# Taco Bell's Ground Beef Is Less Than 35% Actual Meat **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [January 25, 2011, 3:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/taco-bells-ground-beef-is-less-than-35-actual-meat/568875 "2011-01-25T03:09:36Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 6
**Author:** ![Skywatcher](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skywatcher/32/254_2.png) [@Skywatcher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skywatcher)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2011, 8:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/taco-bells-ground-beef-is-less-than-35-actual-meat/568875/101 "2011-01-25T20:33:55Z")
> [@xtisme](#): > > I never get the tacos on the very rare occasions I got to Taco Bell. It’s been sort of a quasi-meat paste for years now (it USED to be real ground beef, and the tacos were at least edible IMHO). These days I get the grilled burrito with steak (never the default ‘ground meat’), and if it’s not real steak it at least tastes like and has the consistency of meat. Yep. > [@Mean\_Mr.Mustard](#): > > Anyone else getting a hankerin’ for Taco Bell? I had a burrito and nachos from a 7-Eleven for lunch. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Alan\_Smithee](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/2acd7d/32.png) [@Alan\_Smithee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alan_Smithee)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2011, 8:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/taco-bells-ground-beef-is-less-than-35-actual-meat/568875/102 "2011-01-25T20:36:26Z")
I think the most likely explanation is that the “seasoned ground beef” is approximately one third beef, one third water, and one third seasoning. There is no TVP, which is nowhere mentioned in the news article or the ingredient list. There is soy lecithin, which is an emulsifier and is sufficient cause for the allergen warning. The bulk of the seasoning is not soy but “isolated oat product.” According to the news report, the problem is not with the accuracy of the nutritional labeling, but with the fact that the mixture cannot legally be sold as “beef” according to FDA guidelines. That’s a serious charge that should result in fines if proven IMO, but it doesn’t make me less likely to eat at Taco Bell. ---
**Author:** ![Taomist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/53a042/32.png) [@Taomist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Taomist)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2011, 8:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/taco-bells-ground-beef-is-less-than-35-actual-meat/568875/103 "2011-01-25T20:36:35Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > I have no problem with TVP, and think it’d make a perfectly acceptable substitute for meat in something like tacos or burritos… But isn’t TVP _more_ expensive than cheap beef? If there’s TVP in a Taco Bell at all, I would expect it to only be by request (and I can certainly see someone requesting it). It’s quite cheap in comparison, and can sit on the shelf for at least a year before needing to be used. Again, this was over 20 years ago, but the first time I ever made the taco meat for the place I worked at, I had to ask WTF this big bag was we were pouring into the meat. It was easily 60/40 mix/meat. You heat up the meat, break it up a bit, then add the mix, which is tvp and flavorings. The meat-grease hydrates the mix, maybe add some water \ and voila, you have meat-stuff. That is mostly not meat. But is still damn tasty! Just go get a taco-flavoring packet and do it at home, but imagine a bigger packet than you have meat. It’s that. More like meat-flavored taco stuff than taco-flavored meat-stuff. ---
**Author:** ![filling\_pages](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/b9bd4f/32.png) [@filling\_pages](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/filling_pages)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2011, 8:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/taco-bells-ground-beef-is-less-than-35-actual-meat/568875/104 "2011-01-25T20:47:04Z")
When I worked at Taco Bell in the mid 90s, the meat came in sealed, clear bags. Like a big ziplock back, but sealed all the way around. It was preseasoned. We would boil the bags until hot, cut off a corner, and pour the heated, seasoned meat into a pan for the line. That was it. I wish I could remember what it said on the box that the meat bags came in. (If you’re curious, the beans came precooked but dried. We’d rip open their bag, pour the dry bits in a pan, add hot water, stir, and give it all a while to rehydrate. Also preseasoned.) ---
