For the record, I consider pinning down Starving Artist to black and white factual claims that counter his statements, which then make him avoid the thread for a while*, to be a public service. I will accept donations of jellybeans and slurpees.
Did you have this beef when Reagan, Bush and W were borrowing and spending or is it only when the Democrats gets into the white house?
I can accept that you have a different idea of how much government we should have and I can see how taxing the rich to feed and clothe the poor might bother you but please leave the bullshit about fiscal responsibility at the door.
There’s always a fucking excuse that explains away the facts isn’t there? America did pretty ducking good during those 50 years of Democratic domination, we had our problems but the economy wasn’t one of them. Its ridiculous to chalk up the Democratic surpluses (or small deficits) from 1945 to 1980 and chalk it up to extenuating circumstances and then say the rates “OUGHT TO BE” some other rate. We racked up huge deficits during Reagan, Bush and W.
I suppose Obama is racking up huge deficits as well but his deficits are not significantly larger than W’s last deficit (remember the 2009 budget gets passed and signed while he is president).
I agree, everyone should pay an income tax. It shoud still be progressive but it is bad for the citizenry when a significant minority of the citizenry pays nothing, perhaps a 5% base tax rate. Of course the top marginal rate should go up to at least 50%.
Aw, now, Beefy, here you go acting like an asshole again after I was just so polite to you. And what’s worse now you’re trying to take credit for chasing me away when John Sandford is the real culprit. Really not very sporting of you, you know. Not very honest either.
But I suppose I shouldn’t be surprised.
Chow.
(Laughing condescention and spelling lesson coming in one…two…) 
Well, my husband isn’t a biased twit who jumps to conclusions.
I was talking about write-offs since the original subject was the lack of difference my our lifestyle after losing +/- $20,000 annual income - apparently in the middle of the night last night I wasn’t paying close enough attention to my terms for your liking. OTOH, since you completely ignore the subject of that post to come in and yell that OMG everybody qualified for the Bush tax cuts, I’d say your error is worse.
Obviously I did - did you have a point?
Seriously? You are completely unaware of the people who are second and third generation welfare? You’ve never lived any place where a neighbor sat around on his butt doing just enough work to buy beer and cigarettes?
Since I didn’t say that, or anything close, I have no idea why you would bring it up.
How is that? You seem to be of the impression that I think that all poor people are poor because they don’t wish to work, which isn’t even close to true, so it might be interesting to see why you think multiple reasons why someone may not wish to work hard to move up a tax bracket is weakening my argument.
At what point did I even indicate a 1-1 correspondence between work and income, much less that it is unquestionable? Perhaps if you just stick with what I actually say and not what you appear to want to attach to it, you wouldn’t have so much trouble with my posts.
OK then - cite?
No. However, that isn’t where we are now, and I don’t have a lot of faith that we will go back to it. Also, is that $1,500 just the IRS taxes? Seems it would have to be, given that low number.
No matter how much my husband makes I’m sure I’d miss $10K (where did you get that number) since by no standard are we rich. As for defying all logic and facts, sorry but the facts I listed are the facts in play. There has been a slight drop in our discretionary income, but not 10 or 20K worth.
Well, I’m not rich, but I think I have some quatloos laying around.
Ironically, apart from “ciao”, the only spelling error comes in your little coda about spelling errors. Idiot.
I find your lack of shame about being called out and pinned down on your stupidity to be a hallmark of conservatives. I know it is not fair to equate all conservatives with you, and no doubt most would bristle at the comparison. However, it is just remarkable how you spew complete ignorance, get drilled for it, cry that you have something else to do that takes you away from any personal responsibility for your leavings here, and then come back to post another steamer! What you lack in shame, integrity, and personal responsibility, you make up for in extreme stupidity.
What’s even funnier is that you would spend your time reading the work of a liberal!
:rolleyes:
No, you still haven’t answered why I need to pay a higher percentage of my wages. You can’t hand-wave it away with ‘oh, it’s just $10K’ or whatever - it’s money I earned. As noted, I almost certainly invested (i.e., spent) a lot more in my career and such. Now justify taking more away from me than the guy next door.
Apparently, it’s “All men are created equal – just don’t tax 'em that way”.
