# Tank Man and his impact on history **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [June 3, 2009, 8:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tank-man-and-his-impact-on-history/498618 "2009-06-03T20:05:32Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 18\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Lantern](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/d26b3c/32.png) [@Lantern](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lantern)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2009, 8:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tank-man-and-his-impact-on-history/498618/1 "2009-06-03T20:05:32Z")
Today is the 20th anniversary of the crackdown on the Tianamen Square protests. Tank Man is of course the man who tried to stop a column of tanks by standing in front of them; perhaps the single most famous act of passive resistance ever. ``` A few questions: ``` What happened to Tank Man? Many people believe he was shot shortly afterwards. Is there any evidence or even informed speculation to suggest otherwise? Secondly what impact did Tank Man have on history? Not very much in China itself if you look at its subsequent history. But in this fascinating [documentary](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SB70mWXrzEE)a journalist describes going to Eastern Europe where people told him that Tank Man inspired them to confront their regimes later that year. So he may have well have helped trigger perhaps the greatest revolution in history. Any information on this? Any other thoughts on Tank Man and his impact on culture and politics? ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2009, 8:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tank-man-and-his-impact-on-history/498618/2 "2009-06-03T20:49:00Z")
Obviously another impact he had was that he called worldwide attention to the situation in China. Maybe that hasn’t fully born fruit yet, but I don’t think it farfetched to say that it will eventually. ---
**Author:** ![Lantern](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/d26b3c/32.png) [@Lantern](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lantern)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2009, 9:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tank-man-and-his-impact-on-history/498618/3 "2009-06-03T21:18:47Z")
That’s a good point. Who knows what the long-term impact of the event on China will be. Perhaps the protestors who eventually bring democracy to China will have been deeply inspired by Tank Man. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2009, 9:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tank-man-and-his-impact-on-history/498618/4 "2009-06-03T21:23:09Z")
Well, I got [some material](http://www.lolcats.com/view/9619/) out of it. ---
**Author:** ![Amp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/6a8cbe/32.png) [@Amp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Amp)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2009, 9:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tank-man-and-his-impact-on-history/498618/5 "2009-06-03T21:34:40Z")
Didn’t do much for [Rachel](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rachel_Corrie) [Corrie](http://alawda.rso.wisc.edu/rachelcorrie.htm). > [@Wikipedia](#): > > On March 16, 2003, an IDF operation in the land between the Rafah refugee camp and the border with Egypt was engaged in house demolition, which the IDF says is necessary to destroy guerrilla hideouts and smuggling tunnels. Corrie was part of a group of seven ISM activists (three British and four US) attempting to disrupt the actions of Israeli bulldozers. Corrie, who had positioned herself in the path of a Caterpillar D9R armored bulldozer, was fatally injured. Basically she tried doing the same thing as tank man in front of a bulldozer and got run over and killed. ---
**Author:** ![Mighty\_Mouse](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mighty_mouse/32/7776_2.png) [@Mighty\_Mouse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mighty_Mouse)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2009, 10:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tank-man-and-his-impact-on-history/498618/6 "2009-06-03T22:42:21Z")
> [@Amp](#): > > Didn’t do much for [Rachel](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rachel_Corrie) [Corrie](http://alawda.rso.wisc.edu/rachelcorrie.htm). > > Basically she tried doing the same thing as tank man in front of a bulldozer and got run over and killed. No she wasn’t. Only the truly deluded don’t believe that there is a legitimate security issue on that border, no matter what you think about the Israeli-Palestinian issue overall. What she was doing would be more like a Japanese American draping herself over an the muzzle of an anti-aircraft gun at Pearl Harbor. ---
**Author:** ![PatriotGrrrl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/9dc877/32.png) [@PatriotGrrrl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PatriotGrrrl)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2009, 11:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tank-man-and-his-impact-on-history/498618/7 "2009-06-03T23:05:04Z")
That one photo is certainly iconic. Literally - I made a little icon of him and just the first tank, which I used as my avatar on various political forums, and AFAIK, everyone recognized it. Does anyone know if a poster of that image is available anywhere? ---
