# Taking "You kids get off my lawn" a step too far **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [June 16, 2011, 4:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/taking-you-kids-get-off-my-lawn-a-step-too-far/585662 "2011-06-16T04:16:15Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Zeriel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/58956e/32.png) [@Zeriel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zeriel)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2011, 2:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/taking-you-kids-get-off-my-lawn-a-step-too-far/585662/41 "2011-06-16T14:45:30Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > Whether the NRA would back this guy on the record or not, the guy is not that atypical of the kind of members they have. This is unfortunately a true statement in my (NRA member) experience. > [@Airman\_Doors\_USAF](#): > > Yes he is. Cite that he isn’t? > > Oh, wait, your post is your cite. I should know better by now. I thought you lived in PA. You’re telling me you DON’T run into guys like this on a weekly basis at the range? I want to shoot where you’re shooting. ---
**Author:** ![billfish678](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7bcc69/32.png) [@billfish678](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/billfish678)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2011, 2:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/taking-you-kids-get-off-my-lawn-a-step-too-far/585662/42 "2011-06-16T14:45:45Z")
> [@Machine\_Elf](#): > > . You must be a big fan of road rage, and of customers who beat the crap out of cashiers when their cheeseburger is made wrong. And that folks, is the sad,sad story of why the Hamburgerler wears the black and white stripped outfits. ---
**Author:** ![Zeriel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/58956e/32.png) [@Zeriel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zeriel)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2011, 2:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/taking-you-kids-get-off-my-lawn-a-step-too-far/585662/43 "2011-06-16T14:49:22Z")
> [@Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](#): > > In my opinion, people get guns because they tend to be more scared about the world, and more likely to overestimate threats, than the average person. It’s not surprising that they then over-react to the threats they perceive. The problem is that guns are a no-take-backs proposition, and someone has to pay for the gun users impairments. If you’d have stuck a “some people” in there instead of just “people”, I’d have been 100% on board with this post. As a gun owner, I feel like I’m in a variant Chris Rock routine–people like this make me want more firearms regulation, because I’m pretty sure I hate irresponsible gun owners more than you do. Also, **Clockwork**? You’re getting some gun-control version of Poe’s Law going in this thread, and it’s really killing my pro-shooting-trespassers boner, alright? Knock it off. ---
**Author:** ![Trepa\_Mayfield](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/edb3f5/32.png) [@Trepa\_Mayfield](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Trepa_Mayfield)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2011, 2:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/taking-you-kids-get-off-my-lawn-a-step-too-far/585662/44 "2011-06-16T14:50:56Z")
> [@AClockworkMelon](#): > > Because look, we’ve all been there, OK? For all we know this guy’s wife just left him, his boss just called him to let him know he’s sleeping with his wife and he’s learned that he’s caught the clap from his wife. OK? > > I guess I could agree that it’s assault. But it’s a slippery fucking slope. :rolleyes: If you’re going to joke about this it might help if you were actually fucking funny. ---
**Author:** ![bup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/6bbea6/32.png) [@bup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bup)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2011, 2:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/taking-you-kids-get-off-my-lawn-a-step-too-far/585662/45 "2011-06-16T14:50:57Z")
> [@tumbleddown](#): > > Yeah, but the NRA is also a huge proponent … of the viewpoint that the world is a dangerous place where … ordinary people are constantly under attack from criminals who are laying in wait to do harm in every semi-shady place. Absolutely. The NRA believes what they’re saying, I guess, but they operate from a position of fear. ---
**Author:** ![Airman\_Doors\_USAF](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e36b37/32.png) [@Airman\_Doors\_USAF](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Airman_Doors_USAF)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2011, 2:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/taking-you-kids-get-off-my-lawn-a-step-too-far/585662/46 "2011-06-16T14:57:25Z")
> [@Zeriel](#): > > This is unfortunately a true statement in my (NRA member) experience. Really, you run into people who profess publicly that they would shoot children (or anybody else) for ringing their doorbell? Nonsense. Absolute nonsense. > [@](#): > > I thought you lived in PA. You’re telling me you DON’T run into guys like this on a weekly basis at the range? I want to shoot where you’re shooting. I have run into all kinds of stupid gun owners, but most of their demonstrated stupidity lies in their indifferent (in my opinion) gun handling or their semi-serious discussions about “zombies” or “SHTF” scenarios. :rolleyes: This guy is absolutely atypical of the members the NRA has. In fact, he probably isn’t a member himself because if he were the news would have fallen all over itself reporting it. ---
