[QUOTE=ZomZom]
DING. You hit the nail on the head. This is what really bothers me, the unquestioning way that so many just accept the irrational because that’s the way it is. Because belonging is more important than being right. Because being us is so much more important than being them. Because I want to claim victory even though I just watched it from the couch.
[/QUOTE]
But, see, it isn’t irrational. Even the most rabid baseball fan doesn’t entertain any delusions that he’s going to be called down from the stands to pitch middle relief. People choose to involve themselves emotionally with their local sports teams because they’ve decided that the payoff is worth it. What’s irrational about the desire to belong, and what about it is antithetical to “rightness,” as you put it?
[QUOTE=ZomZom]
This is what really bothers me, the unquestioning way that so many just accept the irrational because that’s the way it is.
[/QUOTE]
It’s not irrational to root, root root for the home team. You can actually watch all the home team’s games, and your local sports radio is going to discuss the local teams in detail. Local tv shows give you better coverage of the local teams.
It is perfectly rational to identify with the local team(s) in the league(s) of your favorite sport(s).
What is irrational is someone claiming they don’t “get” sports as if sports are invalid until they personally “get” them.
[QUOTE=ZomZom]
DING. You hit the nail on the head. This is what really bothers me, the unquestioning way that so many just accept the irrational because that’s the way it is. Because belonging is more important than being right. Because being us is so much more important than being them. Because I want to claim victory even though I just watched it from the couch.
[/QUOTE]
Well, not you. How are the Nationals doing this year?
[QUOTE=ZomZom]
DING. You hit the nail on the head. This is what really bothers me, the unquestioning way that so many just accept the irrational because that’s the way it is. Because belonging is more important than being right. Because being us is so much more important than being them. Because I want to claim victory even though I just watched it from the couch.
[/QUOTE]
Let me return again to the point I made but you have not addressed, but try it in a different way: is it irrational to go to a Harry Potter movie or a Shakespeare play and set aside the knowledge that one is watching something that has nothing to do with reality in order to gain more enjoyment from it?
[QUOTE=Ravenman]
Let me return again to the point I made but you have not addressed, but try it in a different way: is it irrational to go to a Harry Potter movie or a Shakespeare play and set aside the knowledge that one is watching something that has nothing to do with reality in order to gain more enjoyment from it?
[/QUOTE]
Not at all. But it would be considered more than a bit weird to proudly harumph its success at the box office as a success of your own.
Just as a funny hijack - the day after the Cottonmouths won the league championship, I got an e-mail from my sister-in-law reading “I know that wasn’t my quiet, dignified sister in law I saw on the news last night yelling and crying and almost climbing the glass, was it?”
[QUOTE=ZomZom]
DING. You hit the nail on the head. This is what really bothers me, the unquestioning way that so many just accept the irrational because that’s the way it is. Because belonging is more important than being right.
[/QUOTE]
What is “right” about NOT being a fan of the local team? You’re creating a right/wrong dichotomy that doesn’t exist. It’s a classic error of the false dilemma.
It’s a pastime. It’s just fun. It’s no more “Wrong” than becoming emotionally involved with a good book.
Some people enjoy things that are different from the things you enjoy. Get over it.
[QUOTE=ZomZom]
But it would be considered more than a bit weird to proudly harumph its success at the box office as a success of your own.
[/QUOTE]
Since, in general, sports fans don’t do this, it’s really not very relevant. Since the thread started with comments about the Iraqi soccer victory can you point to some behavior where some fans did that? You seem to have confused celebrating with taking person ownership of the physical action.
But when you choose a team to support, even arbitrarily, you cast your lot with them. I went to a little league all-star game w/ my girlfriend and in the 2nd inning, I asked her which team was “hers”. I told her I’d “take” the other one. It was fun when I lost to “her” walk-off grand slam.
When people go to the horse track, I doubt they’re relying on the horse’s speed to tell them something about their athleticism. Yet they still cheer. It’s because they’ve got something on the line. What bothers me is when someone claims a team when they’ve won and reject them when they lose. I just don’t get what’s great about winning when you can never lose.
[QUOTE=nashiitashii]
This bugs me as well, but mostly in the context of “my school has a better sports team than yours.” The reason why it bugs me is because the majority of people who do this after finding out where I went to college will continue to be dicks about where I went to school in relation to where they went to school at inopportune moments for what seems like the rest of eternity. What’s worse is that the logic of me having gotten into that school as well but choosing to go to another school because it had a better program in what I was originally interested in completely goes over their heads; it’s as if interest in the school’s football team is supposed to be the entirety of my interest in getting a four-year degree from that school. :rolleyes:
Now, I don’t hate sports fans, but I don’t quite understand the vitriol from some of them. I played sports in middle and high school, and I still don’t get the passion of some of these fans that turn into ridiculous in-group/out-group backbiting. It’s really just a game; there is no reason to ridicule, assault, or vandalize property in the name of your favorite team.
[/QUOTE]
Ok this reminded me and now I take back every nice and accepting thing I said. 100% agree with you. I’m a graduate living in the rival team’s town and the people here are N-U-T-S.
No one at my school cared this much about football. I sure didn’t. The people who did would probably identify heavily with the sports fans here except for the sad fact that they are obligated to hate each other. People at my school got worked up about the rival team for about a week each year, before the teams played each other. People here plaster their cars with a (lame) parody of my university’s team logo, have slogans and cheers and songs all about them. There are t-shirts. It is, no offense to homosexuals, the gayest thing. It’s romantic comedy hate. It’s worship hate. It’s like listening to a Celine Dion song with overdubbed fart noises over and over and over and talking incessantly about how much you hate Celine Dion.