**Author:** ![Skywatcher](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skywatcher/32/254_2.png) [@Skywatcher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skywatcher)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2011, 8:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/taco-bells-ground-beef-is-less-than-35-actual-meat/568875/105 "2011-01-25T20:50:29Z")
> [@Markxxx](#): > > My mum was a big fan of “pure” ground beef. Back in her day it was common to use some sort of filler in ground beef to stretch it. I love soy, but I realize most people don’t. [It’s evil!](http://tedsstudio.com/bugsport/?page0060) 😃 ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2011, 8:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/taco-bells-ground-beef-is-less-than-35-actual-meat/568875/106 "2011-01-25T20:57:36Z")
> [@Alan\_Smithee](#): > > I think the most likely explanation is that the “seasoned ground beef” is approximately one third beef, one third water, and one third seasoning. Even then, I’m not sure. In 43g of “seasoned ground beef” there are 2 g of carbs. Let’s assume, worst-case scenario, that all of those carbs come from the oats. Oatmeal is about 70% carbs by weight, so assuming all the carbs come from the oats, we only have about 3g of oats in there. The total amount of sodium in that 43g is 300mg, meaning, if table salt were our only source of sodium (which it’s not), that’s a maximum of 750mg of table salt per serving, meaning every ingredient listed after salt has to be less than 750mg. ---
**Author:** ![Alan\_Smithee](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/2acd7d/32.png) [@Alan\_Smithee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alan_Smithee)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2011, 9:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/taco-bells-ground-beef-is-less-than-35-actual-meat/568875/107 "2011-01-25T21:25:36Z")
“Isolated oat product” is not necessarily oatmeal. It could be isolated oat protein, or any other mixture of oat constituents. ---
**Author:** ![XT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xt/32/456_2.png) [@XT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XT)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2011, 9:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/taco-bells-ground-beef-is-less-than-35-actual-meat/568875/108 "2011-01-25T21:28:37Z")
[QUOTE=BrainGlutton] But, it does not fear or suffer when it dies! [/QUOTE] Yes, but part of the enjoyment is tasting the fear… -XT ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2011, 9:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/taco-bells-ground-beef-is-less-than-35-actual-meat/568875/109 "2011-01-25T21:34:31Z")
> [@Alan\_Smithee](#): > > “Isolated oat product” is not necessarily oatmeal. It could be isolated oat protein, or any other mixture of oat constituents. It seems that it’s oat fiber that is labeled as [isolated oat product](http://books.google.com/books?id=brdM8-ahRg4C&pg=SA72-PA65&lpg=SA72-PA65&dq=what+is+isolated+oat+product+-%22taco+bell%22&source=bl&ots=4NgHeW0wTQ&sig=fmua-0EpFejNxP1yEhurbEKFjqQ&hl=en&ei=akE_TfKHGsK78gbg5NG6Cg&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=1&ved=0CBIQ6AEwADgK#v=onepage&q=what%20is%20isolated%20oat%20product%20-%22taco%20bell%22&f=false). I can’t find any other references to what “isolated oat product” could mean, just “oat fiber.” ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2011, 9:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/taco-bells-ground-beef-is-less-than-35-actual-meat/568875/110 "2011-01-25T21:52:15Z")
On the other hand, running through the numbers– Assuming the beef is 70:30 lean:fat, and using [this nutritional chart](http://www.fatsecret.com/calories-nutrition/usda/ground-beef-(70%25-lean---30%25-fat)), we find that for 4.5g of fat, that’s about 15 g of 70:30 beef. 15g beef/43g serving = 35% beef, on the nose. But that would mean we would need 15g of water, and 13g of “seasoning” to make 43g. ---
**Author:** ![purplehorseshoe](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/purplehorseshoe/32/2996_2.png) [@purplehorseshoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/purplehorseshoe)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2011, 10:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/taco-bells-ground-beef-is-less-than-35-actual-meat/568875/111 "2011-01-25T22:32:30Z")
**Pulykamell** , I read that post as making a distinction between ground beef and taco filling because tacos contain beef PLUS other things (lettuce, tomatoes, cheese…) thus the filling is more than just meat. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2011, 10:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/taco-bells-ground-beef-is-less-than-35-actual-meat/568875/112 "2011-01-25T22:46:45Z")
> [@purplehorseshoe](#): > > **Pulykamell** , I read that post as making a distinction between ground beef and taco filling because tacos contain beef PLUS other things (lettuce, tomatoes, cheese…) thus the filling is more than just meat. I’m confused. What do you mean? We’re just talking about the beef filling here. The lawsuit is that the beef filling is less than 35% beef. I don’t think anyone is taking lettuce, tomatoes, and cheese into consideration for that. Nor is Taco Bell, as they list those ingredients and their nutritional value separately. ---