**Author:** ![D\_Odds](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/d_odds/32/2882_2.png) [@D\_Odds](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/D_Odds)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2011, 3:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/taking-you-kids-get-off-my-lawn-a-step-too-far/585662/47 "2011-06-16T15:05:47Z")
> [@Machine\_Elf](#): > > I haven’t been there. I’ve never felt an overwhelming urge to kill someone who committed a minor infraction against me simply because I had a bad day. Are you kidding? I live in that spot. The ass who sits at the light with his hand on the horn to honk the nanosecond it turns green, faster than it takes to move one’s foot from the brake to the gas? He’s lucky I don’t own a gun. The airhead in the supermarket who, given a whole aisle, chooses to park the cart directly across from another obstruction, such as an aisle display or another cart, blocking the whole aisle? S/he is lucky I don’t bring my softball bat when shopping. Every delivery service who leaves fliers all over my property? Land mines would solve that problem, if I had some. And I wish even a worse fate on those who leave items on my car. I could go on and on. These thoughts always bring a smile to my face. I fantasize in great detail how it would work. However, I have never come close to acting any of them out, like most sane people, and if someone did act them out, I would wish to see them prosecuted, again like most sane people. And while I don’t know **A Clockwork Melon** from a hole in the wall (or my head), I am smart enough to spot a troll post. So know I’m going to fantasize about some sort of keyboard feedback that would electrocute those who feed the trolls. ---
**Author:** ![Zeriel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/58956e/32.png) [@Zeriel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zeriel)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2011, 3:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/taking-you-kids-get-off-my-lawn-a-step-too-far/585662/48 "2011-06-16T15:15:59Z")
> [@Airman\_Doors\_USAF](#): > > Really, you run into people who profess publicly that they would shoot children (or anybody else) for ringing their doorbell? I do in fact run into people who profess that they would and plan to gladly shoot anyone who ignored their no-trespassing signs. Full stop. I wouldn’t say it’s a huge percentage, but at least four or five guys of the 20-30 people in the set of “guys I only know from going to the same shooting range” have expressed similar sentiments, along with “We should have Castle Doctrine here, I should be allowed to kill anyone who’s on my land uninvited with no warning.” Hell, I know a guy who bought a Taurus Judge chambered in .410, with the stated rationale of “This’ll settle the people who fuck around with my woodpile.” The kicker is that the gentleman in question is legally blind and got the .410 because he expects to just scatter buckshot in the general direction of noises in his yard. I wish I were exaggerating. He’s at this point the only person in my hometown who my dad will no longer deliver groceries to. > [@](#): > > In fact, he probably isn’t a member himself because if he were the news would have fallen all over itself reporting it. This is probably true. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2011, 3:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/taking-you-kids-get-off-my-lawn-a-step-too-far/585662/49 "2011-06-16T15:18:39Z")
Why would they report that? Why would it be newsworthy? ---
**Author:** ![MsWhatsit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/eb8c5e/32.png) [@MsWhatsit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MsWhatsit)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2011, 3:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/taking-you-kids-get-off-my-lawn-a-step-too-far/585662/50 "2011-06-16T15:33:43Z")
Adds a little bit of titillating interest to the story. Now you don’t just have a crazy guy who shot a kid. You have a crazy _NRA member_ who shot a kid. Pro-gun and anti-gun advocates will flock to the comments of the story to yell at each other about gun rights, letters to the editor will be written, etc. In my experience, incidentally, there are plenty of crazy NRA members who think it’s OK to shoot at trespassers on their property. There are plenty more NRA members who are not crazy. And being in the NRA is certainly not a prerequisite for crazy gun-related behavior. ---
**Author:** ![Argent\_Towers](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e8c25b/32.png) [@Argent\_Towers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Argent_Towers)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2011, 3:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/taking-you-kids-get-off-my-lawn-a-step-too-far/585662/51 "2011-06-16T15:41:55Z")
> [@tumbleddown](#): > > Yeah, but the NRA is also a huge proponent – perhaps the most visible and obvious proponent of the viewpoint that the world is a dangerous place where not only are the 2nd amendment rights of NRA members/gun owners constantly under attack, ordinary people are constantly under attack from criminals who are laying in wait to do harm in every semi-shady place. _Where_ is the NRA espousing this viewpoint? Through what mouthpiece or publication are they doing it? I get the _American Rifleman_ magazine and read every new issue. I don’t see any fearmongering at all. Hardly _any_ of the feature stories or even the sidelines are about the issue of self-defense. The dominant topics in the magazine are hunting, historical weapons (military, Western, etc) and new innovations in firearms engineering. Aside from an interesting one-page section at the beginning that lists a few robberies, home invasions or other incidents in which gun owners successfully defended themselves, the issue of criminals and violence is really not addressed very much. And the 2nd Amendment _is_ constantly under attack, usually in big cities. It’s bullshit. ---
**Author:** ![Tom\_Scud](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/f08c70/32.png) [@Tom\_Scud](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tom_Scud)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2011, 3:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/taking-you-kids-get-off-my-lawn-a-step-too-far/585662/52 "2011-06-16T15:43:23Z")
How public are the NRA membership rolls? Is it something that a reporter would be able to find with a google search (or something a bit more specialized)? If it were known that the guy was an NRA member, it probably would be all over the place, but it’s possible it hasn’t come out yet. ---