**Author:** ![Amp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/6a8cbe/32.png) [@Amp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Amp)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2009, 11:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tank-man-and-his-impact-on-history/498618/8 "2009-06-03T23:26:15Z")
> [@Mighty\_Mouse](#): > > No she wasn’t. Only the truly deluded don’t believe that there is a legitimate security issue on that border, no matter what you think about the Israeli-Palestinian issue overall. What she was doing would be more like a Japanese American draping herself over an the muzzle of an anti-aircraft gun at Pearl Harbor. Oh, don’t get me wrong. I don’t for one second think what she did was heroic or iconic in anyway. I don’t feel bad for her at all. The reason I brought her up was because she probably likened herself and what she was doing to the Tank Man. If didn’t work out so well for her. ---
**Author:** ![Roderick\_Femm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/roderick_femm/32/14875_2.png) [@Roderick\_Femm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Roderick_Femm)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2009, 11:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tank-man-and-his-impact-on-history/498618/9 "2009-06-03T23:48:35Z")
> [@Lantern](#): > > Today is the 20th anniversary of the crackdown on the Tianamen Square protests. Tank Man is of course the man who tried to stop a column of tanks by standing in front of them; perhaps the single most famous act of passive resistance ever. > > ``` > A few questions: > > ``` > > What happened to Tank Man? Many people believe he was shot shortly afterwards. Is there any evidence or even informed speculation to suggest otherwise? > > Secondly what impact did Tank Man have on history? Not very much in China itself if you look at its subsequent history. But in this fascinating [documentary](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SB70mWXrzEE)a journalist describes going to Eastern Europe where people told him that Tank Man inspired them to confront their regimes later that year. So he may have well have helped trigger perhaps the greatest revolution in history. Any information on this? > > Any other thoughts on Tank Man and his impact on culture and politics? I’d really be interested in knowing what happened to this person too. I’d always assumed he was one of the ones who were killed when the tanks overran the square that terrible night. It wasn’t only the photo, I thought the video was even more impressive, where the tank kept making these feeble attempts to go around him, and he would move from side to side to block it, and then the tank (as I remember, but I haven’t seen it for 20 years) finally gave up and went away. Roddy ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Miskatonic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mr.miskatonic/32/310_2.png) [@Mr.Miskatonic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Miskatonic)\ **Post date:** [June 4, 2009, 3:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tank-man-and-his-impact-on-history/498618/10 "2009-06-04T03:29:27Z")
I can recall during the 2000 Republican convention in Philadelphia there was one protester who tried…and I am watering down the word ‘tried’ here…to do the same thing to an equestrian policeman during one of the more chaotic protests. The horse didn’t care that a scrawny college student kept trying to get in his way. I don’t think the officer on the horse even noticed. The guy tried it twice before pulled pulled to the side by a foot officer when he though he’d try yet again. I’m sure he thought he’d be as good as ‘tank man’ up until the horse knocked him aside. ---
**Author:** ![Lantern](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/d26b3c/32.png) [@Lantern](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lantern)\ **Post date:** [June 4, 2009, 7:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tank-man-and-his-impact-on-history/498618/11 "2009-06-04T07:13:31Z")
Nick Kristoff, who was the NYT Beijing bureau chief at the time, has a [column](http://www.nytimes.com/2009/06/04/opinion/04kristof.html)about Tianamen Square 20 years ago. There were many heroes in addition to Tank Man: > [@](#): > > Troops had already opened fire on an ambulance that had tried to collect the injured, so other ambulances kept their distance. Finally, some unlikely saviors emerged — the rickshaw drivers. > > These were peasants and workers who made a living pedaling bicycle rickshaws, carrying passengers or freight around Beijing. It was those rickshaw drivers who slowly pedaled out toward the troops to collect the bodies of the dead and injured. Then they raced back to us, legs straining furiously, rushing toward the nearest hospital. > > One stocky rickshaw driver had tears streaming down his cheeks as he drove past me to display a badly wounded student so that I could photograph or recount the incident. That driver perhaps couldn’t have defined democracy, but he had risked his life to try to advance it. > [@](#): > > That was happening all over Beijing. On the old airport road that same night, truckloads of troops were entering the city from the east. A middle-aged bus driver saw them and quickly blocked the road with his bus. > > Move aside, the troops shouted. > > I won’t let you attack the students, the bus driver retorted defiantly. > > The troops pointed their guns at the bus driver and ordered him to move the bus aside. Instead, he plucked the keys from the ignition and hurled them into the bushes beside the road to ensure that no one could drive that bus away. The man was arrested; I don’t know what happened to him. He has also has some interesting comments on the long-run prospects for democracy in China. ---