**Author:** ![Irishman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/b487fb/32.png) [@Irishman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Irishman)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2011, 11:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/taco-bells-ground-beef-is-less-than-35-actual-meat/568875/113 "2011-01-25T23:07:23Z")
> [@aceplace57](#): > > I would prefer at least 60% beef. 35% seems a bit less nutritious than it should be. Define your use of “nutritious”. I don’t really have a complaint against TVP. It’s probably in plenty of processed foods I eat. Also, from reading that list, if the ingredients are in the correct order, then I would agree it doesn’t appear to be using TVP. Ergo, for the seasoned beef mix to be 35% beef, it would have to be roughly 35% water and 30% seasoning (or thereabouts). Thinking about it, that actually makes some sense - the seasonings are a lot of dry things like onion _powder_, tomato _powder_, garlic _powder_, cocoa _powder_ - no wonder they have to use that much water. Which tells me that Taco Bell actually is being pretty honest with their labeling - they list it as “_Seasoned_ Ground Beef” on their site, not just “ground beef”. I suppose one might technically by FDA standards have them label it “Seasoned Ground Beef _Mix_”, but that seems a weak semantic argument that is already fairly well addressed. So they use real ground beef in a “tasty”\* seasoning mix and then use that as filling in a variety of products, including their tacos. In related news, my hamburger is only 50% beef. Oh my god! (Wait, there’s a bun? Silly me.) ---
**Author:** ![bump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7c8e57/32.png) [@bump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bump)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2011, 11:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/taco-bells-ground-beef-is-less-than-35-actual-meat/568875/114 "2011-01-25T23:10:32Z")
> [@acsenray](#): > > There are five ingredients on that list: Beef, Water, Seasoning, Salt, and Sodium Phosphates. > > The seasoning is made up of: Isolated Oat Product, Salt, Chili Pepper, Onion Powder, Tomato Powder, Oats (_Wheat_), _Soy_ Lecithin, Sugar, Spices, Maltodextrin, _Soybean_ Oil (Anti-dusting Agent), Garlic Powder, Autolyzed Yeast Extract, Citric Acid, Caramel Color, Cocoa Powder (Processed With Alkali), Silicon Dioxide, Natural Flavors, Yeast, Modified Corn Starch, Natural Smoke Flavor > > The note “CONTAINS SOYBEAN, WHEAT” is merely there to draw attention to the presence of soybean and wheat among the ingredients in the seasoning. Beyond that, I bet the “isolated oat product” and oats/wheat are there as a sort of thickener so that the taco seasoning coats the meat effectively. It’s pretty obvious that there’s more salt than anything but “isolated oat product”, and I’d guess that there’s not more than 1/3 tsp of salt per taco. I bet this is some dumb-ass ambulance chaser trying to make a buck by doing something funky like comparing the dry weight of the beef to the total weight of the entirely hydrated mixture, where there’ll be more water hanging around to screw with the percentage of beef by weight. ---
**Author:** ![Reno\_Nevada](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/6f9a4e/32.png) [@Reno\_Nevada](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Reno_Nevada)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2011, 11:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/taco-bells-ground-beef-is-less-than-35-actual-meat/568875/115 "2011-01-25T23:44:37Z")
> [@bump](#): > > Beyond that, I bet the “isolated oat product” and oats/wheat are there as a sort of thickener so that the taco seasoning coats the meat effectively. > > It’s pretty obvious that there’s more salt than anything but “isolated oat product”, and I’d guess that there’s not more than 1/3 tsp of salt per taco. > > I bet this is some dumb-ass ambulance chaser trying to make a buck by doing something funky like comparing the dry weight of the beef to the total weight of the entirely hydrated mixture, where there’ll be more water hanging around to screw with the percentage of beef by weight. Just so we are all on the same page here, the Taco Bell \*labelling \*clearly states that their Seasoned Beef is almost all beef, with no TVP and very little filler, but some wheat and soy products, enough to trigger allergies. The guy bringing this suit contends that he \*tested \*the Taco Bell Seasoned Beef and found that the label was completely false; that it was in fact mostly TVP and could not be labeled as \*beef \*under existing federal statute. OK, carry on. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2011, 11:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/taco-bells-ground-beef-is-less-than-35-actual-meat/568875/116 "2011-01-25T23:53:10Z")
