:  [@puggyfish](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puggyfish)
#### Post date: [January 20, 2005, 1:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/synthetic-diamonds/285508/14 "2005-01-20T13:23:13Z")
I remember reading a New Scientist article recently that reported on a demonstration of an improved technique to manufacture artificial diamonds which conveniently produces them in sizes up to around 5 mm.
I believe that the biggest market for artificial diamonds at the moment is for abrasion tools, which use very small (sub-millimetre) diamonds, rather than gemstones.
[Here we go](http://www.newscientist.com/article.ns?id=mg18124372.700)
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### Author:  [@Skott](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skott)
#### Post date: [August 23, 2005, 2:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/synthetic-diamonds/285508/15 "2005-08-23T02:36:43Z")
I saw an ad for these jewels called DiamondAura in the “Space X” edition of Discover magazine. It seems to say an awful lot for such a small price. Are they true diamonds? Apparently they have a higher atomic weight.
> [@](#):
>
> Only an experienced diamond appraiser utilizing the proper instruments is able to make the distinction between a natural diamond and a DiamondAura.
To that end, does it really matter? If it is a diamond, sparkles like a diamond, cuts glass like a diamond (does it have the same hardness?), is made of carbon at high pressures and tempuratures, isn’t in a diamond?
[http://www.nextten.com/giftsandjewelry/DiamondAura.aspx](http://www.nextten.com/giftsandjewelry/DiamondAura.aspx)
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### Author:  [@Whack-a-Mole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whack-a-Mole)
#### Post date: [August 23, 2005, 1:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/synthetic-diamonds/285508/16 "2005-08-23T13:52:59Z")
> [@Chronos](#):
>
> It was my understanding that “fire”, in regards to gemstones, is a technical, objective term referring to the index of refraction. Is this not the case?
The fire or brilliance (two different things) in gemstones is partly based on the index of refraction of the stone but is based more on the cut of the stone. The cut certainly takes the index of refraction into account but then the stone is cut so as to provide “ideal” angles for light bouncing about in the stone to come back out in a preferred manner.
This is why the Brilliant Round cut diamond is so popular. It is considered the ideal cut to maximize the diamonds beauty and is not an accident but a mathematical construct devised by [Marcel Tolkowsky](http://diamonds.pricescope.com/tolk.asp) in the early 1900’s.
Presumably different stones with different indexes of refraction would need to be cut differently to maximize their beauty.
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### Author:  [@dropzone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dropzone)
#### Post date: [August 23, 2005, 4:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/synthetic-diamonds/285508/17 "2005-08-23T16:39:12Z")
> [@Skott](#):
>
> To that end, does it really matter? If it is a diamond, sparkles like a diamond, cuts glass like a diamond (does it have the same hardness?), is made of carbon at high pressures and tempuratures, isn’t in a diamond?
Tsk-tsk! Don’t expect DeBeers to be offering you a marketing job anytime soon.
It will be fun to watch those bastitches twist in the breeze as the “fakes” start taking over. I’ve already seen (and bought) CZs that are only distinguishable to the casual observer because they are better stones than any diamond I could afford.
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### Author:  [@Lightnin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lightnin)
#### Post date: [August 23, 2005, 5:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/synthetic-diamonds/285508/18 "2005-08-23T17:20:42Z")
Yesterday I heard a commecial for some sort of jewelry shop, wherein they touted the “age” of natural diamonds. Diamonds were formed billions of years ago, they said, so therefore they symbolize love much better than anything else.
They didn’t specifically mention the artifical diamonds, but that sure seemed to be what they were hinting about- that since the artificial diamonds are man-made, they aren’t as old, or as “symbolic” as the nature-made ones.
'Cause, you know, when they make the man-made diamonds they also make the carbon, right then and there. :rolleyes:
I can’t wait to see DeBeers get steamrolled by technology.
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### Author:  [@Whack-a-Mole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whack-a-Mole)
#### Post date: [August 23, 2005, 5:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/synthetic-diamonds/285508/19 "2005-08-23T17:28:44Z")
> [@dropzone](#):
>
> It will be fun to watch those bastitches twist in the breeze as the “fakes” start taking over.
Don’t be too sure. De Beers is a mighty powerful cartel. They are way ahead of you in trying to stompt these guys out. Personally I agree it’s good to see De Beers squirm and I would love to see their cartel fractured or broken but it’ll be one helluva battle for whoever tries it.
From the link **Desmostylus** provided:
> [@](#):
>
> Several years ago, it set up what it calls the Gem Defensive Programme - a none too subtle campaign to warn jewelers and the public about the arrival of manufactured diamonds. At no charge, the company is supplying gem labs with sophisticated machines designed to help distinguish man-made from mined stones.
>
> _\_
>
> Meanwhile, industry groups led by the Jewelers Vigilance Committee have pressured the Federal Trade Commission to force Gemesis to label its stones as synthetic.
>
> _\_
>
> In an ambiguous April 2001 ruling, the Federal Trade Commission said that it was “unfair or deceptive” to call a man-made diamond a “diamond,” but offered no opinion on the question of calling it a “cultured diamond.”
>
> SOURCE: [http://www.wired.com/wired/archive/11.09/diamond.html](http://www.wired.com/wired/archive/11.09/diamond.html)
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### Author:  [@clairobscur](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/clairobscur)
#### Post date: [August 23, 2005, 10:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/synthetic-diamonds/285508/20 "2005-08-23T22:10:42Z")
> [@Lightnin'](#):
>
> I can’t wait to see DeBeers get steamrolled by technology.
It won’t be. Artificial diadmonds (let alone zirconium) have been around for a long time, but for some reason people would rather buy less beautiful stones for a higher price. I think they’ll go on…(especially since jewellers doesn’t seem to be very interested in selling artificial stones).
It just doesn’t make sense to me. If the stone is equally beautiful when you look at it with your naked eye, why would you spend even one cent more for a natural stone (except if you’re a mineralogist).
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