Aside from my math error (thanks, I was using a 3% difference in tax rates for some reason) the total change in taxes on that last $50,000 in income would be $2,250. That’s all.
As you can plainly see, someone would have to be pretty dumb to think that they would be better off earning $500,000 rather than $550,000 just because their tax bill would go up by $2,250 if the Bush tax cuts for the wealthy were allowed to expire.
I’m sure you’re rubbing off on him, though.
“I was posting in the middle of the night” is the adult equivalent of “The dog ate my homework,” and deserves the same scorn. Besides, in the middle of the night? I show Post 123, where you ridiculously talk about how you don’t qualify for any “tax cuts,” as being posted at 12:36 PM, which would be 10:36 AM in San Diego (and 8:36 AM Hawaii time). Where the hell are you posting from, New Zealand?
Regardless, no, you weren’t talking about write-offs. You were talking about tax cuts. You even said tax cuts. You’ve already admitted that you don’t know what you’re talking about, and it’s patently obvious that you would fail a two-question/two-option multiple choice test about the difference between a tax deduction and a tax cut. So why bother talking to you? I think sh1bu1 said it best:
Where did you earn it? If the system established and supported by the citizens of the US allowed you such great benefit, seems like it’s in your interest to keep it going.
If you needed a suit for your business, you’d consider it an investment towards future net gain. Same for a computer, office furniture, paper, pens, business cards… You’d probably invest in those things without thinking twice.
Now, if you needed communication lines, the ability to ship goods safely, the ability to hire capable and prepared employees, protection from marauders, a system for seeing to the health of your employees and customers, a pool of customers with the resources to provide you with the money you earned, would you invest in those things too?
For good reason! Did you know that the richest 1% pay far less than their share for these taxes? A person making $10 million a year pays far less of the % of their income than does someone making $40,000. We need to make it so that EVERYONE pays in the same %!
I cannot believe we have such an unfair tax system where the rich pay very little of their % of income in taxes and the poor pay a much larger %.
Something needs to be done.
{of course this excludes federal income tax…but that is ok to ignore in making sweeping statements}
Sorry, what does this have to do with the justification for me paying a higher percentage of my income to Uncle Sam?
Are you suggesting that if I go into a store to buy a new suit, I should pay more than Joe Blow if I make more than he does?
I agree on the first statement – The richest 400 Americans pay an 18% tax rate.
I’m not quite sure on the $40,000 income thing, that’s a pretty big exaggeration. The average tax burden on someone making $40 grand is around 10%, all Federal taxes included.
Completely disagree on the last statement. A progressive income tax system is good.
Talk about stupid analogies. Paying taxes is not like buying a suit, you moron.
If you derive greater benefit from the system, you have a greater stake in making sure that it continues. Insisting otherwise is to cut off your nose to spite your face. That is to say, if the principle of making everyone pay the same amount is more important to you than maintaining the system by which you claim to have benefited, then by all means. At least we’ll all go down together.
Are you suggesting that everyone should have the same suit? No, what I’m suggesting is that if Joe Blow is not going to benefit from having a suit, he’s not going to buy one, is he?
I don’t believe you any more than I would if you said that you dropped an apple and it went up.
It may be that you are overwithholding and will see the money at the end of the year, but what you are claiming is impossible. I know that reality does not have the influence it once did with conservatives.
Correction:
You may have been overwithholding before, and then seen the money at the end of the year.
So your argument is, ‘the justification for paying higher %age of income tax is because, well, look where you are now! You should perpetuate the system’?
I don’t ‘derive greater benefit’ from the system because of the system. I grew up beyond dirt-poor; the tax system didn’t do me any favors. I got ahead in life because I worked my friggen’ ass off. I see no need to ‘continue the system’ for the systems’ sake. In fact, I happen to think that a flat rate system would make everyone better off.
Either way, I’m still waiting for a justification for having to pay a higher percentage of my income in taxes.
And here we have the archetypical conservative. Note how he assumes his own fortune is due 100% to his own ingenuity, tenacity, and rectal fortitude, and has absolutely no thought for the possibility that the current system created an environment in which he was able to use those qualities to rise above the station he was born into rather than be kept down by those who already held money and power.
Up next we have a fellow who believes taxes are theft. Keep to your left folks, plenty of room for everyone…