> [@Reno\_Nevada](#): > > Just so we are all on the same page here, the Taco Bell \*labelling \*clearly states that their Seasoned Beef is almost all beef, with no TVP and very little filler, but some wheat and soy products, enough to trigger allergies. > > The guy bringing this suit contends that he \*tested \*the Taco Bell Seasoned Beef and found that the label was completely false; that it was in fact mostly TVP and could not be labeled as \*beef \*under existing federal statute. > > OK, carry on. We’re not on the same page. Where are you getting this TVP info from? I see nothing in the lawsuit that says TVP was found in it, and nothing that contradicts the ingredient list put out by Taco Bell. ---
**Author:** ![Larry\_Mudd](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/f14d63/32.png) [@Larry\_Mudd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Larry_Mudd)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2011, 11:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/taco-bells-ground-beef-is-less-than-35-actual-meat/568875/117 "2011-01-25T23:57:06Z")
> [@aceplace57](#): > > The lab in Alabama analyzed it. they found 35% beef. According to the plaintiff’s lawyers. This is far from established, and Taco Bell is very confidently [denying](http://www.dailybreeze.com/latestnews/ci_17195370) it: > [@](#): > > “At Taco Bell, we buy our beef from the same trusted brands you find in the supermarket, like Tyson Foods,” said Greg Creed, president and chief concept officer of Taco Bell. > > “We start with 100 percent USDA-inspected beef,” Creed said. "Then we simmer it in our proprietary blend of seasonings and spices to give our seasoned beef its signature Taco Bell taste and texture. We are proud of the quality of our beef and identify all the seasoning and spice ingredients on our website. > > “Unfortunately, the lawyers in this case elected to sue first and ask questions later – and got their `facts’ absolutely wrong,” Creed said. “We plan to take legal action for the false statements being made about our food.” Maybe it’s bluff, or maybe Taco Bell actually took care to make sure that they met the “at least 40%” requirement and the analysis is just plain wrong. I can’t work out what would be more naive - thinking that Taco Bell and their lawyers would allow practices to be in place that would put them in dutch with the USDA, or thinking that they wouldn’t. Though I suppose I wouldn’t be\* terribly\* surprised if it played out that Taco Bell was confident that the USDA labeling requirements only applied packaged products sold as “beef,” or something absurd like that. It will be interesting to see. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2011, 12:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/taco-bells-ground-beef-is-less-than-35-actual-meat/568875/118 "2011-01-26T00:02:20Z")
[Here’s a link](http://www.sun-sentinel.com/health/fl-taco-bell-suit-20110124,0,6513275.story): > [@](#): > > Just 35 percent of the taco filling was a solid, and just 15 percent overall was protein, said attorney W. Daniel “Dee” Miles III of the Montgomery, Ala., law firm Beasley Allen, which filed the suit. I’m not sure what in the hell that’s supposed to mean. Pure 70:30 beef is only about 14% protein by weight, and, extrapolating from the fact that 100g of this beef is 30g fat and 14g protein, looks like about 56% water by weight. Of course, this is numbers for the raw product. No idea if the numbers given in the lawsuit refer to raw or cooked numbers. ---
**Author:** ![ralph124c](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/8797f3/32.png) [@ralph124c](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ralph124c)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2011, 12:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/taco-bells-ground-beef-is-less-than-35-actual-meat/568875/119 "2011-01-26T00:23:43Z")
“ah don’t know why they call it hamburger helper…it does pretty well by itself”-from Clark Griswold’s BIL, in “Vacation” ---
**Author:** ![Larry\_Mudd](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/f14d63/32.png) [@Larry\_Mudd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Larry_Mudd)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2011, 12:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/taco-bells-ground-beef-is-less-than-35-actual-meat/568875/120 "2011-01-26T00:35:31Z")
> [@pulykamell](#): > > …raw or cooked numbers. Heh. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/taco-bells-ground-beef-is-less-than-35-actual-meat/568875.md?page=5) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/taco-bells-ground-beef-is-less-than-35-actual-meat/568875.md?page=7)