**Author:** ![Machine\_Elf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/82dd89/32.png) [@Machine\_Elf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Machine_Elf)\ **Post date:** [June 4, 2009, 12:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tank-man-and-his-impact-on-history/498618/12 "2009-06-04T12:39:15Z")
In The Onion’s “Our Dumb Century” book, their edition for 1989 had that picture along with the headline: “Stirring Symbol of Humanity Difficult to Clean Out of Tank Treads” ---
**Author:** ![thirdname](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/d07c76/32.png) [@thirdname](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/thirdname)\ **Post date:** [June 4, 2009, 4:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tank-man-and-his-impact-on-history/498618/13 "2009-06-04T16:16:09Z")
At least we know what happened to his sidekick Tank Girl: [http://www.people.com/people/article/0,,20282331,00.html](http://www.people.com/people/article/0,,20282331,00.html) ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [June 4, 2009, 4:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tank-man-and-his-impact-on-history/498618/14 "2009-06-04T16:49:46Z")
> [@](#): > > What happened to Tank Man? Many people believe he was shot shortly afterwards. Is there any evidence or even informed speculation to suggest otherwise? Tank man was never officially identified. Based on that I believe it’s likely his identity really is unknown. The symbolism of his action was that he was able to defy the power of the Chinese government apparently unscathed. The Chinese government does not want other people to be inspired by this example. So if they knew who he was, it would have been in their best interest to publicly identify him and punish him as an example to other would-be rebels. Quite frankly, I’m surprised that even if the Chinese government doesn’t know who he is, they didn’t just pick some other protester as a scapegoat, identify him as Tank Man, and then execute him. ---
**Author:** ![Lantern](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/d26b3c/32.png) [@Lantern](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lantern)\ **Post date:** [June 4, 2009, 4:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tank-man-and-his-impact-on-history/498618/15 "2009-06-04T16:59:24Z")
However China was also sensitive about the international outcry at the massacre and probably wanted to minimize any further negative fallout. Given that Tank Man had become an international icon, I doubt they would have executed him publicly especially since he didn’t actually harm anyone. The most common view appears to be that he was quietly arrested and shot. ---
**Author:** ![mswas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e99b99/32.png) [@mswas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mswas)\ **Post date:** [June 4, 2009, 5:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tank-man-and-his-impact-on-history/498618/16 "2009-06-04T17:34:35Z")
> [@riker1384](#): > > At least we know what happened to his sidekick Tank Girl: [http://www.people.com/people/article/0,,20282331,00.html](http://www.people.com/people/article/0,,20282331,00.html) Glad I wasn’t the only one who thought of Tank Girl. It’s highly ironic that she hit a skateboarder. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [June 4, 2009, 5:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tank-man-and-his-impact-on-history/498618/17 "2009-06-04T17:55:07Z")
> [@](#): > > However China was also sensitive about the international outcry at the massacre and probably wanted to minimize any further negative fallout. Given that Tank Man had become an international icon, I doubt they would have executed him publicly especially since he didn’t actually harm anyone. The most common view appears to be that he was quietly arrested and shot. I disagree. The worst thing a totalitarian regime can do is show any vulnerability. A dictatorship can tolerate fear or hatred - but it has to have respect. If the people think they can get away with defying the state, they will. ---
**Author:** ![mswas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e99b99/32.png) [@mswas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mswas)\ **Post date:** [June 4, 2009, 6:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/tank-man-and-his-impact-on-history/498618/18 "2009-06-04T18:12:31Z")
Well one thing I think is notable is that China is far less nasty today than it was in 1989. I think that’s pretty relevant, and I think Tank Man had an impact on that.