# Television shows which would be better/worse because of long-term story arcs. (Open spoilers) **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [October 2, 2012, 4:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/television-shows-which-would-be-better-worse-because-of-long-term-story-arcs-open-spoilers/636494 "2012-10-02T16:44:16Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 10\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Finn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dewey_finn/32/4222_2.png) [@Dewey\_Finn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Finn)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2012, 3:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/television-shows-which-would-be-better-worse-because-of-long-term-story-arcs-open-spoilers/636494/41 "2012-10-03T15:08:21Z")
> [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](#): > > Returning to the topic, I think _Star Trek: Deep Space Nine_ got much better once they brought in the Dominion (at the end of the second season, I think), and slowly the show became the story of the Alpha Quadrant’s version of World War II. Makes me forgive the loads & loads of characters, something I ordinarily dislike. By contrast, _Voyager_ was ultimately an artistic failure\* because it refused to commit to what should have been its believable arc: the slow breakdown of the ship & crew as they attempt (and fail) their hopeless voyage home. I never watched Voyager, but I did watch Deep Space Nine and I enjoyed the whole Dominion War storyline. And I’ve watched The Mentalist and it is completely implausible how many allies Red John supposedly has. It would have been far better for him to have been Bradley Whitford’s character and for the show to have dropped any mention of him thereafter. By the way, as for Lost, it seems clear that in the first season, the writers did have some idea how they wanted the story to go, but its popularity meant that they had to keep it going for far too long and introduce too many plot elements that were left hanging at the end. Someday I hope someone releases the original storyline that they started with. I’ll bet it’s a lot more coherent than what we ended with. ---
**Author:** ![Infovore](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/infovore/32/420_2.png) [@Infovore](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Infovore)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2012, 3:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/television-shows-which-would-be-better-worse-because-of-long-term-story-arcs-open-spoilers/636494/42 "2012-10-03T15:11:49Z")
I think in _House_ the sexual tension between House and Cuddy throughout most of its run was a good arc, but it became very bad when they finally let it be resolved. I am not a “shipper” and generally find romantic subplots in non-romantic series annoying (for example, _CSI_), but I think House and Cuddy had good chemistry–as long as there was no actual romantic relationship. Once they got together it was IMO the beginning of the end of the series. ---
**Author:** ![mr.jp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/48db29/32.png) [@mr.jp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mr.jp)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2012, 3:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/television-shows-which-would-be-better-worse-because-of-long-term-story-arcs-open-spoilers/636494/43 "2012-10-03T15:15:39Z")
I have stopped watching The Mentalist, Castle and Burn Notice because of their stupid arcs. I wonder why they have the. I guess that many viewers want something “big” to happen in the shows. That is really unfortunate for me. I always prefer the small stuff. Especially in Burn Notice, the smaller the thing they are helping out with in Miami, the better the episode. ---
**Author:** ![Justin\_Bailey](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/justin_bailey/32/8792_2.png) [@Justin\_Bailey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Justin_Bailey)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2012, 3:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/television-shows-which-would-be-better-worse-because-of-long-term-story-arcs-open-spoilers/636494/44 "2012-10-03T15:24:04Z")
> [@silenus](#): > > It was a line that probably sounded ok on paper: > > \ ***Castle:** “She’s like the Terminator of sexpots.” > > \*\*Beckett: \*_“What, she just keeps coming?”_ I was expecting worse. I know 2 Broke Girls and Two and a Half Men are on CBS, but they get away with much worse. ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2012, 3:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/television-shows-which-would-be-better-worse-because-of-long-term-story-arcs-open-spoilers/636494/45 "2012-10-03T15:26:21Z")
No kidding. What 2.5M gets away with is amazing. Just goes to show that we’ve gotten old, sad to say. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Steve\_MB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steve_mb/32/5339_2.png) [@Steve\_MB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Steve_MB)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2012, 3:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/television-shows-which-would-be-better-worse-because-of-long-term-story-arcs-open-spoilers/636494/46 "2012-10-03T15:26:50Z")