**Author:** ![muldoonthief](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/muldoonthief/32/3188_2.png) [@muldoonthief](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/muldoonthief)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2011, 3:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/taking-you-kids-get-off-my-lawn-a-step-too-far/585662/53 "2011-06-16T15:47:37Z")
Doesn’t _American Rifleman_ still have “The Armed Citizen” feature every month? The one where they collect a dozen or so news stories of armed citizens fighting off criminals? ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2011, 3:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/taking-you-kids-get-off-my-lawn-a-step-too-far/585662/54 "2011-06-16T15:47:52Z")
I can’t help but see some sort of parallel between the HuffPo comment **Argent** mentioned: > [@](#): > > Lock up whoever sold the gun to madman should share a cell with him. and this: > [@D\_Odds](#): > > So know I’m going to fantasize about some sort of keyboard feedback that would electrocute those who feed the trolls. Let’s blame the enablers! ---
**Author:** ![Argent\_Towers](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e8c25b/32.png) [@Argent\_Towers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Argent_Towers)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2011, 3:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/taking-you-kids-get-off-my-lawn-a-step-too-far/585662/55 "2011-06-16T15:51:30Z")
> [@muldoonthief](#): > > Doesn’t _American Rifleman_ still have “The Armed Citizen” feature every month? The one where they collect a dozen or so news stories of armed citizens fighting off criminals? Yes, I mentioned that in my last post. There is nothing fearmongering or polemical about that section; it’s just stating the facts. Many people use it as a rebuttal to anti-gun folks who insist that guns are totally needless for self defense and have never helped save anyone and other ridiculous statements. It’s also a very small part of the magazine. It’s less than one page. The vast majority of the publication, as I said, has nothing to do with criminals or the idea that people need to worry about being attacked. ---
**Author:** ![joebuck20](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/74df32/32.png) [@joebuck20](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/joebuck20)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2011, 3:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/taking-you-kids-get-off-my-lawn-a-step-too-far/585662/56 "2011-06-16T15:54:58Z")
> [@Argent\_Towers](#): > > Here’s a great comment: > > 203 “fans” of the poster. That really says a lot about the Huffington Post’s readership to me. > > I’ll never get over how many morons think that the NRA _condones_ and _loves_ irresponsible, insane, dangerous gun behavior like what this moron did to that kid. I like reading the Huffington Post, but yeah, a lot of their commenters are a little on the, shall we say, wankerish side. ---
**Author:** ![bup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/6bbea6/32.png) [@bup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bup)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2011, 3:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/taking-you-kids-get-off-my-lawn-a-step-too-far/585662/57 "2011-06-16T15:56:26Z")
> [@](#): > > Doesn’t American Rifleman still have “The Armed Citizen” feature every month? > [@](#): > > Yes, I mentioned that in my last post. There is nothing fearmongering or polemical about that section; **Argent Towers** , you make me laugh. ---
**Author:** ![Airman\_Doors\_USAF](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e36b37/32.png) [@Airman\_Doors\_USAF](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Airman_Doors_USAF)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2011, 4:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/taking-you-kids-get-off-my-lawn-a-step-too-far/585662/58 "2011-06-16T16:04:26Z")
> [@bup](#): > > **Argent Towers** , you make me laugh. Why? They are reports, with no editorialization, drawn directly from newspapers throughout the country and properly attributed. Obviously the NRA includes them because the stories fit into their ideology, but they do not manipulate, comment, or anything like that. They present them as they are. ---
**Author:** ![YogSothoth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/8edcca/32.png) [@YogSothoth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/YogSothoth)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2011, 4:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/taking-you-kids-get-off-my-lawn-a-step-too-far/585662/59 "2011-06-16T16:07:14Z")
> [@Argent\_Towers](#): > > I’ll never get over how many morons think that the NRA _condones_ and _loves_ irresponsible, insane, dangerous gun behavior like what this moron did to that kid. Because they do? How many bills that are pro-gun safety have the NRA lobbied to pass? How many fucking tiny little bills on safety have they went apeshit over because of a fear of the slipperly slope? The NRA is probably cheering this guy on and preparing a legal fund in his defense right now :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![MsWhatsit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/eb8c5e/32.png) [@MsWhatsit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MsWhatsit)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2011, 4:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/taking-you-kids-get-off-my-lawn-a-step-too-far/585662/60 "2011-06-16T16:08:42Z")
Unless they also include stories of times when homeowners faced a home invasion and the situation ended happily without the use of guns, they’re pushing a particular viewpoint, and I think it’s a little silly to suggest that they aren’t. I mean, I’m not faulting them for this. It’s a magazine targeted (heh) at gun owners. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/taking-you-kids-get-off-my-lawn-a-step-too-far/585662.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/taking-you-kids-get-off-my-lawn-a-step-too-far/585662.md?page=4)