[QUOTE=ZomZom]
Not at all. But it would be considered more than a bit weird to proudly harumph its success at the box office as a success of your own.
[/QUOTE]
So we’ve established in principle that there is nothing “stupid” with knowingly and temporarily altering matters of identity so as to maximize one’s enjoyment of a form of performance or entertainment.
Do you think, if questioned, that the guy on TV in the Steeler’s jersey, grilling hot dogs in the parking lot with his face painted black and gold, would actually claim to be part of the football team?
Why is it “smart” to disassociate one’s self from reality to maximize enjoyment from fictional characters mocking life events in front of a camera, but “stupid” to temporarily fantasize or project upon one’s self a belonging to a certain community in order to maximize enjoyment of a real-life athletic competition?
I’m not seeing that dissociating from reality in order to enjoy a play is any better or worse than associating one’s self with a real-life community to better enjoy sporting competitions. If my girlfriend says, “That James Bond is one sexy guy,” I don’t think you’d have a problem with that, but if in a (very) fleeting moment of triumph for the San Francisco Giants, me and my friends yell, “We did it! We won!” we’re all dumbasses? That makes no sense.
Story time!
I’ve been rooting for a certain team all my life. When I first learned about them they were just right on top. Basically no competition, they were so good. Then their first rival came along, and though the elite followers of my sport would say my original team was still technically superior, they new guys stole the show with flash and glam. Then the next round of competitors came along, and my poor team was left in the dust. Poor managerial decisions combined with leftover hubris from their glory days thew them into last place. Despite this, they played some amazing games, and I knew the giant of my childhood was still in there somewhere. However, they stayed in that position for many years, with no respect or adulation, even though they could manage some amazing feats.
But now, in the last year, my team has risen once again into the spotlight, once again a household word. Their great skill and contribution to the sport is finally being recognized, and the inflated ego that was once our downfall is now the flaw of our competition. We are number one again after more than a decade, and it sure feels good to know I stuck with my team through thick and thin all those years.
My team’s name? Nintendo.
I also happen to like that baseball team they own.
Moral of the story: It’s about the loyalty. Though you may not care one way about any sports team, the people who get so excited are likely lifelong fans, who have been there to groan and sigh while they got beaten, but still remained loyal. And when your loyalty finally pays off–whether its the red sox winning the world series after 86 years or the big N making it big again after 15–it’s a good feeling.
I would ask you, are their any causes that have been loyal to, despite their failure? Have they come back to glory? If they did would you be excited?
…and yes, I know, the industry would probably be better off without the console wars, disclaimer, disclaimer, &c.
[QUOTE=Telemark]
Since, in general, sports fans don’t do this, it’s really not very relevant. Since the thread started with comments about the Iraqi soccer victory can you point to some behavior where some fans did that? You seem to have confused celebrating with taking person ownership of the physical action.
[/QUOTE]
What bothered me about the reaction to the Iraqi soccer victory was the collective agreement to assign great significance to an insignificant event - the kicking of a ball into a net - and the collective ego of the herd feeding off of it. When an enthusiast of an obscure activity gets overly excited about a victory it can be written of as an eccentricity, but when the vast populace does so it gets kind of creepy for me.
[QUOTE=ZomZom]
What bothered me about the reaction to the Iraqi soccer victory was the collective agreement to assign great significance to an insignificant event - the kicking of a ball into a net - and the collective ego of the herd feeding off of it. When an enthusiast of an obscure activity gets overly excited about a victory it can be written of as an eccentricity, but when the vast populace does so it gets kind of creepy for me.
[/QUOTE]
What?? Name a country (city, county, state) who has not got their massive jollies off after winning a stupid sporting encounter! Surely Iraq deserves their jollies MORE then pretty much anyone (Sudan, Zimbabwee…please win soon).
[QUOTE=ZomZom]
What bothered me about the reaction to the Iraqi soccer victory was the collective agreement to assign great significance to an insignificant event - the kicking of a ball into a net - and the collective ego of the herd feeding off of it. When an enthusiast of an obscure activity gets overly excited about a victory it can be written of as an eccentricity, but when the vast populace does so it gets kind of creepy for me.
[/QUOTE]
But it’s not an insignificant event to the vast numbers of people all around the world. What you refer to as “herd mentality” others think of as community. When the vast populace gets excited about something, perhaps you should reconsider what you think about normal human behavior.
[QUOTE=ZomZom]
What I was thinking of is the frequency with which fans will overlook the fact that they are rooting for criminals.
[/QUOTE]
Overlook? Um…cite? In my experience, fans tend to be very harsh on famous athletes who turn out to be criminals. Take, for example Michael Vick, who has gone from being one of the five most marketable NFL players to a total pariah in the space of two weeks, on the mere accusation of criminal behavior. It sure seems as if you’re starting to pull new stuff out of your ass here as people refute your original argument.
[QUOTE=ZomZom]
What I was thinking of is the frequency with which fans will overlook the fact that they are rooting for criminals.
[/QUOTE]
What if the local team has no convicted criminals? Mine has none. So is sports fandom okay for me, or are you going to just keep inventing arguments as you go?