> [@Diceman](#): > > As for the OP, I grew bored with the _X-Files_ after a while, for precisely this reason. The alien conspiracy stuff got way too paranoid; they were so advanced and obviously far ahead of Mulder and Scully; it was like the police force of Monoco trying to defeat the entire United States military. Well, the problem there is a story arc that comes out more like a story pretzel because the writers make it up as they go along with no clear overall direction. When you keep painting yourself into a corner and cutting holes in the wall to get out of it, eventually you sever too many load-bearing elements and the structure falls down on you. ---
**Author:** ![well\_he\_s\_back](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/3ab097/32.png) [@well\_he\_s\_back](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/well_he_s_back)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2012, 6:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/television-shows-which-would-be-better-worse-because-of-long-term-story-arcs-open-spoilers/636494/47 "2012-10-03T18:01:21Z")
Quoting Steve MB: "Well, the problem there is a story arc that comes out more like a story pretzel because the writers make it up as they go along with no clear overall direction. When you keep painting yourself into a corner and cutting holes in the wall to get out of it, eventually you sever too many load-bearing elements and the structure falls down on you. " = Lost. The writers said they weren’t just making it up as they went along, but they were lying. (they can sue me; I’m still bitter). Everything I had to say about Castle & the Mentalist, I said in my previously mentioned thread. to sum up - just let Castle & Becket be Nick & Nora Charles. The Mentalist should have let the guy Jane shot be the real Red John. Simple as that. Both shows have wonderful lead actors and fun supporting characters, & both are harmed by their big bad arcs. ETA - someone above asked when “arcs” became common. Hill Street Blues was the first show I became attached to that had multi-ep arcs mixed with story of the weeks. and “Two & a Half Men” gets away with being so filthy because it makes money for the network. “Two Broke Girls” shouldn’t be getting away with being so filthy. ---
**Author:** ![Nanook\_of\_the\_North\_Shore](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/bc8723/32.png) [@Nanook\_of\_the\_North\_Shore](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nanook_of_the_North_Shore)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2012, 6:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/television-shows-which-would-be-better-worse-because-of-long-term-story-arcs-open-spoilers/636494/48 "2012-10-03T18:33:29Z")
> [@mr.jp](#): > > I have stopped watching The Mentalist, Castle and Burn Notice because of their stupid arcs. > > I wonder why they have the. I guess that many viewers want something “big” to happen in the shows. That is really unfortunate for me. I always prefer the small stuff. Especially in Burn Notice, the smaller the thing they are helping out with in Miami, the better the episode. People do demand them. Go look at the thread for last seasons Grimm. The early episodes were all monster of the week, and half the comments in the thread here was about “I hope we start getting back story and a nice long arc soon.” ---
**Author:** ![Tapiotar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/3be4f8/32.png) [@Tapiotar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tapiotar)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2012, 10:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/television-shows-which-would-be-better-worse-because-of-long-term-story-arcs-open-spoilers/636494/49 "2012-10-03T22:49:41Z")
Even though I said above I thought the Red John story arc was getting a bit old, and that Red John was too powerful to be believable, but I realized I did get hooked into it when I found myself speculating the Bret Stiles, the leader of a Scientology-type cult, could be Red John, and toting up the evidence pointing to him. So, even though I prefer the stand-alone shows, I have gotten hooked. As opposed to Castle, where I’ve disliked every episode of the “Who killed Beckett’s Mother” arc. ---
**Author:** ![Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skald_the_Rhymer)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2012, 6:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/television-shows-which-would-be-better-worse-because-of-long-term-story-arcs-open-spoilers/636494/50 "2012-10-07T18:02:09Z")
> [@MrDibble](#): > > I’m Sorry. I had no idea you were such a fan of _Evan Almighty_.I was thinking of the interminable “Rory gets a rich boyfriend/drops out of college/moves in with her grandparents” arc. I was cool with other character stuff and don’t really think of that as “arc”, but that one felt like it was, and it would have been better dealt with in just a couple episodes. It went on too long and made me hate Rory a little bit, whereas before I quite liked her character. While I was less than pleased with the Rory-drops-out-of-Yale arc, I thought it was entirely in keeping with her character. She was always oblivious to what was going on in her own head, and needed some long-term intensive therapy. That said, that arc about half a season long–maybe two-thirds of a season. Seemed reasonable, if only because “Rory drops out of college for one week” isn’t a story arc at all. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/television-shows-which-would-be-better-worse-because-of-long-term-story-arcs-open-spoilers/636494.md?page=2)